View Full Version : Creative Assembly Question - Why is early.txt such a mess?
I have recently been trying to edit the contents of the startpos text files to accommodate a new lukmap, and have been having particular trouble with the province attributes, this is the section headed
//========================================
//Region Attributes
//The special characteristics for a region
//========================================
and I am having many frustrations…while I am sure it is possible to edit individual stats in this table, wholesale export to excel and editing is as fruitful as learning Hebrew before a trip to China – I would like to ask GillJay (or etc http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif ) if there are any production .xls files for the early.txt, high.txt, or late.txt? failing this – I ask for an explanation of why these files (actually, this section in particular) is such a mess? It is in places tab delimited, in places space delimited, and sometimes both – but according to no pattern I can make out…but I try and change this pattern and the campaign game removes itself from the list of possible campaigns when I try and change this pattern?
Cheers, Whitey
Kraellin
12-15-2002, 00:57
whitey,
the tabs arent nearly as critical as you might think. yes, you do need them in most places and yes, some are only spaces, but the most common reason for your mod not showing in the list is typos. yup, typos. one little item wrong and no listing in the game. this is much fussier than the tabs.
also, for the early- high- late.txt files i'd suggest using wordpad. easier to read.
K.
well Krae, I do know this, but this reply convinced me to check up on what I was doing...lo and behold a typo (somehow I had missed it!http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif
as for using wordpad, d/l this excel file and see what you think is easiest to work with...
MTWStartpos.xls (http://www.rarakan.co.uk/orgist_conspiracy/MTWStartpos.xls)
EDIT - this is not a comprehensive file, just an example...
Whitey
please make a test campaign by exporting from the excel file,
then tell us if it works,
and how to import to and exprot from excel,
for the new modders here that would be very handy...
thanks
B.
no luck so far Bar...the game is still rejecting the excel - tab delimited imports, this is why I posted in the first place...I have re-checked for typos, and found no more after the initial one - I will play around a bit more, I am convinced there *shouldn't* be any problems...unless there are fields in some of the tables and CA removed the data because they were no longer used, however kept the fields,
But I'll keep looking,
Whitey
If you read my post here, unread it - erase it from your mind...the truth is elsewhere...
Barocca - that section of the file at least seemingl can't be converted to xls and back without ruining what it means to the game...quite annoying really as it does slow down the modding process somewhat...
this is why I asked if there were any production xls files like for the unit prods, I'll bump this thread on monday and see if anybody at CA is paying attention this close to Christmas http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif
Kraellin
12-15-2002, 09:03
whitey,
i have office 2000 excel and i can load and save and have the files work ok. the trouble with the office 2000 excel is that its fields arent large enough to display some the lines correctly and i'd have to format the columns or lines which makes things kind of goofy. i've installed the 1.1 excel files and looked at the early.txt file and didnt like the look, so didnt bother to edit or save. i still prefer wordpad for the startpos files. they are really quite easy to read and work with in wordpad and the saves dont corrupt any of the tabs. in fact, i've edited out some of the tabs in wordpad here and there, just to format the thing for easier reading...and you still have another typo somewhere ;)
if you really get stuck, load your file and the original early.txt and compare them line by line...that works best for me. i kept messing up 'Freisland' and then kept missing finding the mistake until i did a line by line comparison.
oh, and make sure you're using the excel viewer 1.1 if you're patch.
K.
*bump* for tuesday,
does CA have production files?
GilJaysmith
12-17-2002, 11:53
The startpos files are created and edited as you see them, in Notepad or Wordpad I presume. I don't remember there being any great hassle with editing them, but then I didn't do it, perhaps Target and co kept it quiet.
Gil ~ CA
as i understand the process (from misc. comments from Target)
they wrote them in Ecel and exported them somehow - but we do not know how,
of course i could have completely misuderstood the content of his post,
but he did release "the developers v1.0 Excell files" as a download ...
(no disrespect to GilJay,
CA are in a large office, spread across several floors and Target 'n' GilJay worked on completely different sections of the coding)
GilJaysmith
12-17-2002, 13:16
The only Excel files are for the unit and building production spreadsheets (which have indeed been uploaded, pre- and post-patch versions). The startpos files were edited as you see them, as plain text files. Honest. No spreadsheets. I didn't work that much on the campaign map but I'm sure of that much. Can you point me at Target's post where it seems to say otherwise?
I use wordpad. The only reason for not showing up was typos or logical errors.
Editing unit-prod with wordpad is a big pain (most of it), using wordpad to edit the startpos files is doable ihmo.
Edratman
12-17-2002, 14:51
I also have had no luck successfully creating a mod in Excel. But if you open the files in Excel the spacing issues are easily understood.
I open all the startpos files, crusader files and projectile files in excel before making a mod just to see the spacing which then makes it easier to mod in wordpad.
All the earlier posts about spelling and spacing mistakes are correct. Someone earlier posted that there is a utility in the program that detects spelling mistakes and this utility rejects a mod with one. I can confirm that. So now whenever I mod, I will change about 4 lines at a time and then check the mod to see if it works. It is a slow process, but less frustrating than trying to find a single typo or spacing error.
One unique thing about spelling mistakes I've noticed is that several times I made a error in the makebuilding section. When I've done this I have found that the buildings listed in startpos before this error are built, but they stop at the error and no units appear anywhere because makeunit is after makebuilding. So I now maintain strict alphabetical sequencing to help me debug.
I strongly recommend studying all files in Excel to understand the spacing, but don't bother wasting your time making the mod in Excel, it has never worked for me.
I use EditPlus 2 for my text editing, and I have a syntax file for the units text that does a pretty good job of color-coding the important info in the text. You may have to go through the units text and manually delete some blank spaces, but that shouldn't take long.
This program really works great for editing HTML files.
If anyone wants a copy, just email me at wesw@hiwaay.net .
Tab delimited excel spreadsheets will not run in MTW. They are however useful as a visual guide for helping you find where to add information. Wordpad or notepad works fine, however I have noticed some bizarre crashes when I tried using Word so you might want to avoid that.
Kraellin
12-29-2002, 19:36
Quote[/b] ]Tab delimited excel spreadsheets will not run in MTW
sorry, but this just isnt true. my tab delimited files work just fine. you need to find what you're doing wrong and not do that.
and wordpad also works fine. it saves the tabs as well. whatever it is that you are doing, stop doing that. you either have typos, logic errors or are removing the tabs and replacing them with spaces or something. wordpad handles ALL the .txt files just fine.
K.
Quote[/b] (GilJaysmith @ Dec. 17 2002,06:16)]...I didn't work that much on the campaign map but I'm sure of that much. Can you point me at Target's post where it seems to say otherwise?...
my mantra for the day
"engage brain before putting mouth into gear"
"engage brain before putting mouth into gear"
"engage brain before putting mouth into gear"...
i was talking about prod files, but thats not what my post seems to say...
(going a bit vague in my old age...) http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/dizzy.gif
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