View Full Version : powertriper
Shiro i dont care about your reasons if u want to support cheats go ahead please yourself !!!!
I'm sorry Jun Tokugawa. I don't make the rules, I enforce them. .Org will not become a flaming zone if I can help it! NO NAMING CHEATERS AT .ORG!!
Also, I don't support cheaters. In fact, I hate them. This is a question of preventing flames and keeping peace.
i know but we did vote long time ago not to name names i agree but just Flaming happens anyway and exposing peeps that have been proven to cheat can only enhance the quality
of the game and this mb is part of the game if i am not mistaken!!!
ps:i dont wont to start a war of words on this subject i just felt i should say something about this subject thx for your patience
It is fine to share your opinions on cheating. To suggest that people post names in a thread however, is completely out of hand!
No naming people is the rule and I will enforce it unless Dojo policy changes.
maybe be should put up a new vote on that subject with certain requirements for posting cheaters names ??
Maybe Jun should leave if he doesn't like the rules. Christ, I'm not a programmer by any means, but I'm sure I could doctor up some "evidence" of people cheating. I'm getting sick and tired of this argument. It's damn near on par with the gun threads from OT.
Bodhiharma
04-26-2001, 09:43
Heims,
I sort of agree...but you're from Red Deer, what do you know?! :P Just joking! hahahaha
Anyway, posting the name is useless, and I agree with the .org policy on this one, because if people posts names it will just become ridiculous, because if I didn't like someone, oh let's say Jaydee or The Daimyo (*WUV WU GUYS!*) why wouldn't I just put up their names as cheaters to have them diminished to playing on newbie servers? Make sense?
What will that solve? Nothing...As for you claiming that Shiro is a powertripper, then you're dumb...even though I'm a newbie here, I can tell that the admins here are very respectable and follow their own common sense rules. So I wish you all the best Admins! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif So if you do not like the rules, as Heims said, leave, go to www.ezboard.com (http://www.ezboard.com) create your own board, and spam it all you want with names of people, over and over and over...and tell me how well your board does!? http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
Thanks for the time...
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Honour And Pride
--Bodhiharma Daidoji
solypsist
04-26-2001, 09:54
again:
Here's the deal:
Totalwar.org in no way is responsible for answering/explaining themselves to anybody.
There are certain rules in place (for good reasons), and as users we have agreed to abide by them. The admins have been very courteous in trying to explain controversial rules; but by no means do they have to. However, they do have a duty to enforce them.
Stop whining like the site "owes you something," or is otherwise accountable to you in the event you disagree with something.
If you openly abuse the rules, prepare to be banned and expect to have your IP disconnected from the site. It has happened before and I'm sure it may happen again.
Yes there are cheaters, but their presence has nothing to do with Totalwar.org
The Daimyo
04-26-2001, 12:16
I am torn on this issue as some of you are, I've ran into a few cheaters in my time, and it wasn't fun dealing with them personally on the servers, just like it's no fun trying to do something here about it.
The only way that this will change, and i mean the ONLY way it will change, is if we all play by the mob rules.
Sure we know some people are crooks, fine, we still shouldn't need to rat on them. If they cause too much trouble though, and ruin it for the rest of us, then yeah, we gotta whack da bumz.
My best suggestion here would be to inquire with the game's creators about all of these issues. Perhaps we should all get together and put this on the table with them, and have some sort of a "sit down" about it.
It's obviously something serious enough to warrant direct action or this wouldn't happen a dozen times a day at the server, and several times a month here and at other forums.
I remember when people figured out how to hack the text files for Rainbow 6, so they could defy physics and move so fast that you couldn't shoot them. It made 1/2 the people who were playing the game religiously - QUIT.
The game's designers waited till they released Rogue Spear to fix that. Meaning it never got addressed and R6 is still very hackable by even a novice with notepad.
We don't want that happening here.
We must do something about it immediately!
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The Daimyo
Miaowara "Kakizaki" Tomokato
@ http://www.planettotalwar.com
maybe Jun is trying to make a point wich seems to be totaly missed by my fellow warriors!!!!"And when prison camp guards
throwing humans into the oven ,they where only enforcing the rules" !!!
ps:banned me if u like for challenging and wanting to discuss YOUR rules!!!
AMEN to that Adam my friend!!! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Hi Jun..good to see y, long time no seen how are y mate???
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May the honour be with you all..........EuroSan the reborned spirit of LinkSan
hi san havent been to sword dojo long time hehe now i know why with comments like solypsist's hehehe http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
Bodhiharma
04-26-2001, 14:12
I disagree,
Those person's deserved to die in those flam.....er, nevermind.
No seriously, there's a difference though, here we are following the rule of utility, the greatest good for the greatest amount of people. There, cooking people, was something completely different. We're not dealing with human life here, we're dealing with video game life (*though they both have many similarities it is not true that they are the same, and PLEASE don't believe the myth!*)
You cannot relate them in that sense...and I know I'm taking it too literally, and I should look at it figuratively...but I still disagree with the whole thing. .org does not need the incessant spamming of every person on here who thinks they know a cheater, and then that cheater argues and claims they are not, then 2 other people claim they're not, then 4 people claim he is, then it continues until it becomes more flaming in here then hell!
