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Thread: How to Attract Guilds

  1. #1
    BLEEEE! Senior Member Daveybaby's Avatar
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    Default How to Attract Guilds

    From perusing the contents of export_descr_guilds.txt i have determined the following:

    Each guild type has 3 levels, to get a guild at each level the player has to score a certain number of points for either their faction overall, or for that particular settlement.

    Guild: 100 points
    Masters Guild: 250 points
    Guild HQ: 500 points

    The player gains (and loses) points for each guild for each settlement, and for their entire faction, by performing certain deeds. In general, settlements will gain more per deed (typically 10-30 points) than the overall faction score (typically 1-5 points per deed).

    Not sure how the overall faction score works, presumably if your overall faction score exceeds the required amount you will get offered a guild even if none of your individual settlements qualify - thus you can still get guilds by, say, training lots of priests all over the place - but it will still be far quicker if you train them all in the same settlement.

    Agents can also gain points. Assume that this is once per agent, and that these points add to the overall faction score. Edit: hmmm... this may refer to achievements rather than agents.

    Edit: According to work done by Kobal2fr it looks probable that all scores are added to each settlement, or at least the settlement and overall faction scores are (dont know about the agent stuff yet).

    Edit: Eldon made the observation that the three tags in export_descr_guilds.txt refer to the specific settlement, other settlements, and all settlements, respectively. This makes a whole lot more sense than the whole the whole faction and agent scores i came up with, so i've edited the stuff below to reflect this.

    In summary, points are gained for:
    1. The specific settlement where the event occurred.
    2. All settlements other than where the event occurred (usually a smaller number of points).
    3. All settlements regardless of where the event occurred.

    General
    Upgrade a guild (+20 settlement bonus for that guild type, +10 to other settlements)
    Destroy a guild building (huge penalty for that guild type, -100 settlement, -20 others)
    Upgrade a settlement (+10 settlement bonus for all guild types)
    Every 25 turns every settlement loses 1 point for all guilds (or 1 point every turn after turn 25?)

    Missions
    Bonuses are also given for successfully completing a guild mission, but failing to complete the guild mission will incur a penalty for that guild type.

    The following guilds offer missions:
    Assassin's/Hashashim's Guild
    Merchant's Guild
    Explorer's Guild
    Theologian's Guild
    Thieves Guild

    Assassin's/Hashashim's Guild
    Train assassin/hashashim: +10 settlement
    Successful Assassinations: +20 all settlements
    Governor with dread >4: +4 settlement bonus (per turn?)
    Build brothel series buildings: +10/15/20/25/30 settlement, +0/0/0/2/5 others
    Succeed/Fail guild mission: +/-10 all settlements

    Alchemist's Guild
    Train Cannons etc: +10/15/20 settlement
    Train handgunners etc: +15 settlement
    Build cannon maker series: +10/15/20/25/30 settlement, +1/2/3/4/5 others

    Explorer's Guild
    Train merchants: +10 settlement
    Build shipbuilding buildings: +15/20/25/30 settlement, +0/0/2/5 others
    Build merchants wharf series: +20/25/30 settlement, +0/2/5 others
    Fleet distance from capital 50-99: +3 all settlements
    Fleet distance from capital >100 : +5 all settlements
    Succeed/Fail Explorer guild mission: +/-30 all settlements

    Horse Breeder's Guild
    Train cavalry: +10 settlement, +1 others
    Build stables series: +10/15/20/25/30 settlement, +1/2/3/4/5 others
    Build racetrack/sultan's ractrack +50/75 settlement, +5 others
    Governor throws races: +5 settlement

    Mason's Guild
    Build Stone wall series: +10/15/20 settlement, +2/2/3 others
    Build mustering halls series: +10/15/20/25/30 settlement, +2/2/2/2/3 others
    Build town watch series: +10/15/20/25/30 settlement +2/2/2/2/3 others
    Build armourer series: +10/15/15/20/25/30 settlement +2/2/2/2/2/3 others
    Build bowyer series: +10/15/20/30 settlement +2/2/2/3 others

    Merchant's Guild
    Train merchants: +10 settlement
    Build merchants wharf series: +20/25/30 settlement, +0/2/5 others
    Build market series: +10/15/20/25 settlement, +0/0/2/5 others
    Make trade agreement: +10 all settlements
    Successful aquisition: +10 all settlements
    Income > 1000/2000/5000/10000: +1/2/3/4 all settlements(per turn?)
    Succeed/Fail merchant's guild mission: +/- 10/20 all settlements (depending on difficulty?)

