cheats are gone- good or bad thing?

[Hooahguy]

according to Jack Lusted:

The cheat console found in most games is infact a dev console used by developers to help test their games and cheats for those games will be dev commands that are left active in the final game. In most games the console is incorporate in the game, but for Empire the console was run seperately to help aid us in developing and debugging the game. Unfortunately this does mean there is no way for you guys to use it.

so this means no more cheats.

for me this is a mixed blessing.

the good:
the game is harder and you are no longer inclined to cheat. in RTW i cheated a lot. yes, i know, i am ashamed. :shame:
now i have to micro-manage, which is always fun for me.

the bad:
AARs were just made harder. the toggle_fow cheat was essential for most of the AARs, especially mine.
role-playing will be harder as well.

thoughts?

[RZST]

the reveal fow was the only cheat i ever used anyway. the rest? nah. most likely there will be trainers around. so it aint all bad.

voted...GAH!....only option there is man

[Sir Beane]

It's a shame Toggle_fow is gone. And I always enjoyed being able to spawn myself a few elephants for my own amusement. It isn't too bad though.

[KozaK13]

Damn no toggle fow means you cant admire the map in all its glory, as for the other commands i never used them.

mixed blessing

[Sheogorath]

Well, no pre-battle speeches means that you dont have to make all your generals crazy anymore :P

[RZST]

no pre-battle speeches? awwww. guess i shouldnt be surprised, m2 didnt have it..... did it?

[andrewt]

The map cheat was the only one I ever used. It was amusing sometimes to see the moves the comp makes. Either that or being able to see every faction's (including unplayable ones and rebels) starting position without doing tons of starting new games.

[Sir Beane]

no pre-battle speeches? awwww. guess i shouldnt be surprised, m2 didnt have it..... did it?


Med2 had some very good ones :2thumbsup:. Empire doesn't and I miss them already.

[peacemaker]

Hmm..I miss the console. I usually ended up taking "loans" early-game(don't worry, I gave like 10% interest yearly..or grouped it all up until I owed like 100k and my treasury could afford that). But I definetely like keeping toggle_fow on for a while, and then after years of my own campaigning, I can go just see how other factions progressed(who crushed who, etc.) It's really pretty cool, but I'm sure some modder will figure out a way:smash:

[RZST]

quick google of "empire total war cheats" and click the first link you see.

thar be cheetz

[A Very Super Market]

'Tis a real shame.

[Hooahguy]

quick google of "empire total war cheats" and click the first link you see.

thar be cheetz
nope. dont see any....

[Sir Beane]

nope. dont see any....

Thats because there aren't any. Without a console how could there be?

[Hooahguy]

Thats because there aren't any. Without a console how could there be?
^^^ true :yes:

[Praetor Rick]

I chose the "oh noes" one because there isn't an option for "Well phooey, now AAR's will suck because I can't see everything as easily." Lots of legit uses for cheat codes other than, well, cheating.

At least toggle_fow isn't quite as necessary now, since the entire map is revealed from the beginning. No big blackness covering everything I should already know about until I have to send explorers there all over again!

[TB666]

I'm happy with this.
With the other games I found myself using the money cheat everytime I drove my country/kingdom bankrupt.
Maybe now I will run the economical bits properly.

[Dayve]

Don't care either way... i've never cheated in games.

Except when i've played them for years and it's 3am and i can't sleep and i'm bored. That's when i put on Oblivion, give myself a million of every stat and go on a killing rampage in the Imperial City.

[Count Fluffy]

Would it be possible for CA to release their separate console/debug program? I mean, if they used an external one, could it not be ported to us somehow? I'm not so sure about these things, but I imagine it would be possible and not too hard.

[pevergreen]

Dev programs are not for the public. They dont want other groups stealing their work.

[Ishmael]

*sniffle*... Oh Yubtseb Oliphaunts, I shall miss you

[A Very Super Market]

Eh, they sucked anyways. Always crashing the game, and insanely high upkeep.

Also, they warped around and generally looked ugly.

[AussieGiant]

I love the fact that it's gone.

The game gets hammered for not having good enough AI and for being too easy, yet at the same time using cheats was prolific. It doesn't wash out well with me.

They are gone and good riddance.

[Hengist]

Generally a good thing they are gone, just sad for toggle_fow. It was nice to be able to see the campaign map in its full splendor.

