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Thread: Army Lists

  1. #61
    Member Member Kageka's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    I hope the links with the pictures could be of some help. However, I snooped around a little bit more and found a few more ancient Korean warrior picture-links that may be of some use.



    A detailed bronze sculpture head of a warrior:

    http://www.kimsoft.com/2004/images%5...lchiMunduk.jpg



    Paintings of korean warriors:

    http://www.kimsoft.com/2004/pages/Generals.htm

    http://www.kimsoft.com/2004/GoguryoBattle.jpg



    Suits/clothing, semi-useful:

    http://home.att.net/~taekwondo.junkie/soldierunif.jpg

    http://www.koreanie.co.kr/edu_data/d...20protest2.jpg





    I also checked the old replies on the other threads and found some useful links posted by Big John...


    Korean/Hwarang crossbowman and a bamboo gunner:

    http://img71.exs.cx/img71/6007/hang1.jpg


    More pictures, links and info can be found on:
    http://www.allempires.com/forum/foru...141&PN=0&TPN=1
    A useful forum that discuss ancient korean warfare.



    You mentioned that you searched for pictures of korean warriors that looked as different as possible from the chinese troops. I guess thats the right way to go since korean armor and battle gear looks quite similar to the chinese.

    I think by using the special traits as much as possible may do the trick and make the koreans look less chinese. Special traits like the plate turtle necks (common for Koguryeo warriors), the flat redbanded black "amish-like" hats (common for archers and crossbowmen) and the heavy platemail suits/armour (including platemail pants for heavy cavalry).


    I have asked before about the use of gunpowder in the game and the chinese fire lances seem to be the only ones with explosive power. But there are so many good pictures and info-links about ancient korean guns, cannons, bombs and rockets that its a shame not to include them. At least I feel so (I am a sucker for really old guns). But I guess that guns is out of the question since the mod has gone so far and already have found its form and style.
    Last edited by Kageka; 06-02-2005 at 19:11.

  2. #62

    Default Re: Army Lists

    Hey great..you may want to look at this thread straight off.

    Most pictures in back of thread.

    http://www.chinahistoryforum.com/ind...showtopic=1898

  3. #63

    Default Re: Army Lists

    Here are some specific cool pics.

    http://img220.exs.cx/img220/3843/ukkorea0ue.jpg
    http://img44.exs.cx/img44/2588/u7.jpg
    http://img23.exs.cx/img23/305/anshi2.jpg
    http://img44.exs.cx/img44/3511/image...ryoSoldier.jpg
    http://img46.exs.cx/img46/732/rider1.jpg
    http://img9.exs.cx/img9/7876/hwacha.jpg
    http://img27.echo.cx/img27/7212/013fh.jpg
    http://img27.echo.cx/img27/9437/0815tq.jpg
    http://img27.echo.cx/img27/8104/050110l6lg.jpg
    http://img27.echo.cx/img27/1665/0250000000017cx.jpg
    http://img27.echo.cx/img27/3985/b1018sh.jpg
    http://img27.echo.cx/img27/5167/chung035ps.jpg
    http://img27.echo.cx/img27/7218/daegaya0ig.jpg
    http://img27.echo.cx/img27/3734/dongmyeong8rg.jpg
    http://img30.echo.cx/img30/5112/emar62pv.jpg
    http://img30.echo.cx/img30/3153/gimg13cd.gif
    http://img30.echo.cx/img30/5125/goryeo8av.png
    http://img30.echo.cx/img30/2426/gwanggaeto231ff.jpg
    http://img30.echo.cx/img30/7939/gyebaek1qy.jpg
    http://img30.echo.cx/img30/851/haengjusaml7jb.jpg
    http://img30.echo.cx/img30/9530/hwarang4vq.jpg
    http://img30.echo.cx/img30/3345/ia12hp.gif
    http://img27.echo.cx/img27/4654/kwakcha1eu7uk.jpg
    http://img27.echo.cx/img27/7133/kwangm2pq.jpg
    http://img62.echo.cx/img62/9109/s1hv.jpg
    http://img62.echo.cx/img62/8387/samguk0039co.jpg
    http://img62.echo.cx/img62/1497/samguk1039am.jpg
    http://img62.echo.cx/img62/4457/tae15wl.jpg
    http://img62.echo.cx/img62/1695/yisun4bo.jpg
    http://img62.echo.cx/img62/8063/sky1ei.jpg

    Right two are Goguryeoan
    http://img62.echo.cx/img62/8110/sui0sy.jpg



    Hope this helps. That's all for now.

