Does EB have to end in 14AD?

[Cassus Belli]

Does EB have to end in 14AD?

I read that Europa Barbarorom (v.1.2) is scripted to end in 14AD. Assuming that I make it that far into the game, is there some way to prolong it beyond that time?

I feel certain that this question has already been asked and answered by somebody, but I have not been able to yet find the answer in my searches, so perhaps somebody of repute could share the answer with me, or direct me to it?

[DaciaJC]

I believe that if you don't turn on the script, you can play beyond 14 AD.

[Aemilius Paulus]

First of all, you will not make it to that, either out of boredom or CTDs. But even if you do, EB will not stop after 14 CE, even if you do turn on the script. in fact, the the EB Script will end at 14 CE, which means no AI cash bonuses, for one.

[mountaingoat]

going to play to 10000ad?

[Aemilius Paulus]

going to play to 10000ad?
It is possible, if you program a bot to hit "End Turn" endlessly.

[mountaingoat]

would be interesting to play as the casse , sit there for 1000000 turns then take a screen of the empires .... in fact .. that sounds like an idea .. hmm lol

[Cassus Belli]

Aemilius Paulus wrote:

First of all, you will not make it to that, either out of boredom or CTDs. But even if you do, EB will not stop after 14 CE, even if you do turn on the script. in fact, the the EB Script will end at 14 CE, which means no AI cash bonuses, for one.

You are probably right (though hopefully less so in the CTD department), but I was just supposing one did get to 14 AD/CE and still wanted to continue the game, could they? what would happen? :inquisitive:

For example if one were playing the Romani faction and wanted to see if they could follow a relatively historical timeline to the the period of maximum empire expansion of around 240 AD... It sounds like your saying it could be possible to do it in EB, and still preserve the 4 turns per year and other elements of the script?
But would the AI still be as feisty if one wanted to be somewhat ahistorical an invade Parthia or Upper Germainia sometime after 14 AD?
Would the lack of "AI cash bonuses," for example, give the human player an unfair advantage?

[athanaric]

Would the lack of "AI cash bonuses," for example, give the human player an unfair advantage?

It would the player an "advantage" by severely weakening the RTW AI, which is notoriously imbecilic already. Also, EB without script is only half the experience...

[Cassus Belli]

athanaric wrote:

It would the player an "advantage" by severely weakening the RTW AI, which is notoriously imbecilic already. Also, EB without script is only half the experience...

I am playing EB 1.2 using the BI game engine which has a somewhat "more intelligent" AI than the vanilla RTW game engine. But you are very right, the reason I am enjoying this game so much is because of the efforts of the EB creators and the script they have provided.
Without that the game would likely drift away from any sense of historicity (except what the player can induce) and devolve into whatever the BI (or RTW) game engine AI can counter with....
The Roman Republic/Empire at that point should be so vast and powerful that it would simply be no contest in devouring the world right to the edges of the EB map.
Without the challenge of an intelligent AI or script it would be just a monotonous repetition of conquest after conquest, I imagine... :dizzy2:

:idea2: Is anyone working on a continuation of the script to say anywhere from 180-450AD, or perhaps a post Republic or Imperial period campaign using the EB mod?

[athanaric]

:idea2: Is anyone working on a continuation of the script to say anywhere from 180-450AD, or perhaps a post Republic or Imperial period campaign using the EB mod?

You might want to check out "Invasio Barbarorum" which is a historically correct conversion of BI. It isn't exactly the same as EB but AFAIK the mods share some content (e.g. IB has EB's "granary" buildings). Look at the IB fora (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/forumdisplay.php?f=233) or simply ask Ibrahim for further details.

[Aemilius Paulus]

would be interesting to play as the casse , sit there for 1000000 turns then take a screen of the empires .... in fact .. that sounds like an idea .. hmm lol
Well, are you a decent programmer? It is not difficult if you know what to do. Or hell, just make a machine to continuously tap the mouse, once it is pointing at the "End Turn" button.



You are probably right (though hopefully less so in the CTD department)
Actually, realitically, I was optimistic about CTDs. Most people seem to find it impossible to get that far, although with 1.2 the chances are higher.


but I was just supposing one did get to 14 AD/CE and still wanted to continue the game, could they? what would happen?
Yes, you can, once again, you will have to play without the script.


