Few question from MTW fan ...

[Jxrc]

Hello,

A few question from another old MTW fan ...

Shelved the game after a few game when I first got it (AI was terrible in version 1.0) but I have to admit that the game is ok after patch 1.5.:yes:

My questions would be:

- is there a possibility to see a faction reappear after it has been wiped out (in the event a rebellion takes place for instance) ?
- is there some kind of problem that prevent legionary cohorts from charging ? Each time I try to have those guy close in ASAP, they just keep moving slowly forward behind their huge shields ... Had no problem with Hastati, Principes or early legionary cohorts ....
- is it possible for the captain that wins a battle fought on the battlemap to become the "man of the hour"? Tried to get one by getting a few heroic victories with a captain with no result at all but the few time I have auto-calc a battle agaisnt a tiny rebel force I got the "man of the hour" message ...
- is the a maximum of times you can try to bribe the same stack ? After a few failed attempts, when my diplomat start the talks the "bribe" option does no longer appear ...
- can a faction go into civil war if it loses too many battles or cities (just like in MTW) ?
- is it correct that the temple of the city where a new famility member shows up appear has an impact on his stats and traits ? (seems to me I got better command ratings for family members appearing in city with Jupiter temples while those born in cities with Ceres, Juno or Aprhodite temples are more keen to be "fruitful" etc)

Thanks for the hints.
Best regards

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Hi Jxrc,
My questions would be:

- is there a possibility to see a faction reappear after it has been wiped out (in the event a rebellion takes place for instance) ?Sorry, but this was removed in R:TW. It's a shame really - although the M:TW system wasn't perfect, the factions came back a little too strongly for my liking, it was a very interesting feature.
- is there some kind of problem that prevent legionary cohorts from charging ? Each time I try to have those guy close in ASAP, they just keep moving slowly forward behind their huge shields ... Had no problem with Hastati, Principes or early legionary cohorts ....I've never had a problem with them before. All units do need to be a certain distance from their enemies to be able to charge though, which could be causing the problem.
- is it possible for the captain that wins a battle fought on the battlemap to become the "man of the hour"? Tried to get one by getting a few heroic victories with a captain with no result at all but the few time I have auto-calc a battle agaisnt a tiny rebel force I got the "man of the hour" message ...Man of the Hours usually only occur when there is a low general : province ratio to boost up the number of family members. The same applies to adoptions as well which also are much more common under these circumstances. I think any type of victory is satifactory to gain the event, but I'm not totally sure.
- is the a maximum of times you can try to bribe the same stack ? After a few failed attempts, when my diplomat start the talks the "bribe" option does no longer appear ...I think that might be a bug of sorts - I've noticed it occasionally happen too without a decent explaination.
- can a faction go into civil war if it loses too many battles or cities (just like in MTW) ?Sorry, but not in R:TW. This was another feature that was sadly removed between M:TW and R:TW. It was most certainly one of my most favourite part of the game and really added to that feel of immersion. A function mildly comparable to the old M:TW style civil war exists in Barbarian Invasion however, although it only applies to certain factions (only the Romans) and is less wide-spread. Esentially, it's just a fancy settlement revolt which any generals currently stationed in that settlement can join if their loyalty levels are low enough.
- is it correct that the temple of the city where a new famility member shows up appear has an impact on his stats and traits ? (seems to me I got better command ratings for family members appearing in city with Jupiter temples while those born in cities with Ceres, Juno or Aprhodite temples are more keen to be "fruitful" etc)Yep it's correct, although it's not attributed to where the general first appears, but to where they spend their turns after they appear. Each temple provides it's generals with a specific ancillary providing benefits which fit the description of the God. There also is an increased chance of the general gaining similar traits which correspond to the god's personality (e.g, a general living in a city of Baccus will have a higher chance of ending up as a drunkard).

Hope this is helpful ~:)

[Jxrc]

I've never had a problem with them before. All units do need to be a certain distance from their enemies to be able to charge though, which could be causing the problem.

Could be the reason cause I only used those guys in siege battle so far.


Man of the Hours usually only occur when there is a low general : province ratio to boost up the number of family members. The same applies to adoptions as well which also are much more common under these circumstances. I think any type of victory is satifactory to gain the event, but I'm not totally sure.

I had a hunch that the adoption/man of the hour had some kind of balancing effect but here what puzzles me is that I had a guy winning three victories in a row against Pontus (first two were heroic and the first one I still wonder how I ended up winning) without becoming part of the family while jsut after a guy dealing with 240 rebel peasant got his entrance ticket right away... Bit unfair and I kept that in the back of my mind and notice that I never received the man of the hour announcement after a battle fought on the battlemap. Has anyone ever received one?



Hope this is helpful ~:)

This is indeed. Many thanks :2thumbsup:

[Quirinus]

I had a hunch that the adoption/man of the hour had some kind of balancing effect but here what puzzles me is that I had a guy winning three victories in a row against Pontus (first two were heroic and the first one I still wonder how I ended up winning) without becoming part of the family while jsut after a guy dealing with 240 rebel peasant got his entrance ticket right away... Bit unfair and I kept that in the back of my mind and notice that I never received the man of the hour announcement after a battle fought on the battlemap. Has anyone ever received one?
I do recall that happening quite a while back when my lone unit of round-shield cavalry got ambushed by some brigands, I won a very narrow victory with only something like seven men left (out of 55). When I re-entered the campaign map there was this 'Man of the Hour' message for me. I remember being quite bemused by it, as I had suddenly gone from a single-digit number of tier-one cavalry to having a full unit of heavy cavalry and a three-star commander out of nowhere.

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Originally posted by Jxrc
I had a hunch that the adoption/man of the hour had some kind of balancing effect but here what puzzles me is that I had a guy winning three victories in a row against Pontus (first two were heroic and the first one I still wonder how I ended up winning) without becoming part of the family while jsut after a guy dealing with 240 rebel peasant got his entrance ticket right away...I think it's only based upon the events of a single battle more than anything. If the family is short, there's a certain chance that the captain will be promoted regardless of what kind of victory he's won. Occasionally certain generals miss out due to the random system not favouring them.
Bit unfair and I kept that in the back of my mind and notice that I never received the man of the hour announcement after a battle fought on the battlemap. Has anyone ever received one?I've had quite a few appear after the battlemap when I've been low on family members. Since I rarley autoresolve, that's where I've found most of my new adoptees.

~:)

[Jxrc]

[/I]I've had quite a few appear after the battlemap when I've been low on family members. Since I rarley autoresolve, that's where I've found most of my new adoptees.

Ok. Good to know it was just that I exceeded the number of familiy members the AI though necessary or that I was just unlucky.

That pretty much answers all my questions so far.

Many thanks for your help :2thumbsup:

Will try to play some more this week-end and might have some more question next week. Not to likely since I try not to read too much about "normal" game mechanics since the best part is when you face new problem and manage to solve those by yourself (after a few mishap of course) ... Just like when I discovered that those Pontus chariots could kill more of their own army than my own troops if handled correctly (loved it when those idiots killed their own general after running wild ...)

[Jxrc]

GAve up my campaign as the Brutii cause I was really fed up with rebels appearing every turn ...

Changed the spaming rate to 100 instead of 10, but that does not appear to affect ongoing campaign ... :((

Now playing as the Scipii for a different experience (yes one day I will unlock those other factions) ...

Got rid of Carthage and Numidia and now onw Sicily, Western North Africa and a large piece of Spain (expect one last province owned by the Spanish and Numacia owned by the Brittons ...), Crete and Rhodes (too tempting to resist since both islands were rebel-onwed). Julii have made no significant progress (they've juste taken Marseille) ... Brutii got Greece but are now moving northward .... Greeks, Macedonian, Seleucid, Gauls, Daces, Cathaginian and Numidian are history ... Got a 10 star faction leader (was a "military genius" and after a few battles became "superior commander" and "strong in defence") all would be nice if he had not caught the plague ... Building baths and hoping for the best ...