    Cheers
    -GJ

  4. #64

    Default Re: Army Lists

    This forum really needs an edit option.

    BTW, I'm a moderator at both

    www.chinahistoryforum.com

    www.allempires.com/forum

    These are both good places to find out about the histories and armies of the subject nations. cheers!

  5. #65
    Senior Member Senior Member hoggy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    exellent stuff guys.

    I've put a concept up for the monk faction (post no.5 in this thread). they reuse some earlier units mostly but are only a minority faction.

  6. #66

    Default Re: Army Lists

    Quote Originally Posted by hoggy
    exellent stuff guys.

    I've put a concept up for the monk faction (post no.5 in this thread). they reuse some earlier units mostly but are only a minority faction.

    You're an amazing artist.


    Wow..


    Here's some more korean stuff I found.

    http://img70.echo.cx/img70/6610/jangbogo8mv.gif
    http://warmemo.co.kr/image/image_120...ms/warrior.jpg
    http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...eandShilla.jpg
    http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...ingSuiarmy.jpg
    http://www.taekwon-do-illertissen.de/images/Krieger.JPG
    http://www.yescall.com/hwarangdo/images/main.gif
    http://img70.echo.cx/img70/5817/hwang24ci.jpg

    This would be the general uniform of a Shilla Hwarang.

    http://img70.echo.cx/img70/3612/hwarang25uw.jpg


    They would have worn light armor me thinks and they wore lots of make up. Hwarang means flower knight so they were chosen from the best looking guys. Most Koreans would have a beard, but not the Hwarang because they were generally young kids. General Sadaham was only 15 when he began to lead battles against Baekje.

    I've used paint to depict what this guy should look like.

    http://img54.echo.cx/img54/4458/hwarang34oc.jpg

    Not that great, but you get the idea.

    The Hwarang was basically a patriots club who's members often went to war for their nation. Most likely these individuals would have been on horse back because they were of noble blood. From a movie I watched a while back, they were depicted as using spears and bows. Kind of a light calvalry i guess.


    Hope that helps.

  7. #67
    Member Member Kageka's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    Hoggy

    excellent concept art. One question though; there doesn't seem to be any monk units for ranged combat (such as archers, javelin chuckers, crossbow men...)... or is the Masters-unit some kind of battle mage able to throw balls of fire or bolts of lightning?




    Gubok Jangoon

    I see what you're coming at about the Hwarang-do, and I think thats the right way to go. It will give the Choson a more distinct look and feeling. First we have the heavy cavalry with heavy platemail (with platemail pants!!!) and plate turtle neck armor... and then we have the lightly armored and sophisticated hwarang (with makeup!!!). Two very different troop types that together form the ways of a united faction.

    By the way, I really like the two historical forums you are a moderator for.
    Last edited by Kageka; 06-04-2005 at 15:29.

  8. #68

    Default Re: Army Lists

    Quote Originally Posted by Kageka
    Hoggy


    Gubook Jangoon

    I see what you're coming at about the Hwarang-do, and I think thats the right way to go. It will give the Choson a more distinct look and feeling. First we have the heavy cavalry with heavy platemail (with platemail pants!!!) and plate turtle neck armor... and then we have the lightly armored and sophisticated hwarang (with makeup!!!). Two very different troop types that together form the ways of a united faction.

    By the way, I really like the two historical forums you are a moderator for.

    Haha that would be the idea. Hm..the Goguryeo calvalry were more lamellar armour types than plate mail though. Hehe..

