Travel advice within France

[Don Corleone]

Hello to all my backroom friends.

So, I know NOTHING about train service in Europe. Zilch. Nada. Nyet.

And I have to find a way to get from Rennes to Bordeaux one night. I've heard trains are the way to go for such regional travel, but the TGV, the SCNF and the RailEurope sites all seem to want me to travel by way of Paris, which appears to add substantial time and distance. The first two have the unfortunate habit of reverting to French if the orgination and destination are both within France.

Any assistance tendered will be most graciously praised and appreciated, si vouz plait.

Also, as a native English, somewhat Spanish speaker with little to no French in my vocabulary, I'm terrified. Can somebody tell me how gauche it is to be seen carrying a phrasebook around? If I start now, do I have any hope of being 'presentable' in 2 weeks?

As I said, I'll be in Rennes and Bordeaux, not Paris directly (other than a brief change of planes in DeGaulles).

Thanks for the help/advice.

Merci.

[Fragony]

Paris Montparnasse -> Bordeaux. Few hours. Practice your best bonjour and you will be fine most french speak english if you try a little french.

edit, reserve it will be expensive if you don't

[Tribesman]

Why not fly Don ?

[Tristuskhan]

Aouch.... I think you should try Rennes-Redon, and then take the Quimper-Vintimille from Redon to Bordeaux... Good luck, it's a slow train, but wait a minute... i'm gonna check, I'll edit the post.

[Don Corleone]

Why not fly Don ?

I'm traveling with a vertical marketing segment manager, who thinks it will be 'fun'. Fun is when you're there on vacation, finding your way on the train. I'm with you, Tribesman, quick and certain when it comes to business travel. Leaving a customer in Rennes at 5PM and staggering into a Bordeaux hotel at 2AM, with an 8AM customer call the next day is not what I call fun.

The train is also being perceived as cheaper. Don't know if it is or isn't.

[Tristuskhan]

Alright, the "best" I've found is Rennes 7h20 PM to Nantes and then Nantes 8h46 Pm to Bordeaux, arriving at 0h43. Travalling by night is almost impossible in western France... and all the rail network is becoming centered on Paris.

And: no phrasebook, just learn a few, very few words and most will be very happy to use the few english he or she knows to help you.

Edit: and please, what the hell is a "vertical marketing segment manager"?

[Don Corleone]

Alright, the "best" I've found is Rennes 7h20 PM to Nantes and then Nantes 8h46 Pm to Bordeaux, arriving at 0h43. Travalling by night is almost impossible in western France... and all the rail network is becoming centered on Paris.

And: no phrasebook, just learn a few, very few words and most will be very happy to use the few english he or she knows to help you.


Thank you, sir. I suppose a rental car might be another option. You folks drive on the right, correct?

[Tristuskhan]

Usually, yes. And please, answer my call, can you eat a "vertical marketing segment manager"?

re-edit: driving from Rennes to Bordeaux is an easy 5 hours trip.

[rory_20_uk]

Concerning trips to France: don't

~:smoking:

[Tristuskhan]

Concerning trips to France: don't

~:smoking:

I wish all the Brits could think like you do:laugh4: No more carbinized redheads on the beach!

[Brenus]

No phrase books:
If you are not good, they will not understand the question.
If you've got it right, you won't undestand the answer...:beam:

[Ice]

Learn French, Don. Maybe it was because I reaked off an American, but I would always try the "Excuse me, do you speak English? or "Excuse me, where is ____________", and the response would usually be negative.

Edit: in french of course

[Louis VI the Fat]

NM.

:shame:

[Louis VI the Fat]

I found:

Rennes - Nantes - Bordeaux
17:36 - 18:52 - 23:04
€ 94.

Rennes - Paris
17:05 - 19:10
Paris - Bordeaux
19:25 - 22:29
€ 192 total.

Going to Paris and then taking the TGV to Bordeaux is faster but more expensive. Five and a half hours is the fastest I can find by train. You'll hardly beat that by car - Rennes to Bordeaux is, I think, 400 kilometers. You can fly, but strangely, the fastest I can find takes three and a half hours flying time alone. Probably via Orly then.