Few additional questions:

- how does the reinforcement system works ? It's seems there is no way to replace archers or artillery that have run out of arrows and that if more than a full stack takes part in the battle, the additional troops will be managed by the IA .... So how does it work if I need large number of artillery pieces to break down city walls ?

- at what ages does a princess no longer available for a wedding/breeding. Some princesses who are about 25 seem to attract very little interest (I turned down quite a few useless candidates). Likewise a few of my family members have just married princesses well into their 30s' ... Have they any chance to get an heir or is there some kind of time limit for that ?

- how do you know what is the max farm upgrade you can build in a city in order to avoird excessive population ? I undertand that the one that takes four turn to build is normally the limit but there seems to be some difference between province regarding "natural" farming output so that max farm upgrade might have some benefit in rather arid provinces (for instance Sahara)

- do rebels have a negative effect even if I cannot see those ? In some large provinces (Sahara again) I sometimes discover rebels roaming aimlessly around the desert ... Do I need to build watchtower every here and there and hunt them down or can I just let them live ?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

[El Diablo]

Changed the spaming rate to 100 instead of 10, but that does not appear to affect ongoing campaign ... :((

Yeah the spawing rates is part of the program that is read only at the START of a campaign. Thus it will not change any of the games you have already started.


- how does the reinforcement system works ? It's seems there is no way to replace archers or artillery that have run out of arrows and that if more than a full stack takes part in the battle, the additional troops will be managed by the IA .... So how does it work if I need large number of artillery pieces to break down city walls ?

Usually you just take in two or three units of artillery and you can ner rely on the AI to give you any more. Similarly when archers run out of arrows they become pretty expensive and poor light infantry. The best way to get into cities is through sap points rams and towers.

It does mean that you need to get the composition of your army right.


- at what ages does a princess no longer available for a wedding/breeding. Some princesses who are about 25 seem to attract very little interest (I turned down quite a few useless candidates). Likewise a few of my family members have just married princesses well into their 30s' ... Have they any chance to get an heir or is there some kind of time limit for that ?

I dont think there are princess's as in MTW it is more female family members. The game will give you offers of adoption and "man of the hour" evenets if your family member:settlements ratio gets to low. The only way to lose a game from loss of FM's is if your very poor at looking after them, or if you have them all in one stack that gets slaughtered (or on a boat that gets sunk).


- how do you know what is the max farm upgrade you can build in a city in order to avoird excessive population ? I undertand that the one that takes four turn to build is normally the limit but there seems to be some difference between province regarding "natural" farming output so that max farm upgrade might have some benefit in rather arid provinces (for instance Sahara)

This is a tricky one and many people disagree on it (and there has been some quite heated "discussion" her about it). Generally I (note thats me and I am no genius on this game) treat farms as mines - i.e. a source of income. The growth bonus is good if the towns population growth is below 3% at the lower tiers of the town and 2% at city level.


- do rebels have a negative effect even if I cannot see those ? In some large provinces (Sahara again) I sometimes discover rebels roaming aimlessly around the desert ... Do I need to build watchtower every here and there and hunt them down or can I just let them live?

Yes - if they are on your roads they are stopping trade and also causing "devastation" on your farming land. This shows up as blackened "burnt" lookin raes on the map. I highly recommend watch towers if for nothing else they make good early warning systems.

Hope this was of help - but Omanes will be along soon with some better answers.

ED

[Jxrc]

Yeah the spawing rates is part of the program that is read only at the START of a campaign. Thus it will not change any of the games you have already started.

Too bad. Is there a point selecting a higher number than 100 (between 101 and 999 ?). Not that I am not hapy as it is but it seems to me that reducing the number of rebels helps the AI more than the player fro whom rebels are more a nuisance (and a bore) than an actual problem




Usually you just take in two or three units of artillery and you can ner rely on the AI to give you any more. Similarly when archers run out of arrows they become pretty expensive and poor light infantry. The best way to get into cities is through sap points rams and towers.

Ok thus is basically one stack against one stack. Fair enough. Some loved huge battles in MTW (Golden horde and the like) but those were a bit too time consuming for my liking anyway.



I dont think there are princess's as in MTW it is more female family members.

Correct indeed as far as Roman are concerned (at least until you've won the game).


The only way to lose a game from loss of FM's is if your very poor at looking after them, or if you have them all in one stack that gets slaughtered (or on a boat that gets sunk). If one does such thing he's pretty much asking for trouble and deserves whatever he get :laugh4:


This is a tricky one and many people disagree on it (and there has been some quite heated "discussion" her about it). Generally I (note thats me and I am no genius on this game) treat farms as mines - i.e. a source of income. The growth bonus is good if the towns population growth is below 3% at the lower tiers of the town and 2% at city level.

Seems a reasonable rule of thumb to me but there seems to be some cities that are doomed to get out of control. Took Carthage, killed everyone, taxes very high, no agricultural improvement beyond level 2 (the one that takes three turns to build) and still I got a 6.5% increase .... Now I am building peasants each turn to send them to other cities lost in the deserts but it's no longer enough to compensate the population growth ...




Yes - if they are on your roads they are stopping trade and also causing "devastation" on your farming land. This shows up as blackened "burnt" lookin raes on the map. I highly recommend watch towers if for nothing else they make good early warning systems.

Did that just to spend my cash in excess of 50K (weird thing is that I lost two generals while doing so as a result of earthquakes ...) The bore is that if rebels appears in the middle of the desert without being close to any road it takes ages to get to them. IS there a way to now if they are devastating something with any value (farmland and the like) ? If they just burn the desert to the ground, well ... be my guest ...


Hope this was of help - but Omanes will be along soon with some better answers.

Was indeed pretty helpful. Many thanks :2thumbsup:

[Ibn-Khaldun]

Just one thing about the "man of the hour" event that I noticed ...
When your captain dies in a battle then on the campaign map you will get another captain with the "man of the hour" event ..
So far it has always happened to me .. captain gets killed in action and another one will get the "moth" event ..
This could be wrong tough.. So don't quote me on that ..

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

That's correct. If a general or captain dies, traits or rewards that would be earned on the battle field automatically go to the general/captain who takes charge after him. It's a strange bug, but sort of partially realistic.

~:)

[Quirinus]

Did that just to spend my cash in excess of 50K (weird thing is that I lost two generals while doing so as a result of earthquakes ...) The bore is that if rebels appears in the middle of the desert without being close to any road it takes ages to get to them. IS there a way to now if they are devastating something with any value (farmland and the like) ? If they just burn the desert to the ground, well ... be my guest ...
I think devastation shows in the settlement details scroll, so if you see the devastation symbol in the expenses row, a rebel army must be wrecking havoc somewhere. I usually use a spy/diplomat combo to scout them out and bribe them away instead of going to the hassle of assembling a decent-like army and sending them out there.

Not sure if devastation happens in the desert though.

[Jxrc]

I have two additional questions.

Phalanxs. I've played as the Roman for the most part and I sucked big time using the odd mercenary hoplite, the only units against which they seem quite good to me were chariot. Otherwise even if I manage to get the phalanx tidy and all, it gets very quickly disorganised and those silly hoplites start using their swords with no great effect. Even when an heavy cavalry unit charge it head on, it does not get impaled on the spears but somehow manages to disturb the phalanx and turn it into mincemeat .... I have tried to find the answer on the forum but could not find an answer that was reliable enough ... Tried to start a Greek campaign to test things out but except when I faced infantry only I run into trouble each time because it was way too easy to flank me. Could someone point me in the right direction ?

Games slow down eacg time I have played the game for a few hours. That's someting which I undertsood was to be remedied by patch 1.5. but I still get the same trouble each time I play a bit too long ... Any way to solve that ?

Thanks again.

