How to judge distance on the battlefield

[Tarkus]

I've been reading Ibrahim's excellent quick guide to using cavalry (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=103172) and I realize how important it is to be able to estimate distances on the battlefield for timing effective cavalry charges. I also want to do a better job of positioning my own missile units within range of my less effective enemy, i.e., put myself in range without doing the same for his units of lesser ability -- those with a shorter range.

So...how does one determine / estimate distance on the battle map?

[DaciaJC]

Use trigonometry.

[Maion Maroneios]

Ehrm... That'd require too much time. First of all, you'd have to find the scale of the battlefield in comparison to real-time distances, then compute estimations based on (rough) guesses. It's quite unnecessary, actually. Trust your instincts, or you'll be wasting too much time trying to do something that's ultimately going to frustrate you a lot.

Maion

[soup_alex]

Apologies if this is already obvious to all, but the wee flying arrow marker that sticks to the cursor when a missile unit (with ammunition) is selected should give some indication of range (coloured green or red for in- or out-of-range, respectively). You also need to factor in elevation (and angle, when obstacles such as walls are involved), which is best taught by experience.

For a more clearly-defined idea of shooting ranges per unit, I suggest you check the Unit Compare file or the EDU (can't remember if the Recruitment Viewer contains the weapon range stat), where ranges should be given in metres. If Rome hasn't departed from Medieval, though, this figure only gives the range at which a unit will "think" that it can shoot (and the range at which the arrow marker will be coloured green or red); the true range of a missile is determined by its velocity stat.


[edit: Recruitment Viewer does include the range stat. Wow... I seem to remember Bosphoran Heavies looking more impressive on paper...]

[Silence Hunter]

I second Maion and soup_alex. The easiest way to get used to things like these is playing the game. Cavarly isn't very hard to master. If you are playing a campaign with one of the eastern factions you will develop that "feeling" of distance to make a good charge quite fast. Just use your cavalry while fighting and after some time you will "feel" when it's ready to charge and the distance is right. Missile units are a bit trickier. The reason for that is that the range of the troops varies greatly. So in order to be able to measure the distance to get in range you need to know the range of each type of missile unit. That's quite a hard job to do. What I do is: read the unit description to get a rough idea how good it is, then try it on the battle field. Once again you will develop the "feeling" of entering the range. As an example, in my Hayasdan campaign in one army I had Caucasian, Scythian, Persian and Syrian archers. So all of them are quite different, but after playing for a while I started to "feel" when the enemy enters the range of one of my archers. Now I'm timing this perfectly.

Just practice.

[soup_alex]

I second Maion and soup_alex. The easiest way to get used to things like these is playing the game. Cavarly isn't very hard to master. If you are playing a campaign with one of the eastern factions you will develop that "feeling" of distance to make a good charge quite fast. Just use your cavalry while fighting and after some time you will "feel" when it's ready to charge and the distance is right. Missile units are a bit trickier. The reason for that is that the range of the troops varies greatly. So in order to be able to measure the distance to get in range you need to know the range of each type of missile unit. That's quite a hard job to do. What I do is: read the unit description to get a rough idea how good it is, then try it on the battle field. Once again you will develop the "feeling" of entering the range. As an example, in my Hayasdan campaign in one army I had Caucasian, Scythian, Persian and Syrian archers. So all of them are quite different, but after playing for a while I started to "feel" when the enemy enters the range of one of my archers. Now I'm timing this perfectly.

Just practice.

Generally speaking, I try to limit my armies to including only one type of archer*, one type of slinger, etc., though this strategy gets thrown out of the window in the context of a rolling conquest with diverse local unit types.
For example, you play Baktria and move into Alexandria-Eschate. Congratulations, you now have access to Subeshi Archers, which far outstrip the Thanvare Payahdag and Nizagan-i Eranshahr you invaded with. Likewise, pushing towards Persepolis will give you the option of recruiting superior Armoured Persian Archers.
Then again, if playing as a faction (or even if it's just your style) that makes use of a single type of archer that really excels at putting holes in things from a distance, you needn't worry about getting used to specific ranges of individual units (most are roughly similar (+/-10m), anyway)


*actually, this is a lie: in the case of Baktria, at least, I like to mix in a few Archer-spearmen with my "real" archers, as they make a good buffer/pincushion for the units I actually expect to inflict casualties on the enemy. Really, they're just cheap cannon fodder/cavalry deterrent.

[Ibrahim]

I've been reading Ibrahim's excellent quick guide to using cavalry (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=103172) and I realize how important it is to be able to estimate distances on the battlefield for timing effective cavalry charges. I also want to do a better job of positioning my own missile units within range of my less effective enemy, i.e., put myself in range without doing the same for his units of lesser ability -- those with a shorter range.

So...how does one determine / estimate distance on the battle map?

to get the 50 meter distance, the troops you are attacking should look as though they are 50 meters away in real life. same for 200 meters of course. you have to estimate with sight I'm afraid-Maion has an excellent point.. bear in mind, I do not use exact estimates, only rough estimates.

missile weapons can be indicated by clickeing the unit, and moving the cursor over the enemy-when its green, you fire. but efective range varies acording to elevation and terrain-the higher, the longer. it also depends on the archer, as the previous posts said:yes:

[Silence Hunter]

Then again, if playing as a faction (or even if it's just your style) that makes use of a single type of archer that really excels at putting holes in things from a distance, you needn't worry about getting used to specific ranges of individual units (most are roughly similar (+/-10m), anyway)

I like to roleplay the inclusion of many different archer types as a kind of conquered territories tribute to supply soldiers to me. So different territories send different troops for an army.

[Tarkus]

Thanks to everybody for your responses -- even Frontline's trigonometric advice :inquisitive: ...!

Your ideas make perfect sense...I've been a bit spoiled while playing a few other tactical simulations that provide target distances down to the meter, allowing for some effective micromanagement of offensive weapons of superior range. But then again...that was WWII armor...differences in range out on the Eastern steppe around 250BC aren't quite so great.

Time to practice and trust my instincts..."Use the force, Tarkus"...

[Maion Maroneios]

"Use the force, Tarkus"...
:smash:

Maion