[Dradem]

I didn't even know that there where cheats :oops:

but even I knew wouldn't have used them so :juggle2:

[Fisherking]

I didn't even know that there where cheats :oops:

but even I knew wouldn't have used them so :juggle2:


I feel the same way.


I can think if one cheat that would be nice in this game though…and not to through battles but to take over some of the emerging factions and play the game from there…

Switch Factions:2thumbsup:

[General SupaCrunk]

It's great that we don't have cheats!!!! :2thumbsup:

[PBI]

I don't mind cheats being removed (other than toggle_fow, which will be a pain for AARs) so long as the game NEVER, EVER crashes immediately following a heroic victory anymore. My general policy is to use auto_win if this happens twice in a row, due to my suspicion that it is actually caused by the computer crashing in a fit of pique and trying to get me to accept an autoresolved pyrrhic victory or outright disaster rather than the glorious battlefield triumph which is rightfully mine. ~;)

[Dead Guy]

I don't really understand why you would be happy cheats were removed if you never used them anyway? I loved the console, and I only used it to "fix" dumbass things the game allowed the AI to pull off that it shouldn't be able to. I never gave myself money, because I never had to. Some things in Med II just annoyed me (like the situation PBI describes) and it was great to be able to adjust them if you wanted to. For example, it was a good solution before they toned down the rates at which pagan magician attached himself to your family members :p But well, it doesn't matter that much I suppose. I will miss toggle_fow.

[Count Fluffy]

Dev programs are not for the public. They dont want other groups stealing their work.

That makes sense. I was just hoping for a way for us to access any type of console. I thought perhaps there might be a way to strip down such a thing, but like I said, I know little about programming and programming security.

[pevergreen]

I think CA have done a huge boost to the multiplayer community, but it seems to have killed the hotseat/RP groups.

[Rhyfelwyr]

I'm not really bothered about cheats being removed. I used to use auto_win sometimes for those annoying little sieges in RTW/M2TW, but now the surrender feature means this isn't necessary.

It could be a little annoying from a modding perspective though, since I use toggle_fow to check my maps.

[Relic]

I like having full access to everything, maybe a petition for them to release the console after they have finished patches, DLC, etc in a year or two's time?

[JeromeBaker]

While I am going to miss cheats becuase of the role playing advantages it will probably be a good thing for me. If I get my treasury low I always use the add money cheat and then it makes the rest of the game more boring. So to help I get even more money from the cheat and get enough troops to start a bunch of major wars which is all action but kills the fun and strategy of building your empire the hard way. I look forward to having to play the campaign focused and with greater strategy now that I dont have the money cheat to fall back on. Mixed Blessings.. but after I complete my first grand campaign, I think it will be positive the cheats are gone.

[caravel]

Cheat codes are important for modders (for testing purposes etc). Removing them is a very bad move by CA.

[Skott]

I used the cheats. Mainly the add_money cheat so I could give the other factions more money during the game so they would build up and possibly become more aggressive as well as better developed when i fought them. It makes for a tougher AI opponent overall IMO. I suppose I could just allocate more money through modding but the money cheat was a quick way of doing it and it also could be done at any time and done as often as needed. I'm going to miss the cheats but thats just me. :furious3:

[TheArsenal]

Mixed blessing.

While the majority of people who hang around the forums may not need cheats, I'm not so sure that's true across the board. And that's a lot of people (equation: Games Sold - Boards Registration = Everyone Else). And the one thing that makes a game not fun for many people, is getting their butts kicked.

Personally? I've used a cheat or two in the past, even knowing cheats make you a lazy player. This way is more challenging. Look forward to it. Feel bad for the modders though.

[Swoosh So]

Well this could be a bad thing, cheats from the console were sometimes used for modding projects to see ai movements or in the case of my own personal mod to allow multiplayer campaigns, kill character command etc was absolutely essential for this.

[Beskar]

Being honest, opposing revolutions is simple, but playing as the revolution is impossible, so I might have liked 'auto_win' to do a revolution. :P

But that being said, the game is very tactical and depends on so many factors. I had to return Spain as a province to Spain, because I simply couldn't hold it. I maxed up troops, made it tax exempt, but it was never acceptable with it, also, Spain was still in the game and kept dropping units off (unlike France) so I returned Spain after destroying everything in the terrority to broker a ceasefire.