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Phalanxs. I've played as the Roman for the most part and I sucked big time using the odd mercenary hoplite, the only units against which they seem quite good to me were chariot. Otherwise even if I manage to get the phalanx tidy and all, it gets very quickly disorganised and those silly hoplites start using their swords with no great effect. Even when an heavy cavalry unit charge it head on, it does not get impaled on the spears but somehow manages to disturb the phalanx and turn it into mincemeat .... I have tried to find the answer on the forum but could not find an answer that was reliable enough ... Tried to start a Greek campaign to test things out but except when I faced infantry only I run into trouble each time because it was way too easy to flank me. Could someone point me in the right direction ?Phalanx mobility in the game is terrible, so it is often best to focus on keeping all phalanxes marching in a totally straight line with avoidance of moving corners of any shape or form. If you keep them regimented, simply using them as a wall that just walks up to the enemy, you can't really go wrong. They work best in defence rather than the attack which is why, even if you are on the offensive, its best to force the enemy to attack you than you to have to engage with them - just stand close and wait for them charge onto the pikes. If that doesn't work, move the line closer so their spears will touch the enemy - never ever order them to actually attack - that's where their weakness is and when their lines start to bend and become disordered.
Games slow down eacg time I have played the game for a few hours. That's someting which I undertsood was to be remedied by patch 1.5. but I still get the same trouble each time I play a bit too long ... Any way to solve that ?The memory leak never really was ever fixed - the problem was very slightly improved, but not by a very significant amount. Beyond installing extra RAM to cope with the game's hunger for memory, there isn't really much you can do. You could also try disabling RAM hogging services as described here (http://www.jasonn.com/turning_off_unnecessary_services_on_windows_xp), but the positive effect felt here often isn't very large. Sorry ~:(

Hope this is useful ~:)

[Jxrc]

Phalanx mobility in the game is terrible, so it is often best to focus on keeping all phalanxes marching in a totally straight line with avoidance of moving corners of any shape or form. If you keep them regimented, simply using them as a wall that just walks up to the enemy, you can't really go wrong. They work best in defence rather than the attack which is why, even if you are on the offensive, its best to force the enemy to attack you than you to have to engage with them - just stand close and wait for them charge onto the pikes. If that doesn't work, move the line closer so their spears will touch the enemy - never ever order them to actually attack - that's where their weakness is and when their lines start to bend and become disordered.~:)

If I understand correctly, I basically should let the enemy charge or have the phalanx bump into the enemy ? Seems tricky stuff but I'll give it a try.


The memory leak never really was ever fixed - the problem was very slightly improved, but not by a very significant amount. Beyond installing extra RAM to cope with the game's hunger for memory, there isn't really much you can do. You could also try disabling RAM hogging services as described here (http://www.jasonn.com/turning_off_unnecessary_services_on_windows_xp), but the positive effect felt here often isn't very large. Sorry ~:(

Is there an amount of RAM that is sufficient to satisfy the game's appetite or will "eat" whatever amount of RAM I will "feed" him ? I've got to restart the computer after 4 hours of play so it's not that bad anyway


Hope this is useful ~:) Sounds promising. Many thanks indeed :2thumbsup:

[Quirinus]

If I understand correctly, I basically should let the enemy charge or have the phalanx bump into the enemy ? Seems tricky stuff but I'll give it a try.
Yep, pretty much. IMO it's not too difficult once you've gotten it. As a rule of thumb the less you move a phalanx the better, especially when using the Macedonian/Seleucid phalanx. Just move them close to the enemy to intice them to attack, then if they don't just sorta inch forward little by little until either they do, or you 'bump' into them.

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Is there an amount of RAM that is sufficient to satisfy the game's appetite or will "eat" whatever amount of RAM I will "feed" him ? I've got to restart the computer after 4 hours of play so it's not that bad anywayI'm not too certain, but I think that the amount of RAM the game can chew up is only limited to the size of the RAM itself. More of it/preventing other programs from taking it just allows you to play longer without noticing the slowdown problems.

~:)

[Jxrc]

Another small question ....

When playing as another faction as the Romans, squalor seems to get out of control quite rapidly. Played as Carthage last week end and the combination of the "distance from capital" and squalor made it almost impossible to hold a "huge city" even with a full garrison and no cultural difference malus (got thrown out of Cordoba which I had always owned ...) ... Only solution I have found (but that's not really one indeed), is to get out, let rebels take control, move back in and slaughter the entire population ... The money is nice but it's a problem if it happens to a city that was onwed by another not yet destroyed faction. I took Alexandria, enslave the population and the city got out of hand few years later. When I got out the city got full of Egyptians and it could have been a mess if the AI had not decided to charge out of city the next turn in an attempt quash the besieging army ...

Any tips to manage a 0% population growth ?

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Squalor is generally lessened by prevention of the population getting to such higher proportions. Growth buildings probably should be destroyed to help the population growth go down and, although you can build farms, which are indestructible, it may be wise to observe the farming base rate as shown on the advanced settlement details scroll. That base rate is a massive contributor to growth and adding to it with something which cannot later be removed could be quite devastating.

If your struggling with the distance to capital penalty, if you haven't tried it already, you do have the ability to move your capital. Simply go to the settlement details scroll and, among the buttons in the bottom left hand corner, select the option to move your capital to that settlement. If you make the capital as central as possible, this allows you to keep everybody as happy as possible.

~:)

BTW, when you exterminate a settlement and you notice at face value a higher income, you are actually getting a lower income than you would without the extermination. Tax income is calculated based upon the number of people based in a settlement, but the way the game calculates military upkeep, the larger the population the more they pay to the armed forces. This gives the illusion of the largest settlements loosing money when actually they are your biggest earners. In the game it is actually impossible for a settlement to loose money.

A better view of real settlement wealth can be gained by going to the advanced settlement details scroll (the one with the pictograms) by activating one of the buttons on the bottom left hand corner of the standard settlement details scroll. On the income section, add up all the factors on the "+" side and then subtract all of the "-" factors excluding military upkeep.

[RLucid]

I'm not too certain, but I think that the amount of RAM the game can chew up is only limited to the size of the RAM itself. More of it/preventing other programs from taking it just allows you to play longer without noticing the slowdown problems.


One of the fixes to (IIRC 1.5) the game is for memory leak, which would gradually use more virtual memory, but 'dows should page out unused pages into the swap file, so it's not really 'chewing up RAM'. The game can only release that VM when it exits.

In general the RAM use would be asymptopic, rising fast initially then reaching a plateau slowly, with increase only due to 'leaks' where memory is grabbed and not freed correctly.

Most programs stabilise with a smaller working set of pages in RAM, than their apparent Virtual Memory requirements, which is the reason M$ recommend using swap files.

[Jxrc]

Squalor is generally lessened by prevention of the population getting to such higher proportions. Growth buildings probably should be destroyed to help the population growth go down and, although you can build farms, which are indestructible, it may be wise to observe the farming base rate as shown on the advanced settlement details scroll. That base rate is a massive contributor to growth and adding to it with something which cannot later be removed could be quite devastating.

Since the growth increase generated by "health" facilities (city plumbing and the like) is probably compensated by a reduction in squalor, I suppose that only temples that give growth bonus should be destroyed (and replaced) after they have served their purpose (Tanit and Ceres AFAIK) ? Or is there any kind of builing I am missing ?


If your struggling with the distance to capital penalty, if you haven't tried it already, you do have the ability to move your capital. Simply go to the settlement details scroll and, among the buttons in the bottom left hand corner, select the option to move your capital to that settlement. If you make the capital as central as possible, this allows you to keep everybody as happy as possible.


The thing is that I run into problem when my captial Carthage was pretty much in the middle of my kingdom that stretched from Spain to Jerusalem and I still got the maximum penalty (80% ?) form loads of cities so that any move closer to one edge would create havoc at the other end. Been building temple of Baal everwhere, upgrading facilities buit by previous owner and police HQ but it seems not to be enough. In another campgain as the Julii, I took everthing in Northern Europe, a big chunk of Spain and small pieces of Russia without trouble and even moving my initial capital so that it seems to me that "distance between capital" is actually measured on the basis of the distance between point A and B rather than on the number of provinces between those. Makes senses but quite a penalty for faction involved in "huge desert provinces" warfare (Scipii, Carthage, etc). Pehaps building huge armies and being broke all the time is the solution to both the squalor and 50,000 denarii problems ...:beam:

[Quintus.JC]

I suppose that only temples that give growth bonus should be destroyed (and replaced) after they have served their purpose (Tanit and Ceres AFAIK) ?


