View Full Version : Regionalism/Nationalism/Globalism
Cronos Impera
04-20-2009, 15:03
An Orgah survey.
What affiliation suits you the most in this Century?
a)Regionalism
States in US
Land in Germany
Regions/Counties in the rest of the world
b)Nationalism
Country in EU
US
Other independent entities
c) Globalism
European Union
United Nations
......
d)Gah 1
I am an undercover agent of the Octosquid Collective.
e)Gah 2
I like polls.
CountArach
04-20-2009, 15:06
We are going through a period of intense global integration. I wholeheartedly approve and would willingly be part of a world state.
HoreTore
04-20-2009, 15:12
On the condition that it's decentralized as hell, then count me in on this world state.
A. Netherlands, USA, Canada, Australia, and Scandinavia. Belgium and Luxembourg as well. Pure win.
lol, there are too many conflicts and dislikes. Look what happened to Yugoslavia? The only way that a world state would work is if you were to first get rid of all that rivalry, hatred, and conflict (religious, ethnic, ideological, etc). Even still, when the world is so split up on how a country should be governed (Socialism in Europe, Communism in many place, whatever the heck you call America - I will not get into an argument over definitions), that it would never work. Regions would all want to be governed whatever the prevailing way in that reason is and it would fragment. As ideal as it sounds (kinda like Communism did), it just would not work. (even if you went through mass killings and reeducations like the USSR)
Best thing to do IMO is for us all to stick our nose out of each others business and try to work together...not to make others work for us *cough* International law *cough* US in Iraq *cough* Russia in Central Europe *cough*
Sure, some international laws are needed to ensure that everyone does stick their nose out of everyone else's business, but other than that, I think we should let Iraq do what Iraq does, China do what China does, Russia do what Russia does, the US do what the US does, etc. (I am talking about governments, not individuals getting involved in humanitarian work or charity)
HoreTore
04-20-2009, 15:26
The only way that a world state would work is if you were to first get rid of all that rivalry, hatred, and conflict (religious, ethnic, ideological, etc).
That sounds like a terrific idea, let's do it.
Louis VI the Fat
04-20-2009, 15:31
What affiliation suits you the most in this Century?
a)Regionalism
b)Nationalism
c) Globalism
d)Gah 1
I am an undercover agent of the Octosquid Collective.
e)Gah 2
I like polls.Can I vote all five of the above? :yes:
Furunculus
04-20-2009, 15:31
The Sovereign Nation State.
That sounds like a terrific idea, let's do it.
Sounds like you are ready to tell an african to tell his goat to stop farting because it contains CO2.
That sounds like a terrific idea, let's do it.
It does sound great, too bad it is impossible. You see, no one agrees as to the roots of the problems, and everyone wants to blame someone else. Are you ready to push your belief over everyone else and kill any who resist? If not, then I am afraid the best thing to do is live and let live.
I am being completely honest when I say that there are few people I agree with less than the Dutch, and sure, there are opposing beliefs that would never work together in a single state, but I am gonna go tell the Dutch that they have to start doing things my way. The only way for us to live peacefully together would be for us both to agree on something else (never gonna happen), or for one of us to push our beliefs on someone else, which would just be wrong. I do not wanna attack Dutchland (:laugh4:) cause I think they got it wrong, and I do not want to tell them how to govern their country or put sanctions on them. I am sure the Dutch disagree with us, but as long as they are not trying to force their ideas on us, or put sanctions on us, I am content to disagree with them. The best decision is just to live and let live. Most of the horrors and wars that have happened in the world are the result of someone trying to push their beliefs on someone else. You want world peace? Then you gotta sell it to the world (which may be hard, but probably not impossible) that the best thing to do is just leave each other alone.
(Heck, I strooongly disagree with the Russian government, and think that it is oppressive, but it is not the job of the US to stick its nose in. If a citizen wants to speak out, fine, but the government should not stick its nose into another government's business)
Rhyfelwyr
04-20-2009, 16:36
That sounds like a terrific idea, let's do it.
