Superior Tactics 2-NEW VIDEO

[ToeAndno]

http://www.totalwar.com/empire/gallery/videos.php

Enjoy

[ByzanKing]

If I could only watch this at work. Stupid sexy internet firewall!!!!!!!:furious3:

[Fisherking]

it no worky! No picture:furious3:

[ToeAndno]

Just to be safe, try out the UK site

[Sir Beane]

It's Jack!

Cavalry seem a lot less powerful in this video. Perhaps a deliberate attempt to respond to the critiscism of the last one?

[ToeAndno]

Most defnitely a response, haha.

[Fisherking]

Half the world and a few aliens must be on that site! That is the slowest I have ever seen a video load…

I can’t help but think that Jack Lusted is one brave guy. Right now the demo horde has his face scanned and a voice print… they are likely scouring all Britain for his likeness.

They will want to hold him for ransom! And while they do, water board him for additional information….

Quick! Call Downing Street and get that man SAS protection!

[Barkhorn1x]

If I could only watch this at work. Stupid sexy internet firewall!!!!!!!:furious3:

Me too. :furious3:

Can someone be good enough to briefly describe the contents?

Thanks.:2thumbsup:

[Sir Beane]

Me too. :furious3:

Can someone be good enough to briefly describe the contents?

Thanks.:2thumbsup:

Poland vs. Austria, with Poland as the A.I.

The video is an attempt to demonstrate massed cavalry tactics and how to beat them. Poland has a large contingent of Winged Hussars, who are the best cavalry in the game apparently.

Jack sets up a long line of infantry for maximum firepower. The Polish attempt to flank with cavalry but he sends his own cavalry to beat them, his cavalry are eventually beaten. Part of his flank forms a defensive square designed to fight off cavalry and it works (very effectively).

After that its just a case of shooting stray horses, with the cavalry having been soundly defeated by infantry.

[Monk]

.com is apparently getting blown up by high traffic as this video is taking forever to load fully.

Anyone got sights on a downloadable/HD version somewhere?

[ToeAndno]

Direct Link:
Mediafire.com -> Clicky (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?yl1gwoloemm)

From another forum, not hi-res yet.

[Barkhorn1x]

Thanks for that - but I just watched it as I found a link that was not blocked elsewhere.

Observations:
- Looks like a later build than the first vid to me - much more fluid/polished
- Graphics looked much better
- Sound was better too


- Jack looks like he is wearing a Hogwart's scarf! :laugh4:

Hey Jack - say 'ello to 'arry for me. :2thumbsup:

[Fisherking]

Jack looks like Malfoy’s first cousin…just dark hair…and no sneer…

[Monk]

Thanks for that - but I just watched it as I found a link that was not blocked elsewhere.

Observations:
- Looks like a later build than the first vid to me - much more fluid/polished
- Graphics looked much better
- Sound was better too

Agreed. Especially the uniforms of the troops, they didn't have the "low-res" texture look that a lot of the videos from the past have had. Very nice, very richly detailed. With no offense to the previous CA rep who played a game in front of a camera, Jack seems to be much more savvy about his tactical position and what the AI is gonna throw at him. He keeps the squares on the flanks to protect against a cavalry attack while going head to head with the Polish center.

The only thing that concerns me is that the Polish cavalry charges the square. To jack's credit it looked like he had at least two squares that pretty solidly cut off the polish cavalry from attacking his line infantry. Unless they wanted to ride through the exchange of fire and subject themselves to friendly fire it was likely the only other way the AI saw to get to its objective. :shrug:

It's good to see, however, that the best cavalry in the game cannot break through a formation designed to counter them.

Much better Vid. :yes:

[tibilicus]

"These cavalry will beat my infantry if they charge them head on"

This quote concerns me. I'm not hoping for another game whereby blobbing all my cavalry into a big mass and charging a front line ensures me victory.

I hope this isn't the case..

[CBR]

Hm hussars supposedly can charge straight through a line in a frontal attack. Maybe the squares will defeat cav but nonetheless it still manages to enter the square. I'd still like to see more firepower and the advanced morale system than what has been shown so far.

I thought the first video showed more of the action than this one. Difficult to see what is going on.


CBR

[Monk]

Hm hussars supposedly can charge straight through a line in a frontal attack. Maybe the squares will defeat cav but nonetheless it still manages to enter the square. I'd still like to see more firepower and the advanced morale system than what has been shown so far.

I thought the first video showed more of the action than this one. Difficult to see what is going on.


CBR

That looked like a graphical bug to me. I watched the vid again and a number of troops, instead of stopping the cavalry like some others get pushed back, gliding backwards like a phantom and allowing cavalry units to bit by bit ease into the square.

edit: just hit me. Maybe this is the reason we don't have a demo/land battles aren't considered "ready" in that build?

[CBR]

2:33 does not look like a bug to me IMO


CBR

[Monk]

2:33 does not look like a bug to me IMO


CBR

Actually that's exactly what I was referring to. If you look dead center of the screen you can see an infantryman just gliding backwards, not engaging in animation. He's being pushed along by a Hussar. :shrug:

[KozaK13]

You can only do so much, infantry got pushed in Med 2 and Rome like that.