Nobody wants that, and the admins/moderators don't need to waste all their time sorting through the bullshit, when there are people who have serious comments, suggestions, and questions that need to be attended to. That's their reasoning behind it all. If the cheaters are really too much or a problem for you, then I suggest that you just stop playing.........I mean, it doesn't seem to be such a life and death situation for the majority of the other people here, you know?
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Honour And Pride
--Bodhiharma Daidoji
ShaiHulud
04-26-2001, 14:13
Reminds of a Monty Python movie I saw once... "Come see the oppression of the masses!"
(Shiro plays the King of England, of course, ...hehe... what is it about rules that so many like them only so long as they don't apply to them?)
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Wind fells blossoms, rain
fells steel,yet bamboo bends and drinks
hehehe nice 1 http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
and its not the cheaters wich seem to be the big problem to me but the way we deal with censorship and freedom of speech on this MB is more importend then any game!!!
[This message has been edited by Jun Tokugawa (edited 04-26-2001).]
Catiline
04-26-2001, 16:45
Don't be a idiot Jun. It's nothingabout freedom of speech or censorship. The rules justification is already psted, several times, I'm not going to go through it again. Go read them, and if you don't agree tough threads on this issue will continue to be closed, and if they mname people edited. Any moron can edit a log file or a screen shot. THere is no proof that can be posted here that can't be refuted. Deal with it
Since the debate of the rules started up recently there's been a recurrent moan about how old they are, how long ago the vote on them was. Frankly until now it hasn't been a problem, but with cheating evidently on the rise people are getting more annoyed about the issue. Now i haven't been cheated online, but I ussually only play friendlies. (I'll ignore the comments made elsewhere that i don't play. I do when I can, and as too us having been about too long Shiro and I have been in the job for about a month), but if I was I'd be v. irritated. but unless CA?EA do something about it htere's nothing we can. Naming is unproductive for all the reasons we've been through before, and then some. Real cheaters don't care, it takes a bout a minute to regisater another name, and if anything they take it as a compliment, they feel they've achieved something by getting themselves named. And as a general rule in all the threeads our policy has been supported by the patrons. The figures generally look like this, three noisy individuals want the rules changed. That's fine, make your case, give us your suggestions for what evidence we should take to allow people to post accussations etc. THere are however 7 who support the rules as they stand with one other person wavering slightly as to whether they agree with rules themselves, but generally agreeing with our application of them. Significantly I've specifically ignored the views of all admins, mods etc who've expressed views on the subject, and Kurando who as ex admin can't really be counted as an ordinary patron ( that and the fact he's abnormal http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif )
If those views are lumped in, which they could be in most cases as only Shiro and I are the ones enforcing the rules in here, the majority for the rules as it stands is massive.
As for saying you're problem is with us and the rules and not the cheaters you seem to have forgotten what the debate is really about in the first place. We are loath to edit posts, but names must go. Patrons are always asked politely to change their own posts first, and given a considerable period of grace in which to do so. Editing is a last resort, but not a step we are afraid to take if necessary, and whilst these are the rules, as I suspect they will continue to be in perpetuity, they will be enforced if they have to be.
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It's not a bug, it's a feature
[This message has been edited by Catiline (edited 04-26-2001).]
Anssi Hakkinen
04-26-2001, 17:02
There is already one thread on this subject (this one (http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000762.html)) and I posted a better reply there. Here, I will only say this:
If you want to discuss this matter, Jun, then by God discuss it. But this is not a discussion; you are simply flaming Shiro-san and Catiline-san for doing their jobs. Stop that. If you have a beef with the rules, then blame me, or that vote that was had on this issue a long time ago, but don't blame the people who selflessly try to make this forum a better place within the parameters they've been given.
And this is not a freedom of speech issue. For all I care, you can hack into the CNN satellite network and broadcast your cheater blacklist to every television set in the world. But if everyone had complete freedom of speech, then BBs like this one could have no rules whatsoever. Do as thou wilt, but as much as you may hate it, using this board as a medium carries some restrictions. We can discuss those restrictions, even change them if necessary, but as long as they exist, they must be respected.
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"2. Yu: bravery tinged with heroism."
[This message has been edited by Anssi Hakkinen (edited 04-26-2001).]
Bodhiharma
04-26-2001, 17:07
Well put! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
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Honour And Pride
--Bodhiharma Daidoji
That was an absolutely brilliant post Anssi! -Amen bro! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/icons/icon14.gif
I totally agree with Ansi, I bought Black & White a while ago and I had a look at some of the forums I think it was Gamespy (can't be sure exactly). It was ridiculous in there a subject would be raised and after about 3 posts, a whole bunch of flaming and flag waving would occur. Peeps would just insult each other for the sheer hell of it. I'm very glad that the Org isn't like that.
