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Thread: Thrace

  1. #31
    Senior Member Senior Member katank's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    No need for bastarnae mercs and bastarnae as it's redundant. Cretans and militia cav are great additions though. Falxmen are unnecessary if you have the Bastarnae unless you are tight on budget which you should be by that point that you can recruit bastarnae.

  2. #32

    Default Re: Thrace

    I put them (bastarnae mercs and falxmen) in to add a little variety to the army. I've noticed people feel the Thracian "roster" is very limited, so I was trying to add a little variety
    Last edited by Craterus; 04-21-2005 at 16:24.

  3. #33

    Default Re: Thrace

    Currently playing a campaign as thrace and have found them to be pretty fun actually, though maybe this is because the slightly incompetent AI (set on medium...) keeps charging its roman generals right into my phalanxes . Anyway, thrace has easy sources of income (byzantium as both trade and mining, and 2 other mining provinces near start which can be gotten quickly from dacia), decent units, very good mercs (which the mines should help you cough up money for) around starting position.

  4. #34
    Amanuensis Member pezhetairoi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    As someone quoted in the game said, (was it Silius something?) 'Infinite money are the sinews of war.' But war gets a little boring after awhile if you've got nothing to look forward to besides the same ol', same ol'. That said, Thrace is better than Macedon in that it's got infantry that can protect the flanks of the phalanx that ISN'T a phalanx. (wow.)


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  5. #35

    Default Re: Thrace

    Good point. I really hate to use infantry, even less spearmen, as you may know. I was thinking about a campaign with Macedon but after discovering their lack of infantry, it put me off.

  6. #36

    Default Re: Thrace

    hopefully in this new expasion pack(babrian envasion)realeased soon they will have more units for all factions because i think that in some factions there aint many units such as thrace that was disapointing because they are in a good postion and i was hoping to have a game with these i did but because the lack of men i got bored quite quickly even though i enjoyed the infrantry
    does any one have any info on the expansion pack !!!?!?!?!?! coz my rome total war cd has gone bust so i need to buy it again but i dont no wether to wait and buy togther so pleas ether send me private message or through this thread
    "Do you have blacks, too?" —to Brazilian President Fernando Cardoso, Washington, D.C., Nov. 8, 2001
    "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
    —Washington, D.C., Aug. 5, 2004
    "I want you to know. Karyn is with us. A West Texas girl, just like me."
    —Nashville, Tenn., May 27, 2004

    how stupid george bush is !

  7. #37

    Default Re: Thrace

    There are threads in the colosseum regarding the expansion pack.
    Personally, I would like to see Thrace with more cavalry because they were known to have some formidable cavalry in history.

  8. #38
    Amanuensis Member pezhetairoi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    Aye, me too. But you know, Craterus, talking about Macedon, it isn't all that bad? Knowing you are a good cavalry commander, Macedon has a pretty decent array for you too... You could just use the phalanx as bait while your Light Lancers or Companions run riot...


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  9. #39

    Default Re: Thrace

    Before every battle, I sort out a line, including phalanxes if I have them..

    When it comes to fighting the battle , the phanlanx will not move unless anything ets to them.. I spend all this time making sure they are deep enough, right position etc, and in the end I never use them..

  10. #40

    Default Re: Thrace

    yer i no what u mean wen we do joint campaign u go fighting off with the horses and the phalanxes never move unitl i say anything or they never do anything i no u shouldnt move phalanxes but its annoying wen u do that
    "Do you have blacks, too?" —to Brazilian President Fernando Cardoso, Washington, D.C., Nov. 8, 2001
    "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
    —Washington, D.C., Aug. 5, 2004
    "I want you to know. Karyn is with us. A West Texas girl, just like me."
    —Nashville, Tenn., May 27, 2004

    how stupid george bush is !

  11. #41

    Default Re: Thrace

    Why thank-you.. You should know how I fight, infantry is there as a last resort, spearmen are there as a last last resort...

  12. #42
    Amanuensis Member pezhetairoi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    hmm, then why not build an all-cavalry macedonian army drawing scythian mercenaries from Scythia?


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  13. #43
    Senior Member Senior Member katank's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    You know that you can turn off phalanx to move them into position and then turn phalanx back on at the destination? They don't move any slower than normal infantry. With all your cavalry expertise, you must realize how strong cav is in this game, overpowered really.