[Monk]

You can only do so much, infantry got pushed in Med 2 and Rome like that.

I've never seen it to that extent though. But I'll take your word for it. :yes:

[pdoyle007]

That worried me slightly too, although thinking about it realistically if the soldier was unloaded the horse would hit him, push him back and die from bayonet, which is basically what happened.

Unless Jack was obviously better in the line infantry I am unsure why the cavalry charged the squares, it can be seen as a daft AI move (rather than wait for the Polish line infantry to engage the square) or a clever AI move (last role of the dice/act of desperation knowing they'll lose anyway and doing something to try and force a win).

Also glad I'm not the only one that cheers when I win!!

[Pinxit]

That worried me slightly too, although thinking about it realistically if the soldier was unloaded the horse would hit him, push him back and die from bayonet, which is basically what happened.

Unless Jack was obviously better in the line infantry I am unsure why the cavalry charged the squares, it can be seen as a daft AI move (rather than wait for the Polish line infantry to engage the square) or a clever AI move (last role of the dice/act of desperation knowing they'll lose anyway and doing something to try and force a win).

Also glad I'm not the only one that cheers when I win!!

People seem obsessed facing an excellent AI. And there is no mercy when it comes to bad moves by the AI. As you all have proven during these two tactics movies.

What you dont seem to grasp is that an AI that always does the right thing isnt perfect, but actually rather flawed. An AI always doing the right move, would put up little resistance since there is only so many correct moves done by the book, consequently being predictable and easy to beat. I want variation in the computers behaviour. I dont want it to act brilliantly all the time. That would be unrealistic and boring.

And I say that because I live in the land of the :viking:

[Sheogorath]

The muskets sound much better in this movie, I think. They got rid of the old MTW2 'boooum' noise and gave them a much snappier effect. They sound more like muskets and less like miniature cannons.

[Alexander the Pretty Good]

Thanks for the link, ToeAndno. All the official Total War sites seem to be loading very slowly for me (which is weird, I've got great university bandwidth to burn).

I think the pushback thing in 2:33 may be a bug, sort of. I've seen it in M2TW (or nearly as bad, I'm pretty sure). Basically, the cavalry continues to push back the infantry because neither individual is getting a successful resolution to the combat animations or something like that.

[NagatsukaShumi]

Tbf, I am rather pleased that the only negative I can pick out is a slight graphical mishap.

[Greyblades]

I was kinda hoping for a naval battle this time. Oh well...
Actualy have we ever had a demonstration of the naval battles?

[Ituralde]

No, but then we didn't have a presentation of a land battle, before these two videos showed up.

Fortunately there's one in the demo though.

[Fisherking]

Now we don’t need it…We can learn our selves.

And as for the graphics glitch, it has been happening in every game from MTW as I recall. I have lived with it this long, one more game is not going to make much difference.

[Incongruous]

Looks crisper and more professional now, as others have pinted out there does still seem to be the issue or un-responsive animation which has plagued total war since Rome, and I hope it is fixed before release.

Other than that, I was pleased to see that infantry squares, no matter the quality of oposition cavalry, seem to hold out well and win through.

I am still worried about the size, or rather concentration, of battlefields and armies but will hold out judgement.

[Lusitani]

Hmm am i the only one getting tired of watching others playing ETW? lol

And I want different coloured horses in each unit :P


V.

[Greyblades]

Im just glad the infantry squares look like infantry squares and not like that drawing of the tactic, at the official site, or that... thing in imperial glory.

[Tully Bascombe]

Hmmmm.... The squares weren't as "dense" as they should be historically. To me it looked like the cavalry actually did quite well attacking the square. They plunged into the first few lines. Actually the whole point of the square was to present the horses with such a dense mass of people that they would refuse to charge into it, but instead run through the gaps between the squares. The point of putting gunners and cavalry on the inside was to keep them out of harms way.

Cavalry attacking infantry would generally advance at a walk until coming within a few hundred yards, at which point they would speed up to a trot. At 50 to 100 yards they would break into a full gallop. Properly positioned infantry squares would have a few cannons placed beween squares. The cannons would be fired as the cavalry approached, infantry would open fire and the remaining cavalry would be chaneled into the gaps between squares where they would be raked by the infantry on the sides of the squares. It was often very difficult to stop cavlary once they were in full charge mode. After breaking through the lines they might continue to run for a mile or more, by which time their cohesion was so badly broken that it would take hours to reform into an effective fighting force. The square was an effective countermeasure against cavalry most of the time.

A smart guy like Napoleon would turn the enemy's squares against him. Closely following the cavalry would be the horse artillery, which could be driven up to within a few hundred yards of the enemy squares, unlimbered, loaded and aimed before the cavalry withdrew. Before the enemy could reform lines the horse artillery would fire grapeshot into the densely packed squares, often with horrific results. Close behind the horse artillery would be advancing columns of infantry. If the cavalry and horse artillery did their jobs the enemy would not be able to get off volleys of aimed shots against the French infantry columns, and their thined out lines would be easily overrun by the mass of french infantry.

