What to do with the Epeirotes?

[Strategos Alexandros]

In my Makedone campaign I've reduced the Epeirotes to Serdike and Taras. Pyrrhos is still alive but has disappeared into the mountains north of Makedonia. Now I would like some suggestions on what to do with them. So far what I've come up with is:
1. Kill them off, which I would rather not do.
2. FD Taras to the Romani and keep them as Thracian raiders.
3. FD Taras to the Romani and give them Aitolia (Which I have not yet conquered)
4. Let them keep Taras but give them Aitolia, calling them something like the Koinon Pyrrhou.

I'd also like to know what I could call them for each option. Any ideas are welcome and the one I pick will recieve a balloon from my very own stock.

[Subotan]

You could take Seridike. I've had games where the Epeirotes have been left with just Taras, and the Epeirotes have marched up the Eastern spine of Italy, cutting Italy in two, lengthways. It's fun, half because you're screwing the Romani without doing anything, and half because it looks hilarious. However, you'd have to make sure that there is a big garrison in Taras before doing that, and that the Romani are occupied with Gaul.
How's the situation in the rest of Hellas?

[/Bean\]

You could just move them entirely so they become a whole new faction. Preferably one that would stem the mega expansion of giants like the Romani or Ptolies, or Sweboz. You could move them so they become the Boii, or Syracuse, or Massilians, or Pergamon, something like that. Then you can say you defeated Epiros, yet you still use that faction slot to do some good to the game

[Maion Maroneios]

Moving them elsewhere would need some cheating to be done. You see, supposing Taras is their capital ATM, you would not be able to FD their city into the hands of the Romani. Capitals aren't bribeable and can't switch hands from faction to faction through diplomacy either. As such, you will either have to fund the Romani in order to wage war against the Epeirotai, or go there yourself and kick them out. Then you can play with them.

As for what to do, I suggest you take Serdike and leave them in Taras. You could even give them some Illyrian provinces after that, but you will need to teleport there to take the Eleutheroi city/ies , then teleport an Epeirote FM there and rename/recolor the faction.

Cheers and good luck,
Maion

[/Bean\]

Depends how much you want to put into it really

[Cullhwch]

It's pretty fun to turn them into a Syracusan faction. Cheat an army to Sicily, take the big city (throw in Messana as well to build strength) and then FD those territories to them.

[Novellus]

Here's where the important decision is. If you really want to destroy Epieros, go ahead and take Serdike and Taras. However, I will warn you that Taras might be a poor decision. The reason why is that Taras has a wonderful barracks, but it can't be used by the Makedonian faction, just Koinon Hellenon and Epeiros. That is why as Koinon Hellenon, it is advisable to take Taras after the Romani conquer it so that they can train powerful units immediately after occupation. You as the Makedonians however, will have a terrible time should the Romans attack (which they probably will). It would take years for your MICs to be built to a substantial level in order for retraining to occur, and the onslaught of Pedites Extraordinarii, Triarii, and Hastati may overwhelm your initial forces.

However, if you have a capable phalanx-based army and you use your heavy cavalry in coordination with hammer-and-anvil tactics, you should be able to counter the Romans if for a year or two if you have enough soldiers to hold them off. The AI is terrible with dealing with phalanxes, and even Epeirote cavalry can destroy the Roman bodyguard cavalry. So it is easy to charge them from behind to route the Romans (I'm used to playing on VH/VH).

If I wanted to truly cripple the Epeirotes, I would take Serdike instead and work on rebuilding your homeland and preparing to assault Rome. The Romans will become a powerful adversary soon, and they are a mess to deal with should you decide to fight them. There is a good chance the Romans will lay siege to Taras anyway and conquer the Epeirotes there for you. So if I were you, I would simply take out the Epeirotes in Serdike and wait for the computer to do the rest.

The choice is yours. Hail Strategos!:2thumbsup:

[team_kramnik]

WHen in doubt, just recruit them into macedons military.
https://img411.imageshack.us/img411/2478/blackschildshv7.th.jpg (https://img411.imageshack.us/my.php?image=blackschildshv7.jpg)

[Maion Maroneios]

What exactly have you done? Added the Chaones and Koinon Phalangitai renamed as Thessalian Phalangites? I suppose you had to remove some units to do that, correct?

