Adding Pagan Agents?

[Sakurai, Saionji]

I downloaded the Golden Horde Mod and I enjoy it but I am having one problem. The catholics send like three bishops to my capital to convert my pagans to catholicism and there is nothing i can do. my population is only 30 percent pagan now and the majority is catholic. also I wanted assasins because what happened was i was getting a shitload of heirs but i wanted my general with royal blood to be king but i couldnt kill off the khan's heirs because everytime i sent one into battle against overwhelming odds he either didnt get killed, won, or got killed but another heir was born and it got redicilous because my general with royal blood was awesome. on top of this i wanted to bribe the rebels in neighboring provinces so i could concentrate my miliary against the byzantines but i couldnt cus no emissaries http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/frown.gif is it possible to get emissaries and agents?

[King David]

I dig the Mongols as well but. I think there is away to get them agens. Or at least spyes, simply edit the early high or watever campaign you are playing in the mtw\campmap\startpos folder.

Go down to the Makeunit sections and add the unit.
Example:
MakeUnit:: ID_GoldenHorde Assassin 1074 8
The 8 after the birth year gives this assasin 5 stars or 4 dont remember. or you can simply add a whore house to the region were the mongols are in the MakeBuilding section of the same file. Its just an idea havent tried it with mongols it works fine with catholics but try....let me know how you do..

[Sakurai, Saionji]

Agh i am confused and have no clue what you are talking about lol.

[NagatsukaShumi]

This is very complicated, mainly the reason for this is that you aren't even meant to be playing as Pagan's so CA obviously didn't make them any units to use to raise the Pagan support of a region.

All I can say is wait for someone to do a more in-depth look into this and then get in on the conversation.

[Sakurai, Saionji]

The Mongol's have the ability to build the Brothel and Tavern with the Mod but when you build them no units become available to train, many buildings that the mongols can build do this, all he swordsman thingies, most archer thingies, half the stuff you can build does nothing hehe.

[PatrickNeil]

Yeah, this can be done. I did it. In "crusaders_unit_prod11" just scroll down to the bottom and find things like "spy", "assassin" and such, and in that line, scroll to the end where it says "CATHOLIC, ORTHODOX, MUSLIM" change that to "CATHOLIC, ORTHODOX, MUSLIM, PAGAN" and your set. I haven't tried making pagan priests, cause that was someone elses domain as I recall. I've made new agents, but I'm currently struggling with the BUF files found in "pieces", since I can't seem to edit them. But one could probably use existing priest pieces for pagan priets. we'll see. Look for that in the next week.

Patrick

[Sakurai, Saionji]

Ok so but when i right click it wont it crash cus it has no picture? so dont I have to make an agents portrait subfolder in the pagan folder, and just copy and paste some mongol general pictures into their?

[PatrickNeil]

Right, you could copy "Princess" from Catholic or Orthodox, and "Spy", "Assassin", and "Emissary" portrait folders from where ever. Also, in "review_pannel" and "info_pics" folders, you could add a "Pagan" folder and copy any building picture that doesn't seem to work right into those from the others.

Patrick

[Sakurai, Saionji]

Sucess i created an assassin subfolder then i copied and pasted like 13 pictures of generals into the folder and changed the names to Assasin01 etc and it worked http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif also for emissaries. Now i have a question... If I enable Pagan to be able to build priests... will the priests be Pagan, or will I essentially end up making orhtodox priests and converting my own guys to orthodoxy lol.

[PatrickNeil]

I'm about to try this today, cause I noticed that in "crusaders_unit_prod" at the end of "priest", "bishop", etc there's a list of the religions with the relion that the agent is applicable to given a number. such as at the end of Grand Inquisitionr it says "PAGAN(0), CATHOLIC(5), ORTHODOX(0), ISLAMIC(0), JEWISH(0), HERETIC(0)" so I'll change Pagan to 5, and Catholic to 0. This is the same place that you could make a Rabbi if you wanted to. The kicker is that you gotta have a building where you can build these from, so you might change "church" to something the Pagans can build now, like "Tavern". So I'll make a Pagan church, but I'm sure Barocca made a mod of all of this already... in fact, here it is, or at least the posts: http://www.totalwar.org/cgi-bin....l=pagan (http://www.totalwar.org/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=5;t=907;hl=pagan). Hmm... just might take those pictures too.

Anyways, that's what you could do, and I'll try it as soon as I get offline.