    Swordsmith's Guild
    Build armourer series: +10/15/15/20/25/30 settlement, +0/0/0/1/2/5 others
    Train sword unit: +15 settlement
    Units: Sword and Buckler Men, Sudanese Tribesmen, Swordsmen Militia, Armored Swordsmen, Highland Nobles, Zweihander, Noble Swordsmen, Forlorn Hope, Byzantine Infantry, Battlefield Assassins, Norse Swordsmen, Dismounted Feudal Knights, Dismounted Chivalric Knights, Dismounted Gothic Knights, Dismounted Conquistadores, Dismounted Italian MAA, Dismounted Broken Lances, Dismounted Norman Knights, Dismounted Polish Knights, Dismounted E Chivalric Knights, Dismounted Byzantine Lancers, Dismounted Latinkon, Hashishim, Urban Militia, Dismounted Christian Guard

    Theologian's Guild
    Train Priests: +10 settlement
    Build church/masjid series: +10/15/20/25/30 settlement, +0/0/1/2/5 others
    Get your cardinal elected pope: +30 all settlements
    Governor's piety >5: +5 settlement (per turn?)
    Succeed/Fail theologian's guild mission: +/-10 all settlements
    Priest becomes a heretic: -5 all settlements

    Thieves Guild
    Train spies: +10 settlement
    Build brothel series: +10/15/20/25/30 settlement
    Governor with dread >4: +2 settlement (per turn?)
    Spy in a settlement: +2 all settlements (per turn?)
    Succeed/Fail theives guild mission: +/-10 all settlements

    Woodsman's Guild
    Recruit archers (England only!): +10/15/20 settlement (depending on unit)
    Build brothel series: +10/15/20/25/30 settlement, +0/0/0/2/5 others
    Governor with chivalry >4: +5 settlement (per turn?)

    Various Knight's Chapter Houses
    General joins crusade: +25 all settlements
    General abandons crusade: -25 all settlements
    Recruit Specialist Knight: +10 settlement, +1 others (knight type tied to guild type)
    Governor Chivalry >4: +5 settlement

    St. John's guild get a +10 settlement, +1 others bonus when the settlement has muslim neighbours
    St. John's guild get a +10 bonus for all settlements when you declare war on a muslim faction.
    Teutonic guild get a +10 settlement, +1 others bonus when the settlement has pagan neighbours
    Last edited by Daveybaby; 12-08-2006 at 09:44.

  2. #2
    Member Member Whoz'onE's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Great analysis - thanks Daveybaby.

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    Member Member Zenicetus's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Interesting info, thanks!

    Either the data is incomplete or else I'm getting a bug in my game with the Explorer's Guild. I'm playing Spain, and the Explorer's Guild just offered me a mission to take the city of Pamplona from the Portuguese (who I'm currently not at war with). That seemed really odd. I suspect it might be mixed up somehow with what should normally be a Council of Nobles mission.

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    Village special needs person Member Kobal2fr's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Very interesting, and fits neatly with what I had figured.

    I'd say that the "faction" score gets added to every single city's score. I don't believe there would be a point to have two separate tallies when one does the trick.
    Anything wrong ? Blame it on me. I'm the French.

  5. #5
    Member Member dismal's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Agent points = faction points? That seems odd. Are you sure about that?

    I guess it makes more sense than settlement points.

    But what are explorer's guild agents? Ships? If I fail to take a settlement that the expolrer's guild asks me to take I lose 30 points per ship? That's a lot of points.

    I say this not being sure why it would be all that great to have a lot of Explorer's guild points to begin with. Presumably it gets you the wordwide headquarters. If it's not already built somewhere else. But I'm not sure what the wordwide explorer's guild HQ gets you.

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    Member Member andrewt's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Ouch, I'm playing as Russia right now and they have no units that give points for a swordsmith's guild. Turkey seems to have it bad, too, with Hashishims the only unit they have that gives points. It also took me forever to get any with Venice, as I found the Venetian heavy infantry way better than the dismounted feudal knights and only built the knights when I was facing the Mongols and didn't have enough Venetian heavy in queue.

    Guess I will now start to use an inland province to make my priests and spies and will put quite a few on a certain province. I'd like my coastal cities to have merchant's.