Most definitely, or better yet, don't build them at first place. Except if that region has a extremly poor population growth (e.g. Dumatha, Themiskyra, Nepte etc. etc.)

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Since the growth increase generated by "health" facilities (city plumbing and the like) is probably compensated by a reduction in squalor, I suppose that only temples that give growth bonus should be destroyed (and replaced) after they have served their purpose (Tanit and Ceres AFAIK) ? Or is there any kind of builing I am missing ?I'm uncertain about those "other growth" buildings, but they do not reduce squalor - they only counteract it through an extra population boost and a happiness bonus. Regardless of this however, in the end, logically it seems that although they do increase overall squalor, they manage to counteract that increase at the same time due to the happiness bonus. This may make them fairly useless in the end game, but, from that perspective, unless you need the cash, I wouldn't say that they need to be destroyed.

~:)

[Tollheit]

- how do you know what is the max farm upgrade you can build in a city in order to avoird excessive population ? I undertand that the one that takes four turn to build is normally the limit but there seems to be some difference between province regarding "natural" farming output so that max farm upgrade might have some benefit in rather arid provinces (for instance Sahara)


This depends upon the base fertility of the region and the distance to your (future) capital. You can move your capital, but I found it easier to do so early and then never again and to plan accordingly.
Personally, I do not build any farms if the sum of base farm level, existing farm bonuses and distance penalty is equal to or greater than 6. If required, I raise the population by disbanding cheap units (peasants) and mercenaries in the respective city.

[Tollheit]

For my post above, 5% distance penalty translates to 0,5 farm level equivalent;
0,5 % farm level as shown on screen to 0,5.

[Tollheit]

This may make them fairly useless in the end game, but, from that perspective, unless you need the cash, I wouldn't say that they need to be destroyed.

~:)

If your population is too big to achieve 80% garrison, you might want to destroy them, in order to reduce your poplation to a more manageable level.

[Jxrc]

Regardless of this however, in the end, logically it seems that although they do increase overall squalor, they manage to counteract that increase at the same time due to the happiness bonus. This may make them fairly useless in the end game, but, from that perspective, unless you need the cash, I wouldn't say that they need to be destroyed.

~:)

My idea was that it might be a valid option to build a "increasing population" temple (for instance Tanit) until you get to a reasonable size (2000 or 6000 would be my guess) enabling you to buid some basic units and then destroy it and replace it with another temple that shall after a few turns give you the same happiness bonus (as the case may be with some other advantage for trade, weapons or law) without the growth bonus that may become more of a liability in the end. Of course, it will be difficult to do that after the city has reached a higher level since the temple is probably what prevents the people from revolting. If you do it when the temporary loss of hapiness bonus can still be compensate by an increased garrison or a tax cut, this might be worth a try since cities with less than 2000 inhabitants are pretty much uselesss for troop production purposes.

[Tollheit]

I just destroyed the temple of Baal in 33000 pop Carthago, in order to replace it with a shrine of jupiter. No sign of revolution... It can be done without a revolt if you have a high influence governor installed.

[Quintus.JC]

I just destroyed the temple of Baal in 33000 pop Carthago, in order to replace it with a shrine of jupiter. No sign of revolution... It can be done without a revolt if you have a high influence governor installed.

Don't forget the culture difference, a temple of Baal, no matter what the size or benifits is, cannot help in a Roman settlement.

[Tollheit]

Don't forget the culture difference, a temple of Baal, no matter what the size or benifits is, cannot help in a Roman settlement.

This is not true. If a settlement remains long enough in my possession, the culture penalty becomes 0, regardless of remaining alien buildings. I always keep execution places, taverns and odeons, even if playing roman.

Law and happiness bonus in Carthage dropped 10 points each upon destruction of the temple, proving that I did profit from the temple. I had no culture penalty remaining before I destroyed the temple.

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Don't forget the culture difference, a temple of Baal, no matter what the size or benifits is, cannot help in a Roman settlement.This is only partially correct. It provides the same bonuses as it did under the settlement's previous holders, only it also contributes +5% to cultural penalty. If the building is equal to your highest level of temple provider's happiness then destroying it would not be constructive just to get rid of 5% of a penalty (which, overall, is quite trivial).
This is not true. If a settlement remains long enough in my possession, the culture penalty becomes 0, regardless of remaining alien buildings. I always keep execution places, taverns and odeons, even if playing roman.This is due to you upgrading existing buildings to remove their penalty and/or upgrading the govenor's building.

I believe that culture penalty has a cap of 40%. If you destroy/upgrade any building not of your cultural, this should, theoretically, -5% of the factor. I'm sure that nothing gets added on to reflect the existence of any other buildings - in this case henceforth, you get 35% of the penalty rather than it remaining at 40%. Upgrading the governors' building will remove 20% of the factor - this is why in a huge city the penalty can often be much harder to remove.

~:)

[Tollheit]

Thanks for the clarification, Omanes Alexandrapolites. The cap must be somewhat higher, though, since I remember having 50% culture penalty in Sinope.

[Jxrc]

Hi there,

I have some more questions for anyone willing to share his wisdom.

Finally finished my Scipii campaign. Kind of find the selection of temple was great but not for the reason I would have initially thought.

Temple of Neptune is ok but no need to have more than two of those. Temple of Vulcan are great for obvious reasons but only needed in major cities. Temple of Saturn I just build everywhere to keep my governor from becoming drunken idiots.

Now I am in a the middle of a Brutii campaign and I have basically two problems:

* cannot find the kind of temple I should built in most places. Mars is nice but has severe drawbacks (anger, bloody, etc). Same for Juno (ill-health, hypocondriac). Same for Mercure (cheapstake) with the additional disadvantage that they increase my income that is only much too high (see below). Seems to me that Mars should be the default-temple but I am taking suggestions ...

*way too much cash. Even with all my cities set on low taxes, I got more cash than I can ever use after I conquered Greece and Asia Minor ... Now I have taken the former holdings ofPontus, Egypt and the Seleucid empire and things are getting even "worse". Solution I have imagine is to give each turn all my cash in excess of 50,000 to the Senate (since they do nothing, do not train new units anyway, do not spend it on the Julii and Scipii). Works nicely for avoiding the "lover of beauty" "gourmand" traits so far. Senate is quite rich now (close to 700,000) but does not like me any better as a result ... Nevetheless is there (i) any better trick one could think of to avoid to be down in cash (now my profit per turn is almots 50,000 ...) (ii) any risk making the SPQR that wealthy (apart the risk that they bribe my armies when the inevitable clash occurs) ?

Thanks for you help.
Bye

[Quintus.JC]

*way too much cash. Even with all my cities set on low taxes, I got more cash than I can ever use after I conquered Greece and Asia Minor ... Now I have taken the former holdings ofPontus, Egypt and the Seleucid empire and things are getting even "worse". Solution I have imagine is to give each turn all my cash in excess of 50,000 to the Senate (since they do nothing, do not train new units anyway, do not spend it on the Julii and Scipii). Works nicely for avoiding the "lover of beauty" "gourmand" traits so far. Senate is quite rich now (close to 700,000) but does not like me any better as a result ... Nevetheless is there (i) any better trick one could think of to avoid to be down in cash (now my profit per turn is almots 50,000 ...) (ii) any risk making the SPQR that wealthy (apart the risk that they bribe my armies when the inevitable clash occurs) ?

Bye

You can always set the campaign difficulty to Very Hard, they would definitely reduce your income by a health amount. Unfortunely (unfortunely?!) the Brutii tend to get over-rich once they conquer the Aegean. The sea is paved with money, in case of the Aeagean sea it is paved with gold.

You could of course give excessive amount of money to other factions, there is no danger of the SPQR being too rich, they don't use it anyway. The best way to reduce your treasury is by increasing you army size. Typically what I do is use Urban Cohort as basic town garrisons when my treasuries is going over the top, these guys demand a hefty wage (310 denari?). Beside they are historically only town police anyways so just recruit tons of them. Install them in your cities, and watch your treasury drain....

