Loving Saka

[Apgad]

OK, so after a couple of heavy-infantry-based campaigns (Carthage and Rome) I decided to go way outside my comfort zone and give Saka a go. And I'm loving it!

It's a completely different game, and I'm still getting my head around life on the steppe. One thing I've noticed is that time seems meaningless. Seasons and years pass by, and my people carry on as always. At first I was annoyed that it took so long to get around, but now I realise that distance takes the place of walls as a defensive measure.

Battles conducted entirely on horseback and from a distance is also a welcome change. I do feel a little sorry for units of spearmen that spend their time chasing horses while being shot with arrows, but only a little.

Feel free to bombard me with advice, but it's fun finding out stuff the hard way too. What do people recommend for mixed zones - Nomadism or Pastoralism? I was thinking of Nomadism until I start hitting more built-up settlements later in the game.

So, well done EB! This game just gets better and better the more I play. I'm sorry that I stayed in the west for so long - there's a whole new world beyond the Black Sea.

[Parallel Pain]

Build nomadism wherever you can and pastoralism wherever you can't

[Apgad]

I took Baktra and went with the allied government option, as I thought I might need some foot troops in the future. Is that a good idea?

Also, which is better for making money - nomadism or pastoralism?

[Korlon]

I believe pastoralism is better for the economy. If the settlement's on some far side of the empire, you might as well make it pastoral I would supposed. And isn't Baktra all the way on the right side of the map? Going to be difficult to transport troops to the west.

I'd suggest to just keep all horse archer armies for Saka Rauka and just keep some cheap infantry/skirmishers in a stack behind you to garrison newly conquered cities. That's what I'm doing for my Pahlava campaign and the gameplay's basically the same as Saka Rauka.

[Conqueror]

Baktra and most of the cities to the south & east of it are the ones that let you build new units from the Indo-Saka reforms, which requires the allied government type. These units include good quality heavy infantry that'll enable you to assault fortified cities much easier.

[Barry Soteiro]

i still thinks saka need some kind of camelry after all it's depicted on several coins... for EB2 maybe ?

[Watchman]

Yeah, since camels make such excellent war mounts...

[Barry Soteiro]

Yeah, since camels make such excellent war mounts...

They scare horses and their size make them good archery platforms plus they don't need to eat or drink as often than horses.

[Watchman]

Which is why camels and dromedaries were used as beasts of burden, and occasionally anti-cavalry screens. Which is kind of different from actually riding them in battle. IIRC the only ever reliable references to their use as battle mounts involve the northen Bedouin who used dromedaries as archery platforms... I've seen a random mention of the Sassanids really having experimented with cataphract camelry, but dunno 'bout that. TPC might know.

[The Persian Cataphract]

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1896531&postcount=50

In addition, the camels as ridden by the Saka and Indo-Scythian sovereigns, are Bactrian camels; These were exclusively used as baggage and caravan stock, because they were slow and lumbering animals as opposed to the Arabian dromedary. We mainly attribute this feature in Indo-Scythian coinage to Azes I, and it may have been owed to the increased height given by the animal (We see the prominence of the King using a "crucifix" (I forgot the name of this thing, but it denotes kingship and royalty), but the Bactrian camel at best in battles was used only as baggage animals and at occasion if there were insufficient horses, as platforms for mounting large kettle-drums.

The Sassanians occasionally used camelry in the spâh, but in surviving depictions (Gilded silver-ware of Vahrâm Chûbîn hunting while mounted on a dromedary) most prominently as an archer's platform. The convention of a camel cataphract is usually accorded to the late Parthians and their client cities in western Mesopotamia. Because both Ancient Iranians and Graeco-Romans made use of caltrops to screen the enemy cavalry, the camelry never truly found its way into their armies, and at best remained an irregular or auxiliary force.

[Slim_Ghost]

I usually go for Pastoralism whenever possible because of the economic buildings. The Settled Community building is enough for recruiting cheap units for garissoning. I don't need the low tier horse archers as offered by Nomadism settlements - I always prefer to use iron-clad elites anyways. They are like Hetairoi with arrows.

[Dooz]

Well this certainly sounds interesting. I'm very much into heavy-infantry factions, such as the ones you mentioned and some of the other "barbarian" ones as well, and that's been pretty much all I've played. For some reason, I never even really considered playing a steppe faction, but after this thread I think I just might do that next.... whenever "next" might be as I've just recently started my first EB Roman campaign, after holding out on it for ages until it was at the point it is now.

Btw, is it just me or does the title of this thread sound like some weird, ancient, romantic-comedy.

Loving Saka, the story of a nomadic steppe-child who finds her one true love in the most unexpected of places; a Baktrian prison! Coming to a colosseum near you!

[Apgad]

:laugh4: I thought people might get the wrong idea with "Saka Love"...

[Digby Tatham Warter]

I've got a Sarmation(sorry can't remember how to spell the EB name) campaign on the go, besides the fact that their Generals bodyguard are perphaps EB's nicest looking unit, the shear amount of arrows coming from half a stack of horse archers is great.

I attacked a settlement and when they sallied they could barely get out of their own gate. The arrows were like rain(no timed volleys).

I am reluctant to build any inf to go with mtd archers as it takes to long to move across the steppes, t'is better to hire cheap mercs to man a ram when I get somewhere,or my own inf just have to travel on their own.

Do the Sarmations have the chance to get better assault inf later like the Saka do?

