Happy Memorial Day Weekend!

[PanzerJaeger]

To those members who are serving or have served in America's military (MRD, Gelatinous Cube , Kukri, etc)....

THANK YOU for your service!

It is my firm belief that America's best and brightest do not occupy our political institutions, our business community, or even academia. They are serving on the front lines in America's armed forces. Not only do we ask them to destroy our enemies; we also ask them to live among them and rebuild their communities. We ask them to be peace keepers and good will ambassadors. We ask them to take fire before responding. Never before have we asked so much of our soldiers, and under the strictest rules of engagement ever imposed on them.

The vast majority of the nation loves you guys and our hearts are with you.



https://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y104/panzerjaeger/100210-f-9171l-054-1-1.jpg

[Seamus Fermanagh]

To all of those who have served or are serving, thank you.

To all of those who died in that service, my "poor power" to thank you cannot be enough, but my thanks and prayers you have.

[Gregoshi]

Well said PJ.

Joshua Chamberlain said the following at the 20th Maine's monument dedication on Little Round Top in Gettysburg:


"In great deeds something abides. On great fields something stays...And reverent men and women from afar...heart-drawn to see where and by whom great things were suffered and done for them, shall come to this deathless field, to ponder and dream; and lo! the shadow of a mighty presence shall wrap them in its bosom, and... the power of the vision pass into their souls."
On Friday I stood on Little Round Top and at The Angle and amongst the graves at the National Cemetary in Gettysburg. Indeed, the shadow of a mighty presence did reveal the power of the vision into my soul. Alas, what it didn't do and couldn't do is reveal the courage within those men - something for which I've tried over the years to understand but always fail to do so. I may not understand the courage, but I am thankful for the sacrifices made by the dead and the living. :bow:

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Well said PJ.

Joshua Chamberlain said the following at the 20th Maine's monument dedication on Little Round Top in Gettysburg:


"In great deeds something abides. On great fields something stays...And reverent men and women from afar...heart-drawn to see where and by whom great things were suffered and done for them, shall come to this deathless field, to ponder and dream; and lo! the shadow of a mighty presence shall wrap them in its bosom, and... the power of the vision pass into their souls."
On Friday I stood on Little Round Top and at The Angle and amongst the graves at the National Cemetary in Gettysburg. Indeed, the shadow of a mighty presence did reveal the power of the vision into my soul. Alas, what it didn't do and couldn't do is reveal the courage within those men - something for which I've tried over the years to understand but always fail to do so. I may not understand the courage, but I am thankful for the sacrifices made by the dead and the living. :bow:

I remember looking out over that little stone wall at The Angle. You cast your gaze outwards across that shallow vale and think about Armistead and his men crossing it in the face of the Union shooters. There is no cover, only the occasional rail fence to slow them down. The Union is behind a pile of rock -- they are protected by a woolen shirt entirely out of step with the heat of a Pennsylvania Summer. They mass of men is so dense that anybody firing their way is more or less bound to hit someone. And they STILL made it to The Angle. Gregoshi has the right of it, I think. A profound sense of awe.

[KukriKhan]

PanzerJaeger: may I steal that paragraph you wrote? I promise to give attribution. We're doing a quiet little ceremony tomorrow at our local memorial, and I think it would be inspirational to our living vets to hear those words from a non-military 20-something Citizen. So we remember that our comrades' sacrifices were and are not in vain.

[Ice]

To those members who are serving or have served in America's military (MRD, Gelatinous Cube , Kukri, etc)....

THANK YOU for your service!

It is my firm belief that America's best and brightest do not occupy our political institutions, our business community, or even academia. They are serving on the front lines in America's armed forces. Not only do we ask them to destroy our enemies; we also ask them to live among them and rebuild their communities. We ask them to be peace keepers and good will ambassadors. We ask them to take fire before responding. Never before have we asked so much of our soldiers, and under the strictest rules of engagement ever imposed on them.

The vast majority of the nation loves you guys and our hearts are with you.



https://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y104/panzerjaeger/100210-f-9171l-054-1-1.jpg

Well said, PJ.

Thank you is all I can say to those who served and died for this country with honor.