Why bother? The only reason these problems exist are because these people are hateful.
OK I'll stop spilling stuff over from the other thread...
Personally, I like regionanlism. Govern every region the way that suits it best, with just enough centralisation to be efficient. The world is still to diverse a place for a big world government.
HoreTore
04-20-2009, 16:38
Can I vote all five of the above? :yes:
No wonder you french have lost all respect, you can't even decide on a simple poll!
Now make up for you indecision by sending me one of them french babes.:whip:
Strike For The South
04-20-2009, 16:41
Texas
France
The rest may burn, I care not what happens to those philistines.
It does sound great, too bad it is impossible. You see, no one agrees as to the roots of the problems, and everyone wants to blame someone else. Are you ready to push your belief over everyone else and kill any who resist? If not, then I am afraid the best thing to do is live and let live.
I am being completely honest when I say that there are few people I agree with less than the Dutch, and sure, there are opposing beliefs that would never work together in a single state, but I am gonna go tell the Dutch that they have to start doing things my way. The only way for us to live peacefully together would be for us both to agree on something else (never gonna happen), or for one of us to push our beliefs on someone else, which would just be wrong. I do not wanna attack Dutchland (:laugh4:) cause I think they got it wrong, and I do not want to tell them how to govern their country or put sanctions on them. I am sure the Dutch disagree with us, but as long as they are not trying to force their ideas on us, or put sanctions on us, I am content to disagree with them. The best decision is just to live and let live. Most of the horrors and wars that have happened in the world are the result of someone trying to push their beliefs on someone else. You want world peace? Then you gotta sell it to the world (which may be hard, but probably not impossible) that the best thing to do is just leave each other alone.
(Heck, I strooongly disagree with the Russian government, and think that it is oppressive, but it is not the job of the US to stick its nose in. If a citizen wants to speak out, fine, but the government should not stick its nose into another government's business)
A conservative american will probably love it here, might get some fun himself. You guys don't understand this place, the Netherlands is deeply conservative, more so then any other country of europe, very traditional even, woman at home, husband at work, probably too archaic for even an american to cope with. Strange country we have here, live with it .
Impossible is when you stop trying.
HoreTore
04-20-2009, 17:07
Impossible is when you stop trying.
:balloon2:
A ballon for you, good sir.
Megas Methuselah
04-20-2009, 20:43
Regional.
Incongruous
04-20-2009, 21:04
The Sovereign Nation State.
:2thumbsup:
It has taken well over a thousand years of brutality for Europe to come up with that, it took a long time but produced what were very cohesive political and social units. Unfortunatley, certain aspects of the nation state are inclined to absurdity, thus we had the massive self-destruction of Europe last century.
However, the nation state is still the only viable way to govern and live with people, I feel (almost) no affiliation with most Europeans, the current economic crisis has shown that most Germans and Frenchmen would agree on that point.
Why would you want aglobal hegemony in the frist place? When something goes wrong, it is a case of when and not if, we will have nowhere to go except to the gun rack.
Evil_Maniac From Mars
04-20-2009, 21:09
:2thumbsup:
It has taken well over a thousand years of brutality for Europe to come up with that, it took a long time but produced what were very cohesive political and social units. Unfortunatley, certain aspects of the nation state are inclined to absurdity, thus we had the massive self-destruction of Europe last century.
However, the nation state is still the only viable way to govern and live with people, I feel no affiliation with most Europeans, the current economic crisis has shown that most Germans and Frenchmen would agree on that point.
Why would you want aglobal hegemony in teh frist place? When sometging goes wrong, it is a case of when and not if, we will have nowhere to go except to the gun rack.
:yes:
My country comes first - liberal nationalism FTW.
Uesugi Kenshin
04-20-2009, 21:29
How could anyone be wholeheartedly loyal to somewhere else when one is from Vermont? It's just not possible. Vermont is simply the greatest. Sure the USA is a decent country, but let's face it if the whole USA were like Vermont it would be a much better place and thus I have proven that the USA's good qualities in large part stem from the fact that Vermont is a part of it, while the bad are the inevitable watering down of Vermont and introduction of non-Vermont influences. I wonder if I can say Vermont in this paragraph any more than I already have?