    I'm glad you like the sites I work at. :D

  9. #69

    Default Re: Army Lists

    Oops, sorry plate maile is lammellar. Haha, my bad.

  10. #70

    Default Re: Army Lists

    I've also found this site.

    http://warmemo.co.kr/english/exhibition/02/ex_02_02.htm

    The ones that would be pertinant to this project would be the 3 kingdoms, Koryo, and Chosun sections. The Taehan empire may help a bit.

  11. #71

    Default Re: Army Lists

    http://world.kbs.co.kr/src/images/ak...k/050530_l.jpg
    http://haenara.net/bbs/zboard/data/h...rea_02_72p.jpg


    I also wanted to bring this Goguryeoan wall mural to attention.

    http://img9.exs.cx/img9/1281/0175_2.jpg


    In it one can see both Archers/Crossbowmen and Axemen.

    The Archers are wearing the black hats, different from the Amish style hats of Joseon, and have armor. On the other hand the Axemen wear red hats and have no armor.

  12. #72

  13. #73
    Member Member eouia's Avatar
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    Default More About Korean...

    Well, its great work this mod, i've seen. I can hardly wait the mod releasing.
    anyway, have you some time for more Korean information?

    1. Symbol
    The ancient Korean respect some supernatural subjects.

    The Sky - It is holded in common on Manchu-Siberian. the origin of Korean race(called "Han" race) came from there. many traditional cultures of Northern Asia(Manchu, Mongol, Siberia) are similiar with each other. frankly, Korean is more akin to Mongolian than Chinese. The Sky is equivalent to The GOD. it is not Creator, but Harmonizer. The old tale tell us that the first Korean people came from the Sky.

    The BongHwang(Phoenix) - The Imaginary symbol of Chinese is the Dragon. But them of Korean are Birds. The BongHwang is one of them. "Bong" means King of birds, "Hwang" means Queen. The Ancient Han-race use this for their symbol.

    The SamJokOh(tripod-crow) - Another bird symbol. The crow with tripod means Sun. or an envoy of gods. GoGuRyo Kingdom use this symbol.
    I think this is the best symbol for this mod. it's artistic design can't be out-of-fashioned. you can see it below.
    http://www.hsdu.ac.kr/01_about/img/p5_04.gif
    http://ekee.nafeel.net/pattern/bird/img/bird06.jpg
    http://www.asadal.com/company/asadal...logo_img01.gif
    (I don't know why JFA-Japan Football Association use this their symbol. )

    another symbols:
    the Tiger is always friendly animal with Korean.
    the Blue-Red TaeGuk(Taichi, Yin-Yang) is relatively modern symbol used after 19c.
    White is symbolic color of Korean.


    2. Strategy & Arms
    The major weapon of Korean is the bow. From beginning to the end, the bow is domestic. "DongYi", other name of Han-race called by Chinese means "Eastern Great Bow-man". yes, Korean is a natural-born archer.
    Less plain, more forests and mountains make battle strategy of Han race restricted. Carvalry is difficult to use. Heavy Armor? its non-sense.

    well, there is no rule without execption. "GaeMa Carvalry" is it. The GoGuRyo Empire had great iron covering carvalries. they command the Continent. but you must know this. GoGuRyo was not settled on Han-penninsular. they ruled Manchu - the great plain of northern Asia.

    except "GaeMa", many of korean soldiers used bow and spear for their primary weapon.

    sword or knife are rared. most soldiers are not standing army. they had no time for learning swordmanship. the spear is easy to learn. and it is effective in melee.
    "DangPa" is the most basic weapon for ChoSeon Dynasty Infantry. it is a kind of trident. it is two handed weapon. so they can't use shields.
    http://www.ohmynews.com/down/images/1/bluekb_161058_6[225566].jpg

    "JangChangDang(Long-Spear-Party)" is Korean Hoplite(?). its usage is similiar with those of Spartan. the infantry of Shilla use this Long-Spear for stopping charge of carvalry. the length of spear is about 4m 80cm. they stop the charge, and make to fall the enemy riders down. then, the axe-man attack the fallen riders.

    most soldiers had light armor - cloths, leather. on Korean topographical condition, heavy armor is uncomfortable. after long-ranged arrow shotting, fast charge and hit is the capital offensive strategy. on deffensive, they use covering. like mountain, forests, castle, fortress. so, there is no need for shields or heavy armor.

