Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
"mass murder of innocents through suicide. Prior to the Palestinians, this did not exist."
If the man is referring to suicide bombing, then he's probably wrong. Suicide bombing against civillian targets was (IIRC) pioneered by the Tamil Tigers. Anyway that's not the point of that truly incredible article.
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Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
You lefties just cant handle the truth and your part in causing this problem. You provew everything the man says is the truth. Your theories on moral equivolancy make me want to puke.
Oh Palestinians are a religion now as are the left. Have you seen any of the threads bashing Christianity here. Isalm itself may not be the problem but the way certain people interpret it certainly is . You cannot deny that the Palestnians brought us this form of terror and that since then many muslims have embraced it. And I myslef have pointed out that the lefts trying to justify it only makes matters worse..Isnt there anyone else who thinks that this religious abuse should stop?
On the part of the left here it certainly is. All they can do as usual is attack the author the site or myself and not make any reasonable argument why were wrong.But you are right! This thread is meaningless. Pure spam
Fighting for Truth , Justice and the American way
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
As usual the lefties spend more time attacking the writer and Gawain than the article itself.
The main thesis of the article seems to be that the palestinians started the recent trend toward religiously justified suicide bombings in the muslim world and the pro palestinian left around the world - yes there is such a thing - passively supports this activity and tries to justify that.
I see no distortion of the truth there.
Its like saying "Oh well i dont really support Stalin killing all those Ukranians, but i completely understand why he did it and they deserve it anyway." The first thing the leftists, even on this board, do when confronted with evidence of palestinian violence is to try and dredge up Israeli violence or justify it.
Oh and..
That would be funny if I didnt think you really believed it. The biggest terror attacks by AQ came before Iraq was even in the equation. That statement shows a marked lack of historical information on your part.Iraq is now the single biggest reason for the increased terrorism around the world, fact. The left - a vast majority anyway - opposed the war, how can they then be so responsible for the attacks?
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
The same thing could be said the other way around - go figure...Originally Posted by PanzerJager
BTW, the content of the article has been targeted in several posts here, however, I have seen no response to that - so no crocodile tears please...
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
Excuse me but who invaded who in 1948? There is no moral equivilancy here no matter how you on the left try to make it so. Thats one of the main points of the article.The same thing could be said the other way around - go figure...
Fighting for Truth , Justice and the American way
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
Certainly not the Palestinian children who are killed in this conflict.
Here is the nonsense argument Prager is making:
So according to him 9/11, Madrid and London happened because "the left" is justifying Palestianian terrorist attacks (at statement BTW, that I consider to be an outrageous insult).
Dou you seriously think that OBL is intersted what "The left" thinks about suicide attacks? As hit has been stated before - suicide attacks are a means that is also used in other conflicts. It is the tool of groups who have no military means, who are extremely fanatic and who to not care about the liives of innocent people. These people certainly do not care about whether we think their actions are justified or not.
Prager's commentary is (as his other commentary's) just the rant of an angry guy who does not get reality get in the way of his narrow-minded views.
Last edited by Ser Clegane; 07-27-2005 at 16:14.
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
No thats not the only reason but it does give them hope.So according to him 9/11, Madrid and London happened because "the left" is justifying Palestianian terrorist attacks (at statement BTW, that I consider to be an outrageous insult).
Not against civilians it hasnt.As hit has been stated before - suicide attacks are a means that is also used in other conflicts.
I say it is you who are narrow minded and cant see the forrest through the trees.Prager's commentary is (as his other commentary's) just the rant of an angry guy who does not get reality get in the way of his narrow-minded views.
Fighting for Truth , Justice and the American way
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
Passive support and justification only help the cause of the suicide bombers - whether they are palestinian or AQ.So according to him 9/11, Madrid and London happened because "the left" is justifying Palestianian terrorist attacks (at statement BTW, that I consider to be an outrageous insult).
Dou you seriously think that OBL is intersted what "The left" thinks about suicide attacks? As hit has been stated before - suicide attacks are a means that is also used in other conflicts. It is the tool of groups who have no military means, who are extremely fanatic and who to not care about the liives of innocent people. These people certainly do not care about whether we think their actions are justified or not.
Who do you blame for suicide bombings.. the bombers or the people getting bombed?
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
How so?
The Tamil Tigers have already been mentioned in this threadNot against civilians it hasnt.
Well, I am not the one who is painting with the broadest brush available to make a cheap point against my political opponents in my own country.I say it is you who are narrow minded and cant see the forrest through the trees.