[El Diablo]

Have to agree with QJC and say recruit recruit recruit.
Whilst the inital cost of buying troops is not that much a few rounds of buying and buying combined with the upkeep of the troops before will bring you back to a sort of Denarii control.

Added benifits are a huge military might that can be stationed on borders ready for.. oh I don't know... maybe civil war? That and you can also send these expensive troops to cites with low populations and disband them for a massive growth spurt. Especially if you get a bit excited with all the denarii you have and recruit too much.

Also you can station stacks in key locations to take out at least one of your compeditors in any civil war.

As for the govenors getting bad traits - I would not have too many in cities at this stage of the campaign. A good governor only really give you more cash (that you have said you don't want) or happiness that you can subsitute with a big garrison.

Your call...

ED

[Quintus.JC]

Added benifits are a huge military might that can be stationed on borders ready for.. oh I don't know... maybe civil war?

That's an excellent point. It seems that you haven't entered the civil war period yet, get about 5 stack of elite troops around Tarantom and Croton. And when the civil war comes... Bang, and the dirt is gone.

[Jxrc]

It all makes sense to me.
Thanks for the tips.
Anything on temple selection I would not have seen ? Or is just the Brutii selection pretty poor indeed ?

[Quintus.JC]

Mmm. I always thought the Brutii temple selection were pretty good. Mars lets you crack out battle verteran before they even take to the field. Mercury are an awesome addition to any big trading city eg. Athens, Byzantium (especially with mines), and Juno gives a nice health bonus. Although it's the ancillieries that you complaining about, right?

The below section is a portion copied from Frogbeastegg's guide to Rome: Total. It's all about the effects of temples (I only copied the Roman ones) and the retinues are usually comes with it. Definitely helps. :yes:


JULII
Ceres (Fertility)
• Shrine
Public order bonus due to happiness 5%
Population growth bonus 0.5%
• Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 10%
Population growth bonus 1%
• Large Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 15%
Population growth bonus 1.5%
• Awesome Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 20%
Population growth bonus 2%
• Pantheon
Public order bonus due to happiness 35%
Population growth bonus 2.5%
Public order bonus due to law 10%
Bacchus (Fun)
• Shrine
Public order bonus due to happiness 10%
• Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 20%
• Large Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 30%
• Awesome Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 40%
• Pantheon
Public order bonus due to happiness 50%
Population growth bonus 1%
Public order bonus due to law 10%
Ancilliaries: Comedian (Temple or greater), Cook, Courtesan
(Temple or greater), Dancer (Temple or greater), Drinking Companion (Temple
96
or greater), Gourmands Chef (Temple or greater), Titus Maccius Plautus
(Awesome Temple or greater)
Jupiter (Leadership)
• Shrine
Public order bonus due to happiness 5%
Public order bonus due to law 5%
• Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 10%
Public order bonus due to law 10%
• Large Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 15%
Public order bonus due to law 15%
• Awesome Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 20%
Public order bonus due to law 20%
Arcani
• Pantheon
Public order bonus due to happiness 35%
Public order bonus due to law 10%
Population growth bonus 1%
Arcani
Ancilliaries: Fasces (Temple or greater), Pontifex (Awesome
Temple or greater)
BRUTII
Juno (Healing)
• Shrine
Public order bonus due to happiness 5%
Population health bonus 5%
• Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 10%
Population health bonus 10%
• Large Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 15%
Population health bonus 15%
• Awesome Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 20%
Population health bonus 20%
• Pantheon
Public order bonus due to happiness 25%
Population health bonus 25%
Increase in tradeable goods 2
Experience bonus to troops +2
Ancilliaries: Druid - healing type, Master Embalmer (Temple
or greater), Physician (Temple or greater), Wise Woman, Witch, Nicander
(Awesome Temple or greater)
Mercury (Trade)
• Shrine
Public order bonus due to happiness 5%
Increase in tradeable goods 1
• Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 10%
Increase in tradeable goods 2
• Large Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 15%
Increase in tradeable goods 3
• Awesome Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 20%
Increase in tradeable goods 4
• Pantheon
Public order bonus due to happiness 25%
Increase in tradeable goods 5
Population health bonus 10%
Experience bonus to troops +1
Ancilliaries: Freeman Clerk - trade type (Temple or greater),
Idiot Savant (Temple or greater), Numismatist (Large Temple or greater),
Procurator (Awesome Temple or greater), Wise Man
Mars (Violence)
• Shrine
Public order bonus due to happiness 5%
• Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 10%
Experience bonus to troops +1
• Large Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 15%
Experience bonus to troops +2
• Awesome Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 20%
Experience bonus to troops +3
Arcani
• Pantheon
Public order bonus due to happiness 25%
Experience bonus to troops +3
Morale bonus to troops +1
Increase in tradeable goods 2
Population health bonus 10%
Arcani
Ancilliaries: Wrestler
SCIPII
Vulcan (Forge)
• Shrine
Public order bonus due to happiness 5%
Upgrades light weapons +1
• Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 10%
Upgrades light weapons +1
Upgrades heavy weapons +1
• Large Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 15%
Upgrades light weapons +1
Upgrades heavy weapons +1
Upgrades armour +1
• Awesome Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 20%
Upgrades light weapons +1
Upgrades heavy weapons +1
Upgrades armour +1
Experience bonus to troops +1
• Pantheon
Public order bonus due to happiness 25%
Upgrades light weapons +1
Upgrades heavy weapons +1
Upgrades armour +1
Experience bonus to troops +2
Public order bonus due to law 10%
Ancilliaries: Brilliant Inventor (Temple or greater),
Geometer (Temple or greater)
Saturn (Law)
• Shrine
Public order bonus due to happiness 5%
Public order bonus due to law 5%
• Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 10%
Public order bonus due to law 10%
• Large Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 15%
Public order bonus due to law 15%
99
• Awesome Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 20%
Public order bonus due to law 20%
Arcani
• Pantheon
Public order bonus due to happiness 25%
Public order bonus due to law 25%
Upgrades light weapons +1
Upgrades heavy weapons +1
Upgrades armour +1
Arcani
Ancilliaries: Astrologer, Crooked Judge (Temple or greater),
Magician (Temple or greater)
Neptune (Naval)
• Shrine Requires a Port to build
Public order bonus due to happiness 5%
• Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 10%
• Large Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 15%
• Awesome Temple
Public order bonus due to happiness 20%
Corvus Quinquireme
• Pantheon
Public order bonus due to happiness 25%
Public order bonus due to law 10%
Upgrades light weapons +1
Upgrades heavy weapons +1
Upgrades armour +1
Corvus Quinquireme
Decere



edit: In lady Frogs' guide there's also sections about every retinues's effect on each characters, definitely worth the read. Also I always thought that Brutii and the Scipii had much superior temple selection than the Julii, but it's just personal opinion.

[Jxrc]

Mmm. I always thought the Brutii temple selection were pretty good. Mars lets you crack out battle verteran before they even take to the field. Mercury are an awesome addition to any big trading city eg. Athens, Byzantium (especially with mines), and Juno gives a nice health bonus. Although it's the ancillieries that you complaining about, right?

The below section is a portion copied from Frogbeastegg's guide to Rome: Total. It's all about the effects of temples (I only copied the Roman ones) and the retinues are usually comes with it. Definitely helps. :yes:

edit: In lady Frogs' guide there's also sections about every retinues's effect on each characters, definitely worth the read. Also I always thought that Brutii and the Scipii had much superior temple selection than the Julii, but it's just personal opinion.

I was more concerned about the traits the governor get when staying in a city with a given type of temple but I found the data in "geraldtan's advanced traits spreadsheets".