    I think Korean bowmen is analogous to English Long-Bowmen. The range of Korean Bow is above 150m. maximum is 500m. it might be terrific for their enemy. many generals who had invaded to Korea are killed by arrow, not sword.

    The Officers had the sword. but it was not for melee. it was used for commanding or self-protection. the principal majors of officer training were horse-riding and archery. even civillians trained archery. they believe it should be good at mental training.
    so, light carvalry armed with bow. the horseback archery was most important skill for carvalry. After GoGuRyo, heavy carvalry is not used any more.

    Officers weared cloth or leather armor for activity. Generals weared Studded Leather Armor, Scale Male, Brigandine Armor. Heml was also.

    Rockets and Powder is another power of Korean. When Japanese developed musketguns, Korean developed cannons.
    The granade was used in late 14c.
    "ShinGiJeon(Mystic-Arrows)" is definitely very interesting weapon. it is old version of nowadays MLRS. with power of powder, multi-big rockets(lenght about 140cm) are shot automatically. the range is about 1000m. it was invented by in 1448. it is the oldest rocket weapon in the world.
    http://bingoimage.naver.com/data/bin...olove20_33.jpg
    http://bingoimage.naver.com/data2/bi...8/fhdps_24.jpg

    "HwaRang"s are not soldiers. they are similiar with "Boy-Scouts". they learn and train for future honor. most of them are son of nobles. so they respect honor and loyalty. if it shall come in this mod, it is good to describe them like light cavalries or junior chivalries.



    oops. too long. sorry for my poor English. I hope this useful for more fantastic BL.
    i hope to tell you more about real historic Korean war-heroes soon.
    have a nice day.

  14. #74
    Member Member Kageka's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    Eouia

    Cool and interesting facts about ancient/medieval Korean warfare and spirituality.


    But you got to have in mind that this mod ain't a historical mod (atleast I have understand it that way). Blue Lotus is rather a myth-based fantasy-mod based on Asian cultures and mythologies.

    This gives Hoggy & Co freedom to alter things, meaning that the Choson (Korean faction) doesn't have to follow one single historical time-period by the numbers. They can add and withdraw attributes to make the faction more interesting and diverse.

    Guess you already figured that out but I had to say it anyway.



    I personally like the idea of commanding Goguryo-based Heavy Cavalry with full body platemail armor and plate turtleneck armor. This combined with robe wearing archers with hats and so on...

    A faction with two extremes (we have heavy armored melee cavalry and the we got different types of light/non armored infantry mainly focused on archery) and no real allround units would be interesting and "unique".

    It may not be historically correct but it will look good and really give Choson a distinct look that doesn't reminds of the two Chinese factions.
    Last edited by Kageka; 06-10-2005 at 18:35.

  15. #75
    Member Member eouia's Avatar
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    Default more.

    Here is an interesting article for Korean military-arts. (nice pictures are on the link.)
    http://ohmynews.com/articleview/arti...60856&ar_seq=2

    The traditional Korean Military-Arts show is going on everyday in "Hwa Castle", Suwon, Korea.

    "MuYe 24Gi"(The 24 Skills of Military-Arts) was arragned on AD.1790.(in era of King JeongJo, ChoSeon Dynasty)
    Officers of Army had to study those. the skills are composed with variable weapons or physical masterys. u can see the English description of those from here
    http://www1.suwon.ac.kr/~bluekb/martial.html

  16. #76
    Senior Member Senior Member hoggy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    Some really excellent stuff guys. I'll try to bear as much in mind as possible when concepting the korean faction. Top stuff.

