Official list of factions and Q&A about them

[DukeofSerbia]

Hello ladies and gentlemen, fans and supporter of MTR: AOA and other forum members in.ORG.

Our team publish list of factions which will be included in Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition. Starting 31 factions are:

Factions are (alphabetical order):
Muslim:
1. Berbers
2. Egyptians
3. Khanate of Transoxiana
4. Moors
5. Timurids (emerging faction)
6. Turkic Sultanate
7. Volga Bulgaria

Orthodox:
8. Byzantine Empire
9. Georgia/Abkhazia/Sakartvelo
10. Republic of Novgorod
11. Rus
12. Serbia

Pagan:
13. Mongols (emerging faction)
14. Cumans (Qipchaqs)
15. Lithuania (emerging faction)

Roman Catholics:
16. Aragon
17. Bohemia
18. Danes
19. England
20. France
21. Holy Roman Empire
22. Hungary
23. Italo-Normans
24. Kingdom of Leon-Castile
25. Norway
26. Papacy
27. Poland,
28. Kingdom of Portugal
29. Scots
30. Ducate Venice

Plus:

31. Independents


List of factions is final. Mod will start in 1071.

Common Q&A has been erased as we don’t need it any more. Names of some factions are provisional.


P.S.
Can somebody from moderators make this topic sticky? Please.

[Cousin Zoidfarb]

Please consider these suggestions as your remaining factions:

1. The Teutonic order. Script them as an emerging 'horde' in the 1100's. I hear the 'horde' type of faction as been reintroduced as in BI. Historically they started in Jerusalem before moving to Hungary and finaly to Prussia where they created a large independant state.

2. The Knight's Hospitaler. Just like my idea for the Teutons. Granted land in Cyprus then Rhodes then Malta all the while fighting against the Mamlukes and Turks as an important naval power, they even fought against the Timurids.

3. Persia. Just as you have split the other islamic factions in three ( a great idea ) so can you do with this one. Khwarazm-Ilkhans-Timurids. The Khwarazmians fled to the middle east after the destruction of their state ( another horde-faction?) allied themselves with muslim rulers there, and after being defeated fled back to the mongols. The ilkhans and timurids had a lot of persian influence and i think deserve to be put in as the mongols were not unified and conflict existed between the golden horde, ilkhans and timurids. A 'Persian' faction which starts out as a muslim culture and ends up more mongol-persian later in the game would be a great addition.

4. Sweden

5. Another Russian principality....please

I'm not good with computers but offer to do some historical reasearch

[AliAS]

AWESOME , i m happy you want include Bohemia.
And good. a really dont need fight with aztecs so THX. to orientation to Europe and East

Teutonic order ? not bad Idea

[satchef1]

Nice factions list! Got a few suggestions for you:

What about the Navarrese? They would be quite a challenge dumped in between Castile, France and Aragon.
Volga Bulgaria for another Steppe faction?
Ireland? Not really a major player but they're an interesting faction to play as.
Genoa?
Sweden? As mentioned above, would be good to see them in.

I'd like to see Armenia in, would be fun to see them as a Horde at the start of the campaign!

[Kolkhi-2]

Nice factions list! Got a few suggestions for you:

What about the Navarrese? They would be quite a challenge dumped in between Castile, France and Aragon.
Volga Bulgaria for another Steppe faction?
Ireland? Not really a major player but they're an interesting faction to play as.
Genoa?
Sweden? As mentioned above, would be good to see them in.

I'd like to see Armenia in, would be fun to see them as a Horde at the start of the campaign!

1) yeah :) , I agree . when Turks invaded in south Caucasus, Armenian kingdom fall (after battle od Mantsikert in 1177) and Armenian nation never had the statement in Caucasus till 1918. Armenian land incorporated under Georgian Kingdom and late (XV c. ) in persian or ottomans empire.

but in 1080 ad Armenian prince Reuben established small principaliti in Cillicia, caled Armenia minor or Cillician Armenia, in XII c. ducke of Cillician Armenia was already as king and principaliti reorganized as a kingdom of Cillician Armenia.

2) genoa was not importent as Venice.

3) Ireland had not kingdoms as a Scotland or England

4) Volga Bulgaria not, but Bulgarian Kingdom was importent ortodox state, who was opponent for Bizantium Empire for Balkans domination.

