Trade Rights

[Grriffon]

Does establishing trade rights improve trade income, or is it in any way beneficial?

Thanks!

[Poppis]

Yes, it improves trade income.

[Nachtmeister]

Trade rights mean your cities can establish trade routes to the treaty-faction's cities - meaning land trade if you have common land-borders and sea-trade if you and the other faction have a harbor available for it. Not sure about exactly how sea-trade routes are determined but it seems that there is a fixed network of routes possible with all harbors maxed (so Roma could probably not have sea-trade with Sinope, but it does have a trade-route to Qart Hadast). Declaring war on the Qarthadastim means a severe decrease of income for the Romans (vice versa for Qarthadastim) as both factions have very lucrative sea-trade with each other, which is probably why punic wars seldom occur running with RTW.exe.
Generally you'll want to have trade rights with everyone around you.
Take a look at the settlement details=>trade summary scroll for some interesting details...

Does someone know whether trade rights gradually improve diplomatic relations?

[Mediolanicus]

Does someone know whether trade rights gradually improve diplomatic relations?


"diplomatic relations"...?
...
May I ask you what game you are playing?

[Connacht]

Finding a Diplomatic Relationship in a Total War game is just like trying to find a honest politician. Both are endangered species.

[Cbvani]

Finding a Diplomatic Relationship in a Total War game is just like trying to find a honest politician. Both are endangered species.

As far as I know, the AI treats human players differently than it does other AI factions when it comes to diplomacy, especially on higher difficulty levels. So Diplomatic Relationships just don't happen.

[General Appo]

Really? I thought the last Honest Politician died of sometime in the 50s.

You can trade with a faction even without having Trade Rights with that faction, in fact, your people will do so automatically. At least mine do. In fact, I have no idea what benefits it actually gives.
In MTW2 I´ve heard people saying that it gives benefits regarding merchants operating in foreign territory or something like that, but I´m not sure. But I still try to get Trade Rigths whenever I can, I mean, CA must have put them there for a reason. Right?

[Lysimachos]

You can trade with a faction even without having Trade Rights with that faction, in fact, your people will do so automatically. At least mine do. In fact, I have no idea what benefits it actually gives.
In MTW2 I´ve heard people saying that it gives benefits regarding merchants operating in foreign territory or something like that, but I´m not sure. But I still try to get Trade Rigths whenever I can, I mean, CA must have put them there for a reason. Right?

Same experience here. A war will of course cut trade, but I've never been able to spot a difference between trade rights and no trade rights.

[Connacht]

Really? I thought the last Honest Politician died of sometime in the 50s.

Well, maybe in our beautiful and reliable country, but I don't want to generalize too much and say that actually in the whole world, in every existing nation and city, all the honest politicians did the same end of the dodos. :P


You can trade with a faction even without having Trade Rights with that faction, in fact, your people will do so automatically. At least mine do.

Then probably trade rights increase a little exchanges with the faction one signed the agreement with.

[General Appo]

That would seem the most likely explanation, but I´ve learned enver to just assume something like that.
Isn´t there anyone with detailed knowledge of how the Trade Rights actually work?

[Nachtmeister]

"diplomatic relations"...?
...
May I ask you what game you are playing?


:san_laugh: MUHAHAHAR... (RTW-EB; Koinon Hellenon@~24X BC)

Yes they are usually difficult to influence - but it seems that there are some things that can be done to get an AI-faction friendly and many more things to make them very much less friendly.
I was just wondering whether trade rights were among the former or just a means for filling the coffers a bit faster.

[General Appo]

Right now we don´t even know if it fills the coffers faster. And all RTW tech experts seem to ignore this thread like the plague.

[konny]

Really? I thought the last Honest Politician died of sometime in the 50s.

Is that BC?


You can trade with a faction even without having Trade Rights with that faction, in fact, your people will do so automatically. At least mine do.

Seems they prefer to trade with factions you have trade rights with, but that seems to be not necesseraly needed.

[General Appo]

Is that BC?


It is.



Seems they prefer to trade with factions you have trade rights with, but that seems to be not necesseraly needed.