    Phalanxes are great for killing enemy cav. Use them well. Also, they serve as the perfect anvil to the hammer that is your cav. Using phalanx and cav in roughly equal amounts can yield great result especially if you throw in some missiles for support. Use the meatgrinder and lasting ability of the phalanx. They are practically invulnerable from the front if stacked.

  14. #44

    Default Re: Thrace

    Try charing thracian basternae at something in the woods... got a decent 6:1 kill ratio vs greek city armored hoplites for me

  15. #45

    Default Re: Thrace

    Quote Originally Posted by katank
    Also, they serve as the perfect anvil to the hammer that is your cav.
    Anvil and Hammer, that's how Alexander used phalanxes and that's the metaphor they used..

    I'm having some practice with phalanxes online at the moment so I should be ready for a campaign with Macedon or Greek Cities soon.

    I don't like Scythian mercenaries but they are better than the Scythian Horse Archers that Scythia can build..

    Thracian Mercs and Bastarnae Mercs are good mercenaries.. Can Thrace get Sarmatians from their starting provinces?

  16. #46
    Senior Member Senior Member katank's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    Actually, the Scythian mercs are worse than the Scythian HAs. They have no armor 0/2/0 compared with 3/2/0 for armor/defense/shield.

    Scythian HAs are better than the Parthian/Armenia ones due to the 3 extra armor.

    Sarmatians are accessible in the Steppe, Armenia, and Dacia merc pools. You have to travel either north or west to hire them. They initialize at 0 so you have to wait from 7-10 turns for 1 to be generated.

  17. #47

    Default Re: Thrace

    Shame, they are a great cav, especially for Thrace who hasn't got that kind of cavalry except generals.. HA's aren't meant to get involved in melee, I judge missile units on their missile attack

  18. #48
    Senior Member Senior Member katank's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    Still, the addition of 3 armor makes them far better in a missile duel. Missile units are inevitably going to run into missile duels one day.

  19. #49

    Default Re: Thrace

    Yeah, of course..

  20. #50
    Amanuensis Member pezhetairoi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    Thrace is normally expected to expand west into Dacia and south into Macedon, so I suppose it will only be a matter of time before Thrace gets Porrolissum and access to the Sarmatian pool.

    Scythian mercenaries are crappier than authentic HA, but I guess it's all non-Scythian players have to work with, so... :-(


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  21. #51
    Senior Member Senior Member katank's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    Depends on what you mean by authentic. Parthia and Armenia's authentic HAs are equal to the Scythian mercs. They are only worse than the Scythia HAs which seem overpowered, the best basic HA available with only a muster field (town level).

  22. #52

    Default Re: Thrace

    I think the 'authentic' Scythian HA's are incredibly stupid and unlike any other HA's I've ever used, they don't know the meaning of "skirmish" and/or "RUN AWAY!!!" .. they wait until they are close enough to be surrounded and then run away.. and then they decide they'd rathey try and fight rather than run away when I tell them to. Therefore, most of them die.

  23. #53
    Amanuensis Member pezhetairoi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    ...they're impetuous. Nothing we can do about that 'cept watch them verrrrrrry closely. It happens that once I break down a settlement's gates and double click on the town square guard with my horse archer unit, they charge right for the unit instead of galloping to bowshot range and raining them with arrows. ...Impetuous. AND eager, to boot.

    And their skirmish mode is pretty screwy too, cos they'll only run from units that they are targetting. I thought intelligent skirmish mode meant they refrain from contact with -all- enemy units. Oh well.

    Mmm, I suppose given that Scythia was -the- HA race in the past, I'm not surprised it's the most overpowered.

    But, anymore of this and it should go to the Scythia thread :-P
    Last edited by pezhetairoi; 04-29-2005 at 01:12.


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  24. #54
    Senior Member Senior Member katank's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    Someone possibly move it.

    Usually, when you are already in an impetuous charge, it's better to let the unit follow it through and hopefully do some damage instead of trying to turn it away only to be slammed by the enemy unit in the flank while maneuvering.

    Impetuous charges get +2 to morale in MTW and I think it carries over into RTW so it's not always a bad thing.

    The skirmish mode will work for any unit if you don't handtarget enemy units.

    That's why after handtargeting enemy units, after it's weakened or destroyed. I quickly tell all my HAs to stop which lets fire at will take over and this lets them avoid all enemies.

  25. #55
    Amanuensis Member pezhetairoi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    Oh cool... nice info on targeting, thanks! But impetuous charge morale bonuses are pretty useless when your horse archers are going to charge into a phalanx when you wanted them to rain them with arrows...

