The betrayer

[Polemists]

So was playing mtw2 last night a bit after the demo, and got to thinking.

Each game in recent memory has had a betrayer nation. A nation who no matter how much you give, no matter how long you've been allies, pow, they attack you. While this was true of many nations in RTW and MTW2 two stood out to me

Numidia of RTW (Carthage players know what I"m talking about)

and

Milan of MTW2 (Oh...the crossbowmen...so many crossbowmen...)

So who do you think is going to be the backstabbing cannot be trusted nation of ETW? Place your bets :)

Feel free to give reasons that have no facts attached :P

[Rhyfelwyr]

The German factions. They're in a pretty similar situation to that of Milan in M2TW (I never want to see another Genoese Crossbowman again), and especially considering the fact that there will be no Rebels, they will have to annoy their neighbours to expand. Especially the ones that are totally landlocked (Austria, Bavaria etc).

[Sir Beane]

Clearly it will be France. They are huge, powerful, and they know it. Why would they ally with a nation when they could invade and flatten them?

One of the top Empires in the world doesn't need allies. (Not until I take over playing as Britain at any rate).

[Monk]

I'm not sure who will be the betrayer*, but I imagine diplomatic tension in Eastern Europe will be especially high due to the new nature of alliances (You either help an ally in a defensive war or the alliance is broken). I can foresee a lot of betrayals leading to allied coalitions, if "the betrayer" attacks the wrong faction he may end up igniting a full scale war across Europe between many nations. :book:







*Of course, the betrayer will be me. :boxing:

[Sir Beane]

I'm not sure who will be the betrayer*, but I imagine diplomatic tension in Eastern Europe will be especially high due to the new nature of alliances (You either help an ally in a defensive war or the alliance is broken). I can foresee a lot of betrayals leading to allied coalitions, if "the betrayer" attacks the wrong faction he may end up igniting a full scale war across Europe between many nations. :book:







*Of course, the betrayer will be me. :boxing:

I really hope that this is the case. I would love it if my ill-advised rampage of invasion united the whole of Europe in arms against me. Much like Europe united against Napoleon. I hope I will have to pick my battles carefully to avoid annoying a coalition.

Perhaps we will have to use diplomacy and subterfuge to break up an alliance before picking off its members...

It has the potential to be incredible fun :2thumbsup:.

[Monk]

I really hope that this is the case. I would love it if my ill-advised rampage of invasion united the whole of Europe in arms against me. Much like Europe united against Napoleon. I hope I will have to pick my battles carefully to avoid annoying a coalition.

Perhaps we will have to use diplomacy and subterfuge to break up an alliance before picking off its members...

It has the potential to be incredible fun :2thumbsup:.

Indeed. As good as the campaign AI seems from all indications it can only get better, because you know people love to tinker with that kinda thing. Not to mention Jack's campaign report was on Normal, I know the first thing I am gonna do is jump into a Hard or VH game. :yes:

[Marten]

Cleraly the Austrians or Swedes. As my mom's father (aka grandfather) always told me: "Never trust a Swede or an Austrian. :laugh4:
And also you Germans aren't trustworthy. You can only trust old Danes like me or your grandma." :beam:

[Polemists]

While I"ve seen games increase difficult based on VH or H i've never seen them add in a feature that wasn't there.

So if coalitions are in, I am sure they are in for M and VH.

Jack only fought denmark, so no need for form a coalition against him.

In the later game, it still may happen though.

[Lusitani]

Hmmm Polemists...i think your poll is a bit tendencious...since it has Prussia twice :laugh4::laugh4:
I would have chosen France and Spain...if Spain was present on the poll :P

V.

[Daevyll]

Obviously, Sweden.

It will aggressively try to expand its influence even (especially) where it is neither wanted nor needed.

We call this the 'Ikea-motif'

[Polemists]

Well...even tho I plan to play Austria (most votes against) and Prussia is my major enemy (faction listed twice) it was honestly a copy paste mistake :P

I'd change it..but sadly edit does not include polls

So spain is granted a repreive, and everyone knows you can trust the Spainish Enchilada :P

[Dayve]

I went with my own nation, Britain. It has been at war with just about every other nation on earth at some point in the last 1000 years and was awfully greedy during the days of the empire, where it stole a hell of a lot of land and then used the land and its people to enrich the British (mostly English) nobility, and during this games time frame was at the peak of its land grabbing frenzy.

Britain will be the bastards.

I'll avoid the frustration by playing as nobody but the British, since they were the most fascinating nation of this period anyhow.

[Freedom Onanist]

Clearly it will be Perfidious Albion! England will have to play the continental powers off against each other if it is to repeat history.

