Monks ( how many) ?

[general mcmaster]

Funny thing, I come on line and start playing. So I get the MONK RUSH wow what a treat. So I look around and the general concenus is its not honorable and doesn't require a lot of skill. So a lot of players take 5 monks and 10 ND and 2 cav. Now thats honorable right??? How abot 15 ND and 1 hev cav, that cool? Is there a set of generally accepted rules among the online players? I have hearfd 5 monks? Thanks for any imput!

Golden Axe

[This message has been edited by general mcmaster (edited 05-27-2001).]

[EuroSan]

Thats diffrent from player to player...
I play normaly on a max 4 of each unit, but i think to get the best out of this game 2 of each would be the best way...or even go so fare as play 11 unit army with one of each unit http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif

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May the honour be with you all..........EuroSan the reborned spirit of LinkSan

[general mcmaster]

I have been playin with 4 monks and 4 or 5 ND's , they sure don't last long against a monk rush man those PISS me off. Got my shorts in a whad http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif

Thanks

[This message has been edited by general mcmaster (edited 05-27-2001).]

[The Bear]

If you play MP games with low koku, you won't have to face this type of problem. For my part, that's what i try to do.

I find it more interesting when all players have to be more creative than using monk rushes.

You can also take down the names of the players that you had fun with, that way you will know who to look for.

[Shadelord]

Well I am upping my usage of monks to 7 since not one game that i have played latly has had less then 7 monks on the enemy army. So i am just going to fight fire with fire.

But i normaly will only take 4 monks that is what i has been doing for the longest time

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[Kraellin]

i kinda have to snicker each time i see this post about rushes and monks and guns. if you build your army correctly and know how to manage it, it wont matter much what the other guy has, providing of course that he's not using a cheat.

i find no dishonor in taking whatever the koku limit will allow, nor in my opponent doing the same. sun tzu says know yourself and know your enemy. if yer playing a game where someone is taking 7 or 8 or 10 monks each time, then just counter it, cause yer prolly playing the same folks and you perhaps you shld have learned by now that this is how they play.

assigning blame to someone, or fault, or anything else of the sort is simply assigning causation to him and thus leaves you at effect and NOT at cause. how you gonna win if yer not cause? HE did this, HE did that....what did YOU do that got you the loss? or not do? *

K.

*excerpted from the tao of elmarko

[High Voltage]

Monk rushes can be countered with missle units. The problem with monk rushes though is that almost no unit can defeat them 1on1, unless the honor is higher. But then some players use monk and musket combo, or monk and arch. One trick I've found to work sometimes is having a good 6-7 naginitas, have them spread out in the front equaling the length of the opponents line, then have monks, nd's, ys, cav, or whatever behind them, though monks, nd's, or heavy cav work best. While your front naginitas are holding their ground, send the other units behind. It's best if you have your naginitas on hold position at first, then when the monks are flanked take it off. Since hold position gives a defensive boost and offensive loss, your nagis should hold out long enough for your offensive units to do their work.

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[Darrin]

One problem people might have with using a huge number of one unit type is you would rarely encouter that in history or the campaign mode. So limiting yourself to a few of each of the higher units. And having more YS and YA is more realistic. Better test your skill as an attacker and defender in historicaly correct limited unit armys. Each unit has its strengths and weaknesses. A normal army would be composed of many different unit types just because of this.

[darealruler]

Hmm,
reading these post made me somehow laugh.
3 monks 3 nd, and still breaking monks rush!
Its about finding a good army, what is as I always say it "made for you".16 monks means some H1 troops. Those should be taken on and get their back. Normal rules seem now to be
max 5 of any troop (for league dreads host) and I think 80% uses those rules now. Maybe a discussion about what is allowed before battle could help you out.

DARE

[general mcmaster]

The problem I have is just not knowing who does it I guess. But I do not play them again once I get Monk rushed. What thrashes me is I don't use nags when I attack. I guess the bottom line is I need more experience http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif I'll quit snivelin now

Thanks

Axe

[Krasturak]

Krast's Evil Army rarely has more than two Monks ...

ButKrast doesnt care if the enemy has lots of monks, guns, archers, whatever ...

The Koku rules distribute the cost o the units, and although Monks give a good bang for the buck they aren't the only unit of value.

Krast likes cutting the heads off of Monks rushers; their armies have no flexibilty, only maneuver (not to say they don't beat Krast sometimes too, you know).

[RageFury]

hehehe

I think it reallt depends u know..

