View Full Version : Rituals Pre- and post-battle
For a school progect i have to do some reserches on 2 topics: rituals pre-,during and post-battle for romans; same thing for greeks of classical age and I was hoping someone in here could please help me.
So if any of those experts out there could help i'd really appreciate it.
Also i would really enjoy an answer, since i posted the same request in an other post of mine but in 4-5 days i've had no answer relative to the matter.
P.S. i'm particularly intrested in the peana, i know it was a chant to inspire troops in honour to apollo but have no idea what it said.
P.P.S i kinda also need a map of roman expansion in the year 245.
Reverend Joe
01-28-2009, 22:48
Visit your public library.
:wink:
russia almighty
01-29-2009, 01:25
Research sacrifices.
MarcusAureliusAntoninus
01-29-2009, 02:09
Doesn't have your exact date, but here are two expansion maps (I think one comes from wikipedia):
https://img301.imageshack.us/img301/3140/romebig7idqw5.gif
https://img142.imageshack.us/img142/4622/romanrepublicempiremapix6.gif
kekailoa
01-29-2009, 04:36
That is a very, very cool map.
I like.
Visit your public library.
:wink:
if yall look in the other post of mine you willfind out why i cant do that.
and i already searched but really didn't find the right amount of details.
Also thanks a lot MAA for the map. But the second one might be wrong as it shows rome in 270 holding Calabria and Bruttia.
Strategos Alexandros
01-29-2009, 17:09
They did.
Second Map
Could anyone give me some info on the Illyrian remnant of the Westertn Roman Empire, the Romans in the Crimea, and a Roman Moorish Kingdom I've heard about that survived the Vandals. They seem to be quite obscure, so I can't find much info, but that's what makes them so interesting.
They did.
You are telling me that they took two of the biggest regions in italy in less than 2 years?
Plus i kinda was wondering why noone has even given me a link to a decent site. i don't think i'm asking to much just some info on rituals. I've seen much more difficult questions answered much quiker than this, i've been waiting almost a week and have gotten no answers. Please, the paper is due in 3 days!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :help::help::help::help::help::help::help::help::help::help::help:
MarcusAureliusAntoninus
01-31-2009, 01:22
Once Tarentum fell in 272BC, the whole of southern Italy was basically under Roman control.
I don't really know much on battle rituals...
Mediolanicus
01-31-2009, 11:55
Well, there's the story about that Roman general in that sea battle with Carthage, who threw the holy chickens overboard because they wouldn't eat (then let them drink). If chickens, released from their cages, would storm for the food and peck it, it would be considered a good omen for battle. If they didn't eat, it was a bad omen.
The general lost the sea battle. (I forgot all the names).
And I vaguely remember something about birds warning Roman defenders during the seige and sack of Rome by Brennus, but I could be wrong there
Other than that, look for "the evil eye" (Romans are good at those) and curses and stuff.
Look for the Augures, who would interpret omens.
Looking at organs of ritually slaughtered animals (it has a name but I forgot, but it would be done by the Haruspex) and the flight of birds (auspicium) also were ways to tell how the battle would turn out.
I suppose making offerings of food and incense to the Lares (house gods) to saveguard the pater familias or another family member would be done also.
There's a festival called Equiria, in honor of Mars, held in early spring during which the campaigns for the following campaign season were planned (and possibly pleasing Mars into granting them victory).
Can't think of anything else at the moment.
Dutchhoplite
01-31-2009, 12:12
Well, there's the story about that Roman general in that sea battle with Carthage, who threw the holy chickens overboard because they wouldn't eat (then let them drink). If chickens, released from their cages, would storm for the food and peck it, it would be considered a good omen for battle. If they didn't eat, it was a bad omen.The general lost the sea battle. (I forgot all the names).
Publius Claudius Pulcher at the battle of Drepanum.
He threw all the sacred chickens overboard saying "If they won't eat, let them drink", since they refused to eat before the battle.
And I vaguely remember something about birds warning Roman defenders during the seige and sack of Rome by Brennus, but I could be wrong there
Geese warned the sleeping Romans defenders when the Gauls tried to surprise them.
