I'm going under!

[A Nerd]

In my current Venice campaign, about turn 67, I am having some trouble. In the beginning I was doing OK. Economy was growing, no wars, quite peaceful actually. Then it all hit the fan. The Byz declared war on me. I though, great, an opportunity to expand. While warring with them, HRE declared war. Next Sicilly and a naval blockade. Next my ally Hungary declared war, now it's the Turks. I think Milan is massing an army to lay siege to Venice as well. My economy is failing and I can barely defend myself against all the armies attacking my rather meager standing armies and garrisons. What I want to know is how people defend themselves and maintain a positive economy without resorting to cheats. This seems to be my dilema at the moment.

[smooth_operator]

In that case, having armies amassed at your frontier provinces and intercepting incoming armies might keep you alive. However, you can always ask other faction via your diplomats to join you. Don't worry much about Catholic Nations warring with you, especially if you have a high standing with the Pope. Chances are, they'll get excommunicated

[A Nerd]

HRE and Sicily were excommunicated, but I didn't have the means to carry on an effective attack against them. I was too busy else where. The pope died and the new one reconcilled them. My papal standing seems to be falling however. I took Sofia from the Hungarians and was threatened with excom myself. I think I can finish off the Byz soon though, all they have left is Constantinople and not a very good army there. Sofia was very teched up and will provide excellent troops. I was just curious about maintaining a positive cash flow. Perhaps I should produce a couple more merchants when I have time. All my enemies navies decimated my own, I don't think I have any ships at the moment, but I guess that is not as important.

[smooth_operator]

in that case...you can ask the Pope to launch a Crusade against HRE or Sicily, also, if you have the cash, you can always bribe other factions to attack them -at a hefty price though. Ensure a steady flow of trade, make sure your ports are defended by your navy. Merchants will help too.

[A Nerd]

Crusades is a great idea, I never thought of that! I will pump out a few more merchants. The only one I had was only making about 70 florins a turn and he recently died. I have been neglecting my navies and focusing on field armies. The Byz sank anything and everything I could produce!

[smooth_operator]

take note though that your Papal favor points must be high enough to persuade him to call a Crusade on your enemies. :) you may also want to make further trade agreements with other nations, especially those at the far east

[A Nerd]

I had managed to get a trade agreement with just about everyone before I started to get all the DoWs. I am trying to get some alliances with factions I don't share borders with but noone has taken my offer as of yet. I am not sure if any of my enemies are excommunicated at the moment but I will look into it. If Hungary keeps seiging Sofia like they have, they will probably be excomed soon!

[smooth_operator]

For long term results, always ensure too that your priests get a place in the College of Cardinals, have a priest always posted in every settlement, getting them out once in a while to boost their piety. Having your priest elected as Pope is highly beneficial for like 30 turns as it enables you to call any crusade at your whim. As for military concerns, hire an assassin to take out their pesky generals and to sabotage their towns. If you are short on money, be on the move in capturing other settlements to distribute the upkeep cost of your armies

[A Nerd]

I always have priests. They improve catholocism, keep inquisitors away, sometimes able to deal with heretics and as you said, can become cardinals. I think I have 4-5 cardinals currently in the college. In the last election however, I lost. I think it was because I was at war with so many. I use assassins, but the success rate is low, even for emmisaries. I'm moving on as many settlements as possible, but I don't have the funds to maintain a large standing army that would allow fast expansion at the moment.

[smooth_operator]

well, if the Pope has grudges against me, then I settle it with his blood, I once attempted to assassinate the Pope, chance was at around 30%, to my surprise, I succeeded taking him out without a hitch and got my man elected as Pope in his place. :P i've done something in the game's files to play as the Papal States. The inquisitors were under my control and it was so fun putting the kings of other factions to death without ever declaring war. :P

anyway, as for your large armies, simply disband units in areas where you are unlikely to be attacked, that can help your treasury

[A Nerd]

I once attempted to assassinate the Pope, chance was at around 30%, to my surprise, I succeeded taking him out without a hitch

I always level up a few assasins on rebel armies and princesses then leave them near the pope in case of emergency. High level assasins will take him out no problem, especially if he is outside a city walking around.


anyway, as for your large armies, simply disband units in areas where you are unlikely to be attacked, that can help your treasury

I would, but I'm at war on all fronts! The garrisons are quite meagre in very few places where possible. I've gotten a few naval landings by small enemy armies, fortunately I was able to produce some Italian Spear Militia before they attacked. After, I promptly disbanded them.

[smooth_operator]

Well, I wish you luck in your conquest General Nerd. :)
if only the Medieval Age had gatling guns...

[A Nerd]

Thank you, good sir! My Venician armies will weather the storm and soon sweep across Europe and beyond! Gatling guns will certainly be unnecessary!

[smooth_operator]

As for me, I have some serious British butt-kicking to for these Frenchmen. (ntw)

[A Nerd]

I haven't bought NTW yet. But many have said it's quite good. Better than ETW.

[smooth_operator]

It is good indeed. Campaign might be a little linear, but man, domination is all I care about. Battles are stunningly great, for good rigs at least. What's more, I get to play as Arthur Wellesley and put Napoleon to shame! Seriously, what's not to like...?

[smooth_operator]

I've somewhat reassessed your situation. It would really mean a lot if you play out crucial battles. Even if the scales are tipped slightly to the enemy's side, employing the proper tactics in real-time could make the cut

[A Nerd]

I've somewhat reassessed your situation. It would really mean a lot if you play out crucial battles. Even if the scales are tipped slightly to the enemy's side, employing the proper tactics in real-time could make the cut

Wha? I always play out my battles. Unless it's a seige that I will win no problem.