And French are rude in any language. If you enjoy the fine art of intricate insults, learn French. If non-verbal rudeness alone is quite enough for your liking, don't bother with learning French just for a trip. ~;)

[Tristuskhan]

It's a business term. What's business, I hear you think? It's what we people outside of Bretagne do during daytime. Just why Don thinks he should go on a business trip to Rennes is beyond me, but I'll indulge him, seeing as the goal is to get to Bordeaux as fast as possible.

The fastest way by train I think is via Paris indeed. Just the way the rail lines are build. The fast rail lines (TGV) all run to and from Paris as a hub. France is not a country, it's a city-state. Everything runs via Paris. The only other city that matters is Bordeaux, prettier than Paris and recently fully restored to boot. Only three hours and €90 away from Montparnasse.
From Rennes I think a weekly horse carriage goes to Paris to deliver produce, but I'm not sure if you can hitch a ride. I wouldn't rely on renting a car in Rennes - it would be just your luck to discover that the locals need that one car in town for harvesting or something.

Listen to the wise advice of Not' Bon Maître Louis, Don! Just try to stay in the Montparnasse station while in Paris, or you may get drowned in Parisian's spit in just a two minute's time. They don't like the smell of horse dung people arriving from Brittany have. Especially when those people are from the US. And well: don't touch any Parisian since they carry various infectious deseases. Like arrogance, superficality, dry skin and so on....:skull:


Edit: and smallpox, I forgot that. Good luck.

[Louis VI the Fat]

Sorry. :embarassed:

The internet, the written word is not a good vehicle for teases and banter. When will I learn. :wall:

[Tristuskhan]

Sorry. :embarassed:

The internet, the written word is not a good vehicle for teases and banter. When will I learn. :wall:

Louis? Are you sick? becoming too sensitive? I thought pollution had given you some kind of bulletproof armour... Come on, boy, get back on your horse and charge!

[Don Corleone]

Come on Louis, Tristuskhan... I thought I was the one thing that brought you Parisians and Provinicials together in unity... scorn and contempt for the unwashed masses arriving from the West. :usa:

Just kidding. A vertical segment marketing manager.... In my company there's two ways to organize your business strategy. One is by the products themselves. That's a horizontal segment. A guy who makes plans on these sorts of things is a horizontal segment marketing guy. That's be me, in my case, also manager. A vertical segment is a business unit that's aligned by the customer's end market for your products: basestations, video displays, donkey kong machines... whatever you're going to use as a vehicle to flood the market with your chips. A vertical segment market manager sets the company's strategy up along those lines. That'd be Mr. "I've always wanted to get lost taking the trains in Western France".

I don't think I can learn French in 2 weeks. But I can learn hopefully enough phrases to be polite. And I'm all about self-effacing humor, something that seems to trump in spades among the French. :juggle2:

[Fragony]

Thank you, sir. I suppose a rental car might be another option. You folks drive on the right, correct?

If you go by car make sure you have one of these fluorising jackets, if your car breaks down you need it for the police they get nasty if you don't. But driving in the west of France is a nightmare, TGV from Paris takes only 4 hours, and isn't that expensive if you make reservation. Added benefit, you can say you have been in the greatest city on the face of the planet, oh paris je t'aime

[seireikhaan]

TGV.

I took it when on vacation a couple years ago, it was great. 4 hours from Nice on the cote d'azure to Paris, and quiet enough that if you want to take a nap, its quite possible. I dunno about an exact cost though, as I wasn't the one paying. Make sure to not buy anything on the train though, prices were terribly expensive for basic food or drink. So I would sneak something on to snack on if you can manage it.

[Louis VI the Fat]

Will you be spending some time in Bordeaux, Don?


https://img329.imageshack.us/img329/518/bordfh5.jpg




https://img514.imageshack.us/img514/9682/bord4da8.jpg





https://img110.imageshack.us/img110/6295/bord3px3.jpg

[Brenus]

Child pictures in the net? Louis?