IF ETW lets me co-ordinate an attack like that I'll be very impressed.

[Megas Methuselah]

It doesn't sound too difficult... Now you got me all riled up to try that out! :crowngrin:

[Decker]

Yes a square got broken, but what's a battle without a little excitement? :whip:

[Sheogorath]

Tully, that'd be time not spent detailing the grenadier's 'staches. What's more important to you, a fine growth of facial hair, or accurate horse charges? :tongueg:

[Fisherking]

Some of the terms used here are misleading!

The Cavalry breeched a line of the square, they didn’t brake the square. Braking would be a rout and they held. To think they wouldn’t take casualties is a little over optimistic.

[Sir Beane]

Tully, that'd be time not spent detailing the grenadier's 'staches. What's more important to you, a fine growth of facial hair, or accurate horse charges? :tongueg:

I don't think anyone could possibly think that modelling correct facial hair isn't the most important part of the game. Without a decent moustache the world world of the 18th century would have been in ruins, ruins I say!

[Fisherking]

I don't think anyone could possibly think that modelling correct facial hair isn't the most important part of the game. Without a decent moustache the world world of the 18th century would have been in ruins, ruins I say!

Where was it that I read they removed some of it because someone complained they didn’t have the correct wax at the time…

I guess they got a shave. There was something about removing hay stacks too…but that would be totally silly…haystacks were made long before modern harvesting machines. A scythe works on grass and then you pile it high…

They are touchy about some things and others go right over their heads…

Back to topic

Great Job Jack, way to go!


:laugh4:

[Owen Glyndwr]

Well, just watched the video, my thoughts:

1. Graphics looked amazing, as many have said, the clothing looks a little more faded and realistic in this video as opposed to the really bright uniforms of the previous video.

2. I really liked the clip showing the men arranging into squares; my experiences in previous total war games consisted of me giving an order and my men just mulling around for a couple minutes before actually doing anything (Of course I don't really know how responsive the order was as the video was quite edited.)

2. I liked that the ensuing melee of the battle maintained the disciplined line you'd expect rather than either a.) a massed blob as was common in previous games and the previous video, or b.) separated mini-battles of 2 batallions vs 2 batallions or so spaced out all over the map which happened to me a lot.

3. I also like that it appeared to me that the AI was organized enough to initiate a mass charge, as in previous games one of the largest downfalls for AI on the attack was their attacks were disunified and largely were them throwing batallions at you one at a time until they all break. (Which is actually really entertaining when you have a lot of missile troops)

Ok now for some things I didn't like:

1. I didn't like the amount of editing that went into this video. I know, I know, it makes the battle more "action packed", but the point of the video is to give prospective players insight into the game, and I really don't think that zooming in on Jack's hand holding a mouse gives very much insight into the game other than the fact that the game requires a mouse to play.

2. This is added on to the above statement. I wish that we could just see a full battle with just the screen showing what the designer is doing completely uncut. i.e. we see everything he would see, rather than a short clip showing units arranging into a square followed by a zoomed out picture followed by a clip of the Hussars charging the line. Basically what I'm trying to say is that it's really cool that you are explaining all these things the AI are doing, but it's really hard to visualize and comprehend these things when the camera is cutting back and forth to these zoomed in shots. Yes the graphics are lovely, but I want to see the bloody tactics/AI decisions form a position where I can actually make sense of them.

3. Video's too short I want to see more.

And finally, just odd observations, and comments made previously:

1. Jack's scarf: It was really distracting, especially from the angle on the side of his face. The scarf made it look like he was grabbing his throat, so throughout the video I kept asking myself why he was grabbing his throat. Weird I know, so sue me.

2. In regards to the comment Jack made about Cavalry smashing right through his line: The point was that Jack aligned his line down to two files to maximize firepower, and he was saying that since his line was so thin under that formation, it's really suceptible (spelled wrong, I know) to cavalry charge, especially given the outstanding Polish Winged Hussars (which looked awesome by the way. They'd certainly scare the hell out of me). In my mind, he was just informing the viewer that each formation you make use of has its advantages and weaknesses, and you really have to be mindful of them when you're fighting or they could hurt you in a big way.

3. The infantry "glitch" during the Hussar charge. I don't think it was a glitch at all. As others have said, it happens quite often in both M2 and R. The problem with it is that the defending lineman is getting pushed by a horse, and neither of them are dying. In reality I imagine that either the man would get trampled by the horse, the man wouldstab the horse, and maybe get pushed back a little (not to that extent), or the horse would turn away from the pointy piece of steel pointed in its face.
However, I imagine that that would be a little much to ask for, and the image we saw will be fairly commonplace in the game


In conclusion, I liked what I did see, but I wish I could see more of the battle uncut, and from a different angle so as to better discern the strategic elements the programmers have been telling us the AI will implement and leverage. Additionally, I wish that both of these guys wouldn't mumble so much, it's at times very difficult to understand what they're saying.
However, don't get me down, I'm not griping at the game, it looks excellent. I'm more just griping at not getting to see enough of it!