  7. #7
    BLEEEE! Senior Member Daveybaby's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobal2fr
    I'd say that the "faction" score gets added to every single city's score. I don't believe there would be a point to have two separate tallies when one does the trick.
    That would make perfect sense, just dunno if thats what actually happens, or if it's separate - i.e.

    IF (settlement points > threshold) OR (faction points > threshold)

    vs

    IF (settlement points + faction points > threshold)

    Quote Originally Posted by dismal
    Agent points = faction points? That seems odd. Are you sure about that?
    No, not really.
    Just a guess, but it makes sense that the summation of all agent points are added to your faction total - you cant really add them to any one settlement, and the agents cant do anything with them themselves.

    But what are explorer's guild agents? Ships? If I fail to take a settlement that the expolrer's guild asks me to take I lose 30 points per ship? That's a lot of points.
    w.r.t. fleet distances the agents are the fleet admirals. w.r.t. missions then it depends on the mission i guess, but it should be fairly straightforward based on what the mission involves.

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    Member Member Hashashiyyin's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Funny, for the turks, the only sword unit you listed for the swordsmith's guild is hashishim. but you can't build hashashim in a city unless you already have the hashashim guild! thus it appears you can never have the swordsmith's guild as the turns unless you build a LOT of armor factories

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    BLEEEE! Senior Member Daveybaby's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by Hashashiyyin
    Funny, for the turks, the only sword unit you listed for the swordsmith's guild is hashishim. but you can't build hashashim in a city unless you already have the hashashim guild! thus it appears you can never have the swordsmith's guild as the turns unless you build a LOT of armor factories
    Bear in mind its only 100 points for the first level guild. You get +10 for a first level armourer, then another +15 for the second level, and +20 for third.

    So its either 4 cities at level 2 armourer, or just 2 at level 3 (plus one at level 1). Not too traumatic, especially if you bear in mind that most of the sword units are only available after 2 or 3 levels of barracks upgrades anyway.

    Edit: cant believe i posted that, it's garbage.
    Only the settlement points for that settlement will be cumulative, so you would probably have to build all 5 levels of armourer in a settlement in order to get a swordsmith's, unless you build a LOT of armourers elsewhere.
    Last edited by Daveybaby; 12-06-2006 at 08:37.

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    Member Member Varigg's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    One correction: Teutonic Knights get the points for Pagan neighbors, not muslim.

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    BLEEEE! Senior Member Daveybaby's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by Varigg
    One correction: Teutonic Knights get the points for Pagan neighbors, not muslim.
    Fixed, thanks - lazy copy-paste error

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    Member Member dismal's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by Daveybaby
    w.r.t. fleet distances the agents are the fleet admirals. w.r.t. missions then it depends on the mission i guess, but it should be fairly straightforward based on what the mission involves.
    Well, my latest mission from the explorer's guild is "Take Dublin".

    Not something that can be done by an admiral or a ship.

    There'd be a fairly significant difference on those distance bonuses beween agents being admirals v. ships. I tend to keep my ships in big stacks. I could split up a stack of ships and have a bunch more admirals.

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    Captain Obvious Member Maizel's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    How does one get an Hashashim guild then?

  14. #14
    BLEEEE! Senior Member Daveybaby's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by Maizel
    How does one get an Hashashim guild then?
    Functionally identical to assassin's guild. Fixed text, thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by dismal
    Well, my latest mission from the explorer's guild is "Take Dublin". Not something that can be done by an admiral or a ship.
    Quote Originally Posted by daveybaby
    w.r.t. missions then it depends on the mission i guess, but it should be fairly straightforward based on what the mission involves.
    I would guess it goes to the general of the conquering army in that case. Shrug. You know as much as i do on that score.

    There'd be a fairly significant difference on those distance bonuses beween agents being admirals v. ships. I tend to keep my ships in big stacks. I could split up a stack of ships and have a bunch more admirals.
    The file definitely specifies admirals. It probably needs to be ranked admirals - i.e. if you split up a fleet you can recombine them straight away - but if the new admiral gains a star in combat you wont be able to recombine them any more. So i would expect that only 'proper' admirals would count.

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    Relentless Bughunter Senior Member FactionHeir's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    I am quite impressed at your list, good work.