Patrick

[King David]

Quote[/b] (Sakurai @ Saionji,Nov. 09 2002,23:16)]Agh i am confused and have no clue what you are talking about lol.
Another way to make the horde get agents is to make them catholic or orthodox but you wont like the results. Most modifiactions go by religion. Mongols being Pagan You might want to add folders to the pagan faction like the catholics and the orthodox have. Just look around the faction folders and it will give you an idea of stuff you can play with. I havent tested that idea yet but its compeling...
http://www.lugburz.homestead.com/files/blackknight.gif

[NagatsukaShumi]

I'll be investigating this in my "hush hush" MOD (It's a secret don't you know).

[Sakurai, Saionji]

Hmm but if you changed the inquisitor untit to pagan and changed the name to druid then the catholics wouldnt have a grand inquisitor or if you made it also for them its name would be druid. Is there a way to make a seperate unit?

[King David]

Hey Im exited about you guys discovery. It was a shot in the dark but hey, it works. Another hint is you can modify those ugly ass pictures of assassins and such to watever you like. They have to be in TGA form tho so you can use irfanview to convert them or watever other viewer you got.
Keep me posted on how those units behave for pagans. wow thats cool. You can turn the princess into an assassin too i think.. Not sure tho....

[King David]

Quote[/b] (Sakurai, Saionji @ Nov. 11 2002,20:05)]Hmm but if you changed the inquisitor untit to pagan and changed the name to druid then the catholics wouldnt have a grand inquisitor or if you made it also for them its name would be druid. Is there a way to make a seperate unit?
Thats the sad part. Only Catholics can have those fun inquisitions. Your new unit would probablay be useless as an inquisitor in a pagan culture but try him as an assassin. Its all religion driven so you have to switch things around with the limitations of religion..

[Sakurai, Saionji]

Hmmmm but if i made an inquisitor for pagans, it would work as if it would be tryin people for not being pagan enough?
So if i make priests available to pagans, are they going to preach paganism, or will they preach orthodoxy

[King David]

Quote[/b] (Sakurai, Saionji @ Nov. 11 2002,21:47)]Hmmmm but if i made an inquisitor for pagans, it would work as if it would be tryin people for not being pagan enough?
So if i make priests available to pagans, are they going to preach paganism, or will they preach orthodoxy
I think you can adjust that on the productionunitfile were all those nombers go.. Look at the other agents for instance the orthodox priests numbers it will give you an idea of how an orthodox priest is to effect the factions..
every unit is adjusted there..

[King David]

Hey It works

Added the Muslim Assassin folder to the Pagan folder and then Edited the ProductionUnitfile like this:
Assassin ASSASSIN 200 0 1 0 80 1 1 DISCOURAGED BYZANTINE SYRIA "POVERTY_STRICKEN(35), DESPERATE_DEFENCE(1), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST(8), CATHOLIC_NAVAL_EXPANSIONIST(8), CATHOLIC_TRADER(10), CATHOLIC_CRUSADER_TRADER(10), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST_CRUSADER(8), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE_CRUSADER(8), POPE(5), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE(8), CATHOLIC_ISOLATIONIST(5), ORTHODOX_DEFENSIVE(8), ORTHODOX_EXPANSIONIST(8), ORTHODOX_STAGNANT(10), MUSLIM_PEACEFUL(10), MUSLIM_EXPANSIONIST(8), MUSLIM_DEVOUT(8), BARBARIAN_RAIDER(4), REBELS(10), CLOSE_TO_SUPPORT_LIMIT(0)" { TAVERN } ALL_PERIODS YES YES "own_assassin_tooltip1, own_assassin_tooltip2, other_assassin_tooltip1, other_assassin_tooltip2" ALL_FACTIONS "CATHOLIC, ORTHODOX, MUSLIM, PAGAN"

Notice the last part were the religions are. You add Pagan and then play as the golden horde and when you build a tabern you get assassins...Golden Assassins.. I think you can do the same for spies and other agents..

[PatrickNeil]

Yep, you sure do.

What I've gone and done is added lines to that file, copying the lines about other agents. A spy agent type is the most adaptable I've found. I'll upload my modding finds today, and post the link here. That file will add a trainable princess from brothels, which I call a "seductress", and a bard, which I haven't made pictures for, who adds loyalty and pagan religion. I didn't get around to making those pagan buildings, but I did make buildings for those two agents, so there's a pub that's an advanced tavern, from which you can get spys, since the brothel is for seductresses, and I added a courtyard inn, which is for bards. I think it can help people modding units and agents.