[Rex_Pelasgorum]

Necesarily include a Valachian faction... !
I know that Walachia was founded only in the XIV century as a state (in the XV century it was strong enough to interfere in the internal bussines of the rising Ottoman Empire and fight and win major battles against it), but more or less pre-statal forms of organisation existed in the area from at least the IX century, and they were mentioned by the numerous chronicles of that time. Valachians took also an important role in the Vlach-Bulgarian kingdom from the XII, XIII centuries.... It would also , make the situation in the Balkans extremely interesting...

They should start as a protectorate of the Cumans, having controle over the provinces of Walachia and Carpathia. In Carpathia, they should enter in conflict with the Hungarians from the first turns of the game. Also, Hungarians should have a scripted possibility to choose wether to convert to catholicism or convert back to the old pagan ways. This should affect very much theyr culture type, theyr unit tech tree, giving to the player who chooses to play with them, much more freedom. This is accurate from a historicall point of view, as despite the conversion to christianity from 1000, violent pagan reactions took place in Hungary later on until the XII century.I can help alwo with suggestions about Hungary, as i speak (very badly) the language ,but sufficient for me to acces historicall databases.

Returning to Vallachia,

Aditional province of Dobrogea could be created, with its main city at Ticina, an island from the Danube, wich was for a long time a very important trade center of the Byzantine Empire, controlled by them in the begining.

Theyr starting units should be made out of low numbers of Razesi (decent peasant militias), Ciobani (shepherds) , Arcasi (archers), all very good ambushers with bonus in woods and mountains, but not capable of fighting efectivelly on the open field, they also be able to recruit some cuman units into their ranks. Light cavalry and peasant archers should be very important for theyr army, in the early times.

Later, unit tree could be made more diverse, as the Valachians started making better organization, and up into the XIV-XV century, the valachians could get more units, such as Boieri (noble cavalry), Rosiori (Medium Cavalry), Calarasi (Light Cavalry), Lefegii (mercenary armoured spearman), etc...It is not that hard for me to get you tons of images with such units, etc...

I hope you will take into account my proposals,

Sincerely,
Rex Pelasgorum

[SoupNazi]

Thank god some1 shares my exact thoughts of implementing walachia...very important,you just have to have them their the most adorable early guerrila troups you can have in the game. you guys should look up Mircea cel Batran and Vlad Tepes...yeah the guy everybody thinks was Dracula...veeery nice.

And now leaving patriotism aside...will you implement a civil war between the Yorks and the Lancastrians?

[satchef1]

2) genoa was not importent as Venice.

True, but they were important. Only 1 Italian faction would make things a little easy for Venice (i know the Papacy and Sicilians are in but The Pope isnt agressive and Sicily tends to build a Mediteranian empire rather than an Apennine one)

3) Ireland had not kingdoms as a Scotland or England

Yes, but they are very fun to play and did from time-to-time unite under one banner. All that was missing was someone strong enough to keep Ireland as one.

4) Volga Bulgaria not, but Bulgarian Kingdom was importent ortodox state, who was opponent for Bizantium Empire for Balkans domination.

Bulgaria are an important faction, yes. They dont exist at the time of the mod though so cant be included.

Volga Bulgaria on the other hand were active and important at the time of the mod. They controled a lot of the trade between Europe and Asia making them a very powerful player in the Steppes and as there is currently only one Steppe faction planned (the Rus) they would be an important addition.

[Lord Condormanius]

Q: Why there are only three Moslem factions? This is too few.
A: Technically there are three Moslem factions but in reality there are nine.

Moors – Al-Murabitun >>> Al-Muwahid >>> Nasrids
Egypt – Fatimids >>> Ayyubids >> Mamluks
Turkish Sultanate – Great Seljuk >>> Seljuk of Rum >>> Osmanli Oghullarï

However, because there is 31 faction’s slots team have internal discussion and only what can I say is that we’ll be put additional Moslem factions, but they’ll be secret for some period.

Don't forget. The mongols converted to Islam. I'll have to check on the year, but it was before they hit Kiev.

[Tenebrae]

Hey,

Congrats on the taking of such a great enterprise, bla bla bla...