    Now that still does not explain why I never get swordsman guild (except from settlements I conquer) and I never got Mason, Woodsman and Theologians either. And I am constantly at my priest agent limit, trained lots of archers (when I was brit) and always build those buildings you mentioned first for pre-reqs.

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    Member Member dismal's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by Daveybaby
    I would guess it goes to the general of the conquering army in that case. Shrug. You know as much as i do on that score.
    I guess it would just accrue to the faction score anyway. Unless there is a reason to believe that guild points have some meaning at the individual agent level.

    I appreciate that we're doing a bit of speculating here. Thanks for the work you did.

  17. #17
    Village special needs person Member Kobal2fr's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by Daveybaby
    That would make perfect sense, just dunno if thats what actually happens, or if it's separate - i.e.

    IF (settlement points > threshold) OR (faction points > threshold)

    vs

    IF (settlement points + faction points > threshold)
    I know, I know, it's just that... well, if they are indeed separate, it means that for a city to get say Assassin HQ on its own, you'd have to build no less than 40 assassins (FOURTY !) out of it, since top brothel = 100 pts total. And that's not taking into account the -1 per 25 turns thing.

    That's a LOT of assassins sent to die of door-induced broken noses

    Besides, I'm pretty sure faction is added to city total because I've managed to have a basic Theologian Guild built in Paris just like I wanted to, about 25 turns from the start. Here goes the facts :

    - Total provinces owned = 9,
    - one successful crusade,
    - best church a type 3 church in Paris, other regions have type 2 ones, if that. Priests trained everywhere (1 priest per region, all local trained). One pope (who lasted one turn before kicking the bucket too ) , a couple of priests turned heretic. Got the guild when I trained 2 more priests out of Paris (to replace those heretic blighters).

    None of that would equal 100 total points on its own, but :

    30 (priests, local) + 30 (pope, faction) + 45 (church, local) = 105. Minus 10 for priests turned heretic (faction), add a few turns of King Philip before he got his Pagan Magician (local (*)), that's just enough for a basic guild, which is what I got. But the math doesn't work if you take away the faction points.

    What I'm really wondering about is wether agent points are faction-wide, or added to the city that built them originally...

    (*) Have you managed to find out what triggers these BTW ? I swear I've never had a general without David Copperfield in tow sooner or later, even devout Christian knightly knights travelling with two bishops :/
    Anything wrong ? Blame it on me. I'm the French.

  18. #18
    Member Member dismal's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    I had a look through the export_descr_guilds file.

    There are three different types of guild points awarded "s", "a" and "o".

    I think you are probably right that "s = settlement" and "a = agent". I would speculate that maybe "o" means "ongoing". The orders of magnitude of the numbers seem about right for that.

    For examples, if you build an Abbey you get 20 theological guild points immediatetly, and 2 ongoing (i.e., per turn).

    I really wonder what the "a" points do. One thing is clear, they are for events that can't be neatly tied to a settlement. Someof them can't be neatly tied to an agent either. Getting a pope elected gets you 30 "a" points, for example, but you no longer have the character. If you fail a thief mission you get negative "a" points, but which spy would get them?

    On second thought, maybe the "a" means "all" settlements. In some ways, this makes more sense.

    Also, to correct the OP, it looks like you get some "s" points for the Woodsman's guild by building the brothel line.

    Also had a look through export_descr_ancillaries and guilds do trigger certain beneficial ancillaries. An explorers guild can help you get an Intrepid Explorer, Amerigo Vespucci, Marco Polo or Vasco De Gama for a governor or a Naval Navigator for an Admiral.

  19. #19
    Village special needs person Member Kobal2fr's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by dismal
    I had a look through the export_descr_guilds file.

    There are three different types of guild points awarded "s", "a" and "o".

    I think you are probably right that "s = settlement" and "a = agent". I would speculate that maybe "o" means "ongoing". The orders of magnitude of the numbers seem about right for that.

    For examples, if you build an Abbey you get 20 theological guild points immediatetly, and 2 ongoing (i.e., per turn).

    I really wonder what the "a" points do. One thing is clear, they are for events that can't be neatly tied to a settlement. Someof them can't be neatly tied to an agent either. Getting a pope elected gets you 30 "a" points, for example, but you no longer have the character. If you fail a thief mission you get negative "a" points, but which spy would get them?

    On second thought, maybe the "a" means "all" settlements. In some ways, this makes more sense.

