Which faction suffers least from diplomatic insanity?

[FriendlyFire]

I'm in a Pontus M/M campaign using BI.exe, and just sacked Alexandreia in 227 BC after a long and bloody fight down the coast. But while I'm crushing the Ptolemaioi, I'm only holding the Arche Seleukeia at bay by diplomatic trickery. They're allied with Makedonia, so every time the AS besiege my border forts, I ally with Makedonia, forcing a ceasefire on the AS. Now Makedonia has decided that it doesn't want to ally with me naturally, despite being reduced to just two cities with Epeiros and Koinon Hellenon breathing down its neck. I can keep the game going by using force-diplomacy to make the alliance with Makedonia every turn, but it's feeling a bit too cheap, and all because Makedonia has gone insane. (Also, the AS are spawning monster stacks of TABs, Hetaroi, and elite phalangites, so even after I conquer the Ptolemaioi it'll take years before I can tech up to face them :uneasy: )

So I was wondering: what are people's opinions about the best faction to play if I want to postpone the inevitable "everyone hates me" situation for as long as possible? Does this boil down to "which is the faction with the fewest neighbors"? Or "which is furthest from the gray/yellow death"? Casse is one obvious choice. Or maybe the Iberians, if I can kick the Carthaginians out and then fortify that border?

Basically, has anyone had a campaign where the diplomacy actually made some kind of sense, at least until the obvious end game? If so, what faction were you playing? :help:

*And I get a kick out of imagining the AIs of the other countries posting on their own little forums "wth is happening with Pontus and Arche Seleukeia? Every turn I see them declare war, then ceasefire! What's up with that?"

[Cute Wolf]

1) Casse : Sitting in the corner, you will fight your Gallic brothers no matter what (except if you decide it was better thing to sail directly to Iberia and kick Lusotann ass) when you land yourself at the Gauls. There was *enough* pirates to made you sure, Either Aedui or Avernii will want to invade your home Islands, except they had secure the Gallia for themself (and that time, they are quite logic consequence if they mount an invasion to your place)

2) Ptolemaioi : Karthadast hate you... AS hate you... and Saby'n wants to kick you from the back... and your mainland allies, the Epeirotes are never cross the sea unless they drunk enough (KH was triggered to cause inevitable revolt at Halicarnassos). As my personal matters, I have won a Ptolemaioi campaign with Epeirote stay as my "Forever Allies"... in EB 1.1

3) Saka Rauka : Forced to fight for survival against AS, Pahlava, and Baktria (if they hate you, it was a rational hatred anyway)... Later Sauro will declare war because minor inter nomadic raids escalate to a full scale war... (still rational anyway, but if you DON'T border them, they will be your allies forever, due to the reluctantness of going to the east). When you secure an alliance with everyone, save the AS, Pahlava, and Baktria, they will never attack you UNLESS you allready at Antiocheia or bordering Hayasdan.

4) Kart-Hadast : Quite good, Epeirotes will accept your peace offer, and Romaioi Barbaroi will be your historical enemies... If you allied with the gauls (just one, not allied with both), you'll find that they are far more reliable to helping you sack Barbaropolis from the north, when you also help kicking their evil brotha's ass (just help them in blocking their twin nemesis' ports and that alliance will be fine), they will still fight you when you start intruding into Gallic lands... oh yeah, never forget that the Ptolemaioi sand wars with you are quite easy to be checked at Kyrene... just guard that pass with an army full of Lybians, and that would be fine.

Oh yeah, don't forget about "them"
*) Romaioi Barbaroi : Everyone hates you... that's fine.

[Macilrille]

Only Campaign I have tried where diplomacy made a semblance of sense was Bactria on M/M (I play M/M these days in the vain hope that diplomacy makes more sense- I have learned that it does not). Only when I had practically won and was an almost unstoppable power (there were pics in my album till the new format killed them) did the AI go berserk. Saka was my faithful ally even then and Pahlahva became so and stayed it.

Anyway, my best guess would be that Casse would be best till you move to mainland and gets land borders. Sweboz sort of OK if you move mainly east to keep Eleutheroi between you and Romans, but eventually the they will move N and the Aedui will try and take your Belgae holdings at some point.

[ARCHIPPOS]

Casse offers by far the most sane game experience in terms of diplomacy as mentioned by the guys before me.

