Online Petition of Patch Buglist

[RtkBedivere]

I know it might be early. People will say im jumping the gun but CA needs to stop ignoring us. And this is one way to do it.

http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/M2TWpatch1.2

I took the liberty of making a petition for the online community of M2 so that we can potentially make a point to CA saying "here we are we are the multiplayer community, stop ignoring us"

The goal is 300 signatures which is a pretty high number but i think if i advertise enough we can reach it. I know lots of people are annoyed with the patch list as it seems to avoid MP quite a bit. So lets stick it to the man. Or CA whatever comes first .

Also make sure that if you sign you dont post a comment. I would like it if people could but i have to approve comments and i cant find the option anywhere. It appears i can modify comments in so if you have one just pm me your name and the comment you wish to add and i can put it in.

If it eventually gets enough signatures i might even feature it so that the site will send it directly to CA.

Thanks alot,
Sox
p.s. just in case you missed it

http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/M2TWpatch1.2

[Monarch]

I realise that you guys want to maintain good relations with CA, but the community would very much appreciate pinning this thread..

[RtkBedivere]

also comments are now postable.

I'm not sure why it wouldn't work before.

Any input is welcome there should be an option to sign against the pettion. Though im not sure where it is. Site said there should be one. All feedback is welcome.

Thanks again,
Sox

[ELITEofBLIZZARD]

Well Bedivere... do you remember the RTW Patch Petition? Think Kyo or Kanuni made it... we had a damn big list and it helped nothing...I dont want to demoralize you but well... I really want to believe the CA guys can change... but... it doesnt work :(

[CeltiberoMordred]

Blizzard talks about this one: http://p223.ezboard.com/fshoguntotal...icID=387.topic

It was signed by 508 members in 2004.

[Lavos]

Blizzard, couple of months ago, released a patch for Starcraft.

[Carl]

Blizzard and Relic are much better at supporting thier games than most though...

[R'as al Ghul]

Just in case you don't remember CA's position on petitions:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=65338
There was a lot of bad blood in this thread (a lot of which has been edited out), here are the main points:

However there is no need for a petition, in fact you should all be aware of our opinion on these by now. Online petitions have to be disregarded as a measure of opinion as they are completely open to abuse there is no email authentication so any one make multiple signatures. So for example some one could start a petition saying that we should completely scrap the strategy map form our games. Then set up a PC to auto generate signatures and a few days later you a have petition with 1000's of signatures.

Totalwar.ORG members are not autogenerated signatures. We have well established and long tried security measures, the Entrance Hall system and all, to make sure that it remains a place where honourable people with legitimate intentions of discussing the TotalWar games and other things in a civil and friendly atmosphere assemble. There have been very few and marginal instances of crossing the line, all of which being taken care of properly and promptly.

Added to that, quite a large majority of the signers of this petition at this board have been well known and respected members of the community for a long time. They should never be suspected of identity abuse.

I kindly and most respectfully protest such implications as a devoted ORGAH.

Year / Join Date of Member
2000 1
2001 4
2002 7
2003 14
2004 19
2005 20
2006 13

There are 78 signed members on this thread, anyone who signed the thread but since has been permanently banned is not included. Two of these have only posted once on the Org to sign this thread. The other 76 have posted an average of 1589 posts each, for a total of 120,777 posts.

edited by request of the poster

[RtkBedivere]

hell id write a letter if i thought that would work. It wouldn't. Even thought ca says they disregard them then can disregard them. But im going to go through the steps that i personally can to put the word out. If they disregard o well at least i tried. Thats what matters to me and i think thats what matters to the people who signed.



If anyone has some other ideas then sure im up for them. Hey lets just form a picket line out side CA headquarters :)

Also the difference with this petition to ones that have been seen before is that each signature allows for personal input and lets people explain. If people want to send me personal comments about what they specificlly wish to be stated in petition i can update it with specific concerns from the community on points of the game we would like to be fixed.

Thanks alot. I will probably form that list and update the petition at that point in a couple of days.

Sox

[Lavos]

I suggest waiting at least couple of weeks, before starting any petitions. How do you think it looks to ca when we start complaining about patch before its out? Also well be able to complain about things like pikes beating everything for 120 florins, or something similar. ;)

[Lusted]

I hate to say this, but that is an incredibly poorly worded petition.