[PanzerJaeger]

PanzerJaeger: may I steal that paragraph you wrote? I promise to give attribution. We're doing a quiet little ceremony tomorrow at our local memorial, and I think it would be inspirational to our living vets to hear those words from a non-military 20-something Citizen. So we remember that our comrades' sacrifices were and are not in vain.

Sure Kukri. No attribution necessary. ~:)

[Reenk Roink]

:bow:

[Megas Methuselah]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkZSQd1mnmw

Soldiers of my people extend across the continent, and have fought together as brothers in both the Canadian and American militaries. In fact, it was those soldiers returning from the Second World War, both native and non-native alike, who fought again to break down Canada's segregation. I have seen things my great-grand-uncles would never have believed possible, those very same men who seen and experienced things in Europe that I would never have believed possible.

Micwach.

[Major Robert Dump]

Memorial Day 2010

We woke at around 4 am and began loading our vehicles. We left at 5:15, stomachs full of muffins and cereal we stole from the DFAC the night before because we knew we would leave before breakfast. We drove through the KG pass, on a route that was "black", in order to reach the district center of Waze Zadran, an area where my unit has yet to go. The intent was to drop in on the Monday Shura, a meeting of Elders, and pitch some of our programs.

Waze Zadran, according to my translator, is made up of mountain people that are akin to US hillbillies. Just before we arrived, 2 men had been detained for shooting two men to death from another tribe. The crime of the dead was cutting down scarce trees on the other tribes land, of which the border is not recognized or agreed upon by any party. The men being detained did not believe they committed a crime. They even posed for a picture when they saw I had a camera.

My team does agricultural programs and education, much of which is common knowledge with a western 6th grade education. Such knowledge was lost with these folks long ago. We are often confused with the PRT, which is a group of Army, Navy, Air Force, State Department and USAID people who rebuild infrastructure, minus agriculture, which they leave to us. The problem with being mistaken with the PRT is that 3 deployments ago, a bunch of PRT commanders apparently had a race to see who could finish the most projects. The Paktya Province PRT started 115 projects. The Khowst started 105. None of those were finished, most not even started, by the time those units left. A PRT is susally around 40 experts with 40 security. It does not take a genius to understand that in this environment, and with typical beaurucratic red tape, 40 people cannot do 115 projects in 9 months.

The following 2 PRTs, in both district, have not started a single project and have focused only on finishing what was started. The broken promises are immense, and both are now down to less than 50. They are still over cap, as at some point within the last 12 months someone smarter than the others capped all PRT and ADT projects at 35. My unit, the ADT, is currently at 34, but we are about to finish 12 in about 2 weeks.

The Shura members who did not come were scared of the Taliban and with good reason. Two days ago, the Taliban treid to recruit from a village near the District Center, and the elders of the village told them to F off. Funny thing, this village doesn't cooperate with NATO forces either, so to call them our allies would be a huge stretch. Nonetheless, the Taliban did not care for the rebuff, and came back after dark, took the 8 oldest men from the village, and executed them in a field as their families watched. This is what we fight.

The Shura started off on a sour note because the unit in charge of combat operations in the district -- the Battle Space Owner -- bitched at the shura about the number of IEDs found on the newly constructed KG Pass. Rather than thanking them for braving the shura (did I mention the DC got 22 IDF shells dropped on it the day before?) the BSO decided to castigate the elders for 15 minutes. I am not naive enough to believe that at least one or two of those 9 men in that room are in cahoots with the Taliban, especially the way a couple of them behaved and their body language. Nonetheless, that was no way to start a meeting.

Then it was our turn, during which the sub governor quickly pointed out broken promises of the past. We then pointed out that we were not the PRT, and we listed 48 projects that the unit has completed in its 4 months here. I might also add that 12 of those projects were left over from the Tennessee ADT, because they didn't leave the FOB their last 4 months here due to command idiocy and in-fighting that got several 0-4s and senior NCOs removed from their positions after a huge fiasco. In 4 months, we have completed more than Tennessee did in 9 months.