For the three brutii temple there is apparently each turn a possibility to get any of the following traits:

Temple of healing (Juno) - HaleAndHearty
Temple of healing (Juno) - Hypochondriac
Temple of violence (Mars, Ares, Hercules) - Anger
Temple of violence (Mars, Ares, Hercules) - Bloodthirsty
Temple of violence (Mars, Ares, Hercules) - Energetic
Temple of trade (Mercury, Hermes, Britan) - Cheapskate
Temple of trade (Mercury, Hermes, Britan) - DeceiverVirtue
Temple of trade (Mercury, Hermes, Britan) - Embezzler
Temple of trade (Mercury, Hermes, Britan) - GoodTrader

There is thus a possibility to get a good or bad trait each turn.

Got some governor with hale and hearty, energetic traits but did not pay any attention to those (or took them for granted:oops:) ...

Got upset when my best general became bloodthirsty hypocondriacs (-6 hit points or something -1 morale ... nice:wall:) or when my best governors became cheapskate (increase unrest, etc:wall:).

I will need to figure out what the actual odd are to get a good trait rather than a bad one but that should not be that complicated.

Many thanks for your help :2thumbsup:

[Quintus.JC]

Mmm... I don't usually notices these stuff but I think adminstrative temples (the ones that gives law bonus) are better at giving likable retinues and traits, though that need someone with proper research to confirm that.

[El Diablo]

Much like the Senate from the Republic - keep them out of the cities.
Sends them to war for the glory of Rome!!

But seriously. What is the point of keeping them in the town?

Money? - They give you more income from a particular town? You have already stated that you have too much money. So why micromanage to get more? You are trying to get the treasury down and yet still tying to wring out the last coin from the governor?

Public Order? - This is a possibility. Some newly captured towns do need a govenor to prevent rebelling in the next turn. A larger garrison will do the trick and also free up a unit of heavy cav (the govenor!). If you take a city like Carthage and do not exterminate then you will often get a rebellion anyway. I will often have a squad of town watch following a field army to garison a captured town the next turn. Frees up the field army and keeps the campaign moving.

Also remember to destroy the opposing factions buildings (if possible) to eliminate cultural penalty. Take heed that if you can "upgrade" them this is better as the Roman one is built straight over the top without having to build it up from scratch. Also don't just destroy the temple first. That still give the PO bonus (with the standard cultural penalty) but I tend to destroy and rebuild that which is the QUICKEST to rebuild and thus lower the cultural penalty ASAP.

As for field armies 2 generals are better than one. Particularly come civil war time. If one dies in battle (or is assassinated) then no doubt the leaderless stack will be bribed pretty quick.
You (usually) get good traits from battle although I do get a lot of "bloodthirsty" as I tend to wipe out routers. All adds to command...???

Obviously you will play your game... Hope this justs give you a different way to look at it.

ED

[Jxrc]

But seriously. What is the point of keeping them in the town?

Money? - They give you more income from a particular town? You have already stated that you have too much money. So why micromanage to get more? You are trying to get the treasury down and yet still tying to wring out the last coin from the governor?

ED

This is really not for the money. Since taxes are set on low, they get the useless assessor traits very fast and as you say money is really more a problem than anything. I have not build any temple of mercury for the same reason (except if I could just upgrade an existing temple of Hermes).




Public Order? - This is a possibility. Some newly captured towns do need a govenor to prevent rebelling in the next turn. A larger garrison will do the trick and also free up a unit of heavy cav (the govenor!). If you take a city like Carthage and do not exterminate then you will often get a rebellion anyway. I will often have a squad of town watch following a field army to garison a captured town the next turn. Frees up the field army and keeps the campaign moving.

ED

I need governors in huge cities that are too far away from the capital since garrison "public order bonus" is capped at 80%




Obviously you will play your game... Hope this justs give you a different way to look at it.

ED

This is indeed fine.

My "problem" is that if I send all governors out for grabbing some additional land, I feel like I would conquer 50 regions too quickly for my liking. I try to blitz the factions close to me and then adopt a rather slower pace. Despite all that in this particular campaign I moved rather faster than I would have expected ... Got rid of the greeks and macedonians ASAP as I wanted too but the greeks had given me Thermon early in exchange of a cease-fire ... Could not resist taking the two wonders south, got attacked by Pontus, took their land, got attacked by the Egyptians, took them out so that after someting like 35 years I got all of Greece, Macedonia (+Segestica and the Gaul City on the Adriatic - Patavium ? - silly gauls kept bugging me with silly attacks on Apolonia ...), Turkey, the Middle-East, Egypt, Cyrene, the Numidian province between Egypt and Lybia (forgot the name as well) and all the islands in between ...

Normally, I trynot to get carried away and stick to complying with the senate's wishes as long as I reasonably can. Thus I get more family members than I need for leading armies and it seems odd to have them just doing nothing in the middle of the countryside. In my Scipii campaign money was tight duing the entire campaign and I ended up with something like 8 good generals while the rest of the family consisted in stern(saturn)/inventive(vulcan) guys mananing high tax cities ... Felt kind of right ...

I kind of like to have skilled leaders and try to keep them in cities where there are academies and stuff like that. Call me vain but I kind of enjoy having my men getting almost all the senate's offices. I'm sure that it's quite possible to win with a huge aggressive empire ruled by illiterate gladiator fans but it just does not not feel right to me, just give me the impression that my faction behaves like a barbaric warring tribe. Fine with me if I play as the Gauls, German or Brittons but otherwise it just seems odd.

What you suggest makes perfect sense from an efficiency point of view but I just like to turtle a bit... I have not really turtle initially this time and I am now trying to resume my "normal" practice ... That's really to cause of all my problems :shame:

[Quirinus]

This is really not for the money. Since taxes are set on low, they get the useless assessor traits very fast and as you say money is really more a problem than anything. I have not build any temple of mercury for the same reason (except if I could just upgrade an existing temple of Hermes).
Yah, for that reason I always have taxes as high as public order will allow, also helps with slowing down pop. growth somewhat.


I've always thought that the Brutii (and the Greeks) have the best temple set avaliable, with Mars for super-legionaries and Mercury for building cash cows to support said troops. I tend to build only these two. Juno temples I mostly avoid other than for one of the barbarian/desert hovel towns in the middle of nowhere, like, say, Iuvavum or Dimmidi.


Having too much income is not a bad thing at all-- when my empire comes to this point and I don't feel like expanding much for the time being, I like to play god. Either I send a diplomat to a failing faction (say Gaul, or the Seleucids, or Armenia) and pump them with cash every turn. Beats giving it to the Senate because the Senate does nothing with all that gold, but, given that said faction isn't too far gone, you can actually see a gradual, cumulative effect as the war turns in their favour.

Or, just do it more directly, and train one or two full stacks of good troops led by a young general, send them into the midst of a war, and prop up the losing faction by intercepting the other faction's armies, paving the way clear for the ertzwhile underdog to take their cities. This is especially fun if the winning faction is very powerful: say, Egypt versus the Seleucids. I would send the army to Sinai and intercept reinforcements from Egypt. Can be fun to see how long your expeditionary force can hold out before you ship them back for retraining.


Damn, makes me want to play the Brutii now.....




I kind of like to have skilled leaders and try to keep them in cities where there are academies and stuff like that. Call me vain but I kind of enjoy having my men getting almost all the senate's offices. I'm sure that it's quite possible to win with a huge aggressive empire ruled by illiterate gladiator fans but it just does not not feel right to me, just give me the impression that my faction behaves like a barbaric warring tribe. Fine with me if I play as the Gauls, German or Brittons but otherwise it just seems odd.
Yep, same here. I normally keep a 16 year old in a city with a scriptorium (or above) for a few turns to let them gain good management retinues (and hopefully a doctor/chirugeon for army types). I like to think of it as practical schooling in administrative matters, sixteen feels a little too young to be a governor or leader of armies anyways.

[Jxrc]

A few new questions....

In my Brutii campaign, the Julii have managed to convince the Germans to become a protectorate.

Kind of wonder how they did that since they only have something like 6-7 provinces while the Germans have something like 8 or 9 nine provinces (each time I ask another faction with only one besieged city to become a proctectorate, I get the "our freedom ..." speech ...).