. It sounds like your saying it could be possible to do it in EB, and still preserve the 4 turns per year and other elements of the script?
The underlined part: no. EB script is what creates 4-urns-per-year. BUT, you can go and modify the EBBS script, extending it. I do believe it is quite a simple process, and you can make a thread asking how to prolong the script.


Would the lack of "AI cash bonuses," for example, give the human player an unfair advantage?
AI would be quite weaker, although VH campaign difficulty should mitigate that somewhat. You can however employ the console (~) to add money to AI via cheating.


But really, playing until 14 CE is highly unrealistic & unlikely, as I doubt it would be a fun thing to do the whole way. Your expansion would have to be on a gastropodian pace. And the AI factions are most likely all going to disappear save for two, maximum three superpowers, as balance is a tricky thing, and the longer you play, the more likely it is to tilt in favour of one or another. Simply probability.

[Azathoth]

would be interesting to play as the casse , sit there for 1000000 turns then take a screen of the empires .... in fact .. that sounds like an idea .. hmm lol

You would catch it in one of two phases of a cycle: either all provinces (except for Terhazza) are controlled by one faction or half the map is Eleutheroi.

[mountaingoat]

why would they all be Eleutheroi?

[Alsatia]

Probably because big bad empire decays and revolts??

[Andros Antonius]

i don't know if i'd be able to make it that far, because i'm only around 200 bc and i'm getting CTDs more and more frequently. what's up with that?

[Cassus Belli]

Thank you Aemilius Paulus for your elaboration

Aemilius Paulus replied:

Actually, realitically, I was optimistic about CTDs. Most people seem to find it impossible to get that far, although with 1.2 the chances are higher.

This is truly disheartening, though I personally admit that I have seldom played a campaign through to its end... usually there has been some essential non-backward/SAV game compatible upgrade or patch that entices me to start the campaign over, as I'm currently doing. I was well into the EB v0.81a main campaign, then restarted so I could play EB 1.2 in BI.
But I had always assumed that it was not only possible but highly probable to be able to complete a campaign if one stuck to it long enough.

Since it now seems to be such a rare occurrence I would very much like to hear from anyone in the EB community who has actually finished a campaign in EB v.1.2?


...still preserve the 4 turns per year and other elements of the script?
Aemilius Paulus responded:
The underlined part: no. EB script is what creates 4-urns-per-year. BUT, you can go and modify the EBBS script, extending it. I do believe it is quite a simple process, and you can make a thread asking how to prolong the script.

Thank you for that advice, I should do that, especially as I get further into this mod.
From what I remember in RTR sub Mod posts from long ago, somebody shared how to add a 4-turns-per year script, so perhaps that could be incorporated into any extension of the script as well?

Aemilius Paulus said:

AI would be quite weaker, although VH campaign difficulty should mitigate that somewhat. You can however employ the console (~) to add money to AI via cheating.

I read a post where somebody said that EB was balanced for most realistic play on "Medium" difficulty?
If that's true I already erred by starting this campaign on "hard" at all levels.
Would one have to restart a campaign or is it possible to change the difficulty level in mid-campaign to either increase or decrease the difficulty level?

If one were to employ the (~) to add money to the AI, how would one apply it?
Do you give it to a specific faction or does a specific amount automatically go to all?
How much money would one give?
Would the amount be static or would it change?
How frequently would one have to do this? Each turn?


But really, playing until 14 CE is highly unrealistic & unlikely, as I doubt it would be a fun thing to do the whole way. Your expansion would have to be on a gastropodian pace. And the AI factions are most likely all going to disappear save for two, maximum three superpowers, as balance is a tricky thing, and the longer you play, the more likely it is to tilt in favour of one or another. Simply probability.

Wow, truly disheartening... I imagine that is because it must be such an incredibly difficult task to keep such a long campaign reasonably balanced throughout the centuries?... :shame:

So what is the optimum range of best play for this game?
Can we get past the "Marian reforms" and still expect decent gameplay?
Should one even dream about making it to Caesar's Gallic campaign era?