Boy are these two nations remote, the Sarmations seem even more so as they are surrounded by Rebels, where as if the Saka go south-west it won't be long before they bump into other Factions.

[Moros]

The saka if have a reform. If they get hellenized enough they get hoplites and a few other (indo-)greek units.

[VladiNemir]

Are there any unit cards(been checking recruitment viewer) to these indo-saka units..i'm interested in starting a Saka Rauka campaign,because i ran on some heavy hoplites when attacking Alexandria E.(playing with mighty Pahlava:charge:)..so if it's possible to see some units,i'd be thankful:)

[Rilder]

Never got on with Horse factions...

Though eventually I supose the Random Number generator will roll a Saka.

[Apgad]

Are there any unit cards(been checking recruitment viewer) to these indo-saka units

Check out the info page on the EB website: here (https://www.europabarbarorum.com/factions_saka_units.html)

In the RV have a look at the province details for Baktria - this has a large range of early and late units available to Saka.

[lobf]

I just started a Saka game myself, and I am having a great time. I had an awesome Parthian campaign in a previous build, but tried the Saka for something different and it's sweet. I started out by gathering all my beginning units and sacking the two Parthian cities (normally I'd try to keep all factions alive as long as possible, but I don't want to deal with HA stacks later on) and then moved towards India.

Baktra was not fortified, so I sacked it, destroyed everything, and sold it to the AS. I hoped they would start to fight over it and occupy each other's attention while I established an Indo-Saka kingdom, but they are allied, and Baktria is currently extending north and east. My plan is to conquer India, get out of debt (around -150,000 at this point), and get myself some of those neato Indian warriors and longbowmen. Then I'll start extending east and north myself.

[VladiNemir]

Thank you very much Apgad!:beam:...I'm starting a campaign!!CRAZY!!:laugh4:

[Zeibek]

My Saka campaign is my favorite so far. I've always been an nomad player - the first factions I tried were the Pahlava and Sauromatae. The first thing I did was demolish all my buildings in my starting city and then proceed to capture three nearby rebel settlements. Then I waited for a about fifteen turns in order to clear my debt and build an army. Big mistake. That gave Bactria time to capture Kophen and attack. Now I'm fighting large phalanx armies with hopelessly small groups of horse-archers and Saka bodyguards. I've sacked Bactra twice but can never keep it unless I want to be besieged in a hostile city surrounded by heavy infantry with only 20 horse archers. Though the force that was sent to attack my settlements has now been destroyed the Bactrian heartlands are still firmly in their hands. My current plan is to take out all the Bactrian family members to turn them into rebels and give myself some to to recuperate and then later capture their settlements one by one.

[bovi]

As Saka you need to raid a lot. Take 3 cities and keep one, then rebuild your army with the funds you get and repeat. Destroy all the buildings when taking a city as you won't be needing any of them anyway. Do hit'n'run attacks on enemy armies, it won't matter that it registers as a loss when you've lost 4% of your troops and the enemy lost 45%. The next time around you will slaughter them all with a fresh supply of arrows.

[lobf]

I'm having serious problems killing Indian elephants with my Saka HAs. I'm considering modifying the EDU to make them run amok more easily, but I'm not sure what I need to edit. Could anyone give me a tip on either problem?

[lobf]

My Saka campaign is my favorite so far. I've always been an nomad player - the first factions I tried were the Pahlava and Sauromatae. The first thing I did was demolish all my buildings in my starting city and then proceed to capture three nearby rebel settlements. Then I waited for a about fifteen turns in order to clear my debt and build an army. Big mistake. That gave Bactria time to capture Kophen and attack. Now I'm fighting large phalanx armies with hopelessly small groups of horse-archers and Saka bodyguards. I've sacked Bactra twice but can never keep it unless I want to be besieged in a hostile city surrounded by heavy infantry with only 20 horse archers. Though the force that was sent to attack my settlements has now been destroyed the Bactrian heartlands are still firmly in their hands. My current plan is to take out all the Bactrian family members to turn them into rebels and give myself some to to recuperate and then later capture their settlements one by one.

Killing all the FMS won't make them rebels. You have to take all their cities.

[Zeibek]

Killing all the FMS won't make them rebels. You have to take all their cities.

Oh.

It doesn't matter that much anyway. I've got an army coming from the north to help my struggling family members.

[bovi]

To make elephants run amok you need to lower their morale. Also, bring a foot archer unit that can fire flaming arrows, that helps a lot if they're wavering. I found that throwing the same 8 horse archers on a city 5 times eliminated any garrison, be there elephants or no. I sent a new unit of footies each time so I could use siege equipment and not have to wait out the siege every time.

[lobf]

I know I need to lower morale, I just didn't know what line to edit.

[bovi]

See the top of the EDU for a (good!) format explanation.

[Ludens]

Killing all the FMS won't make them rebels. You have to take all their cities.

It does, actually. However, since factions that have less then 3 FMs left start adopting like mad it's not a viable way to kill of a faction.

[Che Roriniho]

It does, actually. However, since factions that have less then 3 FMs left start adopting like mad it's not a viable way to kill of a faction.

I did it with Epieros. they still had 3 settlements. mind you, I did kill 4 of them in a turn, but meh.

[Tollheit]

Early Saka Nobles cannot form cantabrian circles, but their description says otherwise. Was this ability removed from 1.0 to 1.1? If so, what motivated that change? Balancing, quest for realism, historicity, or some other reasons?