[smooth_operator]

Oh well, at times I get too lazy to play out my battles...harharhar

[smooth_operator]

Oh, I forgot good sir, you cannot ask the pope to launch a crusade against a faction unless it's an excommunicate.

[A Nerd]

Oh, I forgot good sir, you cannot ask the pope to launch a crusade against a faction unless it's an excommunicate.

I think you said that. That's what I plan to do with Hungary if they are excommunicated for attacking Sophia. I have to wait 6 turns before I attack them again. Till then I will continue my war with the Byz, and probably move east toward the turks. Papal standing increases if you war with non-catholics.

My dear lord, you can be quite the spaz!

[smooth_operator]

My apologies sire. *wink

[A Nerd]

Good show ol' chap, until another topic arises...I quote your sig! ;)

[_Tristan_]

I have been reading your exchange, gentlemen and I have a few observations of my own...

1 - Never underestimate the power of diplomacy.

You seem to have trouble managing your allies/ enemies... What is your standing (trustworthy or despicable ?) ? This matters a lot with regards to how other factions will respond to your diplomatic offers of ceasefire or alliance. So to keep this as high as possible, never attack another AI faction unless it is in retribution and they declared on you first.

Always try to keep your relationships with other factions as high as possible (perfect if attainable but Very Good at the least...). In order to achieve this, there is a simple method. get a diplomat to any faction city/diplomat and enter in negociations. In the same round of negociations, offer them repetedly to give them one of your provinces and see what they would give you for it... Most times they will simply refuse it but your standing with that faction will go up notch by notch until it reaches Perfect (and at no cost...). Once there you can even get the possibility to trade one of you poorer porvinces against one or two of theirs, managing conquests at no cost to you.

Furthermore, make sure to destroy any recruitment facility in the province you trade and make sure that no merc are available in the province pool, and the city/castle will be left undefended. If you have traded it to a faction that is way across the map, the city/castle will soon rebel due to the distance to capital mechanism, making it an easy prey to you. Thus, you'll have gained one or two territories and reouped your loss by regaining your own.

If you keep your good relations with all factions, they may even offer you money for nothing. I've even seen it coming from enemies with whom I had maintained Perfect status (Egypt, notably...)

This only requires of you to maintain a cadre of diplomats near other factions' capitals or diplomats/princesses.

2 - Never underestimate the power of the Crusade.

Have the Pope declare Crusades as soon as possible. But have a care to select the crusade target. The ideal target has to be first far from your homeland and second a rebel settlement preferably (see my point hereabove)

Then, place as many of your men into the Crusading stacks to cut their expenses using one general per stack if at all possible. Try and maintain the Crusading state as long as you feel possible (have your general leave the crusade one turn, rejoin it the next should prevent desertion, even if you do not make any progress towards the Crusade goal... You'll still have message of men threatening to leave but if you join back again, all will be forgotten...)

With most of your upkeep cancelled by this method, it should free up large sums to either stregnthen your treasury or allow your recruitment/ building of costly units/improvements to you cities.

Following these simple rules should prevent you from going under...

At your disposal to provide more info, if necessary...

[A Nerd]

Nice tips! I've never tried playing in such a way but it is worth a try!


never attack another AI faction unless it is in retribution and they declared on you first.

I never attacked any of my current enemies, they always attacked me first. Though I have noticed my relations with other factions I am not at war with dropping and I don't know why. I assumed it was because I was at war with their allies/trade partners and was taking some of their cities/castles. My empire isn't very large so I don't think it is due to that.


Try and maintain the Crusading state as long as you feel possible (have your general leave the crusade one turn, rejoin it the next should prevent desertion, even if you do not make any progress towards the Crusade goal... You'll still have message of men threatening to leave but if you join back again, all will be forgotten...)

How do you leave then rejoin a crusading army? Are there time limits on crusades? Does crusading an excommunicated enemy reduce favor from other factions? Would repeated crusades against cities/castles be a viable option? Also, taking cities along the way that aren't the target of the crusade, how would that work?

I was also wondering, is there that shared border and random blockade DoW problem that I have heard others talking about? Or is this a matter of faction standing as well?

[_Tristan_]

The attacks you've suffered are probably (and most certainly) due to the fact that your faction standing had been dropping (which it will do automatically bit by bit if you play on the harder settings...). At the first sign of weakness, be sure that you'll meet swift forays into your territories by even your allies...

As to leaving/rejoining Crusades, be sure to have always at least 8 units in the stack and simply click on the icon on the general's card. You have ten turns (or thereabout) to do it. After that you'll need to make progress towards the target or face desertion. But think what ten turns of free upkeep can do to your treasury. In one of my campaigns, I spent ten turns with 8 20-units stacks at no upkeep, and I mean virtually no upkeep as cities were garrisoned with militia units only... Only the castles' garrison cost me anything during those turns... I thus managed to upgrade to cities to large cities in a single turn...

Crusading against an excom'ed faction shouldn't reduce your standing...

Concerning repeated crusades, they are certainly a viable option... I even did it with Baghdad, sending no less than 3 crusades against it, conquering it then selling it to the richest and farthest faction in the game (Denmark or Russia at the time, I think...) or trading it for a more interesting settlement then seeing it rebel and finally waiting for the next crusade to send against it...

I would advise against taking targets of opportunity along the way unless those settlements are rebel-owned, otherwise you might encounter a standing drop.

I've never encountered the random blockade DoW problem playing along those lines... Not even Milan has shown any sign of its reknowned aggresiveness...;-)

[A Nerd]

Thanks of the advice! I'm going to try the next time I play!