Playing Baktria despite all the great faction attributes,coolness and exoticism tends to become a bit insane. For one you start by being allied to AS which suffers blows from Pahlava and Saka. Because Alexandreia Eschate (AS' most distant and exposed settlement in the North-east) is usually the last to fall to the nomads, and because AS needs to establish a corridor with this last secluded pocket (after Antiocheia Margiane and Marakanda have fallen) the grey Death sends wave after wave of halfstacks sieging Baktra. So basically although Seleukids are losing bad in the East against the Parthian and Scythian nomads they decide to attack you (their only ally in the area) and make one extra enemy. You (playing as Baktria) are thus engaged in war with AS (usually from the early start of the game-first decade or so) and in peace with the Sakas (who are the ones you should be normally fighting-you being the protector of hellenism and the civilised cities of the East). so not so realistic if you ask me... on the other hand Pahlava will NOT attack you first (which is good i guess).

Pahlava is ok in terms of diplomacy. Constant, never-ending war with AS, peace with Baktria and Saka and Sauromatae just as long as you concentrate on expanding to the South only .In my current campaign Baktria and Saka are fighting desperately over Marakanda (which must have changed hands 5-6 times in 15 years-i've put a spy right by:yes: ).-I hold Margiane joyfully seeing them slay eachother :laugh4:. I keep Gava-Mazsakata as a buffer and wouldn't capture it even if it was offered to me...

In those games i have set strategic difficulty at VH by the way... I think Forced Diplomacy is your best bet for having some form of rational and balanced AI behaviour. I'ld gladly use it if it didn't ruin my game experience (to me it sounds like cheating:no:).But again this is highly subjective.

[Tristuskhan]

Agreed about the Pahlava: the campaign I played until 42BC saw an everlasting alliance with Saka Rauka and late war with Baktria came only when I decided. I even managed to keep at peace with AS until 250BC at least - very very slow beginning, indeed.
Diplomacy in my current AS game (191BC) is also quite nice since I waged war on Pahlava and Baktria and then kept my alliances with Pontos and Hayasdan. Pontos is expanding slowly to the west (besieging Serdike) and Haï have reached Gava Roxalana (even though I hold Crimea). I think those alliances are going to last some more.
My other campaigns (Epeiros, Saka and Getai) were more than one year ago so I don't remember diplomacy very well.

BTW, I always play VH/M, no blitzing obviously, no retraining, no Force Diplo.

[Arutima]

the samartians , casse and sweboz . since you stay into your own corner for a while

[Skullheadhq]

Casse, stay in your island and noone will backstab you ;)

[Zradha Pahlavan]

Casse for sure. Sauromatae after that. No one seems to like tangling with them.
Sweboz and Sabeans both have it pretty quiet at first but then sooner or later you'll have to pick a side in your local neighborhood power struggle between the bigger factions.

[NikosMaximilian]

Apart from the already mentioned, they Getai can live a few peaceful decades with all factions given the right conditions.

- East/North-East: Expand north but be in peace with the Sauromatae. They get stuck in a war of attrition with the Hay and don't expand. After many years they can start fighting against Pahlava or Saka too, and that could produce them to collapse if they lose or become an unstoppable horde if they win. Just keep a few watchtowers on your borders and a couple of spies near (not inside) their settlements. The northern provinces aren't very rich, but they'll give you some trade income. Kallatis, Gáwjám~Bastarnoz, Gordu-Neuriji should be your border towns in this direction. In case you find a horde of thousands of horse archers coming your way, make your stands on the bridges of the Dniester river.

- West/North-West: There's absolutely no one apart from the Eleutheroi to that direction, and no one is going to expand there for at least 50 years, except maybe a rushing Epirote, but that rarely happens. Go as far to Lucarottea or Vindobona, but no more. Carrodunum, Eburonum and Iuvavoaeta have fullstacks and those nasty scripted defenders, it's better to leave them as a buffer, in case the Romani, Sweboz or Aedui/Arverni get that far. Just check from time to time if any of those factions has succesfully conquered them. Going any further West can get you into war with the Romani and Epirote very early, but I must admit that Segestica and Dalminion are very interesting to conquer, when you develop those cities they represent a HUGE income.

- To the South it will be your most active border and the one you should keep your eyes on the most. Go no further than Buridava and Singidunum, and send spies and diplomats to check how things unfold between Makedon, Epirote and KH. Hopefully they'll be too busy killing each other to send armies your way.

Expanding to the mentioned places and then bulding up your cities and economy can leave you well prepared for the future attacks (and believe me, they will come).