Cheap and narrow-minded on a schoolyard level (but I should not slander high school kids here)
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
The bombers - however, Prager decided to blame a boogeyman he calls "the world's left"
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
Every opponnent of the US uses Nam as their template for defeating us. Their only hope is to change the minds of the public here. Your attempting to do exactly what they want. You are their only hope.As are many on the left If everyone were like me and Panzer they would quit or be destroyed.How so?
Wasnt that by the author. Youve already made a point to disregard what he says.The Tamil Tigers have already been mentioned in this thread
Its your who are thinking with a broad brush. He doesnt say ALL MUSLIMS or ALL PAlestinians this is a commomn debating tactic. You choose to take it that way. It never even occured to me. I know exactly what and who hes talking about. Its indocrinated into their schools. You all think they think like we do. Thats one hell of a big mistake. If you dont believe me just ask the indians.Well, I am not the one who is painting with the broadest brush available to make a cheap point against my political opponents in my own country.
Fighting for Truth , Justice and the American way
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
So far it seems that it is yours and Panzers mindset that is fueling the hate and provides AQ with an endless stream of motivated terrorists.
See Sinan's post at the top of the page - perhaps you should take the time to read the replies to a thread you started.Wasnt that by the author. Youve already made a point to disregard what he says.
However, it's strange that you claimed that there are no other cases of suicide bombers when even Prager mentions it (though he chooses to dismisses this case as he claims that it is completely diffrenet from the situation in Palestine - which is utter nonsense).
Perhaps you did not read the article before you posted it?
In case you haven't noticed - I haven't referred to his view on muslims in my posts, I referred to his view on the "world's left".Its your who are thinking with a broad brush. He doesnt say ALL MUSLIMS or ALL PAlestinians this is a commomn debating tactic. You choose to take it that way. It never even occured to me. I know exactly what and who hes talking about. Its indocrinated into their schools. You all think they think like we do. Thats one hell of a big mistake. If you dont believe me just ask the indians.
So it seems that you haven't read my posts either...
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
When will the bomber-right understand that just couse us lefties dont support the war on terror as it is done today doesnt mean we support terrorists?
I really want to know... do you people have a hard time understanding!? seriusly? tell me so I can explain it more simple!!
Socialists, social-democrats, commies, pinkos or what the hell you call them do NOT support Terrorism!!
neither do we blame the US and the UK for All of the terror but try to understand the background as to why people commit suicide-bombings!
Understanding the terrorist doesnt mean you become one!
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
More likely they don't care much for everyone to the left of Karl Rove being labelled a terrorist supporting lefty.
The article title is absurd, not much reason to read such sensationalistic crap.
Rome Total War, it's not a game, it's a do-it-yourself project.
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
Yes..good plan. Don't read it because it might offend you.
Nice.
Azi
Mark Twain 1881"If you don't want to work, become a reporter. That awful power, the public opinion of the nation, was created by a horde of self-complacent simpletons who failed at ditch digging and shoemaking and fetched up journalism on their way to the poorhouse."
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
Azi, you might want to try taking a shot of intellectual honesty here... When I see an obviously sensationalistic headline aimed at those with low IQ, or so biased as to be silly stereotypes, I'm not inclined to read the article. I don't see enough skill in the crafting of the title to suggest the author has any insight, just noisy diatribe.
Rome Total War, it's not a game, it's a do-it-yourself project.
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
And Blair's Bombs is the superior article in what way exactly?
Azi
Mark Twain 1881"If you don't want to work, become a reporter. That awful power, the public opinion of the nation, was created by a horde of self-complacent simpletons who failed at ditch digging and shoemaking and fetched up journalism on their way to the poorhouse."
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
I wouldn't know. I didn't read it, and for the same reason.
Rome Total War, it's not a game, it's a do-it-yourself project.
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
The scary part is, many people do read those articles. And never both (probably because they are from different sources I would think...aren't they?). Then they think they get all the info needed, and then go out an proselytize their co-workers, who are too lazy to check for themselves. Now we have a bunch of people following one of them who does not even have half the facts.
That is how we get protests against the government (or death threats for certain government officials) or mosques blown up (I think the second is horrible myself. The mosques I have been to are gorgeous).
Ignorance may be bliss, but it is sure as heck dangerous.
Azi
Mark Twain 1881"If you don't want to work, become a reporter. That awful power, the public opinion of the nation, was created by a horde of self-complacent simpletons who failed at ditch digging and shoemaking and fetched up journalism on their way to the poorhouse."
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
I didn't feel it necessary to read past the first paragraph of either article.
"A man who doesn't spend time with his family can never be a real man."
Don Vito Corleone: The Godfather, Part 1.
"Then wait for them and swear to God in heaven that if they spew that bull to you or your family again you will cave there heads in with a sledgehammer"
Strike for the South
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
I can not take someone serious who does intend to question Islam.. Tell me you know nothing or mis-informed somehow.. I would just ask "Where is PJ?" after looking at the first page, and fortunately he was not late at all to miss the show.. You must have a club running over there to provoke this...Isalm itself may not be the problem but the way certain people interpret it certainly is ...
I tell you, anyone on this earth taking religion cover for his actions is committing the most dangerous crime ever. You seem well looking to get provoked against Islam. And if you do and grow it, expect more of those bombings, take cover. You are just getting involved by raising anger against Muslim. However, I am already convinced that you were looking for ways to spit it out, and there you have it now..
Last edited by LeftEyeNine; 07-27-2005 at 20:28.
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
LeftEyeNine, while I may not agree with Gawain's or PJ's position on this particular stance, I think I should point out to you that "say nice things about Islam or expect to be bombed a lot more" is not going to win a lot of converts to the idea that Islam is a religion of peace.
"A man who doesn't spend time with his family can never be a real man."
Don Vito Corleone: The Godfather, Part 1.
"Then wait for them and swear to God in heaven that if they spew that bull to you or your family again you will cave there heads in with a sledgehammer"
Strike for the South
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
Didn't Arafat recieve a Nobel Peace Prize... seems like and endorsemant to me...
RIP Tosa
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
You just cant help but blame everyone but the terrorists can you? Now not only is it America and Britains foriegn policy that brought the terrorism onto us, but its me and Gawain's mindset that has done it.So far it seems that it is yours and Panzers mindset that is fueling the hate and provides AQ with an endless stream of motivated terrorists.
This is ridiculous. Do you honestly believe the terrorists take our opinions of them into consideration? Do you think if me and Gawain said we loved them and gave them hugs they'd stop?
What the hell does that even mean? Our mindsets are giving AQ new recruits? What kind of mindset would you like me to have? Id be glad to change my mindset if you could provide any shred of evidence it would prevent AQ from getting new recruits. How sympathetic should I be? Do you want me to send them money?
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
Panzerjager, do you even realize how ironic this post is considering the statement my reply was directed at?
I guess not...
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
Showing desperate hatred against will not help it definitely, if you want me to clarify things.. That's for sure..LeftEyeNine, while I may not agree with Gawain's or PJ's position on this particular stance, I think I should point out to you that "say nice things about Islam or expect to be bombed a lot more" is not going to win a lot of converts to the idea that Islam is a religion of peace..
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
Yea, and? Your statement seems to be serious.Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny
You are their only hope.As are many on the left If everyone were like me and Panzer they would quit or be destroyed.
So far it seems that it is yours and Panzers mindset that is fueling the hate and provides AQ with an endless stream of motivated terrorists.
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
That was in 1994 after the Oslo accords. As much as I dislike Arafat, it had some logic at the time. However, the award should have officially been revoked when Arafat walked away from making further agreements in the later peace process and returned to terror. As far as I know, the award has never been taken away before...so there was lack of a precedent for doing so unfortunately. Now that he is dead, it is doubtful that the outrage will ever be corrected.
Rome Total War, it's not a game, it's a do-it-yourself project.
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
The point was, that Prager, Gawain and you accused "the world's" left of being responsible for terrorism.
However, when I reply that your mindset (i.e., the suggestions you made how this war on terror should be handled, e.g., provoking civil war in Iraq) is actually counterproductive and increases the support for AQ and their terrorist network you cry foul, accuse me of of blaming others than the terrorists themselves (extremely hypocritical considering your previous post) and claim that terrorists do not take our opinions into consideration - meaning that you directly contradict your and Gawain's posts in this thread.
Yes, very ironic I would say
Re: What the world owes Palestinians and the Left
That article is plain dumb. Putting all "lefties" in the same bag is just bullcrap. The way he blame the left, that's just poor demagogy. To demonize a group, ethnic cultural political or racial will always lead to bad things. Anyway, i have always think putting people in group as "lefties" or "righties" is an easy generalisation.
I am not defending people who defend or excuse terrorism. There's no excuse to that, only capital punishement.
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