Two Papal States? Is it possible?

[Jon el' Thror]

Is there anyway to replicate the relationships between the Papal States and the Cristian Factions? Almost as if to make a second pope? What i'm thinkinh of is having the main pope, then having an usurper. THis is probably hard-coded though, but if anyone knows how-please respond...

I posted this in the Mod Chat, but nobody responded...maybe it's cuz I didn't fully explain myself...

Imagine the Papacy. And everything that has to do with it...
Then, imagine a rival Papacy, exactly alike, but opposite.
This rival papacy would probably have it's own culture/religion, and excommunicate members who deal with the orginal papcy, and vice versa.

This othe papal state would have it's own pope, it's own candidates for the papacy, etc...

Anybody know how to make this happen?

[CavalryCmdr]

The simple answer is you cant.

The complex version is you could make a faction that is similar to the pope in many ways. You could have effects similar to excommunication etc by editing relation effects and the AI script. I know some people were working on trying to make pope-like elections, but I'm not sure if they got it to work well. You could not make the factions give missions though, among other less noticable limitations. All in all, a whole lot of work for mediocre results at best.

[alpaca]

Don't forget than an interface for this would probably be nonexistant so it'd be very hard to see what the pope is up to.

[Jon el' Thror]

Thak you! This may be totally off topic, but I guess this applies in the same way to the Senate-Roman Family relationship in RTW? Like you couldn't have Brittania as a Senate, with the Gauls, Germans, and Dacia as Families?

[alpaca]

I think you can only have them instead of the normal senate and internally they would have to be called the senate.

[Jon el' Thror]

I see...thank you.


Er, one last question, if you please...
It wouldn't be possible to make two Rebel factions either, because of the same difficulties as the Senate and the Papal States, correct?

[alpaca]

Not quite correct, you can have something similar to the Roman empire rebels in Barbarian Invasion. It's not quite like the rebels but shadow factions are close conceptually.

[Jon el' Thror]

Alright, thanks again! That will be all for now...
...I really appreciate the prompt awnsers!

[absinthia]

i noticed these entries in descr_sm_factions:
special_faction_type papal_faction
special_faction_type slave_faction
what does the special_faction status actually do? and can it be applied to more than or any other factions than the papal states and slave? in which file would one find the definitions for these special faction types?
the thought is what if one made a turkish lookalike clone of the papal states, gave it the papal_faction status and possibly even made it a shadow faction of the papal states? how close to a centralized muslim or orthodox christian entity could one get?
another thing.
i get the impression that the pope also is some variant of a guild. this is mainly because while playing as the papal states one still get missions from the pope, while actually being the pope him self. this leads me to believe that there is no real connection between pope the character on the strat map, and pope the mission giver. if so, could not this scripted pope be duplicated and applied to the turks?

[Motep]

Very interesting Idea. If it is not hardcoded, but is purely textual, than it could be replicated, but at a long cost. If it is hardcoded, you might be able to find a way around it. Just be sneaky!

[absinthia]

i have done some test to see what would happen, and not to much really did...
i edited descr_sm_factions and made byzantium special_faction_type papal_faction. i edited descr_strat and gave the byzantine faction leader the IAmPope trait, instead of the factionleader trait. i enabled byzantium for the IAmPope trait in export_descr_character_traits and also removed the hidden-status for the trait. i did nothing to change the papal states.
the game did not crash and emperor alexius was also a pope, or at least he had the is pope trait. which i realize actually do not do anything.
then i changed byzantiums religion to catholic and got the join crusade button.
i did loose the ability to have a faction heir. so when i had the emperor alexius killed i lost the game, there are obviously no papal election when there are two papal factions. then i played as the papal states, disbanded the army, killed the pope and lost rome to rebellion. still no papal election, i was left with a cardinal and a diplomat.
looks like giving a faction the special faction status papal_faction removes its ability to have heirs, but does not render it indestructible like the real papal states.
also when i removed byzantiums papal_faction status it regained the heir ability, but the heir did not inherit the IAmPope trait when the emperor died as i thought he would.