Client rulers

[duncan.gill]

I am playing KH - with some of my cities I have instigated Level 4 governments but have not been granted a client ruler. Is there anything that I am doing wrong (i.e. should I move a FM there and then he becomes a client ruler or do I need to ensure that the city isn't fully garrisoned)?

[Seleukus]

I am playing KH - with some of my cities I have instigated Level 4 governments but have not been granted a client ruler. Is there anything that I am doing wrong (i.e. should I move a FM there and then he becomes a client ruler or do I need to ensure that the city isn't fully garrisoned)?
Have you activated the script?

[duncan.gill]

Yes, the script is always activated

[LordCurlyton]

Heh sometimes the script doesn't work right, especially if you're fully garrisoned. I once forgot to leave a space and the character got spawned but did not go into the city and displace a unit, as it has done before. And since it never enteredthe city, for whatever reason it never got the client ruler trait. So I got a free general to do with as I pleased (I sent him on a suicide mission and rebuilt the Type IV since I wanted a client ruler).
Another time I got the client ruler, but he was outside of the city. Apparently he got into the city, got the trait, and kicked himself out...

[brymht]

which cities? I noticed a few which were absent I had to add in the buildings file.

[mini]

i've never used a type IV before, how does it work?

I gather it spawns a FM for you, and from there on?

Can you use it to fight off rebels, or does the AI do that for you?

[Korlon]

It spawns a basically immobile family member. It gets 100% movement penalty so he cannot move unless he has some traits that increase that such as energetic. There's a fix that makes it so that the penalty drops down as there's a problem with sallying when there's a client ruler in the city. Don't bother trying to fight off rebels with him, he can't move much.

Generally, a client ruler, I would say, isn't worth it. Their upkeep (around 700) is usually higher than what they contribute to the income of the city. They only get past that once they grow a lot older, but by that time you've have lost a lot of potential money already. But this is a permanent feature.

[Yossarian]

I just found out that client rulers actually require vast amounts of upkeep (875 mnai in my game, large unit size) compared to FM's who have zero upkeep. This explains my struggling Hayasdan economy so I've started killing off these client rulers by rushing them into besieging generals. This is a bit of a pain though, so I'm wondering if there are any other ways to get rid of these mnai-guzzling hunks of junk?

I'm open to cheating and console commands if there are any.

[konny]

Like family members, you can't kill them without a little help from "your friends".

[LordCurlyton]

I only use client rulers mid- to late-game. That way you aren't too concerned about the upkeep. And they have an optional fix to allow client rulers to sally. Besides, if you don't make a Type IV you can never make the trainable FM generals since you need a regional MIC 5, and those can be INVALUABLE once you start to balloon. In any case, as long as you focus on making education buildings rather swiftly you can get good client rulers. I'd say greater than 80% of all the client rulers I've ever made turned out to be a good governor in some sense (high influence/management, good retainers, good trader/miner) that more than made up for their cost. And the cost for client rulers/trainable generals is different by which type of general. I believe either the Eastern or Hellenic one is the most expensive, whereas the Celtic Lesser King is a darn good bargain.

[Irishmafia2020]

The first time I used a type 4 government I didn't know what I was doing, and I immediately destroyed it after building it. The spawned general was still there, but he could move a small distance. I am unsure if that was because he had some other trait that increased his mobility or if he lost the "client Ruler" status when I destroyed the government. Either way I was able to use him to fight some spawned rebels, whereas even using the "fix" I can't get my client rulers to sally when they are under siege. I think they make solid governors though, if you leave them there for a lifetime. I have a half dozen client rulers in my current Baktria campaign, at around 240 BC, and i did not even notice the economic drain. Most of those guys have between 7 - 10 management scrolls, and they free up my FM's for military duty. Also, when the rulers die, they are replaced by my chosen college kids within the family who take over and upgrade the respective provincial government. If you can't get your client ruler to sally, I suggest that you keep one nearby unit who can attack from the outside during a siege and the Client ruler and his garrison will reinforce that unit for the actual battle.

[Yossarian]

The first time I used a type 4 government I didn't know what I was doing, and I immediately destroyed it after building it. The spawned general was still there, but he could move a small distance. I am unsure if that was because he had some other trait that increased his mobility or if he lost the "client Ruler" status when I destroyed the government. Either way I was able to use him to fight some spawned rebels, whereas even using the "fix" I can't get my client rulers to sally when they are under siege. I think they make solid governors though, if you leave them there for a lifetime. I have a half dozen client rulers in my current Baktria campaign, at around 240 BC, and i did not even notice the economic drain. Most of those guys have between 7 - 10 management scrolls, and they free up my FM's for military duty. Also, when the rulers die, they are replaced by my chosen college kids within the family who take over and upgrade the respective provincial government. If you can't get your client ruler to sally, I suggest that you keep one nearby unit who can attack from the outside during a siege and the Client ruler and his garrison will reinforce that unit for the actual battle.

That is exactly how I've been killing off three of my client rulers so far. That leaves three, two of which I actually need since they govern large cities that won't be needing any upgrades for a while yet.

I really wish there was an easier way to get rid of them though.

[Bacchus]

I never noticed they cost so much...
I found it handy to have them as a standingforce in the settlement so my legions can move on.
The government is destroyed as soon as it is stable. Just wait for the general to die, actually.
Mistakes in my game-playing are treated as simple management errors offering a new challange to survive them... :laugh4:

:wall:

[Vortexmind]

What does it happen when the client ruler dies? Does it get replaced by another client ruler?

I ask because only client ruler I saw dying in my game had been slaughtered by the enemy who then took over the city :clown:

[d'Arthez]

Once a client ruler dies, you don't get a replacement. Best thing is to tear the government building down. You can get a new CR by building a new lvl 4 govt, or you can create a more advanced government, with better bonuses.

[Vortexmind]

Once a client ruler dies, you don't get a replacement. Best thing is to tear the government building down. You can get a new CR by building a new lvl 4 govt, or you can create a more advanced government, with better bonuses.
Oh that should be fine but I wanted to not "cheat" by using a type 2 gov and still retain local barracks to level 5. I use this as an house rule, so I will recreate the client state to mantain level 5 auxilia