Maion

[team_kramnik]

Yes, an irish infantry had to go for the Chaonions and I replaced the Celtic mini-elephants with the epeirote and koinon medium phalanx. Also made the mercenary phalanx retrainable as a permanent foreign legion. So when the woodshields become available I'll have the lewy phalanx for garrison duty and 7 professional phalanxes for the royal army. I just hate fielding the same unit twice even in phalanx heavy armies. :yes:

Anyone know ancient greek? I named my new medium phalanxes:
Thessalikon Pezhetairoi and Molosson Pezhetairoi
Does that make any sense?

On-Topic:
I gave a few bonuses to the romans so they throw Epeiros much faster out of italy then I could throw them out of greece. So in my last Macedonia game they ended up in central Europe blocking the roman advance together with the cool mini-kingdoms EB added there with the last patches. Rome ended up first taking Corsica, Sardinia and Sicily then conquering Gaul and parts of Iberia before breaking through to central Europe. So if you want to restrict Rome to western Europe this would be an option.

[Maion Maroneios]

Yes, an irish infantry had to go for the Chaonions and I replaced the Celtic mini-elephants with the epeirote and koinon medium phalanx. Also made the mercenary phalanx retrainable as a permanent foreign legion. So when the woodshields become available I'll have the lewy phalanx for garrison duty and 7 professional phalanxes for the royal army. I just hate fielding the same unit twice even in phalanx heavy armies. :yes:
I see, pretty interesting. I believe you deserve a balloon for this: :balloon3:


Anyone know ancient greek? I named my new medium phalanxes:
Thessalikon Pezhetairoi and Molosson Pezhetairoi
Does that make any sense?
Actually, the term "Pezhetairoi" in Makedonia was strictly reserved to Makedonian citizens. This means that you should forget the 'Pezhetairoi' part and go for something like this:
Phalangitai Thessalikoi - Thessalian Medium Phalanx
Phalangitai Molossoi / Phalangitai Molossoi Epilektoi - Molossian Medium Phalanx / Picked Molossian Phalanx or Molossian Elite Phalanx

Hope this helped.

Maion

[team_kramnik]

Great thanks, but I'm sorry I might have to change ancient greek as I don't have a soundfile for
"Phalangitai Thessalikoi". :sweatdrop:
Wiki gives regions of upper macedonia as units of Philip II phalanx: Orestis-Lyncestis, Elimaea and Tymphaea. That would be an alternative but then I'm lacking the needed skins. Well an ox for Thessaly isn't perfect either. :wall:
I'll just see the use of Pezhetairoi as an attempt by the Macedonian king to show Northern Greece is becoming a unified nation. Also whereever large forces of professional phalangites would be recruited that would probably have required some social chances with the resulting class identifying with the Pezhetairoi of Macedonia.

Quess I'll go with:

Phalangitai Deuteroi: Lewy Phalanx found everywhere in the homeland regions.

Pezhetairoi Makedonikoi: Phalanx unit mostly recruited from the traditional areas in upper Makedonia. Or what's left of them.

Pezhetairoi Agrianikoi: Phalanx unit based on Paeonians imigrating to Macedon during the Galatian invasion. Again according to Wiki bull is one of the few surviving paeonian words. So I quess it's a better fit then Thessaly. And the Koinon Phalangitai is the best looking phalanx of the game.

Pezhetairoi Molossoi: Phalanx unit founded by the Epeirote King and taken over by the Makedonian King.

Misthophoroi Phalangitai: Freelancers or soldiers from states with cash problems having entered longterm contracts with the King of Macedon.