Patrick

[PatrickNeil]

And here's that link: http://www.totalwar.org/Downloa....don.zip (http://www.totalwar.org/Downloads/Mtw_Uploads/MTWupload/SeductressAddon.zip)

May want to make some backups. It's not really intended to be for everyone, but for people to look at, in particular the two files "crusaders_build_prod.txt", which had new lines for the TAVERN, INN, and BROTHEL so far,
and "crusaders_unit_prod.txt" which, at the bottom, has new line on new agents, and has all the normal agents buildable by pagans. Just to look at, all the other files are merely aesthetic things to go along with these main changes.

OH and unzip to C:\, I didn't bother changeing it to be unzippable elsewhere.

Patrick

[King David]

Quote[/b] (PatrickNeil @ Nov. 12 2002,15:34)]And here's that link: http://www.totalwar.org/Downloa....don.zip (http://www.totalwar.org/Downloads/Mtw_Uploads/MTWupload/SeductressAddon.zip)

May want to make some backups. It's not really intended to be for everyone, but for people to look at, in particular the two files "crusaders_build_prod.txt", which had new lines for the TAVERN, INN, and BROTHEL so far,
and "crusaders_unit_prod.txt" which, at the bottom, has new line on new agents, and has all the normal agents buildable by pagans. Just to look at, all the other files are merely aesthetic things to go along with these main changes.

OH and unzip to C:\, I didn't bother changeing it to be unzippable elsewhere.

Patrick
Looks good patrick. Did you get it to work in the game ?
There is a Robin Hood Piece and a Joan of Arc Piece that you could probably use as well In the Agents folder I think.. Have you worked with those yet ? [B]Dude Looking at the crusade unit entri on the unitprod file I just got an idea..I think it would be possible to Have eigther the pagans use that unit as a RAID for the Mongols instead of crusade It would make them stackable. And The orthodox could use it as a CAMPAIGN for like the bizantines.
Campaign
Barbarian Raid
Quest
Mission
............The possiblilities are endless

[PatrickNeil]

Yep, it all works in the game, not always pretty, but they work. I did notice the Robin Hood and Joan of Arc, and I used the Robin Hood piece for the Bard, at least until I can edit the BUF files.

I like the crusades because they can cross provinces of other factions. I often don't want the land, or more likely, couldn't take the land of one faction, and love to just pass over them.

Also, the names I've used are just temporary, and I really don't like them too much. So if there's a better name for a large tavern, large inn, woman produced in the brothel, a large brothel, pagan priests, or a medieval singer I'd love to replace these current names.

Another problem is the portraits. While you can add a folder in "Pagan" names "Preists", the standard agent that I base a new agent off of takes the same portrait. Like, if I tried to add, oh, say, British punks as an agent of the rebels, I'd have to settle for one of the... wait a sec... where's Joan of Arc's unit She's got her own "Misc" portrait and piece and everything. I'll get on this.

Patrick

[barocca]

seeing as this topic came up again i thought i would revive a few threads on the issue,

(pagan addon thread
and pagan religious buildings)

most of the work in th0se threads if for v1.0.
but the underlying principles remain,
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

oh yes, i also uploaded some pagan building resources to the upload folder
http://www.totalwar.org/Downloads/Mtw_Uploads/MTWupload/
these are half finished, and also some resources to design more.

barocca

[King David]

Quote[/b] (PatrickNeil @ Nov. 12 2002,20:40)]Yep, it all works in the game, not always pretty, but they work. I did notice the Robin Hood and Joan of Arc, and I used the Robin Hood piece for the Bard, at least until I can edit the BUF files.

I like the crusades because they can cross provinces of other factions. I often don't want the land, or more likely, couldn't take the land of one faction, and love to just pass over them.

Also, the names I've used are just temporary, and I really don't like them too much. So if there's a better name for a large tavern, large inn, woman produced in the brothel, a large brothel, pagan priests, or a medieval singer I'd love to replace these current names.

Another problem is the portraits. While you can add a folder in "Pagan" names "Preists", the standard agent that I base a new agent off of takes the same portrait. Like, if I tried to add, oh, say, British punks as an agent of the rebels, I'd have to settle for one of the... wait a sec... where's Joan of Arc's unit She's got her own "Misc" portrait and piece and everything. I'll get on this.