BTW, does the current script have all these historical characters (Sulla, Pompey, Crassus, Spartacus, Caesar, Antony, Cleopatra, et al) appear at the appropriate times?
Right now I'm looking around for the birth of Hannibal and Scipio so that they can be matched up after 220 BC. Will they appear?

:idea2: I guess what would be ideal then would be to to have a series of adjoining campaigns for best historical balance from period to period.
For continuity, though, it would be nice, if it's possible, to be able to preserve the gains of the played faction at the beginning of each continuing campaign as they were from where they left off in the succeeding one?
Would any of this be possible?
Is anybody working on it as we speak?

[Azathoth]

BTW, does the current script have all these historical characters (Sulla, Pompey, Crassus, Spartacus, Caesar, Antony, Cleopatra, et al) appear at the appropriate times?
Right now I'm looking around for the birth of Hannibal and Scipio so that they can be matched up after 220 BC. Will they appear?

No. It's almost impossible for those two specific humans to be born after 272, right?

[DaciaJC]

If by finishing a campaign you mean completing the victory conditions, then yes, many people have, myself included (Getai 1.2). If you mean by going to 14 AD... not many people see the point in campaigning that far.

The EB Team recommends that you play at Very Hard campaign difficulty, Medium battle difficulty. If you feel a strong urge to change the difficulty mid-way through a campaign, then try RomeSage (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=448). Don't forget to make a backup of your savegame.

[Cassus Belli]

BTW, does the current script have all these historical characters (Sulla, Pompey, Crassus, Spartacus, Caesar, Antony, Cleopatra, et al) appear at the appropriate times?
Right now I'm looking around for the birth of Hannibal and Scipio so that they can be matched up after 220 BC. Will they appear?

Azathoth said:
No. It's almost impossible for those two specific humans to be born after 272, right?

Well, I thought since this is such a historical mod that they might have scripted as many of the most famous historical personages as they could to appear in the appropriate time frame.
Since all of these people were relevant (to the Roman faction, anyway) and appeared on the scene well before 14 AD I was just hoping that they might show up....???? :oops: :no:

Frontline1944 said:

If by finishing a campaign you mean completing the victory conditions, then yes, many people have, myself included (Getai 1.2). If you mean by going to 14 AD... not many people see the point in campaigning that far.

Oh, I see... I've been deliberately restraining myself, trying to play along with what I thought was a historical script...
At this point I've taken Italy proper, from Aemilia & Liguria and the penninsula south, and attacked the Epirotes in their homeland and plan on taking Epeiros & Illyria from them in the appropriate time.

I was going to hold off an invasion of Sicily until Carthage broke the treaty around 264 BC and then capture Messana and attempt to kick Carthage off the island. Likewise I was going to try and capture and annex Corsica & Sardinia sometime during the latter part of the 264-241 BC First Punic War period. I was figuring that If I didn't behave too aggressively that Carthage would sue for peace, though I would probably have to send an expeditionary invasion force to Africa to make my threat credible. I was hoping then the "script" would cooperate and allow a 20 year peace for Carthage to build up in Iberia before we fought again in the second Punic War with an invasion by Hannibal in 218 BC.

In fact my spies have already told me that a Carthagenian family member named "Hamilcar" is in Lilibeo. If he is still there when war breaks out and I meet him on the field of battle I was planning on allowing him to escape, if I could, as he may end up being Hannibal's father ("Hamilcar Barca") and I wouldn't want to break that family line... In the name of trying to play along a historical timeline myself.
And I have a couple of Scipio nameskes in my own Romani family tree, one of which I'd hoped would soon have a son named "Publius Cornelius Scipio" that I would groom to be the general to defeat "Hannibal."

Anyway, this had been my planned strategy up to now.
I was going to follow as closely a historical timeline so that I could better play along with a historical script... But if those characters aren't going to appear, and if the script is ahistorical, then I may as well do my own thing and try and meet the objectives of the game as quickly as I can before some unforeseen CTD puts a premature end of the game altogether....
So much for 14 AD... I guess. :shame:


The EB Team recommends that you play at Very Hard campaign difficulty, Medium battle difficulty. If you feel a strong urge to change the difficulty mid-way through a campaign, then try RomeSage. Don't forget to make a backup of your savegame.