    Also, to correct the OP, it looks like you get some "s" points for the Woodsman's guild by building the brothel line.

    Also had a look through export_descr_ancillaries and guilds do trigger certain beneficial ancillaries. An explorers guild can help you get an Intrepid Explorer, Amerigo Vespucci, Marco Polo or Vasco De Gama for a governor or a Naval Navigator for an Admiral.
    "o" for "overall" perhaps ? But overtime could work as well.

    "a" for achievement instead of agent would be my guess.
    Anything wrong ? Blame it on me. I'm the French.

  20. #20
    Confiscator of Swords Member dopp's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    The triggers for ancilliaries can be found in export_desc_ancilliaries. The chance of picking up a pagan magician is 2% every turn in any land where the population is less than 90% of your religion. No wonder they are so common. I think the trigger should has been reversed (ie it's a minor typo/bug). It should be if more than 90% of the population is NOT of your religion.

    Another one is secret love. A flat 5% chance EVERY TURN for any princess to acquire one is just asking to be modded out. There are only 2 ancilliaries that give a princess bonus charm (and one of them isn't even working: there is no trigger for faithful servant) and plenty that take away (but most only trigger at birth based on the father's VnVs. There is also a tendency for princesses to acquire useless ancilliaries (tutor) on birth because the code doesn't include checks to exclude them from the triggers.

    The rest seem mostly ok, ancilliaries have never been as harsh as say VnVs.
    Last edited by dopp; 12-06-2006 at 00:46.

  21. #21
    Grand Duke of Zilch Member supadodo's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Guilds

    Hey uh can someone help me here. Ok here it goes. Ive been past the gunpowder age and I want an alchemist guild to set up shop in my settlements. According to the export_desc_guilds, I am supposed to build cannons and handgunners and the cannon makers. SO I pump these guys out like mad but still no alchemist guild. Also there are no other guilds currentlly present in the cities which i am producing them and I've yet to see other factions towing a cannon with them. I'm Turks btw.

  22. #22
    BLEEEE! Senior Member Daveybaby's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Guilds

    @Kobal: Yeah, looks like youre right - they are added. Nice one - will change OP to reflect this.

    I think i figured "a" was for agents, because most of those events are based around agents, e.g:
    Code:
    Trigger 0090_Exploring_Fleet
        WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd
    
        Condition AgentType = admiral
              and DistanceCapital > 50
              and DistanceCapital < 100
    
        Guild explorers_guild a 3
    But youre right, that could be achivements as well.

    @dismal: i doubt "o" is "ongoing" - if those values were added every turn it wouldnt take much to get most of those guilds. "overall" seems much more sensible, which i took to mean "overall faction score".

    Also, to correct the OP, it looks like you get some "s" points for the Woodsman's guild by building the brothel line.
    Heh, yeah - i did have that in there already - but managed to somehow delete half of the line, along with half of another line regarding governor chivalry - oops. Fixed now.

    @Supadodo: no idea sorry, we are feeling our way around this at the moment. I would suggest concentrate on pumping those cannons out of just one province and see what happens.
    Last edited by Daveybaby; 12-06-2006 at 09:21.

  23. #23
    Member Member dismal's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by Daveybaby
    @dismal: i doubt "o" is "ongoing" - if those values were added every turn it wouldnt take much to get most of those guilds. "overall" seems much more sensible, which i took to mean "overall faction score".
    Well, I am operating on the hypothesis that only settlements accrue guild points. We know settlements get them and how they use them, but have no idea what factions or agents would do with them.

    2 or 3 points per turn doesn't strike me as all that excessive for an advanced building. I have gotten several master guilds and guild HQ's, and it doesn't seem like I've trained up anywhere near enough agents to get to 500 points.

    If you built a cathedral, for example you'd only get a total of 70 "s" points. You'd have to train 43 priests there to get to 500 for the settlement on "s" points alone.

    But if you are also getting 1, 2 then 5 "o" points per turn and some occasional "a" points from denouncements and cardinal or pope elections, making 500 seems reasonable within 100 turns or so.

    I suppose this is a testable theory. We should be able to predict the exact turn a settlement would get offered a guild if we control for all the variables. Assuming they all start at zero guild points.

  24. #24
    Guardian of the Fleet Senior Member Shahed's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Guilds

    Excellent thread here, been referring to it all day.