1. They have not copletely ignored the mp community, there are several multiplayer bugs on the list, and several single palyer bugs being fixed that will affect multiplayer. So stating they have compeltely ignored the multiplayer community will not help your cause.

2. It's short. There is no how you would like to see things changed, or what you would like to see in the patch. Just a petition that can be summed up as "Boo CA suck!". I bet that really wants to make them listen.

3. As outlined above, CA have a set attitude towards petitions.

So frankly the petition is pointless. It appears to serve no purpose apart form to whine. If your gonig to make a criticism/whine, amke it constructive, or add in some positives. No one, and i mean no one, likes being whinged at.

[Puzz3D]

CA have a set attitude towards petitions.

Their current attitude is a result of the RTW petition which was a constructively worded petition signed by 508 registered org members. Lots of players worked on verifying that the issues presented in that petition were legitimate issues. CA shut the door on petitions after that.

[RtkBedivere]

Thanks alot. I will probably form that list and update the petition at that point in a couple of days.

Sox

Noted. This was the shorthand start of the petition. I will update it in a couple days when i have sometime. I'm getting on a plane tomorrow to head home for spring break so i just have to get collected first.

Any help is welcome btw

[Monarch]

I hate to say this, but that is an incredibly poorly worded petition.

1. They have not copletely ignored the mp community,.

lmao

[Titan of Gaul]

I'm not one to nag, but even trying to do a 2 vs 2 with 3 others in my clan the lag was unbearable, we all attacked, and no one pressed another button for ten minutes, as its impossible to control your units.

Really I know bugs are understandable, but if CA expect people to play online, sort out the lag, they can defend it, but I would like to see 6 of them even try a 3 vs 3.

[Monarch]

Actually mate, the lag is bad but not as bad as what you've just described. You must have been playing with someone with an extremely slow internet/pc.

[Titan of Gaul]

Oops, I forgot to say, good connection, but lives in Austrailia. We have no trouble doing large 3 vs 3 games on Rome, even when some people have not so good computers, Rome had issues, but nothing as bad as this.

[Denali]

Lusted you have some good points but tell me.... what would you do? Havent we tried everything allready to get CA's attention? Haven't we tried to help as much as we could with bug-lists, tons of ideas how to improve mp.

I have written several emails to CA, no bashing but constructive critism. It didn't help. But hey, ive seen smaller mp communites than the tw mp community and no1 was ignored over years.


If CA would really care about the mp part (which is the future and keeps a game alive) they would have started to work togheter with the community a long time ago. And workign togheter doesnt mean to fix 5 mp bugs togheter with 500 sp bugs, it means to react on suggestions and at least say: "here we are, you arent completely forgotten".

[Lusted]

Lusted you have some good points but tell me.... what would you do?

Well im going to be chatting to Palamedes about further balancing changes once patch 1.2 is released, and so try and get multiplayer improved that way. But im very lucky in regards to my contacts with the devs, i do try and read the mp forum lots because it generally has the best idea about how units should be balanced.

Havent we tried everything allready to get CA's attention? Haven't we tried to help as much as we could with bug-lists, tons of ideas how to improve mp.

Yes you have, but this petition is not going to help. At least word it properly. Something like this:

Dear The Creative Assembly,

We the undersigned members of the TW multipalyer community would like you to focus more on improving the multiplayer side of your games as we feel you have been neglecting it.

We are very happy you are fixing several mp bugs in 1.2, and several big sp bugs that really affect unit balance, but we would like to see more work done to fix bug, balancing issues and lobby issues that affect the mp side of the game.

These threads below detail some of these things(should then be links to various threads in these forums).

If these issues get fixed, M2:TW mp could become a popular part of the games and help prolonge the lifespan of the game.

Thank you for taking the time to read this petition.

So you mix compliments in with your criticisms(makes people more likely to read it), point out positives for them(people play the game for longer, might encourage more people to buy it), and its worded politely.

[Monarch]

If you look, Lusted, many people are actually very formal and constructive in the comments, theres your suggestions. CA just need to take the time to scan through the comments.

Anyway, my vision for cav is they should have the same charge as now. IMO its an interesting gameplay strategy that you have to take measures to stop someone successfully charging your inf (and there are successful measures that can be taken).

The problem comes, however, after the charge. I don't know about medieval history but gameplay wise it'd be cool if when pinned infantry easily beat mounted. So cav become purely chargers/flankers than charges/flankers/melee gods.