The elders were impressed with out track record, and all seemed well, the then Afghan in them kicked in. Despite the dozens of potential projects we pitched -- telling the sub governor to pick the 5 most important projects and locations -- the SG then rattled off a list of everything they needed, including lots of things that are not our expertise, things that would personally and financially benefit him and the elders, and he even went so far as to say we needed to provide refreshments at future shuras. He said we cannot split our attention between multiple districts (typical tribal foo foo) and that his district wanted all of our attention. We pointed out that we were here for all afghans, not just him and his cronies. He complained that if we do one or two projects for a couple of villages, that the other communities would be mad at him. We told him "welcome to politics" and that he better choose the villages in the most need then. Again, he repeated riduculous demands, and we repeated what we were williung to do.

So far, our two most successful projects have been poultry keeping and beekeeping, where we provide the training, animals and supplies for poor, disabled and widowed women to be able to support themselves. At half of these programs, particularly the ones in the more liberal north, there are plenty of women and little girls to attend the training. But at places like Waze Zadran there are mysteriously "no women available." Obviously, this is crap, you know it and I know it, and we all know why they don't want women -- not even widows or little girls for gods sake -- to be educated or know how to take care of themselves.

Anyway, the poultry and bee class we pitched will -- if it happens in this district-- be only for a 100 or so young males, due to cultural and security concerns, mostly cultural...I can't imagine getting 100 kids to the class would be any more of a security issue than getting 100 women there. One of my interpeters told me they just don't want women to learn, my other interp said that he believed them about security and women being talked to school would anger the Taliban 10 fold. Regardless, in districts where we have a strong presence and solid security and virtually no Taliban or Haqqani, women are still denied this training.

On the way out, I secured 14 duffel bags I had brought in a trailer and rallied the children. There were probably 100+, so I whipped out the bull horn and gave it to my Terp to tell the children to be orderly and share with the girls or no one would get anything. As you might have guessed, that went over like a turd in a punch bowl and I practically got knocked down when they saw I had hand crank radios. I retreated back into the ANP checkpoint so I would have a control point, and had one of my men pass out stuff to the boys while I passed out stuff to the girls out of view of the boys.

To the boys we gave duffel bags with the Afghan flag, ANP and ANA recruitment propoganda, notebooks and pencils. To the girls I gave hand crank radios, coloring books and crayons, food from care packages, mardi gras beads, brushes and sandals....Then I gave them a quick class on how to hide the stuff in their clothes so the boys would not kick the crap out of them and take their stuff -- something that happens every time i pass stuff out. We then distracted the boys by throwing about 30 rubber balls down a hill, and I sent the girls off with their loot.

We all shook hands, we reminded them that we are not the loser PRT, and we reminded them that things sometimes work very slow, especially when 1 year deployments ensure ever-changing teams and commanders, and when construction workers cant even finish the KG pass or G2 roads because they keep getting assassinated. It is, after all, a war zone. And the army has never been efficient at anything other than killing people.

On the way home, back through the KG pass on a 2 hour ride at 9500 feet above sea level, we took 3 RPG shots from 3 different directions, all of which missed, one of which blew up a car with a father and two children inside. The occupants were barely scathed because the shot hit the engine and they were all alseep in the back seat. The bad guys did not stick around to talk to our guns, but certain equipment which I cannot discuss did enable us to get accurate descriptions of all 3. After cleaning up the scenes and watching birds hunt down 2 of the 3, I gave the rest of my toys and books to the kids from the car and we left.

Back to the FOB at 1530. At dinner, the DFAC had ribs and prime rib and ice cream in celebration of the holiday. Halfway through my meal, I got a call that we were needed for QRF.

It's funny, despite being second rate citizens due to being National Guard, despite getting into tiffs with other units who think we are unprofessional because we roll our sleeves up on patrol on hot days, we were not the jackass regular army folk who rolled out on a 22 vehicle 47 mile unpaved convoy and decided not to take a wrecker. One of the civilian Jingle Trucks, which was towing an MRAP on a trailer, rolled off the road and into a ravine. Now we get to go pull them out.

Nothing happened that time around.

Checked the office before coming to room, and saw that, as usual, the Taliban's verison of their attack on us not only said they killed everyone in the convoy, but they denied we popped two of their people and made no mention of the civilian property damage. I responded to their story by sending my own out to my radio and tv stations -- complete with funny headlines (the highlight of my job sometimes) and came back here to drink a diet pepsi, check the org on my $300 per month slow internet, clean my toe nails and sleep under my bed.