At the moment, it came to the point I had lots of money, and pretty much fully upgraded in my areas, so I went to expand into Saxony. This made a long-term ally, Poland-Lith declare war on me (I don't mind that, gives me a chance to get the areas I need from them) and during that campaign, Austria strikes me. I ended up having to Blitz across Eastern Europe to wipe out the enemy, but damn, my armed forces are so spread thin, that Poland-Lith, re-emerged as a nation.

I am planning on brokering some of the Poland area to Russia to broker form Alliance with them, will give me a chance to rebuild and stabilise.

Also, I am now a member. :D

[Ibn-Khaldun]

I think pevergreen is right when he said "but it seems to have killed the hotseat/RP groups".

It is practically impossible to create a game similar to Last of The Romans or Will of the Basileus without console!! Also, I haven't heard anything about hotseat option in ETW(I think it doesn't have it)!

[oz_wwjd]

I frequently used the madras and vindaloo cheats for when the AI decided to be extremely stupid and decided to attack with an army that had no hope of taking my city,6 times in a row. As long as the AI is much improved from MTW2 I'll be happy.

[robpa]

I frequently used the madras and vindaloo cheats for when the AI decided to be extremely stupid and decided to attack with an army that had no hope of taking my city,6 times in a row. As long as the AI is much improved from MTW2 I'll be happy.



I will truely miss them.

[Aero]

Well not exactly a toggle but, there's a way to disable the fog of war on the campaign map.

All that's need is to edit this file

Game_directory..\data\campaigns\main\scripting.lua


look for the function OnWorldCreated() and add this line of script to the function

scripting.game_interface:show_shroud(false)


The whole function should end up like this.

local function OnWorldCreated()
scripting.game_interface:technology_osmosis_for_playables_enable_culture("european")
scripting.game_interface:technology_osmosis_for_playables_enable_all()
scripting.game_interface:show_shroud(false)
end


This script should probably work for those midway into a campaign by adding it to the function

OnFactionTurnStart(context)

enjoy your Empire ..ggrrr:2thumbsup:

[robpa]

[QUOTE=Aero;2163881]Well not exactly a toggle but, there's a way to disable the fog of war on the campaign map.

All that's need is to edit this file

Game_directory..\data\campaigns\main\scripting.lua


look for the function OnWorldCreated() and add this line of script to the function

scripting.game_interface:show_shroud(false)


The whole function should end up like this.

local function OnWorldCreated()
scripting.game_interface:technology_osmosis_for_playables_enable_culture("european")
scripting.game_interface:technology_osmosis_for_playables_enable_all()
scripting.game_interface:show_shroud(false)
end


This script should probably work for those midway into a campaign by adding it to the function

OnFactionTurnStart(context)

enjoy your Empire ..ggrrr:2thumbsup:[/QUOTE

I "hear" theres a trainer out there that actually works gives bunch of money and faster constructionn. I heard it even talks to you so you know its thhre.

[Lord of the Isles]

Bad thing, for sure. I couldn't care less about cheating to improve my chances but that wasn't what I used to use it for.

One more help for modders gone - as if the game wasn't mod unfriendly enough to start with compared to previous TW games.

Furthermore, I've just reached turn 30 odd in my third attempt at playing ETW, and there is a Maratha Confederacy fleet stuck in my only Indian port. This is a bug (reported in the stickied bug thread) - I'm at peace with this faction but they are preventing me using the port and are killing my entire Indian trade. With a console I could move the damn fleet somewhere else. Without it, that's another game I have to abandon. I'm enjoying the game mostly but 0/3 in attempts to get beyond 30 odd game turns because of bugs isn't a good record. I'm starting to get annoyed.

[Polemists]

I never used cheats, but whether they were in or not never really affected me. I've always enjoyed games the same even if cheats are in, I just refuse to use them unless something odd happens. Bugs, stuck issues, etc.

The game will take sometime to mod, though hopefully when CA does release the tools (next month?) we can hope the mod community's new vanilla ETW will include a cheat console if nothing else to avoid game stopping bugs.

For instance I remeber in MTW2 it got very annoying do to all the path's blocked messages you could get.

[pevergreen]

I think pevergreen is right when he said "but it seems to have killed the hotseat/RP groups".