Isn´t there any way to check this? I´m jsut worried that it´ll turn out to mean absolutely nothing and be just a waste of time.

[Centurio Nixalsverdrus]

I think the AI factions have some kind of memory. I think they are basically ready to make peace with you if you had ONE war with them, not more. The second war can end if it is short. The third war is basically everlasting.

It helps (it helps, it isn't necessary) if you have only a short or better no border with them. It also helps if they were traditionally on "your side", meaning they were allied to your allies and such. Strong garrisons in border cities also help and can tip the balance if their military has an eye on your cities (we know that the AI's general staff and diplomatic corps live on different planets). It also helps to gift them a little bit money every turn, which is quite historical by the way.

Oops, what does that have to do with trade rights? I don't know. Perhaps trade rights help a bit in the sense of a pupils' exchange, for better understanding between two people?

[Tartaros]

Does establishing trade rights improve trade income, or is it in any way beneficial?

Thanks!

yeah, trade rights improve more income.
you can check it in your towninfo (left small icon i think). there are the in-and export land and seatrade (if possible) and the mnai you gain with some resources like wine, glas, timber and so on.

[General Appo]

Ummm... have you read the thread at all? Can you prove that Trade Rights actually improve income? You trade with other cities with our without Trade Rights, so there´s doesn´t seem to be any way to tell what exactly Trade Rights actually do.

[Tartaros]

mhhh, have to check it for sure in the game, but for example the seatrade turns blue in the great map when it its active and gray if not... and i believe that only friendly towns with trade rights appeare in the list...

[General Appo]

This I know to be false, as in my current Pontos campaign Kallatis turned up on my trading list despite me not having Trade Rights with them. Which I of course got right after that, just because I thought it would help somehow. Now I´m not so sure anymore.

[General Appo]

From the official TW forum:

http://shoguntotalwar.yuku.com/reply/143089#reply-143089

Note however that these guys aren´t official CA guys, nor give any sources. Also, this is for MTW2 and they mention merchants as proof, which of course don´t exist in RTW.

Looked around some more, and this pretty much seems to sum up the general belief:

"Ports connected with neutral factions' ports without trade rights give only half the trade income (or maybe it is two-thirds, I can't remember), whereas neutral factions' ports which you have trade rights with generate the same amount of trade as if you owned the province yourself... "

Now so far I havn´t seen any real proof of this, but I know a lot of the guys over at the .commie as we call it, and I´m gonna chose to believe this to be true.

[Tartaros]

i just tested a fresh pontos game.
first alliance with the arche sel. + trade rights: income with mazaka 38mnai.
then i kicked the alliance and the trade rights and ended the turn: income with mazaka next turn 8 mnai.
no other sea or land trade because only rebels (i don´t look if i was in war with them from the start up).
seems to make sence... without trade rights - minimal income
trade rights - earn more money with friendly neighbors

[Tartaros]

...as in my current Pontos campaign Kallatis turned up on my trading list despite me not having Trade Rights with them...
this make sense when there is a minimal trade with factional regions (as i learned befor). with establised trade rights there must be more income with Kallatis (?)...

[General Appo]

Indeed. I believe this matter has been sufficiently solved by the Superteam Appo &Tartaros!

That´s right, our colour is pink, and don´t you dare say a word about it, you homophobes. We´re queer and we´re here, deal with it!

[Tartaros]

TAADDAAAA!!! :belly::belly:

[General Appo]

Oh, that dress is just fabulous darling! Where did you get it? I just love it. :smitten:

Oh I´m so happy I just want to dance! :dancing:
Grouphug everyone! ~:grouphug:

Appo :kiss2:

[a completely inoffensive name]

The thread will become yet under cockroach crushed underneath....THE FOOT!

[Chris1959]

Isn't Map Information important as well as you will only trade with cities you Know about.

[General Appo]

I don´t think so, I believe the trade routes to automatically wether you know of them or not. Makes sense really, just beacause the Romans have´t bothered to get map info with the Ptolies it don´t mean that once the they conquer Phoinike everyone there will suddenly stop trading with Alexandreia.