  17. #77
    Senior Member Senior Member hoggy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    Quote Originally Posted by Kageka
    Hoggy

    One question though; there doesn't seem to be any monk units for ranged combat (such as archers, javelin chuckers, crossbow men...)... or is the Masters-unit some kind of battle mage able to throw balls of fire or bolts of lightning?
    oops sorry missed this kageka, the masters will hurl flaming blue lotuses as a deadly missile weapon.

  18. #78
    Member Member Kageka's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    Hoggy

    Ah cool. Feels like the Monks are the head act in the game (Blue Lotus) in one way... their symbol is a blue lotus and their ranged units fires burning blue lotuses.


    Well I watched the army lists once again (well I love those concept pics you have drawn, wonderful stuff) and there was one unit that I felt to be a wee bit "misplaced" and superfluous.


    I am talking about the Tibetan Infantry.

    1.
    First of all I think that the name doesn't fit. The reason is that world of Blue Lotus is a fictional fantasy/mythological world, not our world. Thats the way I have understand it after reading all your (an your crew's) posts about the game. Therefore there can't be no Tibet. Ok there may be a place similar to Tibet, but i doubt that it will have the same name as our world's Tibet. Call them something else... maybe Northern Guardsmen.

    2.
    Secondly I doesn't see the use for the Tibetan Infantry in an army as broad AND specialized as the two Chinese ones. I mean we have four spear/pike-using infantry unit types already. Two of them wear helmets and armor and one of them have shields as well. I think that the four other spear man-units have their potent place and using in war, which render the Tibetan Infantry superfluous.

    3.
    The Tibetan Infantry concept pic and the 3D-model is excellent in every way, so I don't think that it should be nerfed from the mod though. I think that the Tibetan Infantry (Northern Guardsmen?... ) should be an mercenary unit able to be hired in some mountain-territory resembling to Tibet or Nepal.

    4.
    Another option is to include the Tibetan Infantry (Northern Guardsmen?... ) into the Monk-faction. Why do I suggest this? Well if remember it correct the Monk-faction was to be inspired/influenced by Buddism and Tibet. Well why not make the Tibetan Infantry the cheap stand-back defence typ-o unit?

    This will also make the Monk army list a bit more interesting due more units to choose from.


    Well that was just some thoughts of mine. I don't know if they can contribute to anything though.
    Last edited by Kageka; 06-10-2005 at 19:28.

  19. #79
    Just your average dragoon Member DragoonXXIV's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    I disagree with you Kageka.
    I think the Tibetan Infantry have a very good purpose, namely as specialty troops. To be more specific they should get a hefty bonus for being in the woods and a modest bonus for being in snow. This way they can make great anchors for your spear line, while the other spearmen severe only as general troops maybe even have a disadvantage in snow due to heavy armor.
    As to they're name, i personally like Tibetain Infantry, if you say northern guard then they would be associated with Mongolia, however if you say Tibetan everyone has a clear idea of thier climate and temperment.
    Also i think you raise a valid point about thier affiliation, to me it would make sense that they are extremely disciplined due to thier buddhist upbringing and could also work for the monks (possibly under a different name, i.e. Tibetan Templars) but i don't think they should be mercanaries due to thier elite nature and added historical context.

  20. #80
    Member Member Kageka's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    DragoonXXIV

    Hmm, well you have a good point about the Tibetan Infantry doing its purpose as a specialized unit. A sturdy unit meant for fighting in snow and woods. But still, there are already four spear-based units... I have a hard time to understand how none of them, in constellations with other trooptypes, can't fight properly without a fifth spear unit such as Tibetan Infantry. I can't help it but I really find the Tibetan Infantry more as a Monk faction unit option than a Zuanshi/Yuwan (Chinese) unit option.


    I still think its wrong to name the unit Tibetan Infantry. I mean its like adding a archer type of unit in a "Middle Earth" game and call it English Longbowmen, while there is no England (and therefor no englishmen)in "Middle Earth". Same goes for the tibetans. There are no Tibet in Blue Lotus because its a asian mythological fantasy world, not our world (atleast I have understand it that way), and therefore there are no tibetans.


