Music to fight by

[Forward Observer]

One of the things that we tend to ignore, that really adds to the overall immersiveness of STW, is the music. It adds charactor and drama to the overall game package. I wonder if the expansion pack will have any new or original background music.

This also got me to wondering what kind of music they would use for the next evolution of this game. I have read threads suggesting Roman wars, Greek wars, Celtic, and Peloponesian wars.

I suppose for a Roman war based game you could use the grand imperial sounding music like they used in the Hollywood epics like Ben Hur or Sparticus---Lots of trumpets and kettle drums. Or better yet, since it's Italian how about Dean Martin or Perry Como. I love their stuff. Naaah! Love songs wouldn't do for killing soldiers.

Or what about Greek? Is ancient Greek music simular to modern traditional Greek music? I think the theme from Zorba would get on my nerves after a awhile.

Then there are the Celts. What kind of music made their hit parade? For some reason I think it would be flute music Yeah, lots of flutes--hundreds of flutes. Did you know that a person who plays the flute is called a floutist. I alway thought that the word sounded like someone had gas.

And last is Peloponesian music. I can't remember the last time I heard a good Pelopnesian tune, but it was a real toe tapper.

Whatever they choose, I know the perfect composer--Barry Manilow--he's out of work right now, and I bet he would do slam bang up job. (FO hums a few bars of Copa Cabanna to himself)

Actually, a little ZZ Top would be just fine.

Some food for thought that may result in brain flatulence, so be warned.

Cheers

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Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl.

[This message has been edited by Forward Observer (edited 05-18-2001).]

[Hosakawa Tito]

I'd kind of like to hear "Flight of the Valkyries" as my cavalry runs down those pesky archers. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif
Tito

[Irving]

dude... that'd be sweet...

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Chaos is born from order.
Cowardice is born from bravery.
Weakness is born from strength.
-Sun Tzu

[Alastair]

No, ancient Greek music has absolutely nothing to do with anything heard today. They had two instuments, the lute and one other I forget. The Celts, to my mind, would obviously have a bagpipe, but that may not have been until later. By Peloponesian I assume you mean the peninsula in Greece, and I would assume that would be the same as Greek music so I don't know exactly what you mean...

I would suggest no non-film music after 1950, as that is generally pop culture and not fitting for a historical wargame. Myself, I think it would be somewhat fitting to insert at least a little Gladiator music. Also, Ride of the Valkries, however nice, is about Norse mythology, and the one you are most likely thinking of is not the main theme of that piece.

Finally, I don't think a "slam bang up job" is what is needed in this game. Probably the best solution is to look around in the Romantic composers and find one good for orderly war. Maybe Mahler's Resurrection symphony.

[This message has been edited by Alastair (edited 05-19-2001).]

[candidgamera]

Soundtrack music:

Generally:
Heavy Metal - the first one.
Das Boot - the pursuit track.
Glory.
Last of the Mohicans.
Opening track to . . . Red October.

O'Fortuna and Siegfried's Funeral.

And Finally:
The Red Army Sings, Tracks:
Partisan Song.
Song Of The Volga Boatmen.

Specifically, the Ran soundtrack was pretty good in places


[This message has been edited by candidgamera (edited 05-19-2001).]

[candidgamera]

Another thought:

Maybe they could get Yo Yo Ma to do something similar to what he did for CTHD.

[Alastair]

CTHD?

[Catiline]

Somewhere you used to be able to download the Gladiator theme renamed as one of the battle wavs for shogun. Can't remember wehre, I never installed it, but i stuck it in my MP# folder, before deleting it because of course to keep it would have been illegal http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

Peloponnesian gentleman please. It's taken me three years to learn to spell it, you might as well learn too. As to ancient greek music i may be imagining it but I'm sure there is at least some actual notation, though not in any modern sense, survivning for it somewhere. with what accuracy it can be reconstructed i don't know... THere were definitely more than two instruments though Alastair. I want Greeks next, but it won't happen.

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It's not a bug, it's a feature

[candidgamera]

Alastair:

Boy, sorry about making a habit of cryptic posts to you there sir: Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon.

General:
Another appropriate composer would have to be Ryuichi Sakamoto who helped with score for "The Last Emperor" and also did "Wild Palms" soundtrack, the latter ironically has some good pieces for battles or "atmosphere" on it.

Hans Zimmer has done some nice stuff lately too: "The Thin Red Line" for example.

Of Roman, Greek period: The PBS miniseries:
"From Jesus to Christ" has some good, stirring period (it would seem) music to it -good horn and drum stuff in places.