    In other news, I lost a family member ganging up on the Spartan hoplite garrison of Sparta even though I pounded them from all sides with 7 units of shock cavalry >.< Oh well. He wasn't too good in terms of traits.


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  26. #56
    Senior Member Senior Member katank's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    That's true. Hoplites are another matter. I'm referring to other light cav or even infantry skirmishers. If they turn and is caught by a countercharge on the flank, then it's over. Might as well follow through.

    Hoplites are slow and thus can't catch you with a countercharge. Besides, the effect of following through on a hoplite unit is total destruction so there is no point in doing so.

  27. #57
    Amanuensis Member pezhetairoi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    Ah, light troops, I see. But sometimes your horsearchers charge into other infantry formations, and that's where you're screwed. I'd rather turn and risk the chance of an enemy countercharge, than to follow it through and see severe losses by the time the charge is over, even if the unit doesn't break. I value my HA's arrows more than their short swords. Of course, there are limits, like if there are cavalry nearby I have no choice but to throw that charging unit away and make the best of it by rear-charging the enemy cavalry when he comes to charge my HA.

    But, Thrace! Thrace! LOL. I'm thinking of modding my Thracian faction so they can build Light Lancers, but with a lower charge bonus. At least that'll give them some decent starter cavalry besides that joke they call Militia Cavalry. Views?


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  28. #58
    Guest Es Arkajae's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    I'm finding Thrace to be a good faction with some nice advantages, mainly to do with location, it has some good buildable units (see below) but its access to multiple mercenary pools and some of the best mercenaries in the game is its main advantage.


    Thrace can build phalanx pikemen and bastarnae, these two units make an excellent combination. Earlier on you can use falxmen or Thracian mercs until you can build bastarnae (mecenary bastarnae are also good but a bit pricey in early). In the very early game you should use militia hoplites or mercenary hoplites to try offset the Macedonian lancers if you have to. Lancers when its all said and done are very weak units once their charge is over.

    As regards cavalry the Thracians get only militia cavalry (which is a good fast unit) and Greek cavalry, however Thracia is ideally located with easy access to FOUR mercenary pools, three of which have Sarmatian mercenaries and one of which has Scythian horse archers. The two easiest pools to access are the Scythian and Dacian pools and it is possible using a general starting off in Campus Getae to recruit in BOTH pools and have the recruited Sarmatian and horse archer mercs halfway to Tylis all in the same turn.

    And once you take Byzantium its just a quick hop across the Bosphorus to grab some Cretian archers or if you're really desperate for Sarmatians a further boat journey to Pontic lands where you can hire them there too and swiftly return.

    Thus all the guys whining about lack of cavalry simply haven't been using their noggins, either that or they really can't handle cavalry properly if they keep losing so much of their cavalry in battles that the merc pools can't keep up with demand.

    With all this in mind it is quite possible and indeed quite simple to eventually have armies consisting of phalanx pikemen, bastarnae, Cretian acrchers, horse archers, Sarmatian cavalry and Illyrian mercs for skirmishers if your plain peltasts aren't enough. A potent force which the Romans are going to be bitchslapped by.

    Also keep in mind that the Temple of Ares the Thracians can build can give valuable morale upgrades making Thracian built units harder to break than the norm.

  29. #59
    Amanuensis Member pezhetairoi's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    Nay Arkajae, you haven't been reading the earlier posts closely enough. Inter linea, buddy :-D We were talking about Thrace's -buildable- units as a faction, which have a hodgepodge flavour with no amount of variety (as compared to the other factions, Thrace has way less unit choices).

    If you did read above, I believe you would notice I did mention myself the amazing range of mercenaries Thrace had and the fact that it would have to base its campaign strategy on mercs. But the point being, mercs do not make the faction. It's what it can build that is its soul. And what it can build isn't much.

    And, sorry 'bout the tone above if it offends you...'m feeling a little grouchy today thanks to my lecturer. Take no mind of it. Any sarcasm was not intended.
    Last edited by pezhetairoi; 05-04-2005 at 06:23.


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  30. #60
    Senior Member Senior Member katank's Avatar
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    Default Re: Thrace

    Actually, pezhetairoi, I think enabling light lancers is a good idea.

    They should get both lances and militia cav with basic stables. Both have their uses and this diversity reflects the cavalry tradition of Thrace.

    I personally think there should be a unit like Thracian nobles which would look like barbarian noble cav but be weaker in defense but have the charge of a light lancer.

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