[Louis VI the Fat]

Child pictures in the net? Louis?I my mind, I live in a parallel universe where pictures of children playing with water on a sunny day is associated with innocent fun and childlike amusement. :sweatdrop:


The idea was to make people / Don curious about what those pics are all about anyway. Not that anybody is remotely interested, but I have a few minutes to spare so I'll post a video and some pics anyway just because I wouldn't want to waste this fine opportunity to make to make the rest of the world envious of the grandness and beauty of France. ~;)


Bordeaux is the prettiest city in France, this is the prettiest part of BX. It's a 'water mirror'. It is build between the city and the river, to visually connect the two. The stilness of the water gives a beautiful reflection of the city when strolling along the river. A stillness, that was, until people discovered that three centimeters of water and mist spraying machines make for splendid toys. A bit of sun, and the whole city moves to the quay to splash around in it, get soaked, run through the mist and otherwise amuse themselves in childish ways with this 'work of art'. Sheer bliss. :smitten:

Videos:
Magique à Bordeaux (http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=y06CVUNeoq8&feature=related) - after 1:00 a beautiful water ballet hot chicks with wet shirts.

Urban wakeboarding (http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=Tq8KCbSlX3A&feature=related)



https://img50.imageshack.us/img50/4962/bord1as2.jpg


https://img205.imageshack.us/img205/2577/bord2xj4.jpg

https://img362.imageshack.us/img362/8214/bord11oa4.jpg

[Brenus]

I understand.
But living in England makes you paranoid about this kind of things...
Health and safety things... They forbid sports at school because it could be dangerous, then complaign about child obesity...

I can't take apicture of my grand daughter in her bath... They made all adult a potentail pedophile.
A toddler drawn few day ago, in a pound. A adult saw her going there but didn't dare to intervene. What would have happened to him if somebody would have seen him chasing a toddler?

The kids now bully adults in the street in maning them pedophile if they try to say something about a litter in the street. In croydon a police patrol was attacked by a mob because they ask a teenager to put the paper she just dropped in the bin...
The immediat reaction from the police Head Quarter was "do NOT atagonise the teenagers"...

It is so good to be protected...:beam:

[Fragony]

It's a 'water mirror'. It is build between the city and the river, to visually connect the two. The stilness of the water gives a beautiful reflection of the city when strolling along the river. A stillness, that was, until people discovered that three centimeters of water and mist spraying machines make for splendid toys. A bit of sun, and the whole city moves to the quay to splash around in it, get soaked, run through the mist and otherwise amuse themselves in childish ways with this 'work of art'. Sheer bliss. :smitten:

That is simply amazing.

edit; everybody will want to know where the music is from; 'In the mood for love', chinese movie that you need to see.

[Don Corleone]

I desparately wish I had time to spend in Bordeaux, but alas, it won't work for us. I think the train to Paris and out to Bordeaux winds up being the same amount time traveling, but because the train doesn't leave until 6pm, we wouldn't get in to Bordeaux until 11, and we have to be up at 5:30 the next morning. By driving, we can leave at 3:30/4:00PM ish, and get in around 9AM.

I've always wanted to go to France, but I'm afraid this is going to be a typical tour for me... the airport, the inside of a car, the hotel and a few assorted conference rooms. ~:mecry:

[Don Corleone]

Yay, it turns out I won't be driving to Toulouse after all. Rebooking the flight was going to add $1000 to my ticket price. So I'll have about 4 hours to kill in Bordeaux, (my flight to Munich is at 5:55 so I'll probably need to be at the airport by 4:30PM). Any recommendations on what a foreigner should do with 4 hours in Bordeaux?

Merci.

[Louis VI the Fat]

I desparately wish I had time to spend in Bordeaux, but alas, it won't work for us. I think the train to Paris and out to Bordeaux winds up being the same amount time traveling, but because the train doesn't leave until 6pm, we wouldn't get in to Bordeaux until 11, and we have to be up at 5:30 the next morning. By driving, we can leave at 3:30/4:00PM ish, and get in around 9AM. Don! This is France! Trains run every few minutes. You can take the train at 15:05, and be in Bordeaux before 9PM.