I mean low koku 2-3000 and all people get is bloody monks and nodachi...this koku it is pure gun n rush tactics..not creative at all

high koku 7k+...just gets silly...idiots with 7+ monks and 5 honour 4 guns..just silly


For me 5-6000 koku is perfect..it allowas u to get reasonable variety of units...requires wide knowledge of units, careful spendingand allows the man with balanced army to beat the monks rush....nice

As a general rule i always take 4 but sometimes less......i like sand idea but think that with less variety could quickly get boring..part of the challenge is outpickin someones army..or winnin when u think ur army should lose


-Fury

for me less than 4 is a rule.

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[Vanya]

What exactly IS Krast's evil army?

[DarkSword]

well I don't know about you guys but before you play anyone the first time you will never know what they bring to the table. sure you might lose the first time they rush you but you will learn to counter it the next time right? this is a strategy game you change tactic as your opponent does. maybe all he does is rush or sit there. You have to change your tactic to defeat this single simple minded opponent. If he never change then he's a dead duck. For example,
you play a guy once he rush you and kick the crap out of you. you go to the drawing table and say why?
1. did I stand to close to the setup border(ehheheeh...this is a rusher dream)
2. did I not have my army in information?(ehheheheh....some attacker never have their army in formation....easy picking don't even need to rush)
3. what units does he used?( this is hard when they are kicking the shit out of you you just want to cry and see how happy their army is...eheheh)

once you get this thru your skull slosh it around a little and experiment with what works and what doesn't. I hate people whining that there is no strategy in rushing or this or that....the point is to win the battle..you use whatever is necessary to win...but if you lose you should learn form it instead of whining....ehheheeh...if I had ever rush someone I would love to give them a rematch to work on their tactic....I have never say piss off...which sometimes I want to...eheheh..the point is to play with as many people as you can and know their tactic....sometime I see newbie won't play because so and so has a good record...well if you don't play good people how are u going to learn...you get more out of a tough battle than a rout.....ehehhe....well if u read this far then you can come and kick my samurai's butt online if u disagree....heheheh

[Vanya]

LOL

I just wanted to compare it to the undefeated legion of doom: the wet gunny wedgie rush army! Since I have never seen Krast online, perhaps he could share his evil army here...

[Draksen]

Once again, ... warrior monks...

I have just a question, for experts :
If we omit the price of those very expensive units, (which would be possible in a MP full game for example),
how can you counter a MONK ARMY ?
I mean a 100% monk army.




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[Krasturak]

Krast looks forward to meeting Vanya some day. He wants to cut off your head!

So ... Krast's Evil Army has two constant properties, being (1) ALWAYS contains guns, and (2) ALWAYS is commanded by Krast.

Other details subject to maskirovka.

[Dunhill]

I've encountered several rush variants, and I enjoy trying new things out on them, but it can be a bit of a problem in 3v3 fights when you might bring a "usual" army. I think the rush defense requires some advance planning in unit selection which isn't the norm in larger battles.

I'm still working on Sativa's all no-do wedge rush attack strategy, but trying to do it with my "usual" army, [2-monks, 2-NDs, 2Ycav, 2 Musks(or Archers) and 6-8 YS/0-2 YA.]. I wouldn't mind hearing suggestions on defeating a rush without Nags, which I rarely use (maybe that's my problem).

Cheers

[DarkSword]

to counter a 100% mk rush is not that hard..ehehehe......5 guns...4 yary samurai....after those u should have mk or dachis and yc......heheheh
the main point in countering a defender rush is to always have your army in formation...ehehhe..
never assume he will stay back......have the guns in front
the YS 3 deep in hold formation right behind the guns. there should be some spaces left in between the YS
....third line is mk or dachi if u have yc have them on the outside to flank once the rush begin......

well the rest is up to you...eheheh...good luck...hehehehe

[Vanya]

Quote Originally posted by Krasturak:
Krast looks forward to meeting Vanya some day. He wants to cut off your head!
[/QUOTE]

Krast will then be disappointed, for I have the Headless Horseman in command of my armies...

But, I usually see some bobbing-head-doll salesmen on the sidelines... Perhaps Krast will settle for some of those...?

[Kocmoc]

who is darksword?

a good rush, on a flat map...
u always will lose, maybe u have luck.... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/tongue.gif

u need to play amp.....


Koc

[DarkSword]

Yeah I want to try defend against amp's rush....If I know it was coming..then I can turn away most of them....totomi or green...

[general mcmaster]

AMP straight up smoked me. The reason for this thread. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif It was quite humlin.