Patrick
I would be very interested in taking a look at your modifactions for PAGAN and Or Orthogox Crusades.. Ive tried it but cant get it to work..As far as the portrait modification that is a piece of cake. For the king you can just use one or two pictures if it is a central character to the mod. For Solidiers the game draws from the genelar folder And even those you can modify as long as the BMP or JPG is converted to TGA or saved as TGA and resized to the same size as the original portrait. I did that for the Mordred Faction in the Camelot Mod and it looks great.
It would be great to have the Golden Horde go on a Barbarian Raid accross Europe or the Bizantines go on a Campaign..

[Sakurai, Saionji]

Im really really really confused lol. How are you making new units without replacing old ones?

[PatrickNeil]

Well, I've made the Stonecircle and Stonehenge, and they look pretty good, and am gonna do images for the Druids today, so I hope to have the result of the original intention of this post up online tonight. Thanks for the images, Barocca.

Adding agents and units ins't so hard. First you should open the "crusaders_unit_prod11" file, and scroll to the bottom of the text (you can delete the mile of extra spaces if you want, it makes scrolling much easier). Find the list of agents, that's pretty obvious, and choose one to base your new agent (or unit) off of. This is important because of how it will function. Highlight the line that contains the information about the chosen agent, copy it, and paste a copy on to the bottom of the text. Change the first word to anything you want, like "Mad Scientist", this is what the game will identify the agent with, and is the most important value. the second word in the line is the second most important value, as it defines how the agent function and you can't change that (yet?) because the actions are hardcoded. On and on in the line is pretty self explanitory, or can be understood with the notes at the top of the file, i.e. price, time they take to train, required buildings, required culture, required religion, etc.

Patrick

[PatrickNeil]

Cha-ching. I'm putting this one in the done books. You can download the file here:

http://www.totalwar.org/Downloa....don.ZIP (http://www.totalwar.org/Downloads/Mtw_Uploads/MTWupload/Pagans_Civil_Rights_Addon.ZIP)

Wouldn't mind seeing that and some of the other big mods getting coverage on the front page of the Org.

It adds a certain equality to the Pagan religion, so that's why it's called the "Pagan Civil Rights Addon". For all those who have advocated and fought to get the pagans their equal representation when it comes to churches and priests.

Read the "Read Me", it's pretty good. Back you your modified files, like "crusaders_unit_prod11.txt" and "crusader_build_prod13.txt" before you install it. Like wise goes to backing up and "Loc\Eng" files, as "Names.txt", "Descriptions.txt", "Tooltip.txt", and "Events.txt" are all slightly changed.

Some of the portraits are fun, so check them out. Maybe we can do another version soon, but I really gotta work on college applications for the next month, so if we do an update with prettier info pics, working BUF files, minarets, and more portraits, I just don't want to go it alone.

Enjoy

Patrick

[monkian]

The map wouldn't load when I installed the civil rights files.

Something about can't find campmap_/startpos_inn2.bif ?

Any ideas ?

[PatrickNeil]

Damn, what was that? What a let down. I'll fix it, and re-upload what ever wasn't working. Really sorry about that.

Patrick

[King David]

Quote[/b] (PatrickNeil @ Nov. 20 2002,19:04)]Damn, what was that? What a let down. I'll fix it, and re-upload what ever wasn't working. Really sorry about that.

Patrick
Were you able to get the pagans and Orthodox to crusade ? If so could you show us how you did it ? Pleeez...

[Sakurai, Saionji]

WOW My Name is in the readme that opens up when you open the zip file http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif YAY He didnt even expect that credit lol. Anyway good job I didnt really expect any credit but this looks great, im installing it right now

[Sakurai, Saionji]

Agh has this ben fixed yet? cus when i try to play it it crashes and says cannot find campmap_stonecircle.bif
or something like that.

[PatrickNeil]

Really sorry about that. I fixed it and a problem with "Names.txt" that I found. It was just this one file out of a hundred that I forgot to put in.

Here's the new link, and Barocca can you take down the old version.

http://www.totalwar.org/Downloa....1.1.ZIP (http://www.totalwar.org/Downloads/Mtw_Uploads/MTWupload/Pagans_Civil_Rights_Addon_1.1.ZIP)

I did try the Ortodox crusades, without success though. I got as far as training the "Quest", but before it actually appeared on the campaign map it gave me a message that I had "lost the support of my Chapter House" and that the crudade would be disbanded, so I tried to make the reliquary, which I was using as the required building for making "quests", funtion like Chapter House, then when that didn't work, I tried just making Othodox able to build Chapter Housed, but it seems they're hardcoded into being catholic. So no go there.