Have a nice day.

[KukriKhan]

Thanks for the "Day In The Life Of..." report, el-Tee.

Keep being well.
Keep doing good.
Keep on Keeping in Touch.

You're doing us proud. :bow:

[Gregoshi]

Thanks for the report MRD. :bow:

I went to my local Memorial Day ceremony this morning. First ceremony I've ever been too. It was tough. It seemed everytime I looked at the vets standing there to honour their buddies, I'd get choked up. I took some pictures, which was rather hard to do with tears in my eyes. Here are a couple of shots from the ceremony:

https://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h12/gbresslr/Org%20Pictures/RS_MemorialDay2010May31_04f.jpg


https://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h12/gbresslr/Org%20Pictures/RS_MemorialDay2010May31_17f.jpg

[Louis VI the Fat]

https://img241.imageshack.us/img241/1792/americain.jpg

[Seamus Fermanagh]

MRD, thank you.




Good pics, Louis and Grego

[Beskar]

I remember a story from when I was 10.

We were on a school trip to Normandy around rememberance day. We visited all the museums, the beach-head bunkers, all those historical sights. One rememberance day itself, I believe, we went to a massive World War 2 grave, which looked similar to Louis' picture. A mass row of well-kept graves with nationalities of the British, French, Americans, Belgiums, and others. So we as a class were there paying respects, and seeing the scale of it all. However, a few of the children ended up going along and came across the graves of the German soldiers. Their reaction to this was initially of disgust, then they were actively boo-ing at the graves of the German soldiers. (Afterall, to these kids, the Germans were the evil bad-guys who killed their grandparents and kin.)

One of the teachers ran up and obviously scolding the children to stop. Then she set them aside, along with the class then explained at the dead German soldiers were just like the soldiers of the allied forces. They were conscripted and sent to fight others, on the behalf of their leaders, sacrificing their lives in order to also protect their own families and friends and how the majority of them did not choose this fate, but continued on the behalf of others.

Being honest, she explained it far better than what I remember or could do myself, but it instilled the sense that we are all equal and should be respected in death, even if they were the "bad guys".

So I post this, to honour all those who fought in all the wars with the service they did to us all, even any opponents, that death will bring them the peace they could not have in life.

[Banquo's Ghost]

Fascinating report MRD, thank you. :bow:

[Hosakawa Tito]

Fascinating report MRD, thank you. :bow:

What he said Lt. MRD. Isn't the ability to communicate from the most remote places, in real time no less, the most amazing thing? Back in the day I remember standing in line for hours to use some dodgy landline phone that usually didn't work half the time, and that would be on base. Aboard ship or in the field forget about it, send a letter or postcard and give it a couple weeks or months.

[rotorgun]

May I say how very proud we are of your efforts, and the efforts of your unit MRD;"weary not in well doing" as the bible says. I was particularly touched by your relating to us just how it is for the dear little girls of such a backward country, long has it been this way. If I can be of some service to You or your folks, in any way, I should be very happy to oblige. I would also like to thank PJ for such a heartfelt expression of support for the military; he is a true patriot indeed. Let us never forget that the real heroes are the ones who never make it back.

PS: I am wiping the tears from my eyes as I write.

[Louis VI the Fat]

Memorial Day now firmly behind us, I've got some criticism.
It is my firm belief that America's best and brightest do not occupy our political institutions, our business community, or even academia. They are serving on the front lines in America's armed forces. I think you'll find that an overwhelming amount of America's brightest do not work in the frontlines. It is sentimental mythologisation.

Working in the armed forces has the unique aspect of carrying a great risk of dieing while in public service. Even more so than firefighers, or police officers, or discharging explosives (where 'your first mistake will be your last').

The army of a democracy fights on behalf of all, so those that die, or suffer otherwise, in performing their task hence deserve respect.



But I dislike too much respect for the army itself. The army is not the pinnacle of society, not the highest vocation. An army is a killing machine, it is dirty, nasty business in no need of sentimentalism and mystification.