Quote Originally posted by Kurando:
That was an absolutely brilliant post Anssi! -Amen bro! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/icons/icon14.gif
[/QUOTE]
kurando- sorry to say this, but after reading your coffe story, and now this latest post here (well, mainly this one) i am REALLY starting to worry...
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http://www.waymoresports.com/images/MapleLeafs_logo1501.gif
go Maple Leafs (http://www.torontomapleleafs.com/home.html) !!!
Although being cheated on stinks, I can only reiterate what someone else stated: its only a game, so dont take it too seriously. Aim to have fun above all. And if the cheater ruins your fun, flame him on the foyer ala Llama Insane (although that will probably get you on some people's ignore list).
But, best thing is: don't flame them or recognize them -- just move on. Don't give them the satisfaction of notoriety. Adopt the mantra of never negotiating with terrorists, which is what cheaters really are in STW...
http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif
I have what may be a stupid question concerning this topic. When an online game is played, is there an electronic file kept of IP addresses? I was thinking that persons found to be cheating could be reported to the powers that be. If enough complaints are recieved and confirmed from a given IP address, said cheater could be banned without so much as a whisper of a name online. One could record the time & date of the battle in question then forward the information to the aforementioned authorities. Maybe this isn't possible, but then again VISA does pretty well tracking purchases, and they NEVER forget to bill me. A feature permiting such tracking would seem to be the answer to an honorable gamers prayers.
Hi MoriBoy..Each Cd-key has its own database on EA server......so every name you creat is linked to your Cd-key........so it is possible for them to ban them.....if they want to http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif
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May the honour be with you all..........EuroSan the reborned spirit of LinkSan
Quote Don't be a idiot Jun.[/QUOTE]
hehehehe sorry that just struck me
don't worry about it cat, i do typos all the time, it's just that one's pretty good lol
i'd be proud
[This message has been edited by lei (edited 04-26-2001).]
lol and i'll stop laying into you (today, at least)
Bodhiharma
04-27-2001, 02:08
Mori,
Also, it is possible to log all ips, I mean, this forum logs all the ips, so it is possible, and seems more reliable then logging cd-keys, at least that's what I think.
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Honour And Pride
--Bodhiharma Daidoji
Minagawa Daimon
04-27-2001, 02:18
lets make it simple boys, make the guilty party do this....
http://www.ballericons.com/icon/5519.gif
Catiline
04-27-2001, 08:36
Edited the post, so originally it was gramatically correct.
It seems like we are only making more work for the moderators of the forums, instead of accomplishing anything useful against the cheaters.
ah
caught me out there, congrats
How does one become a powertriper? What makes powertripe different to ordinary tripe. Or is powertripe this pointless argument against a reasonable forum rule?
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"Put 'em in blue coats, put 'em in red coats, the bastards will run all the same!"
LinkOctavian
05-04-2001, 08:31
I want to start by saying that cheating sadly is a part of all online games nothing we can do about that not all games have a code of honour as we do in Shogun so our problems are not as bad as most online games but i agree about not posting the names of so called cheats only because you cant really prove it now can you even log files can lie or be made to look one sided on the other hand something needs to be done about all the cheating going on people have been cheating in this game from the very start but slowly it's been getting worse now it's become a real problem and needs to be fixed up before we lose some good mates from the game as did happen with rainbowsix and many other online games i hope that the makers of Shogun have been taking note of this problem and are coming up with a way of stoping it i would hate to see Shogun go the way of a lot of other online games. Sorry about using the name LinkOctavian i have yet to get around to making TigerOctavian for this forum.
ShaiHulud
05-05-2001, 04:52
LinkO... Welcome back!
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Wind fells blossoms, rain
fells steel,yet bamboo bends and drinks
BlackWatch McKenna
05-09-2001, 04:37
Seems to me that if a person could cheat, then that same Cheater would easily be able to make a Fake Log to "prove" that an honost person was a cheater. I myself could never even begin to be able defend myself against some fake log - i just dont know how. Electronic evidence is always suspect. The risk of naming cheaters would be that an honest person could be Burned at The Stake and have their reputation charred.
I support the No-Naming policy as it applies to cheaters.
It is not a 1st Amendment issue (the government needs to be the suppressor for that to apply).
Since i dont present a problem without also offering a solution, here it is:
Why dont we just make an Honorable Player list.
Seems like if you had a list (or clan) that only took the most honorable folk, then people would be on the lookout for those Good Guys and want to play with them.
I can tell you from experience that there is nothing better than having a stranger support you in a chat room by saying "hey, dont disrespect that guy, he is in xxxx clan, everyone knows those guys are totally honest."
Of course, its easier to call someone a Cheater and start a flame-war than it is to act Honorably on a daily basis.
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// Black
// "Did we win?"
I'm not so sure about logging the IP adresses, as mine doesn't seem to be visible, to others online. I can't host games for this reason, I use my Uni server and can join games, but have never been able to host. Therefore I think it would be difficult to identify addresses of folks like me. besides I could always move to another computer at the uni, or possible even change my address here within the uni, couldn't I.
I think cheaters just have to be remembered and I've had plenty of luck finding enough good players online, and they provide enough variety for me to have fun with.
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