    I agree with you that the substitute name I suggested is misleading. Northern Guardsmen leads the thoughts to Mongolia. But instead they could be called Templar Guardsmen, Monastery Infantry, Templar Infantry, Mountain Guardsmen, Monastery Guardsmen or Mountain Infantry.

    Another idea could be to exchange the prefix Tibetan and change it for something that sounds pretty much the same or just reminds of tibetan.

    (Lhasa) Lhasar Infantry
    (Tibetan) Tibhutan Infantry
    (Ladakh) Laudak Infantry
    (Amda, Kundun) Umdun Infantry


    Just some suggestions and ideas from a (I hope not that annoying) Blue Lotus fan.
    Last edited by Kageka; 06-11-2005 at 01:15.

  21. #81
    Just your average dragoon Member DragoonXXIV's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    Kageka

    Frankly i think the Chinese faction has too many units, but that's just me, also the 4 other spearman units they have, have a clear hierarchy (kindly like the pike hierarchy in vanilla R:TW). None of them have clear differences or markings as specialists units, but the tibetans do. If anything i think the regular spearman should be kicked.

    As for the name... I guess it's just a matter of opinion, however you can't say there isn't a Tibet in Blue Lotus, even though the mod is original and mythological it does have very clear parallels in real histroy. What i mean is, using your same argument they should rename Samurai, Sohei, Shaolin, Krishnapur, Hwarang-Do, etc. because these are very specific names and titles.

    Anyway that's just my opinion. This is Hoggy's mod, and since i'm not paying for it, i can't complain. I can suggest things and argue complaints, but i can't complain.

  22. #82

    Default Re: Army Lists

    I tend to agree with Kageka here. We shouldn't be naming units after real live places. For one, city names are being made up and another it doesn't really seem to fit.

    Just a note here. Let's not call the Hwarang "Hwarangdo". Hwarangdo means way of the Hwarang. That doesn't really make sense for a unit name..(In Korean anyways).


    Here are some more pics.

    Korean royal body guard:

    They would be wearing red.



    Chariots:



    Various weapons.




    Ok, here the one that says 중국검 and 중국식 협도 are Chinese style weapons.

    The ones that say 왜겸 and 왜식 협도 are Japanese style weapons.

  23. #83

    Default Re: Army Lists

    Found this bugger too.


  24. #84
    Member Member Kageka's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    DragoonXXIV

    "Frankly i think the Chinese faction has too many units, but that's just me, also the 4 other spearman units they have, have a clear hierarchy (kindly like the pike hierarchy in vanilla R:TW). None of them have clear differences or markings as specialists units, but the tibetans do. If anything i think the regular spearman should be kicked."

    Ok we seem to agree on the part that there are to many units in the Chinese faction. But we disagree on the part on what unit that should be "ditched".
    I still find the Tibetan Infantry not a wathertight Chinese faction unit, still think it would fit better as a Monk faction unit.


    "As for the name... I guess it's just a matter of opinion, however you can't say there isn't a Tibet in Blue Lotus, even though the mod is original and mythological it does have very clear parallels in real history. What i mean is, using your same argument they should rename Samurai, Sohei, Shaolin, Krishnapur, Hwarang-Do, etc. because these are very specific names and titles."

    Yes ofcourse I can see that the mod has clear parallels to our world, but it isn't our world. And it is a difference in calling a japanese looking warrior Samurai than calling a unit by its geographical name. I mean Samurai, Sohei, Shaolin doesn't refer to a country/nation from our world, but Tibetan does (referring to Tibet).

    Lets take an other example by comparing with some more or less medieval european fantasy world. They can include knights, paladins, barbarians, druids, crusaders etc. and still not clash with our world. But if they include English Bowmen, Gauls, Germans, Roman legioneers, Norse Vikings etc. then they have referred to countries/nations/people from our world. It sounds strange since England, Gaul, Germania, Rome or Norway doesn't exist in that world with its own countries/nations/people.

    But if the world of Blue Lotus is in fact the same as our world then there is no problem if some units refer to countries/nations/people from our world.