    You know what's funny ? I just got an offer for Horse Breeder's Guild in a city where I never produced a single cavalry unit, BUT I held monthly races (to keep unrest down while I rush to catch up on contentment bonus buildings). I got the offer after like 3 turns. So you don't have to go through the whole build loads of cavalry, just hold races instead. Considering the recruitment cost and upkeep, you probably better off with monthly races. I'm taking about Turks, don't know if Catholic or Orthodox factions have racetracks.

    BTW the Swordsmith's guild is basically out for the Turks as you can't build 2 guilds in the same location, hence you can't have a HashashiN Guild AND Swordsmith's Guild in the same city.

    Any workaround for this ? Is there even any point to having the Swordsmith's Guild for Islamic factions, since you don't have any ' knights' ?
    Last edited by Shahed; 12-06-2006 at 16:40.
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  25. #25
    Confiscator of Swords Member dopp's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Guilds

    Swordsmiths give +1 attack to all melee troops. You can only get them offered in castles though. Islamic heavy cavalry counts as knights for recruitment purposes, I think, as do katatanks.

    You could simply capture the swordsmiths off some hapless victims. Just about every AI castle I've captured has one. Imagine, endless streams of JHI queueing up at some "liberated" swordsmith to get +1 attack. Extra shiny halberds.

  26. #26
    Magister Vitae Senior Member Kraxis's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Guilds

    Btw, looking at the unit file I can't see any skin for upgraded weapons, but are there? Can you see upgraded weapons in battles? I ask because the game has refused to offer me any swordsmiths.
    You may not care about war, but war cares about you!


  27. #27
    Member Member Musashi's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Guilds

    I was offered a swordsmiths guild playing as Russia after building a crapload of woodsmen and dismounted Druzhina and Boyar's Sons... All of which are axe troops. So apparently axe troops count as sword based for the purposes of being offered a swordsmith's guild (My guess is it's just a matter of building non-spear infantry...)
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  28. #28
    Confiscator of Swords Member dopp's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Guilds

    Musashi is probably right... the game only differentiates between missile, spear and heavy infantry (sword, axe, halberd, bill) so building the heavy infantry should work. Hybrid units may count as either heavy infantry or missile depending on which aspect they emphasize more. Of course, historically spear and heavy infantry are pretty much the same thing (the French and English knights at Agincourt fought on foot in a "push of pike" using their lances) so the distinction is mostly an artificial one intended to improve gameplay.

    Not all units have the upgraded weapon graphic. Your knights' lances get some sort of shiny chisel head and your spearmen get broad-bladed spears. Other than that it's hard to tell. Doesn't your unit card show the bronze weapon upgrade symbol?

  29. #29
    Sardonic Antipodean Member Trithemius's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Girls^H^H^H^H^H Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by Hashashiyyin
    Funny, for the turks, the only sword unit you listed for the swordsmith's guild is hashishim. but you can't build hashashim in a city unless you already have the hashashim guild! thus it appears you can never have the swordsmith's guild as the turns unless you build a LOT of armor factories
    I noted this as well. Extremely annoying actually. Also, all the likely foot units for swordsmith guild chance bonuses are built in cities - so it looks like you are out of luck if you want guilds in castles if you are a Turk. :(
    Trithemius
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  30. #30
    Sardonic Antipodean Member Trithemius's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to Attract Guilds

    Quote Originally Posted by dopp
    Musashi is probably right... the game only differentiates between missile, spear and heavy infantry (sword, axe, halberd, bill) so building the heavy infantry should work. Hybrid units may count as either heavy infantry or missile depending on which aspect they emphasize more. Of course, historically spear and heavy infantry are pretty much the same thing (the French and English knights at Agincourt fought on foot in a "push of pike" using their lances) so the distinction is mostly an artificial one intended to improve gameplay.

    Not all units have the upgraded weapon graphic. Your knights' lances get some sort of shiny chisel head and your spearmen get broad-bladed spears. Other than that it's hard to tell. Doesn't your unit card show the bronze weapon upgrade symbol?
    The list of troops is mentioned in the initial post in this thread. I'm not sure if it follows any pattern really.

    No halberd/bill/voluge using troops are mentioned - so JHI are out, and Dismounted Sipahi Lancers are spearmen, not swordsmen. Perhaps the Turks need Dismounted Sipahi (some kind of lighter swordsmen?) or something?
    Trithemius
    "Power performs the Miracle." - Johannes Trithemius

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