French trains are quick, reliable and safe!

https://img205.imageshack.us/img205/425/montparnasse2sp4.jpg

I am happy you have decided on not renting a car. Me, if I were you, I'd get myself a nice first class train ticket, a fine glass of wine, and watch the landscape whizz by your window. What could be more relaxing?
Alas, you'll be travelling trough the boring part of France. Flat, agricultural and build up. But if you're anything like me, you'll find even foreign traffic lights endlessly fascinating.

~~~~

Four hours in Bordeaux is short. Oooh!
I think you should just opt for a nice city stroll. There is little in Bordeaux that you must see before you die. No Louvre, Versailles, Big Ben or Colloseum. Bordeaux does have a very pleasant, very pretty and very compact city centre. You can soak up quit a bit in a few hours.
My tip; don't be 'American' about it. Don't rush, don't try to do it all. Just relax, have a cup of coffee somewhere too, take your time if you see something interesting. Bordeaux has the grandeur of Paris and the atmosphere of provincial France. You just can't go wrong.

I'm sure some travel guide has a good city walk. I am trying the net, but with not much luck.

What would be interesting, is if you get to see a bit of Rennes too. You'll know you're in Europe - 400 kilometers distance means two different worlds. Rennes is Brittany, northern, above the great dividing 'rooftop' line in France. Bordeaux is southern, the proximity of Spain is notable.

Rennes is rather pretty too. And you'll do a stopover in Paris. If you go up from Montparnasse - your train station - you're right in the city centre, just a few hundred meters away from the Eiffel tower and les Invalides. I can't believe you're travelling to all these places, first time in France at that, and you don't have the time to properly explore them. ~:mecry:

[Don Corleone]

I think I've confused you. Right now, unless I can talk my rather stubborn co-worker into turning the car in when we're in Rennes, the car, not the train is the plan. *bleah* I'm with you... I would be all about the train. In truth, if you want to understand Americans, take a road trip. If you want to understand Europeans, take the train.

I get to Rennes on Sunday, will be there from noon until sleep finally catches me. Monday will be all visits, then getting ourselves to Bordeaux. Since the trip down to Toulouse (which I also really wanted to see) would be prohibitively expensive, I'm actually just going to kill the afternoon in Bordeaux, then move along to Munich.

I agree. I'm just going to wander downtown, a coffee, perhaps a glass of wine, a nice lunch at a cafe, then mosie to the airport.

You know Louis, you should meet me in Rennes. You could play cultural attache. I'm sure I could expense a hell of an afternoon in Rennes' finer cafes.

[drone]

How far is Colleville-sur-Mer from Rennes by car? It's the opposite direction from Bordeaux, but it doesn't look too far away on Google Maps (distances can be deceiving in rural driving, though). I've always regretted not going there when I was living in the UK.

[Louis VI the Fat]

Apparently, I was confused over the train/car thing. Well you should be aware of the pro's and con's of both by now. Train or car doesn't make much of a difference in time or money. Trains, however, beat the stress of driving a car in a foreign country on a tight time schedule. And they serve great wine in first class.

Me, I'd try to convince your colleague that you don't need a car. This, indeed, is not America. And, in apparent contradiction to that, you'll only be shocked at how Americanised French main roads are. Hypermarkets, shopping malls, ugly square office blocks and chain restaurants everywhere.

Gah! Americans! Willing to spend two weeks on a crash course on learning French, and unwilling to spend three hours on such Frenchities as travelling by High Speed Train while enjoying a good glass of wine or coffee, the daily newspaper, and the changing landscapes that gently unfold before your very eyes.
At this rate, even if you do learn French fluently you'll still be Lost in Francelation during your stay.

I don't even have a driver's license. Bike, subway, train is all I need. Those and petty grovelling at the Car People to please please please take me to places that are out of reach. ~:mecry:


~~~~~~


On a bizar coincidence, if everything goes well, I'll be leaving for a trip to America on Monday. However, things do not appear to be well and family business might keep me here. I am not sure where I'll be on Monday. Uh, I'll PM you on your offer later tomorrow.

And speaking of coincidence, between Rennes, Paris, Bordeaux and Toulouse you'll have visited the towns of Tristuskhan, me and Meneldil. ~;)



Colleville-sur-Mer from Rennes by carOne and a half hour, as a quick guess.

[Don Corleone]

Well, I have now successfully navigated 2 days in France. All I have to say is.... wow.