Seamus Fermanagh
04-20-2009, 21:34
I chose regionalism not because I believe that Virginia should secede again, nor out of any mislike for -- oh, say, Vermont (I've heard Montpelier is lovely in April) -- but because I believe this republic would be better served by "dialing back" the central government in favor of the states.
Repeal the 16th and 17th ammendments and we'd have a different start point.
A conservative american will probably love it here, might get some fun himself. You guys don't understand this place, the Netherlands is deeply conservative, more so then any other country of europe, very traditional even, woman at home, husband at work, probably too archaic for even an american to cope with. Strange country we have here, live with it .
lol, no offense Frag, I got nothing against the Dutch, I just really disagree with your politics and culture. Like I said though, live and let live. I was not preaching, simply giving an example to Hore Tore.
lol, no offense Frag, I got nothing against the Dutch, I just really disagree with your politics and culture.
No problem at all, heard worse (today), but can I please point out that you are just as bad as Hitler before I respect your opinion and continue to have fun with ya ??
No problem at all, heard worse (today), but can I please point out that you are just as bad as Hitler before I respect your opinion and continue to have fun with ya ??
I take offense sir! I am MUCH worse than Hitler! He may have picked on Jews and Slavs, but it is my goal to exterminate ALL life! MUHWAHWA!
:skull::hmg:
Rhyfelwyr
04-20-2009, 22:49
I wonder what poll option Hitler would choose? At first I thought nationalism, but then maybe globalism, so long as the Reich is that world government...
LittleGrizzly
04-20-2009, 22:51
We are going through a period of intense global integration. I wholeheartedly approve and would willingly be part of a world state.
:yes::yes:
What this clever guy said!
Seamus Fermanagh
04-20-2009, 22:51
Vuk & Frag:
Play nice. Others are reading, and some of them may not get your humor.
Sorry
:bow:
Just to clarify to everyone, I was only joking with Frag, not serious. :P I know, I got a weird sense of humor. :P
Furunculus
04-20-2009, 23:43
:yes::yes:
What this clever guy said!
all very clever until you realise that you will be submitting to a government composed in part of people who believe that honour killings are normal practice, and suti, and female genital mutilation, and wearing wooden shoes, and ......................................
and then you realise that western democracy has worked precisely because it inculcated a shared family with shared values, which is why you, the individual, submit to be governed by others in your name.
oh wait, never mind.
Evil_Maniac From Mars
04-21-2009, 00:05
The basic problem with one world government is that you can't run and you can't hide.
all very clever until you realise that you will be submitting to a government composed in part of people who believe that honour killings are normal practice, and suti, and female genital mutilation, and wearing wooden shoes, and ......................................
and then you realise that western democracy has worked precisely because it inculcated a shared family with shared values, which is why you, the individual, submit to be governed by others in your name.
oh wait, never mind.
I don't really know what you have against the dutch but who said we're going to vote muslim extremists in? Do you really think they have that much of a fanbase across the world?
LittleGrizzly
04-21-2009, 00:18
It doesn't have to be exactly like one big country straight away... half the reason people believe in backward things like wooden shoes is because thier economy's haven't developed yet
I would like a world goverment but not a forced one, it would have to be up to each county to decide.. but lets assume thats happened all over..
Firstly I would try to harmonise the world into zones, say like EU, SAU ect.
Then concentrate on economic development in poorer regions
Then over time the zones can join up as they get to similar levels of development until its one functional goverment...
lots of money saved on expensive army's, that money can go on research, and obviously the world research and space program budgets are now on big budget, rather than researching things another country already knows all knowledge is pool and learning shared...
oh wait, never mind.
Thats lucky because i had this long list of things... like tax havens, various forms of international crime...
It doesn't have to be exactly like one big country straight away... half the reason people believe in backward things like wooden shoes is because thier economy's haven't developed yet
The dutch economy has not developed yet? You learn something new everyday...