[Alastair]

Sorry Cat, I just remember reading part of a book on the history of music, and it talked mainly about two instruments, the lute being high, and one other being low. I probably shouldn't make statements without finding the book again. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif

[Anssi Hakkinen]

Modern "traditional" Greek music (bouzouki, etc.) has about as little to do with ancient Greece than modern "traditional" Italian music (Perry Como http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/biggrin.gif) has to do with ancient Roman music. A lot of things have changed there in two thousand years.

On ancient Greek instruments: if Alastair-san's high instrument was the kithara, then I'd assume the low one would be the lyra (lyre). There was also a wind instrument, a "double oboe" known as aulos. See the pertinent page at Microsoft Encarta (http://encarta.msn.com/find/Concise.asp?ti=0493E000).

Anyway, Zímmer (Gladiator) -type music would be such an obvious choice for TW2 - Romans that I'd be surprised if they didn't go through with it. Oh well, it's not a bad choice. And the Celts could use bagpipes... Lots of bagpipes (see James Horner).

(BTW: This is a development unpredecented in Dojo history. A thread that began as frivolous has turned serious! Way to go! I knew we had it in us! http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/cool.gif )

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"4. Rei: right action--a most essential quality, courtesy."

[Otomo Sukemasa]

Just to put in my two Koku worth. How about each clan has its own battle theme?
Here are my suggestions.

Ronin - 'Self Preservation Society' from The Italian Job

Takeda - Darth Vader's theme from Star Wars

Imagawa - 'Spice Up Your Life' The Spice Girls (please note I only know about this through my daughter)

Mori - 'Mack the Knife' Frank Sinatra

Hojo - Theme music from The Terminator

Uesugi - Theme music from The Sound of Music ('The hills are alive...' etc etc)

Shimazu - 'We Will Rock You' by Queen

Oda - 'Two Tribes' by Frankie Goes To Hollywood



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Otomo Sukemasa

"An exhausted animal will still fight, as a matter of natural law"

[Catiline]

Some where in the Depths of OT is a frivolous thread that developed into a serious discussion, but i can't rember what it was on... i'll go look http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif

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It's not a bug, it's a feature

[Catiline]

Recnostructed Greek Music (http://www.oeaw.ac.at/kal/agm/) from incriptions and the like here. It's ummm painful in places, but it's done with a synthesiser I'm going to look for some better reconstructions, but there's some suitably haunting stuff here.

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It's not a bug, it's a feature

[Catiline]

Ok here's a download of a a reconstruciton of some of Homer's Odyssey (http://www.oeaw.ac.at/kal/sh/demodokos.mp3), equivalent to thrity lines or so. Be warned, it's 2.4 MB.

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It's not a bug, it's a feature

[Alastair]

Oops, the high one was the lyra, and the low one the aulos. Sorry, really should find that book... And, ah, Otomo, I hope you weren't serious... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/eek.gif

[shingenmitch2]

ANSSI - you guys all seem to be correct on the Greeks/Romans -- however, way off on the Celtic bagpipes. [IGNORE REST OF POST: SEE CATALINE BELOW :-) ] These are celts, not Scotts. I think the bagpipe is much more recent than the celts. Anyway, I am sure FORWARD was talking more of the "Gallic" Celts and Germano-celtic tribes, who were far more numerous than those stuck in Britain. Lets see: Belgae, Cerusci, Ambarii ... etc. All the Celts in France, Germany, northern Itally, Spain... my guess would be drums, the shield beating and the ever popular "War horn that Rattles"--supposedly was quite noisey.

[This message has been edited by shingenmitch2 (edited 05-21-2001).]

[Catiline]

You want bagpipes Go Here (http://www.tartans.com/bagpipes.html) and Here (http://www.bagpipes-henderson.com/history.cfm). They've been about a very long time, the Romans used them, though i'm not sure about the way this information is used on these sites, the reference is I think Procopius who was 6th century aD and talking about the armies of his time. None the less they were about and being used.

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It's not a bug, it's a feature

[shingenmitch2]

Wow! I stand corrected. Cat great info! Never came across anything on bag pipes before in my readings on classical warfare (must admit I've never looked into the instrument end of things)

I would say, tho, that all the accounts I read of the Gallic wars only ever mentioned "war cries" and "war horns, war rattles" for the celtics. So this must be something often overlooked!


[This message has been edited by shingenmitch2 (edited 05-21-2001).]

[mrkamakazisan]

did anybody even mention gettysburg? the main title can whip the dickins out of gladiator any day.

[candidgamera]

M:

Gettysburg: agreed, though don't know if it works for STW period wise. Also the Gburg extra music with the fife and drum stuff.
Thinks its especially well tuned in to ACW.

Henry V might work though, or Elizabeth - both orchestral.

BTW: is that Point Pleasant, WV of the "silver bridge" disaster fame? - ironic if so: going to be in Ravenswood just up the stream a ways for a few days starting tommorrow.