Hysteroi Pezhetairoi: Veteran Phalanx based on Pezhetairoi Agrianikoi

Chaeonion Agema: Veteran Phalanx based on Pezhetairoi Molossoi

Argyraspides: Veteran Phalanx based on Pezhetairoi Makedonikoi

anyway I can't claim to do very realistic modding:

https://img368.imageshack.us/img368/1354/macedonsa4.th.jpg (https://img368.imageshack.us/my.php?image=macedonsa4.jpg)

[teh1337tim]

omfg more cities O.o...
howd you do that?>>.<< ah well...
lemme guess, you took a provice out from somewhere in the baltics OR somewhere in the far east huh..

[Strategos Alexandros]

Alright, I've decided to take Serdike and move the remaining sons of Pyrrhos to Taras with some phalangites, Thraikians and Illyrians. I'll also give some hoplites, tarentine horse and brettians/lucanians to Taras to represent the peoples of Magna Graecia rallying to the banners of the sons of Pyrrhos. Thanks to all for suggestions, have a balloon each:
:balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2:
And, team_krannik, I may steal your idea too!

[Maion Maroneios]

I'll just see the use of Pezhetairoi as an attempt by the Macedonian king to show Northern Greece is becoming a unified nation. Also whereever large forces of professional phalangites would be recruited that would probably have required some social chances with the resulting class identifying with the Pezhetairoi of Macedonia.
While this is unhistorical, it sounds interesting as an idea. Good luck with Hellenising the world, noble sympatriotes!


Thanks to all for suggestions, have a balloon each
Yeah, I has balloon!!!:2thumbsup: Thanks mate and good luck with your campaign!

Maion

[Novellus]

Alright, I've decided to take Serdike and move the remaining sons of Pyrrhos to Taras with some phalangites, Thraikians and Illyrians. I'll also give some hoplites, tarentine horse and brettians/lucanians to Taras to represent the peoples of Magna Graecia rallying to the banners of the sons of Pyrrhos. Thanks to all for suggestions, have a balloon each:
:balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2:
And, team_krannik, I may steal your idea too!

Thank you for the balloon!

Hooray! My first one!:beam::balloon2:

[Subotan]

Sweet. I shall name him "Junior".

[Cambyses]

Another thing, to actually "win" the game with the Makedonians you do actually need to eliminate Epirus and KH. So option 1 from the OP will ultimately be the only viable one.

In my Makedon campaign I booted them out of Greece and they then proceeded to take over Italy. In fact Ive never seen the Epirotes do well while they hold territories in Italy and their homeland regions. But as soon as they are booted out of one area they seem to grow a lot stronger in the other.

[Skullheadhq]

Sail to India, conquer a town there, give it to the Epirotes. crush their settlements in europe and the Indo-Epirote kingdom is born!

[team_kramnik]

omfg more cities O.o...
howd you do that?>>.<< ah well...
lemme guess, you took a provice out from somewhere in the baltics OR somewhere in the far east huh..

Yes, you're right. I can't add anything real modders can't add. I first took out the Gaesatae because I thought I would need a model_slot for my "pezhetairoi" (sorry Maion) and obvisously the Gaesatae/Tindanotae model is not used by other units. Everything else came from Britain except the Averni as unfortunatly Britain only has 1 faction (no, I don't hate celts).

Apart from the effect of buildings I haven't edited stuff before, so this work is all very crude.
I just saw this thread ybout the Epeirotes while I was editing their army and couldn't resist.

Maion, I made you tyrant of Megalopolis. Hope you'll find the time, you'll also get a balloon for your effort. :balloon3:


Alright, I've decided to take Serdike and move the remaining sons of Pyrrhos to Taras with some phalangites, Thraikians and Illyrians. I'll also give some hoplites, tarentine horse and brettians/lucanians to Taras to represent the peoples of Magna Graecia rallying to the banners of the sons of Pyrrhos.

Sounds good. Maybe also send an expeditionary force to help them. Keeps the Balance in Italy and the sons of Phyrros will owe you making them less able to stir up trouble in Epeiros.



Thanks to all for suggestions, have a balloon each:
:balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2::balloon2:
And, team_krannik, I may steal your idea too!

Thanks for the baloon!
Regarding the units, just make sure you change the model. Otherwise you'll have e.g. naked men pretending to be phalangites and noone wants to see that.