I assume that those German provinces are now added to the Julii provinces for the purpose of assessing if the 50 provinces vitory condition is met.

Questions are:

- if I attacke the Germans, will the protectorate end or will the Julii be at war with me ?
- is there are risk that the Germans attacke me while I am still allied with the Julii ?

Thanks (again) for your help

[Emperor Mithdrates]

I'm the same as you, and have never managed to gain a protectorate due to the fact of that freedom speech you metioned. however i thought a protecterate was just a pitiful excuse sometimes offered to prevent that "offering nation" from being destroyed by the nation they are offering to protect. I think that if you attack Julii the germanians will declare war on you however if you do it the otherway (by attacking Germania) the julii wont mind because they were planning on destroying the germanians in the first place b4 they became a protectorate.
I think that may be right. If not then...:end:

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Unless you've gone past the "chance for power" message, the Julii will have the option to choose between you and the Germans. If not, they have to choose you and do not have the option of starting the civil war. Of cause, if you were not Roman, they would not have to choose your side at all, regardless of yours or their position.

The Germans can attack you while their along side the Julii BTW - they still can start their own wars, manage their own diplomacy and break the protectorate at will. In reality, a protectorate is nothing more than a glorified alliance with restrictions on monetary income (if the protectorate's income goes over a certain level, the protector takes shares of it). If they do attack you, as long as the "chance for power" message has not appeared, the Julii will again be forced to take your side.

~:)

[Jxrc]

Been sick at home for a week. Nice opportunity to do some more playing (except for those people from work daring to disturb me every now and then of course ...).

Some more questions thus:

- got two of my armies involved in one single battle. Both are lead by a family member. Can't seem to avoid that the IA takes control of the second (even when I uncheck the box in the pop-up screen before the battle start). Is that a bug or some hard-coded rule ? Or am I just missing something ... Seem to have no problem whne the second army is lead by a captain ....

- is there a happiness penalty when destroying any building (not even a temple or a circus) ? My idea was to destroy as many foreign building as possible when conquering a city so as to keep only those that are essential (basically destroying all trade facilities and building that only produces crappy units such as velites) but it seems that happiness sinks lower with every building destroyed. Makes sense in a way but it does not seem to be documented as far as I know.

Thanks for you help again :2thumbsup:

Finally, I have to say that it was weird to discover that the old spy rush of MTW v.1.0 works even better in RTW 1.5 ... Just brought Egypt to its knees with 10 spies in just a few turns ... A bit too easy when compared to a previous Scipii campaign during which I had to fight the all way from Egypt to Bagdad. Could remain a nice way to balance the odds between the Seleucid and the Egyptians though ... BTW has anybody seen the Seleucid manage to survive more than a few turns ? I have not tried them myself but they look to be quite a challenge ... I started one campaign but immediately gave up when I saw that the garrison where made of peasants and militia hoplites only ... Will try when I feel brave enough ...

Bye for now.

[Quintus.JC]

- got two of my armies involved in one single battle. Both are lead by a family member. Can't seem to avoid that the IA takes control of the second (even when I uncheck the box in the pop-up screen before the battle start). Is that a bug or some hard-coded rule ? Or am I just missing something ... Seem to have no problem whne the second army is lead by a captain ....



You can only control 20 army units at one time. Anymore than 20 then the rest is led by the AI.




- is there a happiness penalty when destroying any building (not even a temple or a circus) ? My idea was to destroy as many foreign building as possible when conquering a city so as to keep only those that are essential (basically destroying all trade facilities and building that only produces crappy units such as velites) but it seems that happiness sinks lower with every building destroyed. Makes sense in a way but it does not seem to be documented as far as I know.



Can't give you a reliable answer, I'll let someone else handle that.

[Jxrc]

You can only control 20 army units at one time. Anymore than 20 then the rest is led by the AI.

No big armies were involved in the instance I have in mind.

As far as I remember, Appolonia was besieged by an army of Gaul that included two units of swordmen, one warband, one unit of skirmischer and one unit of barbarian cavalry. Besieged army included one governor, two militia and two velites. The rescue team included one unit of equites and one militia. Thought is would be winnable fight if I could manage to gang my two cavalry units against the Gaul general. I am sure that I did deselect the option "authorise management by the IA" for the besieged army but whne it appeared on the battlemap it was IA manage nonetheless ... The rest is easy to guess ... IA managed general charged the warband head on, velites got caught by the swordsme, militia routed, my poor equites were butchered a little later ....

Got my revenge a few turn later with an army I could lead without IA interference but it did piss me off at the time ...:wall:

[Warmaster Horus]

Did you uncheck the box and then look at the enemy army? I think I remember someone who said doing that basically inverted the allow AI to take control box...

[Jxrc]

Did you uncheck the box and then look at the enemy army? I think I remember someone who said doing that basically inverted the allow AI to take control box...

Cannot remember but I'll test that as soon as I get the chance.

Thanks for the tip:2thumbsup:

[Jxrc]

Started a new Seleucid campaign this week-end (moderate/moderate).

Was not as tough as I thought after I attacked the Egyptian in the first turn (so easy to deal with the general and silly chariots with one uniti of militia hoplits) but I still have a few question:

- how does those silly schyted chariot work ? I tought they would create havoc and deal with most light infantry but no ... Those idiots got smashed even when I sent them after easter infantry and hillmen .... After few second they get stuck, get slaughtered and then go bersek ... Even chasing routers they stop running after them even before they have been all captured ....
- what's the deal with those "levy pikemen" or "round shield phalanx".... they are even less reliable than militia hoplites .... Apart for dealing with chariot, they are rather useless. I did as I have been told and avoided to tell them tro attack anyone but let them walk "into" their target instead ... Nonetheless the still switch to sword after a while and get murdered big time ... One unit was charged head on by one unit of pontus heavy cavalry (the one who thow javelin) and got butchered ... As the Roman, I've ought against armoured hoplites and german warband and those guy did surprinsingly well even when attacked from all side so perhaps I am missing something (for the german warband, I even wonder if there is not some kind of a bug involved since the slaughter my equites even when charged from the rear but whatever ....)


Am I missing something regarding those two units ?

Despite my lack of undertanding of tye basic unit, I did all right the Egyptian were gone in less than 10 years, Pontus was done in twenty years ... After some 25 years I have got Cyrene, the initially Numidian province next to Egypt, Rhodes, all Asia Minor, all the southern holdings of the Parthians so that I just have to take the few armenian provinces before the Roman show up .. juts hope that I will be able to produce my onw legionaries before they do cause if I have to rely on pikemen and chariots it will not go well at all... For almost all previous battles, I used mercenaries (eastern infantry sucks but I lest I know how it works, ....), militia hoplite, a few elephants and loads of javelin throwing light cavalry ... Nice big empire but my army is a kind of a silly mix of pretty poor units ....

Thanks for pointing me in the right direction if I have erred ...

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

- how does those silly schyted chariot work ? I tought they would create havoc and deal with most light infantry but no ... Those idiots got smashed even when I sent them after easter infantry and hillmen .... After few second they get stuck, get slaughtered and then go bersek ... Even chasing routers they stop running after them even before they have been all captured ....The tactic here is to not directly attack, but to simply order them to run through their targets. If they get bogged down, as they will do in a normal attack, they always will end up getting rapidly picked off. This can be a little tedious, but its required to get them to have any sucess whatsoever.
- what's the deal with those "levy pikemen" or "round shield phalanx".... they are even less reliable than militia hoplites .... Apart for dealing with chariot, they are rather useless. I did as I have been told and avoided to tell them tro attack anyone but let them walk "into" their target instead ... Nonetheless the still switch to sword after a while and get murdered big time ... One unit was charged head on by one unit of pontus heavy cavalry (the one who thow javelin) and got butchered ... As the Roman, I've ought against armoured hoplites and german warband and those guy did surprinsingly well even when attacked from all side so perhaps I am missing something (for the german warband, I even wonder if there is not some kind of a bug involved since the slaughter my equites even when charged from the rear but whatever ....)Levy Pikemen should probably be considered sword fodder at best - they are relatively easy to break up and destroy. Round Shield "medium" Pikemen are much better though, and should be more successful if used correctly.