Strategos Alexandros
01-31-2009, 15:24
Polybius may contain something: http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/ptext?lookup=Plb.+toc
I would check for you myself but I don't have the time right now. The search function might find you something else too.
Does anyone have any idea wich chapters of polybius' histories i have to gh through to find the info i need? And thank you all for your answers.
Hello? Would anyone mind answering?
Mediolanicus
02-01-2009, 18:41
Hello? Would anyone mind answering?
In my experience, people are less helpful when you urge them.
I wouldn't mind answering, but I really don't know which lines of Polybius could be useful.
Fluvius Camillus
02-01-2009, 23:09
Could anyone give me some info on the Illyrian remnant of the Westertn Roman Empire, the Romans in the Crimea, and a Roman Moorish Kingdom I've heard about that survived the Vandals. They seem to be quite obscure, so I can't find much info, but that's what makes them so interesting.
The Last Remnant of the Western Empire is the one of Julius Nepos, The emperor before Romulus Augustus.
http://www.roman-empire.net/collapse/collapse-index.html
Read the last parts of this.
In my experience, people are less helpful when you urge them.
I wouldn't mind answering, but I really don't know which lines of Polybius could be useful.
I'm sorry i didn't mean to be rude but the project is due in 2 days and I still have very little material.
So please if anyone out there knows anything about Roman and greek rituals pre and post battle post here!!!!!!!!!!!!! :help:
Ok now it's pretty frustrating, I know there are a ton of experts that could help me on this site, plus there have been more or less 600 views, how come of those 600 only 6 answered?
Please i really need help, c'mon.
Dutchhoplite
02-04-2009, 22:32
Well, this may sound harsh but *i* don't think people come here to do your homework. You can only hope for the best and find some helpfull people.
Succes!
what difference would it have made if i haden't added that i need it for scool? would people have answered me quicker?
C'mon.....
anyway i'm not triyng to plagiorise(sorry but i have no idea how to spell that word) any of the work on here, i just would like to know how the greeks and romans would make the gods happy before a battleand how they'd thank 'em after a victory. Plus i have a new question, often xenophon and thukydides and herodotus after a greek army won a battle they'd erect a trophy. What where tese things, i know they were like to simbplise victory but what did they look like?
C'mon. please...... :help::help::help::help::help::help::help::help::help::help:
all I really need is even just a link to decent site that could help me, i've done most of the reserch by now but still can't find anything on trophys.
Strategos Alexandros
02-07-2009, 11:48
Some of the captured armour might be used to erect a trophy (tropaion) at the point where the 'turn round' (trope) of the enemy had first occurred. Usually it was nailed to a nearby tree as a monument of the battle.
http://www.forgottendelights.com/images/Trophy%20Painter%20MFA.jpg
Wow thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!
A lot.
Dutchhoplite
02-07-2009, 14:14
Roman coins ;)
http://www.romanemperors.com/images/julius-caesar/julius-caesar-denarius-venus-coin-9.jpg
Julius Caesar Denarius with the Head of Venus wearing a crown as a sign of royalty is on the left. On its right is the Trophy of Gallic arms with seated captives at either side of base, with "CAESAR" below as emblem.
http://www.kernunnos.com/culture/warriors/trophiesAV_sm.jpe
Caesar,gold aureus, 48 BCE
Thanks a lot both of you, this really helps.
I do have a few curiosities thow, like did the romans start building trophys as a result of greek influence or did they have the same idea? Plus i know that hoplites after a battle had to be recognised and properly buried, would this happen also with the roman soldiers?
Thx in advance
Hello? anyone in there?:dizzy2:
Dutchhoplite
02-09-2009, 21:41
Private message for mister Cyrus!
Thx very much Dutch hoplite.:beam:
But unfortunately i am still completely ignorant about roman rituals, so if any one could answer my previous questions :"did the romans start building trophys as a result of greek influence or did they have the same idea? Plus i know that hoplites after a battle had to be recognised and properly buried, would this happen also with the roman soldiers?" i'd really appreciate it.
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