So, I don't get it. Why do you take the Condado Portucalense/Portugal faction out of the mod?
It was the first european nation to establish an Atlantic projection which was relevant and it was one of the major players in western Europe in the period which is portrayed in the game (in MTW2, that is - don't know if you guys are thinking of changing the period for MTR) Too bad it sank after that...

'Though I can't think of any faction-specific units I'll be more than glad to collect some historically accurate information for your project, in my free time, of course....

PS: Yes, I am Portuguese

Cheers

[Tenebrae]

Sorry, just checked the time period in the FAQ...still my point is the same, except for the Atlantic projection part...:P

[satchef1]

I'll have a guess at this and say its because Portuagal didnt really exist as a nation until 1128. The mod starts about 50 years prior to that

Portugal gained its first de jure independence (as Kingdom of Galicia and Portugal) in 1065 under the rule of Garcia II. Due to feudal power struggles, Portuguese and Galician nobles rebelled. In 1072, the country rejoined León and Castile under Garcia II's brother Alphonso VI of Castile.

Portugal traces its national origin to 24 June 1128 with the Battle of São Mamede. Afonso proclaimed himself first Prince of Portugal and in 1139 the first King of Portugal. By 1143, with the assistance of a representative of the Holy See at the conference of Zamora, Portugal was formally recognized as independent, with the prince recognized as Dux Portucalensis. In 1179, Afonso I was declared, by the Pope, as king. After the Battle of São Mamede, the first capital of Portugal was Guimarães, from which the first king ruled. Later, when Portugal was already officially independent, he ruled from Coimbra.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Portugal

[SLK]

Please consider these suggestions as your remaining factions:

1. The Teutonic order. Script them as an emerging 'horde' in the 1100's. I hear the 'horde' type of faction as been reintroduced as in BI. Historically they started in Jerusalem before moving to Hungary and finaly to Prussia where they created a large independant state.

2. The Knight's Hospitaler. Just like my idea for the Teutons. Granted land in Cyprus then Rhodes then Malta all the while fighting against the Mamlukes and Turks as an important naval power, they even fought against the Timurids.

This could make a very interesting non-playable feature. Have these two orders as emergant factions, disable their ai, move their armies via script and allocate them provinces following their historical progression and once they reach a desired ‘state’ un-freeze the ai.

MTR please consider as this would add a unique angle to your mod.

[slav frunze]

Teutonic order would be a very interesting addition.

Should cause a few problems for the Rus, Poles and Lithuanians.

[oj121]

Wales by any chance???

[Cronos Impera]

I think the best candidade for our extra Orthodox faction would be the Romano-Bulgarian Empire. It is basicily the empire founded by the Asen brothers (vlachs) that strached from Wallachia to Bulgaria. However shortlived the Empire was (it was later bulgarised). Defeated Byzantine Emperours Isac and Alexeius Anghelous, waged war with the Latin Roman Empire and aided the byzantines to recapture Constantinopole.

[Darkarbiter]

what about the swiss? I know their a bit late but they still made quite a big impact.

[Tenebrae]

Satchfe:

You are referring to Portugal, hence me mentioning the Condado Portucalense (which existed as Condado de Portvcale -a county inserted into the kingdom of Galicia - since 868. Granted to Henry of Borgogne on 1095 by King Alphonso VI of Leon for his help in the Iberian Reconquista movement, having its name changed to Condado Portucalense - or Portuguese County, in English). The Condado Portucalense actually engulfed the lands of Portus Cale (nowadays Porto), the County of Coimbra (taken from the Moors in 1091) and the southern galician parish of Tui. It had complete independent "administrative" rule from Leon.

1091 is usually considered to be the date of the begginning of the Portuguese Reconquista, 1095 the founding of Portugal (Portucale), as an independent county. Quoting the wiki you posted: "At the end of the 11th century, the Burgundian knight Henry became count of Portugal and defended his independence, merging the County of Portucale and the County of Coimbra. Henry declared independence for Portugal while a civil war raged between Leon and Castile."

In fact, the battle of S. Mamede you referred, and which is in fact the event which is normally considered to be the "founding battle"...it is not so. It was more of a struggle for independence from D. Afonso Henriques, fending off his mother's attack (D. Teresa of Leon) on Portuguese independence at S. Mamede. Once D. Afonso Henriques won in S.Mamede he had no more worries from the Leonese crown and was free to truly begin moving south towards Olisippo(Lisbon) and the Algarve...