Incongruous
04-21-2009, 02:01
The EU is fast turning into a lame duck, all it took was economic strife to show it up for what it is, too fat too fast.
Don Corleone
04-21-2009, 02:22
I think you're all looking in the wrong direction for progress. We should all be looking at ramping DOWN the level of engagement... personally, I'm already back to the locally regional level (Go Sox! Go Sox!), trying to get back to the tribal level. This summer, I'm forming up my own local Fian, comprised of American born, grandsons of Erin. Within the next five years, I hope to have reprogressed to the clannish level. Anybody want to get adopted?
All kidding aside, it's this mentality of looking for a line to draw in the first place that causes all the troubles. I'm not even sure I'm against illegal immigration anymore.
Evil_Maniac From Mars
04-21-2009, 03:08
I need to clarify my original post. I believe that the nation is the largest level that there should be - but that there needs to be a fair amount of regionalism involved. There needs to be a balance of power between the states and the central government, but my first loyalty is always to Germany and not to Bavaria or Brandenburg. As such, I voted for nationalism.
a completely inoffensive name
04-21-2009, 03:35
I reject all these choices, my only affiliation is humanity itself.
Independence is my happiness, and I view things as they are, without regard to place or person; my country is the world, and my religion is to do good.
-Thomas Paine
Nationalism with a close cooperation with the octoquid powers other nations of the world.
Furunculus
04-21-2009, 08:49
I don't really know what you have against the dutch but who said we're going to vote muslim extremists in? Do you really think they have that much of a fanbase across the world?
muslim extremists........?
suti is/was an indian practice of burning the wife alive on the pyre of her dead husband.
FGM is i believe an arab/african cultural practice that just happens to coexist with islam.
Furunculus
04-21-2009, 08:51
I think you're all looking in the wrong direction for progress. We should all be looking at ramping DOWN the level of engagement... personally, I'm already back to the locally regional level (Go Sox! Go Sox!), trying to get back to the tribal level. This summer, I'm forming up my own local Fian, comprised of American born, grandsons of Erin. Within the next five years, I hope to have reprogressed to the clannish level. Anybody want to get adopted?
All kidding aside, it's this mentality of looking for a line to draw in the first place that causes all the troubles. I'm not even sure I'm against illegal immigration anymore.
don is quite right.
i voted nation state, but i hold the same views as EMFM, localism within the sovereign nation state is what is needed.
Samurai Waki
04-21-2009, 08:57
To me Global is just another definition of expensive, and inefficient. The Bigger the Government the more expensive and inefficient its going to be. I'll go with Regionalism.
LittleGrizzly
04-21-2009, 16:32
The dutch economy has not developed yet? You learn something new everyday...
Frunculus was being sarcastic putting it in his list... i was being sarcastric choosing it as an example because it was the only silly one in his list...
Now i just can't tell if you didn't get my and frunculus sarcasm or if i didn't get your sarcasm...
I own a pair by the way, on soggy ground accept no less.
Tribesman
04-21-2009, 17:53
Global national regionalism , you know its a winner .
Incongruous
04-22-2009, 10:16
don is quite right.
i voted nation state, but i hold the same views as EMFM, localism within the sovereign nation state is what is needed.
Indeed, more influence needs to be given to local elected bodies of government, but to make sure they do not turn out in the UK just like the Commons, they should have more accountability and heavy punishements for misconduct. Too many absurd councils of the type we have now with increased powers and the property developers will have Britain built up into one massive IKEA within a few decades.
b and c. European Union with great political autonomies for its member states. Expel the UK.
Incongruous
04-23-2009, 01:15
b and c. European Union with great political autonomies for its member states. Expel the UK.
:laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:
Ace.
Kagemusha
04-23-2009, 11:35
Dont worry earthlings Oqtosquid overlords will love you in any form, state or not. Boiled or deep fried,smoked or roasted. It really does not matter.:2thumbsup:
Furunculus
04-23-2009, 13:06
b and c. European Union with great political autonomies for its member states. Expel the UK.
you have my vote.
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