Okay, so I need to try and change a couple of settings: Up the campaign to Very Hard, and Lower the battle setting to Medium.
So I can do this without restarting using "RomeSage?"
Forgive my ignorance, but is that an in-game program that I am unaware of?
How do I access "RomeSage?"

[Azathoth]

Well, I thought since this is such a historical mod that they might have scripted as many of the most famous historical personages as they could to appear in the appropriate time frame.


In EB you make your own history.'

So Caius Iulius Caesar can be the one to defeat Carthage in the 2nd Punic War and Publius Cornelius Scipio can go on to conquer Gaul and maybe even usher in the Augustan Reforms.

"one two" lol

[Cassus Belli]

Azathoth said:


Quote:
In EB you make your own history.


So Caius Iulius Caesar can be the one two defeat Carthage in the 2nd Punic War and Publius Cornelius Scipio can go on to conquer Gaul and maybe even usher in the Augustan Reforms.

I see, well I guess "a Rose by any other name would still smell as sweet.."

I found a site that had a version of "RomeSage" for RTW, but all the sites that supposedly have it for "BI" appear to have dried up. They say that they're available but no place to download from...
Does anybody know where I can download a version of "RomeSage" for RTW - BI v. 1.6? (in english.. please)

[Cassus Belli]

Well I found this:
ETFullToolsCollection1.0 (Uploaded January 10, 2006)
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=820

It's got a shebang load of cool looking Modder tools...
It says that RomeSage is included, but whether it's a version that will work with BI ???
I also saw a 4 turns per year (script generator) in there?

Anyway, I'lll open it up now and see if it'll let me change my difficulty level/s without restarting. Hopefully it's the version I need.
Will let ya all know.

Well this version of RomeSage: RTW save game editor states in the ReadMe:

Change history:
19th December 2005 version 1.6.0.0
Added support for RTW Barbarian Invasion 1.6 and RTW 1.5.http://www.twcenter.net/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=448
So I guess it's the one I'll use.

[Cassus Belli]

Well I used the 2nd downloaded version of "RomeSage" I posted above, played a couple of (4turn) years and everything seems to be working fine... now.

I followed Frontline1944 advice and made a special back-up SAV for the transition and a good thing too as the first time I clicked on "RomeSage" I only paid attention to changing the difficulty levels and evidently it had a couple of default settings that weren't my own.
When I went to play the game it had downsized my cohort sizes to small and for some strange reason I found myself with a string of "year in history" reports popping up all the way to 14 AD. ...?:dizzy2:
I Went back in to "RomeSage" and checked ALL of the settings, made sure that the cohort size was back up to strength and the year was correct. Got back into the game, clicked on the script and have had no problems since... so far.

What a cool little time saving tool. Thank you so much Frontline1944 for recommending this to me!!! :beam:

I was wondering does anybody know of a RTW or RTW-BI mod that does have a historical campaign script with historical figures and events scripted to occur along a period timeline?

I imagine that such a campaign would have to be faction specific...

But if the MOD authors know their stuff its a great way to reinforce a history lesson...
One reads Polybius, or Tacitus, or Caesar's journals, etc. (with a little antiquity theme "mood" music playing in the background) :book: and then steps into some great general's shoes and for a moment gets to partake in a little bit of what we think it may have been like for them (within the limits of the game, of course). :egypt:

Sort of like the historical battle recreations one can play in this game, only on a grander campaign scale.

God help me, I really do love this game... If I didn't have an alarm clock set to go off next to the computer I could (and have) literally spent hours at a time doing nothing else. :embarassed: :shame:

[DaciaJC]

I am delighted that I could help! :beam:

Regarding other mods... you may consider trying out SPQR (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=32) <<link. It is a Roman-centric mod, but it does include historical figures such as Hannibal.

I have not tried it myself, but it is the closest that I can find along your requirements. Good luck!