The armed forces attract a wide range of people. Ranging from idealists who want to serve their society in a manner they deem honourable, to unemployed and undereducated bums who couldn't find any other job, to complete psychopaths living their dream of running around in an authoritarian uniform, legitimised in intimidating and commanding around other people, looking for an opportunity to fulfill their fantasy of a violent orgy.
Most volunteers do not join the armed forces out of a unique altruistic willingness to sacrifice. They join because the uniform, the job, the army culture attracts them.

So no, I do not think the armed forces attract the best and brightest (not the worst and least bright either).

Nor are the armed forces deserving of too much respect or a of a unique position in society.
This carries a great risk of a militarisation of society, of political considerations being swayed too much towards military solutions. Nobody likes a North Korea.

Nurses devote themselves to helping others, for their entire lives, to little financial compensation. Some teachers work in miserable circumstances, many of them managing to remain positive, to keep their faith in helping others to become what they can be.
These are heroes.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

... Nor are the armed forces deserving of too much respect or a of a unique position in society.
This carries a great risk of a militarisation of society, of political considerations being swayed too much towards military solutions. Nobody likes a North Korea.

Nurses devote themselves to helping others, for their entire lives, to little financial compensation. Some teachers work in miserable circumstances, many of them managing to remain positive, to keep their faith in helping others to become what they can be.
These are heroes.

While it doesn't materially affect your point, nurses in the USA are compensated pretty well (partly because of scarcity).

I think the difference for me with the military is them going in knowing the level of risk involved. The added chance of me getting killed while selling insurance to people in their homes is so close to the baseline norm that I don't think you could chart it. On the other hand, training accidents etc. mean that ANYBODY going into military service stands a much greater risk of grievous harm and/or death than your average citizen. I do believe therefore that this form of public service warrants a notch more respect than does my county building inspector.

You are correct to the extent that respecting/honoring your military should not segway into a cult of militarism -- that begets evil.

Military service is an honorable calling, and that service is worthy of respect.

[al Roumi]

Thanks MRD, that really was an interesting post. As Kukri says I hope you stay safe and can continue to be good.

[Louis VI the Fat]

I think the difference for me with the military is them going in knowing the level of risk involved. The added chance of me getting killed while selling insurance to people in their homes is so close to the baseline norm that I don't think you could chart it. On the other hand, training accidents etc. mean that ANYBODY going into military service stands a much greater risk of grievous harm and/or death than your average citizen. I do believe therefore that this form of public service warrants a notch more respect than does my county building inspector.Is respect for public service tied to the level of danger? Should casualty statistics determine the amount of social respect for a civil servant?

And does K the mailman deserve less respect than K the Indomitable Village Slayer?

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Is respect for public service tied to the level of danger? Should casualty statistics determine the amount of social respect for a civil servant?

And does K the mailman deserve less respect than K the Indomitable Village Slayer?

K the mailman has powerful alien friends and saves galaxies....not at all a fair comparison!


Actually, it is my belief that all persons should be accorded respect unless or until they prove themselves unworthy of it. Even then, your self respect and a decent respect for the opinions of others should require you to treat them with social politeness on the rare occasions when you are forced to interact with them.

So my baseline is not: "military folks are worthy of respect whereas other public servants don't really count." Do not attempt to box me in unfairly, cher Louis. It's an argumentation tactic unworthy of you.

In addition, "Village Slayer" is not a title of respect for us New Worlders. We really are a tad more culturally evolved than the typical Germano-Celt barbarian, despite what some of our Old World pals think. :laugh4:

[KukriKhan]

I take Louis' point about honoring but not glorifying the military. What so struck me about PanzerJaeger's OP was this bit:


Not only do we ask them to destroy our enemies; we also ask them to live among them and rebuild their communities. We ask them to be peace keepers and good will ambassadors. We ask them to take fire before responding.

which I thought accomplished that balancing act ('honor, not glorify') rather well. It showed a more full understanding of what we want our military guys to do: overcome our natural dis-inclination to:

-kill other humans
-kill other humans ON COMMAND, and STOP on command
-make peace with former enemies
-actually try to win 'hearts and minds'
-be righteous in our war-making

those are almost impossible tasks to perform, yet we demand they be performed.

And then, when our most useful military skills wane as individuals (around age 35) we demand our soldiers stop being military and start/resume being productive citizens - another almost impossible task, that nevertheless gets performed every day.