It is practically impossible to create a game similar to Last of The Romans or Will of the Basileus without console!! Also, I haven't heard anything about hotseat option in ETW(I think it doesn't have it)!

Correct..there is no hotseat mode...

[Sir Beane]

Correct..there is no hotseat mode...

Well that's killed off your hotseat campaign idea :no:.

[Daimon]

I "hear" theres a trainer out there that actually works gives bunch of money and faster constructionn. I heard it even talks to you so you know its thhre.

Must be from Cheathappens.com those guy's are always the first to make great trainers.. One problem, you have to pay for them! And I think it's not really worth it.

You can also cheat (if you really have to) by using CheatEngine.

[pevergreen]

Well that's killed off your hotseat campaign idea :no:.

It was a good one at that.

Oh well, next idea: moderator 1v1 championships! :laugh4:

[robpa]

Must be from Cheathappens.com those guy's are always the first to make great trainers.. One problem, you have to pay for them! And I think it's not really worth it.

You can also cheat (if you really have to) by using CheatEngine.

You know your stuff man, they had that thing done the day of release almost lol.

[Mister V]

I liked toggle_fow. And auto_win was useful for those battles I couldn't be arsed to play. However, since there aren't that many battles, and my forces are superior, I find that autoresolve works well enough.

[beatoangelico]

really bad thing for modding and AARs.

[satchef1]

For playing the campaign i don't thing Toggle_FOW is actually needed any more, CA have done a great job of fixing the problems with it. Finally, and end to laying all of those bloody watchtowers! ~D

As for mods, assuming there are mod tools then i'd have thought there'll be a substitute for the dev console in with those.

[GeneralHankerchief]

I'm very disturbed. The past few major Throne Room PBMs made extensive use of the console to provide a more immersive experience. Hotseat was a growing community as well.

Hopefully they'll put it back in with a patch... :shrug:

[Aemilius Paulus]

No cheats!?! Pfft, screw ETW; what is the sense of buying something you cannot win. :clown:

But seriously, that is a huge minus. Surely there must be something??

[Legionaire]

Must be from Cheathappens.com those guy's are always the first to make great trainers.. One problem, you have to pay for them! And I think it's not really worth it.

You can also cheat (if you really have to) by using CheatEngine.

Does the trainer really works? I tested some of them but it doesn't work. Btw, I am using a licensed game.

[Zarky]

Voted gah because there's not even need for toggle_fow anymore since you can see which nation captured which region without constantly buying map information or cheating.

[Neoncat]

Never cheated in total war games and it really doesn't matter if someone cheats in one player game.

[Prussian to the Iron]

mixed for me:

good:

-now i actually have some fun in anything but the battles, and am not inclined to cheat.
-i now have a hard choice:

lots of full crappy stacks, or a couple elite stacks?
-now i actually lose battles!!!


bad:

-naval battles are crappy, so i have to save up for great ships just to beat the uber-naval a.i.

[Slaists]

according to Jack Lusted:


so this means no more cheats.

for me this is a mixed blessing.

the good:
the game is harder and you are no longer inclined to cheat. in RTW i cheated a lot. yes, i know, i am ashamed. :shame:
now i have to micro-manage, which is always fun for me.

the bad:
AARs were just made harder. the toggle_fow cheat was essential for most of the AARs, especially mine.
role-playing will be harder as well.

thoughts?

a big negative for me: in the previous titles, if I had just played a big battle and won it and the game decided to go CTD, I could always reload and type "auto_win <attacker/defender>" in order not to have to refight the battle...

[Schiltrom]

Yay!!! No more cheats means I'm becoming a good player.

[econ21]

Strange poll result - removing your options is a good thing?

I voted that removing cheats is a bad thing because they are very useful for the PBMs in the Throne Room. While recent TW games can start out challenging, there comes a point when you have so much territory is in your hands, you have an insuperable advantage[1]. Using the console to spawn enemy units is very helpful in breathing new life into a PBM. Similarly adding money to enemy factions.

Being able to spawn your own units and alter traits can also help role-playing.

[1]STW and sometimes MTW managed to avoid that problem, as an AI faction far away from the player could sometimes become dominant (eg Hojo horde). Best old style PBM I ever played was as Almohads when I inherited a map that was half purple (Byzantine).

[crpcarrot]

i never used them so its doesnt affect me at all