[Cassus Belli]

Thank you again Frontline1944 you've been very helpful. :2thumbsup:

I went to that site and finally located a download of what appears to be the latest version:

SPQR 7.0 Download Link

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?p=4328569#post4328569

There was a link to several videos from fans of their game/s and it looks to be a really tasty MOD.
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?p=4328569#post4328569

I just installed and made a BI exe shortcut so I will soon be trying this MOD out for myself! :beam:

[Aemilius Paulus]

Well, after EB any RTW mod or simply any TW seems drab in comparison :sad:. Damn you, EB Team, you bloody killjoys for making such a heavenly game!!! :laugh4::laugh4:

[Macilrille]

AFAIK there is only one person who have played till 14 AD...

[Cassus Belli]

Macilrille said:

AFAIK there is only one person who have played till 14 AD...

Boy, I'd sure like to here from that person! :yes:
What an experiance they'd have to share...


BTW, started that SPQR Mod campaign last night.
First turn encountered Hannibal and after a horrific battle, suddenly found him slain and what was left of my haggard army in control of the battlefield.
But there are numerous enemy armies around me, and I've only 3 full Legions to field to protect under developed settlements and defend both northern & southern borders.
No money, few men, many enemies....
So I think that my joy at the results of this first battle will be very short-lived.

This looks to be "maybe" a good "continuation" or alternate period piece Mod, when one has gone as far as one can get in EB, as the Romani faction.

SPQR starts in 215 BC early in the 2nd Punic war. The Polybian reforms are in effect with Marian & Augustan reforms yet to achieve. There is a Senatorial faction in control of Latium and one begins with 3 full strength legions and only 5000 denarii to defend and develop the remaining underdeloped settlements, which, aside from Messena, only include Italia proper, from Segesta and Patvium south, with Tarrantum under the contol of Hannibal and Carthage, and the north Gauls, enemies all!

It appears to be a good quality mod with a long development history. Not near the group effort of the EB team, as it's been strictly controlled by it's creator/developer, but that is not necessarily a bad thing, as is obvious by the care and quality that has gone into it.

It has multifaction options, but EB it is not. It was most definitely designed and scripted with Romani as the primary faction!
This specificity and simplicity apparently gives it it's strength in that area.
For those who favor the Romani, this looks to be a Mod worth playing.

The campaign and battle screen music is pure hollywood! :laugh4:
I've heard themes from "Ben Hur," Spartacus," and "Excaliber," to Wagner's "Ride of the Valkyries," even a little "Caesar 3," so far.
Not authentic period music to be sure, but it is well blended and does rouse and heighten the senses!

Thank you again Frontline1944, for introducing me to it!:2thumbsup:

I Now for the momentfind myself playing back and forth between EB and SPQR ...
In a hurry to Get nowhere fast :juggle2:

[Aemilius Paulus]

Well, unfortunately for me, the battles are 1/3 of the fun, and campaign map is 2/3. That is how I am. And with all the other mods focusing almost strictly on the skins and nothing else, I am an unhappy person indeed.

[Cassus Belli]

Aemilius Paulus said:

Well, unfortunately for me, the battles are 1/3 of the fun, and campaign map is 2/3...

I too love the strategy, intrigue and faction interaction of the campaign...
And one spends far more time playing the campaign map than in battle, so for me the two go hand in hand.
Like the covers of a good book, you must have both to bind it together, but there must be substance in the middle to make it all worthwhile...

But even in EB you are required to fight an awful lot of battles before you can be eligible for Marian reforms, et al. So it is a battle centered MOD if you ever want to want to see those advanced units or even to win a campaign...

And I must admit that I do appreciate and enjoy all the great eye candy and attention to detail of all aspects of the battle screen as well.
From the units, to the effects, to the buildings, to the terrain of mountains to the sky, to the blades of grass, they all add to the experience, along with an AI that follows through intuitively (on and off the battlefield)...

In fact when I interactively stroll through the streets or farm fields of the game, and look at all the detail, I wonder what it might be like for the little sprites who live in such a place...:laugh4:

When you find a MOD that has it all, you've found a classic!

A good MOD Campaign is like a fine wine.. it ages well. And you always enjoy having a taste of it!:beam: