Quick Question (QQ) - Saguntum

[Megas Methuselah]

What's up, homies?

But heeeeey, is that settlement on the eastern coast of Spain, called Arse, the exact same settlement that Hannibal famously stormed (Saguntum)? Also, is it the same thing as this map's Zakynthos (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f4/AntikeGriechen1.jpg)? I've read that Zakynthos is a Greek colony; so, if these 3 names are all the same thing for one city, here's my real question: is EB's settlement of Arse a Greek colony? Further, what would the Greeks have called it? Arse, Saguntum, or Zakynthos?

:dizzy2:

[WinsingtonIII]

So, I could ascertain that Saguntum and Zakynthos are indeed two names for the same city. Here's the link (http://chestofbooks.com/reference/American-Cyclopaedia-14/Saguntum-Or-Saguntus-Saint-Barbara.html) from an encyclopedia (hopefully reputable). It seems the original Greek name was Zakynthos (after the homeland they came from), so I doubt that they would have called it Saguntum. Arse seems difficult to find information on (probably because the internet likes to think you're searching for "arse," which leads to some wonderful discoveries).

This book (http://books.google.com/books?hl=en&lr=&id=DXUDAAAAQAAJ&oi=fnd&pg=PA1&dq=greek+colonies+in+spain%2Barse&ots=qN5FKWUPo6&sig=4AIJPw6EVAgMBNie7nZvP1JnQ2I#v=onepage&q=&f=false) (A Smaller Manual of Ancient Geography
By William Latham Bevan), on page 195, mentions that the Greeks settled at "Emporion and Saguntum," and on 197 mentions that indeed the Greeks initially called the city Zakynthos, that this was the same city later assaulted by Hannibal, and that it's modern name is now Murviedro.

Still no information on Arse, as far as I can tell, but Arse and Saguntum/Zakynthos do seem to line up rather well on the map, so maybe that was another name for the same city (I have no proof other than the map unfortunately).

I can tell you that in EB Arse seems to be a Greek colony. The city revolts to the Koinon Hellenon, and you can recruit Hoplitai and Hoplitai Haploi and the other various Greek regional troops in the city.

Hope this helps!

[Hannibal Khan the Great]

Maybe Arse is the native Iberian name? However, I can definitely say that Zakynthos is Greek and Saguntum is Latin, and the latter seems to be a latinization of the former.

[Megas Methuselah]

Thanks guys, that's awesome (take a :balloon: each)! I knew I could count on my bro's in the EB horde; this forum is where the historians are levied, after all. :smile:

Considering I won't be going through any reforms, I'll rename the city to Zakynthos. From what I can gather, the only danger in re-naming cities is that they won't be included in reforms once re-named.

[WinsingtonIII]

Thank you, good sir! I'm only an amateur historian, but I try to help where I can.

Just out of curiosity, why are you renaming the city? Did it rebel to the KH and now you're roleplaying it as an independent Greek city-state?

[Megas Methuselah]

Nah, I immigrated to Massalia from Epirus, edited some game files, and I am now playing as the Epirote-Massalians. Zakynthos is a city I recently brought into my fold, but seeing as it is a Greek polis, I will be making it a type4 allied territory rather than fully assimilating it.

AAR on the way. :smile:

[WinsingtonIII]

Sounds cool! I'll keep an eye out for it.

By the way, just discovered this: "During this period the city was known as Arse," so it looks like all three were names for the same city. Searching by the modern name of the city (which appears to actually be Sagunto, not Murviedro) was much more effective. This info is only from Wikipedia, but I'm going to believe it because it cites a legitimate book, which happens to be written in Spanish, so I cannot read the actual work.