First, the food.... I now understand why the French despise British and American cooking. One of the bright spots on driving from Rennes to Bordeaux this evening was an amazing occurrence. In the US, rest stop restaurants serve notoriously bad food. While not as good as the cafe's I've been indulging in for the past 2 days, the food in the rest stop cafeteria was better than most restaurants I've eaten in. And the cafe where I had the good fortune to enjoy lunch today was out of this world. Truly impeccable.

Second, the notorious French 'haughtiness, arrogance, dispersion to outsiders'. Not true. With no more French under my belt than "Bon jour, bon soir, merci, si vous plait, excuse m'oi, and no parlez frances", I have received friendly, smiling service from everyone I've come across. Perfect strangers, who had no requirement, professional or social to help, have contributed with suggestions for restaurants, cafes, electronics stores (for chargers), you name it. The reputation for hostile French people is poorly earned, and I for one am depely appreciative of just how kind and hospitable the population at large has been. Air France delayed my bag for a day.... 100 Euro spending spree to get what I needed. Try getting that in the USA...

Finally, an observation, not meant as criticism but general surprise. I had always thought of the French people as a whole as being rather lively and outgoing, for good or for bad. Not so. It has been my personal experience in Rennes, in Bordaux, and the stops along the way that while friendly and polite, the French people as a whole are somewhat reserved, even possibly shy.

Anyway, wonderful, wonderful time, even though it's been mostly work. Perhaps one of the best kept secrets I've ever stumbled across. Merci bouquet.

[Ser Clegane]

Great to see that you are enjoying your trip to France/Europe, Don :2thumbsup:

Probably shows that if you are traveling with a good and positive attitude it will eventually reflect back and you will be in for a good time.

Hope you enjoy the rest of your trip as well

:bow:

[Big_John]

Well, I have now successfully navigated 2 days in France. All I have to say is.... wow.

First, the food.... I now understand why the French despise British and American cooking. One of the bright spots on driving from Rennes to Bordeaux this evening was an amazing occurrence. In the US, rest stop restaurants serve notoriously bad food. While not as good as the cafe's I've been indulging in for the past 2 days, the food in the rest stop cafeteria was better than most restaurants I've eaten in. And the cafe where I had the good fortune to enjoy lunch today was out of this world. Truly impeccable.

Second, the notorious French 'haughtiness, arrogance, dispersion to outsiders'. Not true. With no more French under my belt than "Bon jour, bon soir, merci, si vous plait, excuse m'oi, and no parlez frances", I have received friendly, smiling service from everyone I've come across. Perfect strangers, who had no requirement, professional or social to help, have contributed with suggestions for restaurants, cafes, electronics stores (for chargers), you name it. The reputation for hostile French people is poorly earned, and I for one am depely appreciative of just how kind and hospitable the population at large has been. Air France delayed my bag for a day.... 100 Euro spending spree to get what I needed. Try getting that in the USA...

Finally, an observation, not meant as criticism but general surprise. I had always thought of the French people as a whole as being rather lively and outgoing, for good or for bad. Not so. It has been my personal experience in Rennes, in Bordaux, and the stops along the way that while friendly and polite, the French people as a whole are somewhat reserved, even possibly shy.

Anyway, wonderful, wonderful time, even though it's been mostly work. Perhaps one of the best kept secrets I've ever stumbled across. Merci bouquet.sounds like you are having a good time, enjoy. france is one of my favorite places, though i've only been to the cote azur and corsica.

from what i understand, the rudeness reputation pertains mostly (entirely?) to parisians, and comes mostly from tourist who expect the world handed to them by the locals.

the difference in the food is remarkable.. part of it is just the freshness of the ingredients. i got the sense that food is highly localized in france, what is common in one area is rare in others (because french cuisine relies heavily on local ingredients). btw, the single best piece of meat and the single best fish dish i've ever had, i had in france.


edit: btw, are you a wine drinker?

[Strike For The South]

I wanna go to Europe :sad:

[Big_John]

study abroad.

[Strike For The South]

study abroad.

I cant sell enough blood semen and marrow.

[Big_John]

I cant sell enough blood semen and marrow.
doesn't your school pay for you?