So, without being too smarmy, I see both PJ and LtF as being correct, at least as concerns this country I live in: it's right and good to honor the sacrifice of the fallen; it's right and good to respect our war-fighters; it's right and good to demand of our war-fighters the highest standards of conduct and adherence to our core values; and it's right and good that not every citizen be a war-fighter, and that war-fighters eventually return to the position of Citizen.

-signed, K, the mailman

[Gregoshi]

-signed, K, the mailman
Who delivers yet another wonderfully thoughtful post. :bow:

[Kadagar_AV]

[QUOTE=PanzerJaeger;2497564]To those members who are serving or have served in America's military (MRD, Gelatinous Cube , Kukri, etc)....

THANK YOU for your service!

It is my firm belief that America's best and brightest do not occupy our political institutions, our business community, or even academia. They are serving on the front lines in America's armed forces. Not only do we ask them to destroy our enemies; we also ask them to live among them and rebuild their communities. We ask them to be peace keepers and good will ambassadors. We ask them to take fire before responding. Never before have we asked so much of our soldiers, and under the strictest rules of engagement ever imposed on them.

The vast majority of the nation loves you guys and our hearts are with you.




As to your first point, I fully agree.

As to your second point, source please?

[PanzerJaeger]

Memorial Day now firmly behind us, I've got some criticism.I think you'll find that an overwhelming amount of America's brightest do not work in the frontlines. It is sentimental mythologisation.

I very much appreciate that you held off until after the holiday, sir. :bow:

Before I address your points, allow me to restate two important caveats to my statement. I was refering very specifically to America's military forces in contemporary times. Many of your comments would indeed apply to most of today's modern militaries and even the American military of the past.

Now then, "brightest" is of course subjective. To quote Lemur, there are many measures of intelligence. Today's volunteer(selective) American military, and the ideology of pushing responsibility down the chain that it has adopted, requires a level of intelligence far greater than has even been required before. In fact, the average IQ of each branch is significantly higher than the average for the population as a whole.

Certainly engineering a successful counterinsurgency doctrine in the middle of a war that does not involve killing everyone and razing the country took some intelligence from military leadership. And further down the line, your average fighter pilot, intelligence analyst, or nuclear engineer on an aircraft carrier are in fact some of America's most measurably intelligent individuals. And while the "grunts" on the frontline may not be on that level intellectually, they are no slouches either, especially the officers and NCOs. The days of "shut up and follow orders" are long gone. America's soldiers have degrees of operational freedom that would have been unheard of even 50 years ago.

Further, the situational awareness one must possess to lead combat operations under ridiculously strict ROEs, conduct localized diplomacy with tribal elders from cultures completely different than your own, rebuild communities, resolve local disputes, maintain moral, and the million other big and small things today's frontline soldiers are asked to do, all with the ever-present specter of IEDs, suicide bombers, and enemies intermixed with the civilian population, and to do it for 8 years straight, is simply immense.

I am quite confident in my assertion that many of America's soldiers are some of the brightest minds in America - both intellectually and situationally.



But I dislike too much respect for the army itself. The army is not the pinnacle of society, not the highest vocation. An army is a killing machine, it is dirty, nasty business in no need of sentimentalism and mystification.


If only. Things would be so much easier if the military was simply a killing machine, if our boys and girls could destroy everything and everyone and put the pieces back together in whatever way they liked. However, in America's military, killing has been subordinated to peacekeeping, diplomacy, rebuilding, and fostering good will. Fully fledged battles such as Falluja and Marja are the exception; not the rule, and even then ROEs are highly restrictive.

America's modern army does deserve respect, not for its lethality, but for its restraint - and the many role's its soldiers must take on other than simple state sanctioned killing.


Nor are the armed forces deserving of too much respect or a of a unique position in society.
This carries a great risk of a militarisation of society, of political considerations being swayed too much towards military solutions. Nobody likes a North Korea.


I think you must separate the celebration of the military as an institution from honoring the individual soldiers that serve within it. In a mature democracy, I believe most are capable of the latter without society devolving into a North Korean type of situation.




As to your first point, I fully agree.

As to your second point, source please?

Could you specify which point you mean?

[Vladimir]

Once you get past the bleeding heart intro, it's actually an interesting interactive map.

http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/war.casualties/index.html