Greek Fire

[DemonArchangel]

What do you think was the chemical composition of Greek Fire? Post your answers here.

I think its based off petroleum, quicklime, sodium and some sort of stabilzing compound./ (dunno what it would be)

[chilliwilli]

It will remain a secret for all eternity hehe. Probably Sulfur, naptha, quicklime, pitch, and something else. I've also heard people say incense.

[Hakonarson]

Anyone who's ever known what was in it has been dead several hundred years.

[Alrowan]

hmm... naptha

[Muneyoshi]

Wouldnt just be naptha, as greek fire burst into flames on contact, would burn for quite some time, and burned on water. Personally I go with what most people feel and believe its liquid petroleum, naphtha, burning pitch, sulphur, resin, quicklime and bitumen, along with some other "secret ingredient".

[Lechev]

Is the greek fire invented by the Byz or the muslims? I quite confuse on who invented the greek fire. All I know is that the greeks did not invent the greek fire... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Brother Derfel]

I read somewhere that it was Sulpher, Napha and Quicklime. That seems to be the most logical combination, but in what proportions I don't think anyone realy knows.

[Teutonic Knight]

Quote[/b] (Lechev @ Feb. 23 2003,08:35)]Is the greek fire invented by the Byz or the muslims? I quite confuse on who invented the greek fire. All I know is that the greeks did not invent the greek fire... http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
I'm almost 100% certsain it was the Byzantines who invented it to use in sea battles.............the Moslems only copied them................

[chilliwilli]

A primitive form of Greek fire was known in antiquity, but it was nothing compared to what The Byzantines employed and in ancient times no one used it on a large scale. The Byzantine Greek Fire was created by a Syrian engineer named Callincius in 673 A.D. and it was much better than anything the ancients cooked up.

[Muneyoshi]

Yes it was invented by Byzantine (or rather by Callincius for Byzantine Empire)

It is said that when they emitted from a large tube their was a rather large boom, suggesting that Byzantine had gunpowder at the current time. Now this is around the 7th century around 673-725 A.D. yet the Chinese are credited with inventing the substance around the 8th century.

[Teutonic Knight]

I had long thought that it was just Chinese propaganda they taught us in public schools all these years...........

[DemonArchangel]

the chinese invented Naptha though, but not greek fire.

[Muneyoshi]

Quote[/b] (DemonArchangel @ Feb. 24 2003,08:37)]the chinese invented Naptha though, but not greek fire.
Who said anything about chinese creating greek fire?

[DemonArchangel]

ok, first of all, greek fire resembles modern napalm, Greek fire was clearly invented by the Byzantines. Naptha was invented by the chinese/

P/s: I'm chinese, i should know that chinese didn't invent greek fire.

[Muneyoshi]

Well you mentioned that they didnt invent greek fire, yet no one had even said that they did. Im aware that the chinese invented naptha, but its not even close to greek fire if you think about. Greek fire would burn for a long time, and could not be washed of by water so jumping into the ocean wouldnt help you, that being said greek fire would actually burn on the water.

[JANOSIK007]

It was definitely related to NAPALM, which was officially invented some one thousand years later.

Greek fire was certainly a well kept secret. Too bad CA didn't include this naval unit in MTW.

[chilliwilli]

Quote[/b] (JANOSIK007 @ Mar. 05 2003,10:49)]It was definitely related to NAPALM, which was officially invented some one thousand years later.

Greek fire was certainly a well kept secret. Too bad CA didn't include this naval unit in MTW.
Well they kind of did. Fire Ships would be the type of unit that used greek fire.

[Muneyoshi]

Quote[/b] (chilliwilli @ Mar. 05 2003,07:56)]
Quote[/b] (JANOSIK007 @ Mar. 05 2003,10:49)]It was definitely related to NAPALM, which was officially invented some one thousand years later.

Greek fire was certainly a well kept secret. Too bad CA didn't include this naval unit in MTW.
Well they kind of did. Fire Ships would be the type of unit that used greek fire.
Nay, greek fire was not used during the time of MTW, and shouldnt be in the game during. Perhaps they could for VI, but I doubt it. And napalm isnt quite as bad as greek fire was, greek ire was rather harsh stuff.

[andy119]

surely it would contain some potasium or atleast some element from the alkaline metals to burn on water and as bright as it was.

[DemonArchangel]

You're correct about the alkaline metal part. But what stabilzed greek fire??

[Leet Eriksson]

i thought the muslims invented naptha,as you can see "naptha" is an arabic word.

[rasoforos]

BTW do you know the name the Byzantines were calling this stuff? It might shed some light in its history. Was it 'ygron pyr' ( liquid fire ) as i learnt at school , or was it 'ellinikon pyr' (greek fire) as the english speaking people call it .

[Muneyoshi]

They called it liquid fire usually I believe it had some other names, but they seemed to of passed my mind at the moment

[kataphraktoi]

I'm chinese too but I know that we make the greatest noodles in the world.

Greek fire was beyond doubt an Eastern Roman invention, Callinicus was a Greek Syrian who was a refugee of the Arab invasions of Syria, his chemical weapon came just in time before the first Constantinople siege of Arab. It became a state monopoly and secret and as such Byzantine efficiency saw to it that it was a secret. sniff sniff.

ME and my friends in high school wanted to make some but got nowhere but we did make a name for it after ourselves - the spurious "neo -sarayanglium" we made nothing therefore burnt nothing.

It is mentioned that part of the ingredients came from the old Khazaria region where the marshes produced a certain fuel.

Naptha

[DemonArchangel]

errr... greek fire (or as heraclius refers to it "ellinikon pyr") more or less like was naptha and some sort of alkaline metal, such as sodium, but where would the byzantines find sodium??

[LordTed]

the sea