[Tenebrae]

I forgot to mention that the official recognition in 1143 was merely a political powerplay from the part of D. Afonso Henriques to ensure the Leonese wouldn't try and seize the county once again.
Btw...Afonso Henriques is Henry's son. (and the first Dux Portvcalensis)
So, as you can see, considering the inclusion of Serbian ducates under Roman rule in the mod, I just think it to be fair for the Condado Portucalense/Portugal to be included. Given that after the Reconquista Portugal would become, together with the kingdom of Spain one of the, if not THE, most powerful nations in the whole of Western Europe...

Cheers

[DukeofSerbia]

First post is slightly updated.

Knight’s Orders will be not factions. They will be represented as is in vanilla through units.

I think the best candidade for our extra Orthodox faction would be the Romano-Bulgarian Empire. It is basicily the empire founded by the Asen brothers (vlachs) that strached from Wallachia to Bulgaria. However shortlived the Empire was (it was later bulgarised). Defeated Byzantine Emperours Isac and Alexeius Anghelous, waged war with the Latin Roman Empire and aided the byzantines to recapture Constantinopole.

If mod starts 1072 (slightly possible) Bulgaria had high chance to be playable faction alongside with Armenians and both if will be included will be horde. If mod starts 1066 (90%) then still there is a chance that Bulgaria and/or Armenians will be additional emerging factions from 1186 and/or 1072.

Wales by any chance???

No.

Volga Bulgaria on the other hand were active and important at the time of the mod. They controled a lot of the trade between Europe and Asia making them a very powerful player in the Steppes and as there is currently only one Steppe faction planned (the Rus) they would be an important addition.

Actually, steppe factions are Cumans and later emerging Mongols. And yes, Volga Bulgars are in (you “busted” our surprise ).

[Darkarbiter]

So uhh how will the swiss rebellion from the holy roman empire be fitted in?

[Kmotr]

Ireland had not kingdoms as a Scotland or England??

Im sure that Irish has the same kingdim as Scotland,and the same kingdom as Bohemia...
And there is enough space for Irish,island is empty(only Rebels)
Its also great challenge to try defeat the strongest enemy like England(alliance with Scotland?)
And from history side,is it still "heat" topic( Northern Ireland)
So I think that Irish has they part in history and in MTR also..

[Fisherking]

Ireland is certainly over simplified in the game but so are others. It wasn't even fully subdued until the 17th century and had more than enough color for its own game. The problem of Ireland becoming a power was that they could never put aside their differences long enough to drive the English out.

The island does need 4 or 5 provinces and Scotland could use more as well...but then again, so could most everything else.

I am sure it would be a favorite of many, however. But not just as a single province the way it is set up now.

[Lord Condormanius]

It wasn't even fully subdued until the 17th century.

Some might argue that it was never "fully subdued." In fact, the English policy toward Ireland was somewhat standoffish at first, they were already tied up in dealing with France. It wasn't until after King Henry II noticed that some of his subjects (Strongbow) had managed to acquire pretty sizeable chunks of Ireland that England even cared enough to pay attention (1171). And yes, it probably wasn't until the time of Oliver Cromwell that England would assert their influence over most of the island.

I think that for Ireland to work, there needs to be at least 3 more Irish territories (perhaps, Waterford, Galway and Armagh). These should probably added even if Ireland isn't playable.

[Tazmanius]

Ok..some points ...

In response to the recent immediate discussion...Ireland as a viable Medieval Kingdom...sorry..No...It was at best a bit player during the majority of the Medieval period...and what influence it did have(at a pretty local level was disjointed and factionalized).Wales at the same time had more influence and impact on the Medieval History of England than Ireland did...In fact..pre Bannockburn..Wales virtually outdid Scotland in terms of it's resistance to the English and the influence it exerted on the political map at the time.

Q's related to the English/Welsh/Scottish/Irish issues...given the province limitations...what number of provinces will be given to the above nations...?
Suggestions might be to double the number of initial start provinces in the British Isles...Wales..2..North and South but with the Eastern area integrated,as the Marches..as hostile(rebel)territory in England..to be subdued and perhaps with a good chance of revolt over a sustained period.

Wals(2)..Gwynedd,Deheubarth or Glamorgan...
Scotland(4)..2 Initial..2 rebel?
Ireland(2)..Area around Dublin..which was the main Anglicized area...and another province making up the rest.
England(6)..Marches/Mercia..East Anglia,Kent,Wessex,York,Lancaster?..Marches,York and Lancaster all rebel to start..to simulate the difficulty the Normans had in subduing the latter 2 and also the continuing border warfare in the Marches between the Marcher Lords and the Welsh?

Also for consideration..a doubling of the various provinces of mainland European France...for a better simulation of the 400 years of war that went on between the Anglo-Normans/English and the French...
On a related note,,,Found a map on the net that perports to detail the various kingdoms,principalities etc. and some ethnic territories circa 1100 AD..could be useful for extended province mapping and for determining the major factions for inclusion.

Note regarding muslims...would definitely include Abbasid and Fatamid branches as seperate entities as their religious doctrine led to much conflict between them..

[Lord Condormanius]

Ok..some points ...

...Ireland as a viable Medieval Kingdom...sorry..No...It was at best a bit player during the majority of the Medieval period...

I would call that a very generous appraisal.

[Antagonist]

I had understood that a Kingdom of Ireland existed in that various records attest to the existence of such a title and that a particular individual was occasionally recognised as such by other monarchs and the Pope etc. (prior to the Norman colony) but that it was, at best, a HRE level of unity, an agglomeration of independent-minded princedoms who only really cooperated if the leader was strong, and that crucially the title was never converted to a dynastic inheritance. But you could hardly call it a great power, and what influence it had was largely a vestige of it's social and religious influence in previous centuries.

Having a single province with Dublin as the capital doesn't seem that accurate though, as it was only made greatly significant by the Norman colony which wasn't established for almost a century after the start date. Also, going on the assumption that an "English" occupation was inevitable sooner or later ignores the presence of Scotland as a faction, a country with which it had vastly more in common (the Irish and Highland Scots being near-enough identical at this juncture) and therefore could more easily be fitted into. However, historically the only Scottish attempt to "liberate" Ireland was made by Robert Bruce later then English involvement.

Antagonist

[satchef1]

And yes, Volga Bulgars are in (you “busted” our surprise ).

class wonder who the other one is?

[Kepper]

Any possibility of Portugal as emerging faction in MTR they came in MTW 2


(Portugal came into existence as an independent nation on June 24, 1128, when Afonso Henriques, Count of Portugal, defeated his mother in battle, Countess Teresa, and her lover, Fernão Peres de Trava, thereby establishing himself as sole leader. Afonso Henriques proclaimed himself king of Portugal on July 25, 1139, after the Battle of Ourique and was recognized as such in 1143 by Alfonso VII, king of León and Castile, and in 1179 by Pope Alexander III.

Afonso and his successors, aided by military monastic orders, pushed southward to drive out the Moors, as the size of Portugal covered about half of its present area. In 1249, this Reconquista ended with the capture of the Algarve on the southern coast.

In 1373, Portugal made an alliance with England, which is the longest-standing alliance in the world. In the following decades, Portugal spearheaded the exploration of the world and undertook the Age of Discovery. Prince Henry the Navigator, son of King João I, became the main sponsor and patron of this endeavor.

In 1383, the king of Castile, husband of the daughter of the Portuguese king who had died without a male heir, claimed his throne. An ensuing popular revolt led to the 1383-1385 Crisis. A faction of petty noblemen and commoners, led by John of Aviz (later John I), seconded by General Nuno Álvares Pereira, defeated the Castilians in the Battle of Aljubarrota. This celebrated battle is still a symbol of glory and the struggle for independence from neighboring Spain.

In 1415, the Portuguese empire arose when a fleet conquered Ceuta, a prosperous Islamic trade center in North Africa. There followed the first discoveries in the Atlantic: Madeira and the Azores, which led to the first colonization movements)

[Stratos]

Catalan-Aragonese is the correct name for the Aragonese faction, cause is the union of both kingdoms, both conserving same rights and privilieges and some autonomy, Saying only Aragon is like calling the Austro-Hungarian empire only Austria.
My two cents