    "Anyway that's just my opinion. This is Hoggy's mod, and since I'am not paying for it, i can't complain. I can suggest things and argue complaints, but i can't complain."

    I fully agree with you here (for my own account as well). I'am just suggesting things and present ideas that Hoggy & Co may find useful in some way. But in the end I have nothing to say that can change things since it isn't my mod. And like you I don't complain. What is ithere to complain about? This mod has fantastic graphics and models (looks better than the original ones in RTW), it is original and has really interesting factions and armies to choose between.
    Last edited by Kageka; 06-11-2005 at 15:03.

  25. #85

    Default Re: Army Lists

    I was thinking about Korean standards and though...

    Hm..how about the Korean war drum? Here are some pics.

    http://www.vac-acc.gc.ca/content/fea...koreandrum.jpg
    http://www.vac-acc.gc.ca/content/fea...r072503_04.jpg

  26. #86

    Default Re: Army Lists

    I've also been thinking about gunpowder. I know you don't want it in the game, but I'm going to push this anyways.

    This is the Shingicheon Hwacha

    http://img9.exs.cx/img9/7876/hwacha.jpg

    It basically shoots arrows so it's not like cannon balls or anything. The way I see it, it's like a massive Firelance. Just a thought.

  27. #87

  28. #88

    Default Re: Army Lists

    Here's a video on Gayan arms and armors. You'll have to forgive the long loading time and the horrible English. The video is well worth it though.
    http://211.252.141.15/wmv/luxury/MS20040403_e.wmv

    Here's another one about Cast armor and Lamellar
    http://211.252.141.15/wmv/relic/MS20040324_e.wmv

    Gayan Swords
    http://211.252.141.15/wmv/relic/MS20040315_e.wmv

    Saw knives
    http://211.252.141.15/wmv/relic/MS20040317_e.wmv

    Gayan Armor
    http://nongae.gsnu.ac.kr/~gyomu/kook.../sub2/img3.gif


    Here's a random video about flag poles..just reminded me of banners
    http://211.252.141.15/wmv/relic/MS20040318_e.wmv

  29. #89
    Senior Member Senior Member hoggy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    (moved) Ramareddy wrote:

    Before responding please take a look at the army lists:

    http://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=41921


    Is it just me, or does each faction seem very well balanced?

    Not between factions, mind you, but each army list in and of itself. It seems like they all have great infantry and cavalry, with very few perceivable weaknesses.

    Do you guys think that maybe these lists should be changed in favor of lobsiding factions toward a particular tactical power?

    Perhaps China can be the middle of the road civilization, with decent infantry and cavalry, but nothing exceptional. Japan can have great attack infantry, while the Indians will use good missile troops and elephants and pathetic cavalry, so on and so on.

    I'll use a 1-5 scale for each component of a faction, the goal being to make each factions average a "3". When taking each into consideration, think about the variety of units given, and the power of those units.


    Example:

    Krishnapur-
    Melee Infantry: Average 3
    Missile Infantry: Good 4
    Melee Cavalry (Elephants and Chariots included, however horsemen should be poor): Good 4
    Missile Cavalry: Very Poor 1
    Average: 3

    Khanate-
    Melee Infantry: Very Poor 1
    Missile Infantry: Good 4
    Melee Cavalry: Good 4
    Missile Cavalry: Very Good 5
    Average: 3.5

    Japan-
    Melee Infantry: Very Good 5
    Missile Infantry: Average 3
    Melee Cavalry: Average 3
    Missile Cavalry: Average 3
    Average: 3.5

    These are no representative of how the factions are now, but merely examples of what strengths a faction "should" have and the basic grading system itself. Applying this system to the current factions will give us very different results, I suggest you guys try it.

    Keep in mind you're trying to make each faction have an average of three.

    Good Luck.

  30. #90
    Senior Member Senior Member hoggy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Army Lists

    (moved) Dragoon wrote in reply:
    i won't put it that extreme, but i completely agree with you that they factions need to have more 'personality' and individualism. However hoggy hasn't shared the stats for the units so it's very possible that though all the units look cool there stats play very differently.

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