Maximizing economic return on investment

[Davout]

Thought I’d share my rule of thumb for prioritizing economic development in the Capmapign game to build your income as efficiently as possible

Range of regions base economics:
85 (Arabia or Norway) to 690 (Constantinople)

For simplification, three sorts of Region:
·Rich regions – greater than 400 florins income
·Average regions – between 200-400 florins income
·Poor regions – less than 200 florins income

Economic development prioritization:
Investments Years to payback
1)Upgrade rich provinces to 20% 4-8
2)Build mines 10
3)Upgrade rich regions to 40% 7-13
4)Upgrade average regions to 20% 8-15
5)Upgrade rich regions to 60% 12-19
6)Build Complexes 15-18
7)Upgrade average regions to 40%13-25
8)Upgrade poor regions to 20% 15-30
9)Upgrade rich regions to 80% 21-31

Breakeven points:
(years to get payback, no Acumen adjustments)
Return on farmland
Income +20% +40% +60% +80%
600 5 8 13 21
500 6 10 15 25
400 8 13 19 31
300 10 17 25 42
200 15 25 38 63
100 30 50 75 125
Mines: 10 years
Complexes: 15-18 years

[Magraev]

Thanks for the breakdown!

This comfirms, that the ai is kinda silly to build 80% farming in Sinai. OK the money would eventually come back, but you'd almost certainly be better off investing in something else.

[maroule]

good one indeed
I hadn't do the precise maths but it confirms some of my guiding lines :
- build mines ASAP everywhere, any type
- don't bother giving an economic role to poor provinces (I let them with tower + church + fort + inn if border) one exception, 20% agri also give a boost to population happiness, I think, so should be build everywhere, alongside with church/mosque of course

[andrewt]

What about NPV? j/k

In-game farm income is lower than what is written in the txt file. Anitoch, IIRC, only gives 303 when it is supposed to give 500+. Constantinople, I think, only gives around high 300s or low 400s in practive.

[Forward Observer]

Thanks for the list. I was going to compile one, but you saved me the time.

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Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl.

[Dorkus]

Best way to make money is simply to cause multiple revolts. You confiscate the rebels' estates and make a killing.

Of course, this is a bit risky, but you can make a couple k in florins every round without wasting building time on economic upgrades.

[ToranagaSama]

Quote Originally posted by Dorkus:
Best way to make money is simply to cause multiple revolts. You confiscate the rebels' estates and make a killing.

Of course, this is a bit risky, but you can make a couple k in florins every round without wasting building time on economic upgrades. [/QUOTE]

Of course, its a bit Cheesy, as well.

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ToranagaSama Says:
"Please the Game The Way It Was Designed!"

[olaf]

Acumen really helps out a lot, and IMO it makes the farm improvements worthwhile in most cases.

olaf

[Lord Romulous]

Quote Originally posted by maroule:
good one indeed
I hadn't do the precise maths but it confirms some of my guiding lines :
- build mines ASAP everywhere, any type
- don't bother giving an economic role to poor provinces (I let them with tower + church + fort + inn if border) one exception, 20% agri also give a boost to population happiness, I think, so should be build everywhere, alongside with church/mosque of course

[/QUOTE]


dont understand the bit about building mines
in my games my mines make about 20 florins per year while my farms make 500 + per year.

what should i do to make mines a good investment ?

[el_slapper]

A salt mine costs 250 or so, gives 26 a year. 10 years and you have your return on investment. Other mines have similar R-o-i.

A farm brings 500. This means a VERY good province, or much acumen from the governor. Well. First 20/100 improvement. Costs 600. gains 100. 6 years of r-o-i. Cool. 2nd one. Costs 1000. brings 100. No better than your salt mine : 10 years of r-o-i. 3rd one costs 1600 : 16 years to wait before you get your money back. Better build your salt mine before!!!

It doesn't mean you don't have to upgrade to 80/100. It simply means you'll earn more while following the upper table while choosing your development path.

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War is not about who is right, only about who is left

[maroule]

merci el slapper
I wouldn't have answered better...
the other advantage of mines of course is that they're really qucick to build (the full mine upgrade is only 6 years, while getting the full 4 agri upgrade takes 20 years)

[MajorFreak]

once i get most of the world conquered i'll post a list of the farming income (base; no irrigation/governor)as i tend to sort tax levels by income of a province, it's helpful to me (plus the rich provinces will be my itinerary for my next campaign)[/list]

[Eternal]

I expand agriculture in the rich provinces, and generally only advance agriculture in low income provinces whenever I get a new king. That way I can give him a Steward virtue, which adds 10% to all provinces. That's a good ivnestment.

[hrvojej]

I would say that this is right from purely economical standpoint, and I try to follow it as much as I can, but way often I find myself chaotically building everything I can that produces money to keep up with the troop production. Sometimes the balance plummets because of that, sometimes, I manage to pull it off. What I'm asking is: the people who actually manage to stay cool and really follow the plan(s) to the letter (since I can't), can it keep up with constant and rapid troop amassment? Do you get a more stable economy when paying attention to the long-term return than when you're just trying to cope with rapidly growing expenses to stay afloat?

[AgentBif]

Quote Originally posted by Eternal:
I expand agriculture in the rich provinces, and generally only advance agriculture in low income provinces whenever I get a new king. That way I can give him a Steward virtue, which adds 10% to all provinces. That's a good ivnestment.[/QUOTE]

How many farm upgrades do you need to get this virtue?

bif

[Cheetah]

PAF

[favedave]

The best return on investments is TRADE.

Get 2 ships in every sea province and build up trade buildings. (you need 2 ships cuz random storms sink them.)

Do not conquer any inland provinces ever! Until you're ready to go for the final win.

[Magraev]

Quote Originally posted by favedave:
The best return on investments is TRADE.

Get 2 ships in every sea province and build up trade buildings. (you need 2 ships cuz random storms sink them.)

Do not conquer any inland provinces ever! Until you're ready to go for the final win.[/QUOTE]

Eh I think you can make money from inland provinces too. It's true though, that trade is what can make you filthy rich (5k income from Antioch anyone?)

[el_slapper]

Yeah, Antioch rulez. The point is, you can't forecast accurately your trade income. Ports are destroyed, others are captured by your enemies, & so on...

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War is not about who is right, only about who is left

[favedave]

Yes you can make money from inland provinces, but save them for last. Make all your money from trading on coastal provinces, then save up a few million. Then go for the win.

[remoh]

Is there a list of the base income values of all the regions?

[This message has been edited by remoh (edited 10-22-2002).]

[sodoff]

It is usually a good idea to specialize provinces and make a list of which will do what, adding to the list as your empire expands. Those rich and potentially rich provinces must be exploited for their economic potential (with the addition of good defences).

Even though there is little incentive to build large castles in poor provinces, they may be used as your main military-producing areas. Remember, it takes TIME to build improvements, military and economic ones alike, and even though spending thousands on upgrading poor provinces may not save (or gain) you any money, it may save you TIME. This division of labor will bring you faster technological developement and is well worth the florins.

[HopAlongBunny]

Very nice guide =)
I try to calculate years to break even; return per year...but generally I just build til I run out of money; then look at my neighbours to see what I can pillage.

We're out of control!
The treasury is gone...besides the pension fund was just sitting there http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

[HopAlongBunny]

A very nice little reference =)
Maybe with such a compact summary I will be able to get my economy under control when I am up and playing.

...but the pension fund was just sitting there!

[HopAlongBunny]

A very nice and compact summary =)
Thank you Davout!