Furthermore, theres an issue that even when infantry sometimes can kill cav when pinned (yet not easily...especially spearmen which should, gameplay wise, make cav drop like flies) that you can simply click your cav behind the enemy inf and they'll run right through owning the inf that you may have thought was beating the mounted gods. I don't remember this working in RTW, I think in Rome when you tried that the cav got owned, I'm not sure why...realistically that wouldnt happen but its a good gameplay mechanic.

Fixing the shield bug will make inf better on cav when pinned but if the "plough of death" is not removed, then it won't mean squat because the spearmen won't have a chance to even get off two stabs at the cav.

I know you probably have 1000 suggestions from people to pass on, but if you could bring up these points it would be greatly appreciated.

[Lusted]

Fixing the shield bug will make inf better on cav when pinned but if the "plough of death" is not removed, then it won't mean squat because the spearmen won't have a chance to even get off two stabs at the cav.

Ah but the shield bug being fixed will also make inf better at facing the charge, as the shield bug even counts agianst infantry when they are charged. Even with the rather crude shield bug workaround used in mods infantry and much more able to receive a charge.

And cav charges are going to be weaker in 1.2.

I don't remember this working in RTW, I think in Rome when you tried that the cav got owned, I'm not sure why...realistically that would happen but its a good gameplay mechanic.

I think it was in RTW as well, i am not sure.

[RtkBedivere]

Pull through didn't work great in RTW but it worked in BI. Someone somewhere said shield bug got fixed thats a good start.

Lusted you said earlier its not going to help so why do it. Well i did cause i am tired of sitting around and saying hey maybe the patch will fix it. It won't so i am doing something. It might not work but at least i am giving it a shot.

I arent engrish major but i do plan on making a more formal response and in it will be included the main issues for MP game play maybe even alternate suggestions as to how to get them fixed. But i just don't have the time to do that now because i want to make sure i get it done well.

The last thing i want is for this to turn into a fight. I appreciate everyones opinions. Lets discuss the issue and find a solution. If this doesn't work then we will have to try something else. I LOVE TOTAL WAR. I don't want to give it up but i also don't want to spend my free time bashing the AI across the map when i could be having fun playing a strategic battle online with my friends.

And lusted if you want to help me write the response you can contact me via pm on these forums or on

MSN:Virus_Blacksox@yahoo.com
AIM:Sox987
Xfire:Blacksox

that goes for anyone btw

Thanks again,
Sox

[Stig]

Oh do stop whining, it's not like you're paying to make the game, CA is, be glad they add atleast some sort of MP. Only 1 in 10000 persons buy this game for MP only, why would you focus at that.

Next to that things as petitions never work, CA hates them, and I have to agree, it's their game, not the game of 10 fans who sign the petition.

[tibilicus]

pinned as requested.


And keeep it calm pelase stig

[Cheetah]

Gentlemen, the patch is not even out. We do not know what kind of fixes it has. It is way too early for any kind of petition.

Please be patient.

[Stig]

And keeep it calm pelase stig

I am calm ... and right .... and so is Cheetah

[sapi]

stig didn't say it particularly well but he had a point - it only makes sense to focus on the far more numerous sp players

[Titan of Gaul]

Look at it this way, how many people still play the rome campiagn, very few, hundreds still play online. That shows what keeps a game going.

[Monarch]

stig didn't say it particularly well but he had a point - it only makes sense to focus on the far more numerous sp players

lol, I also play Titan Quest whose online community is way smaller than tw, their equivelent of .org sometimes only has like 3 people logged in. And yet for the xpansion Iron Lore are focusing on improving multiplayer.

Have you ever thought WHY nobody plays multiplayer? I mean sure you'll just say no campaign, but the fact is even then nobody hops on for a game once or twice a week, they actually avoid it and refuse to play it. Despite there being no campaign this doesn't mean people can't play both. But because of waiting five hours for gs for work, because of the exploit fest, because of imba such as cav...nobody wants to have a casual game every so often.

The future of gaming is online. Hell even consoles have woken up to that.

[Puzz3D]

Oh do stop whining, it's not like you're paying to make the game, CA is, be glad they add at least some sort of MP. Only 1 in 10000 persons buy this game for MP only, why would you focus at that.

I agree that this game should not be purchased for multiplayer. Anyone who buys this game for multiplayer had better set their standards low.