Or, to put it another way, subsidise Europe in the face of misguided French megalomania - in the meantime it can get on with building a real empire :2thumbsup:

The Dutch might be able to play this game as well - much more difficult though

[Zatoichi]

Yeah, I think the Brits will be in a position to betray everyone. But then the French will keep on having revolutions so you won't know where you stand with them either.

As for the Dutch - well, they'll no doubt appear all friendly, meanwhile amassing a gigantic stockpile of tulips with which to conquer the known world!:2thumbsup:

[Wausser]

We'll be nice :beam:
But in the meanwhile we'll trade and sail with our powerfull navy, hell I'll even sail to Chatham again if I have to :smash:

[Beskar]

Russia is going to be the bad boy. It wants to expand to the West to get Sea access and it wants to advance South into the Ottoman Empire.

Russia might have been a little backwards, but a tech'd Russia would make the Europeans cry for America to be founded.

[Thermal]

Ottomans, they have alot of neighbors and alot of land, they won't hesitate to plough through there lessers I wouldn't think.

[A Very Super Market]

It probably depends on what faction you play as.

[Don Esteban]

Ottomans, taking back the role played by egypt in MTW.

[Beskar]

I can't vote on the poll...

But yes, I would say France.

[KipDan]

Never trust a Turk, never. The Ottomans want to take Europe but I will Gallipoli their asses. Well, maybe not like how it really happened. I will take more ships!

[pyradyn]

just cause we are Rivals inst it....I will see you on the fields Polemist see you on the field....ps bring the cup cakes I might forget them

[ratbarf]

United Provinces, my Dutch friends always turn on me during team doubles in Paintball....

[Sheogorath]

Courland, of course. Who else would it be? Those Courlandians are nothing but a bunch of traitors. :winkg:

[Greyblades]

Clearly it will be Perfidious Albion! England will have to play the continental powers off against each other if it is to repeat history.

This is from what I understand from intercontinental politics and warfare of the 18th century (which for some reason my history class missed :furious3: so I am probably wrong.)

Its not so much of repeating history but a necesity for Britain to pit the other contries against eachother. Britain could barley have whithstood a full on fully concentrated invasion by France during the 18th century and I think the AI will consider this. At the time France was the resident Superpower and seeing that France hated Britains guts they needed all advantages they could get their hands on to keep the "Franch armageddon that would smash the dreams of a Perfect Albion" from becoming a grim reality. If CA are realy going to deliver on to their claims on AI, Britain will not be a warmongering nation spoiling for a fight but a more cautious neigbour trying to keep the current top dog in check and distraced enough for it to not beable to safely commit to taking the jewel that was the British Isles without being backstabbed by landgrabbers.


Clearly it will be France. They are huge, powerful, and they know it. Why would they ally with a nation when they could invade and flatten them?

Again assuming that the AI will act similar to what is historically accurate;
!Warning long sentance ahead!
On the french side of things their AI wont be the rampaging superpower taking over the world because they know that if they even thought of taking over anything larger than a small island outside of defending an ally that was attacked, in Europe anyway, they would have Britain(definitely), Portugal(if persuaded by Britain which would have been a certainty), Spain, maybe Denmark, Norway and/or Sweden, some german city states and some northern Italian factions come crashing down on them using Frances agression as an excuse to grab precious land.

Sorry that should be "To join in with their allies to put down an agressive Enemy that had full intention of selfishly taking over the world and them with it"

Well thats my :2cents: anyway.

Oh I allmost forgot. I beleive it will be the USA who will be the betrayer nation because they will be eagar to kick any faction out of NA.

[A Very Super Market]

Bit like the war of 1812, eh?

Hopefully, the AI of different factions will all be unique, or at least historically accurate. Or it could differe by who is the faction leader...

[Greyblades]

Well if I was the USA I would not want a bunch of smelly trespassers setting up shop on my nice, relatively untouched new home.

[quadalpha]

Well if I was the USA I would not want a bunch of smelly trespassers setting up shop on my nice, relatively untouched new home.
I think the idea is that you are the smelly trespassers. :)

[Ibrahim]

the british; mostly because I will be playing them.:clown:

EDIT: people actually voted "I like voting in polls"? auch!!

[Greyblades]

I think the idea is that you are the smelly trespassers. :)

I was trying to express how the USA saw it and how it will probably react to the situation in the game.

[Sir Beane]

I was trying to express how the USA saw it and how it will probably react to the situation in the game.

In my games I am hoping to never have to see that faction of ungrateful barbarians, since I'll be oplaying as the British :laugh4:.

Maybe the Native Americans will be betrayers, since they won't want to share ancestral lands with greedy foreigners.

[Beskar]

In my games I am hoping to never have to see that faction of ungrateful barbarians, since I'll be oplaying as the British :laugh4:.

Maybe the Native Americans will be betrayers, since they won't want to share ancestral lands with greedy foreigners.
For some reason, I am reminded of: http://xkcd.com/84/