One thing you must do, at all costs, is keep all of the mini shield pikemen out of the way of any form of projectile - arrows, javelins whatever, it's devastating to them due to their relatively low levels of armour and shielding. Something else I recently learnt is that more success will always be felt with guard mode switched off when ordering the units to walk into their enemies.

One key thing to do as the Seleucid Empire is to upgrade all military facilities rather rapidly to get to the better units. Their higher level military units take more development to get to than those of other factions, making generating a very successful armed force more difficult.

On the equites, that probably isn't a bug - equites are the peasantry of the cavalry world, being rather poor at performing many tasks, their main function being chasing down fleeing enemies. On another note, the right flank and the rear flank, when the soldiers have shields, are always weaker since the benefits of the shield do not apply there - if you charged into the left flank that may have been what assisted the rapid annihilation.

Good luck ~:)

[Jxrc]

The tactic here is to not directly attack, but to simply order them to run through their targets. If they get bogged down, as they will do in a normal attack, they always will end up getting rapidly picked off. This can be a little tedious, but its required to get them to have any sucess whatsoever.

Thanks for the explantation. Kind of feel it's more trouble than it's worth and I'll probably stick to elephant then ...


Levy Pikemen should probably be considered sword fodder at best - they are relatively easy to break up and destroy. Round Shield "medium" Pikemen are much better though, and should be more successful if used correctly.

One thing you must do, at all costs, is keep all of the mini shield pikemen out of the way of any form of projectile - arrows, javelins whatever, it's devastating to them due to their relatively low levels of armour and shielding. Something else I recently learnt is that more success will always be felt with guard mode switched off when ordering the units to walk into their enemies.

Phalanx is indeed a weird stuff ....

Kind of miss roman legions where you only have the odd phalanx to deal with chariots and that's it ... Read somewhere that phalanx where great in cities but I do not really agree since I have seen one of my units of pikemen decide to face one wall after it had finished its move ... Surprinsilgly enough they got slaugthered ... again ....


One key thing to do as the Seleucid Empire is to upgrade all military facilities rather rapidly to get to the better units. Their higher level military units take more development to get to than those of other factions, making generating a very successful armed force more difficult.

I kind of did the opposite since most players advised to attack the Egyptian early in the RTW guide ... Built plenty of units I could not use properly and managed to prevail just thanks to the weight of sheer numbers... Did the trick against Pontus and Parthia but they do field dodgy units of their own (especially the Parthians after I had bribed their two katatank). Eastern Infantry is not really a match for anything at all ... In one Roman campaign, two units of legionary cohorts were attacked by about 1,200 of those idiots ... Just put my to units in a corner of the map ... lost 3 killed 400 before the all routed ...


On the equites, that probably isn't a bug - equites are the peasantry of the cavalry world, being rather poor at performing many tasks, their main function being chasing down fleeing enemies..

I kind of disagree, Equites are more than all right to deal with barbarian or greek cavalry and when I use them to charge a phalanx of militia or regular hoplites (or nile or nubian spearmen), they win every time. Armoured hoplites do not seem bothered in the least but it kind of makes sense since it's high level unit. Weird to see that it does not work with German warbands since it a low level units which seldom breaks before I have killed their general ...


Good luck ~:)

Will need it apparently ... Many thanks for the tips and explanations. Will be most useful.:2thumbsup:

[El Diablo]

One thing with a phalanx is mirco management is not good!!!

Every time you click on the to move they all lift up their spears and think about things. This is often just as the opposition is about to attack and they get slaughtered. They are not good at moving sideways and crabbing across the battlefield.

Phalanx work well in narrow streets. Just get them there early. Get the width of the unit right (ie. make it narrow so it fits in the street) and then either wait for the oppositon to charge onto the pointy sticks or if you are attacking the click for them to move BEHIND what you want to attack. Otherwise they tend to walk up to the unit, stop, lift up their spears, scracth their backside - oh and get slaughtered.

Another trick (although some will call it an exploit) is to put a phalanx on top of a phalanx. There is (to the best of my knowledge) no penalty in RTW for fighting in close proximity to another unit.

This phalanx on top of another works very very well in bridge battle and at gates or hole in your walls where the enemy has to come through a narrow gap.

Hope this helps..

ED

[Jxrc]

Every time you click on the to move they all lift up their spears and think about things. This is often just as the opposition is about to attack and they get slaughtered.

A very accurate summary of the, often short, lives of my own phalanxs. Love the "think about things" bit ... Makes you wonder what kind of discussion might go on in the phalanx ... "We're being charged by peaople on horses ... to hell with those silly long sticks. Let's just use our daggers and teach them a lesson..."


Hope this helps..

Will only be able to give it a go next week-end ... Will probably have an additional list of question by then ...

Many thanks for you help:2thumbsup:

[El Diablo]

Just noticed this as well...


Weird to see that it does not work with German warbands since it a low level units which seldom breaks before I have killed their general ...

I may be wrong (and Omanes will be here soon to clean up my mess) but a German warband has the ability to form a sort of barbarian phalanx. Thus as you would not charge horses into greek formations don't do it to the germans.

I was playing last night as the brutii and my merc hoplite were magic! They are very slow to react to anything but if they have their pointy stick pointing down when anying runs into them it is carnage!

So as stated - leave them alone as much as possible even to the point of keeping them static and fighting a cav battle behind the oppositions line knowing that yours wont break.

[caravel]

Personally I never order phalanxes to attack while they're in phalanx mode. It is better to simply move them into position and leave them there. When enemy units approach the phalanxes "braces" to take the charge. If you order it to attack it will hesitate and raise the spears. The only time I order attacks is when I'm using them out of phalanx mode as flankers.

This is pretty much why AI phalanxes can be dealt with easily as the AI uses them poorly.

[Tony Furze]

I seem to remember I stumbled across a way to f....(just a minute while I look in the MTW manual) ,yes, "follow projectiles" in RTW as you can in MTW.

Is there a keyboard combination, or even a single key to do this?

My Velites (the spearthrowers?) javelins are also not clear...i.e. not single, whole "sticks". How do I adjust that?

I've managed to get rid of the pointy feet.

Turning off the pesky advisors and just using good ol' intuition helps a lot, too.

Thanks.

And thanks for putting this thread here.

[caravel]

I seem to remember I stumbled across a way to f....(just a minute while I look in the MTW manual) ,yes, "follow projectiles" in RTW as you can in MTW.

Is there a keyboard combination, or even a single key to do this?
Not aware there was one. I'd be interested to know this too.

My Velites (the spearthrowers?) javelins are also not clear...i.e. not single, whole "sticks". How do I adjust that?
How do you mean? I thought they were drawn ok as default. Perhaps check the detail levels?


I've managed to get rid of the pointy feet.
I found that upping the unit detail removed them on my old graphics card, but that in large battles some units would go into "auto pointy limbs mode".


Turning off the pesky advisors and just using good ol' intuition helps a lot, too.

Thanks.

And thanks for putting this thread here.
Yes the advisor is annoying. I also turn off the voices, the green arrow markers and the big clunky battle interface and I enable the classic TW style camera controls.

See this guide for how to do that:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=38382

:bow:

[GMaximus]

Not aware there was one. I'd be interested to know this too.
I'm fairly certain you can follow projectiles by pressing Delete while in control of a missile unit. It works for M2TW, too, as I accidentally found out while fiddling around with a monster bombard.

[pevergreen]

Pressing Delete will follow a unit around, and if they have missiles, will follow the missiles as they arc towards the target. When used with normal archers, you will miss out on some of the impact when at full range, due to reload time, it will transport you back to the new flight, rather than the dieing enemies.

[Tony Furze]

Yes, GMaximus, it's the Delete key...thanks.

Thanks again, Caravel. That link to FBEggs guide is a treasure. Switching off a number of unnecessary embellishments really makes the game more MTW player friendly. I now, for the first time, feel I want to give this game a go.