Patrick

[King David]

Quote[/b] (PatrickNeil @ Nov. 23 2002,01:40)]Really sorry about that. I fixed it and a problem with "Names.txt" that I found. It was just this one file out of a hundred that I forgot to put in.

Here's the new link, and Barocca can you take down the old version.

http://www.totalwar.org/Downloa....1.1.ZIP (http://www.totalwar.org/Downloads/Mtw_Uploads/MTWupload/Pagans_Civil_Rights_Addon_1.1.ZIP)

I did try the Ortodox crusades, without success though. I got as far as training the "Quest", but before it actually appeared on the campaign map it gave me a message that I had "lost the support of my Chapter House" and that the crudade would be disbanded, so I tried to make the reliquary, which I was using as the required building for making "quests", funtion like Chapter House, then when that didn't work, I tried just making Othodox able to build Chapter Housed, but it seems they're hardcoded into being catholic. So no go there.

Patrick
[B]Ahh, You ran into the hardcoded monster of MTW. Good try tho patrick, don't give up on that idea, I am sure there has to be a way round it. I guess the same would go for the Muslem Jihad? Have you figured out what the numbers after the faction behavior in unitprod and buildprod files do ? Maybe it has something to do with those numbers rather than some hardcoded table. Has anyone figured out what those numbers do yet ?
Example:
CATHOLIC_NAVAL_EXPANSIONIST(192), CATHOLIC_TRADER(160), CATHOLIC_CRUSADER_TRADER(160), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST_CRUSADER(192), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE_CRUSADER(128), POPE(80), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE(128), CATHOLIC_ISOLATIONIST(80), ORTHODOX_DEFENSIVE(128),
this is found in the crusaders_unit_prod11 file

[monkian]

No worries Patrick http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[PatrickNeil]

I really thought it would be a good idea, cause right now the use of Orthodox Monasteries and Reliquaries is questionable, and making them like Chapter Houses would make them useful. And yes, the same goes for Ribats, I tried that today.

The numbers are used for helping the computer decide what to build. They're only important for units, as the numbers are the same for all the agents, including Crusades and Jihads.

I don't think it can be done at the moment, but I hear of this expansion pack rumor, with the Vikings, and certainly the vikings will have something like this, and be pagan. Think about what units pop up when a crusade is targeted, they're christian, and there's no place to change this.

Patrick

[barocca]

Patrick, thats a good point about the Viking Expansion, we will quite probably have an awful lot of Pagan bits and pieces to play with when that comes out
:-D
(well we can hope, unless it is similar to the Mongol Invasions expansion, the mongols had no strategic agents,
in which case we will need to be prepared with a full set of agents and buildings so people can add them to the expansion's pagan factiosn)

now these might be helpfullModders Portraits Pack One - 720K (http://www.totalwar.org/Downloads/MTW/Stats/Modders_Portraits_Pack_One.zip)
is a set of portraits that you may find usefull for your pagan mod,
a collection of 46 male and female portraits, knights, barbarians, kings, maidens and warrior maidens
(just for starters http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

[Sakurai, Saionji]

OMG I thought of an idea. It not a sure-fire thing, but I think its worth a shot. You know how the Papacy has its behavior set as Pope, and when you train a crusade the pope has to approve it... I think the problem we might be encountering is because were trying to make a crusade like thing, but we dont have a pope like guy to approve it...
So I am thinking, if you made whatever pagan faction you play as, if you set its thing to Pope, then maybe when as pagans when you try to make a pagan crusade, it will be buildable because now there will be pagan faction that acts as a "pope" to approve it. Get what I mean? Im not sure if this will work, but considering that we have come to a dead end, I think that it is worth it to try this.

[PatrickNeil]

I don't know if that would help, but you can try it. Right now, thanks to the new BUF editing capiblities, I put in the missing, or at least, unchanged files, from the addon. This makes it so that the agents, like the druids, look the way they should when sitting on the campaign map, and not like inquisitioners. So here's version 1.2.

http://www.totalwar.org/Downloa....1.2.ZIP (http://www.totalwar.org/Downloads/Mtw_Uploads/MTWupload/Pagans_Civil_Rights_Addon_1.2.ZIP)

Patrick