Government Shutdown

[TinCow]

Perhaps this is bigger news for me, since I live in DC and work for the Federal Government, but I'm still surprised there isn't a thread on this.

If you aren't aware, the current budget showdown in Congress is reaching a crisis point. The current budget runs out on March 4th, which is next Friday. If Congress does not agreed on a new budget, or at least a continuing resolution, in the next eight days, the Federal government will undergo a generalized shutdown. Here are a few (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/federal-eye/2011/02/what_might_a_government_shutdo_1.html) articles (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/federal-eye/2011/02/government_shutdown_facts_and.html) that (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/debonis/2011/02/how_will_a_federal_government.html) discuss (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/federal-eye/2011/02/government_shutdown_what_about.html) the impact of the shutdown.

In short, many government offices and services cease to function and no Federal employee gets paid. While I am, fortunately, not one of them, many Federal workers live paycheck-to-paycheck, just like the rest of the country. These people will suddenly have serious credit problems, and there's no guarantee they'll ever get the money back, though that does seem unlikely. Federal contractors will not get their money back, period. In addition, many businesses which depend on the Federal government, or Federal employees, will take a financial hit. The DC transit system will lose a massive amount of money, as well as numerous restaurants and retail businesses in the DC area and around every major Federal center in the country. Plus, every business that regularly supplies goods or materials to any Federal agency.

So, is Congress doing the right thing by risking this kind of situation in order to uphold their beliefs about the budget, or is compromise necessary to avoid it?

[Strike For The South]

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?133292-I-love-The-Smell-Of-A-Government-Shutdown-in-The-Morning

I guess I am a man ahead of my times

As per the shutdown:

I was lol when this happens, as if there is some unreconcialable difference that quite simply can't be met

You're there to compromise and workout differences, do that please

[TinCow]

Ah, sorry, didn't see the thread. A merge would probably be good here.

[Strike For The South]

Ah, sorry, didn't see the thread. A merge would probably be good here.

Meh, I'm just rambiling and there nothing ground breaking in the other posts

I'm sure you are more in tune with the Feds than I am but here is how I see it

In a republic we elect reps
They go to the captial
They squabble
still squabbiling
still squabilling
....
They compromise and get something done

How is shutting down the gummint conduceive to this at all? I know both sides are claiming the inherent rightness of there cause but don't piss on my boots and tell me its raining. Some action is better than no action

AND CONGRESS STILL GETS PAID

[drone]

In short, many government offices and services cease to function and no Federal employee gets paid. While I am, fortunately, not one of them, many Federal workers live paycheck-to-paycheck, just like the rest of the country. These people will suddenly have serious credit problems, and there's no guarantee they'll ever get the money back, though that does seem unlikely. Federal contractors will not get their money back, period. In addition, many businesses which depend on the Federal government, or Federal employees, will take a financial hit. The DC transit system will lose a massive amount of money, as well as numerous restaurants and retail businesses in the DC area and around every major Federal center in the country. Plus, every business that regularly supplies goods or materials to any Federal agency.
But on the plus side, the traffic improves dramatically!

If I remember correctly from the 1995 shutdown, the federal workers will get their back pay, contractors are out of luck. It won't last very long, but it is a suckier time now financially. It would be interesting to see if they can keep the government shut down past April 15th. ~;)

Truth be told though, more people are worried about the NFL negotiations. March 3rd is the deadline, a lockout is definitely looming.

[TinCow]

If I remember correctly from the 1995 shutdown, the federal workers will get their back pay, contractors are out of luck.

Technically, getting the back pay isn't mandatory, but Congress always does it. I suspect they don't want to deal with the consequences that would result from taking away a few paychecks from the 1,350,000 people who make sure the government works.

[ICantSpellDawg]

If you're staring at a house teetering on the verge of collapse, sometimes it would just be better for it just collapse already so that we can re-build. Nobody is serious about avoidign it, so just let it happen already.

[Lord Winter]

That would maybe have some merit if either side was actually talking about cutting something that would actually matter. Descritionary spending is only around 12% of the federal budget.

[a completely inoffensive name]

I love how when it comes to politics, the lives of actual people always continue to be ignored by the public except when they want to make hyperbole in support of their party/ideology.

[drone]

That would maybe have some merit if either side was actually talking about cutting something that would actually matter. Descritionary spending is only around 12% of the federal budget.
Indeed. This is like arguing what the band will play while we rearrange the deck chairs.

[Samurai Waki]

I've heard some jargon from Customs Agents talking about the shutdown, I may not actually be involved with the business aspects of the Port of Portland; but I know a few higher ups have been sweating bullets from the prospect of a shutdown. No Customs Agents means no cargo is going to get unloaded = bad for everybody.

[Don Corleone]

A government shutdown will be disastrous for Republicans.

There is a fundamental philosophical debate going on regarding the role of government in a well functioning economy, and how best for a Western Democracy of quasi-capitalism-socialism to strike the balance of conusmer/industry/govenrment spending.

Republicans have been making the argument that taxation hurts growth. Defecits hurt growth. Therefore, let's cut back on the defecit & government spending (amazing how they rediscovered this hallowed truth on Nov 5th, 2008).

Democrats are making the argument that the private sectors aren't contributing in ways that will rebound the economy, nor would they with more disposable income. The consumer sector is overspent and scared, the industry sector is waiting for the success to come, so they can then invest and bet on the winners.

I think both sides have a point here. Nobody is naive enough to believe that Democrats or Republicans act on idealism... they chose philosophies as weapons to win power for themselves. But that doesn't change the merit of the philosophies themselves. We should care about and debate their relative merits. WITHIN REASON.

If they puruse a government shutdown, all sorts of short term misery will be handed out. The Democrats and the media will only be too happy to lay this at the feet of the Republicans. They stand no hope of messaging anything... I'm sympathetic to many of their arguments, and I would see this as the triumph of "screw-all-of-you, we're right" idealism over pragmatism.

Personally, I think Pelosi and Reid are praying to whatever gods they hold dear that the Republicans will be this short-sighted. I'm surprised Obama can contain his excitement at the prospect, as a shutdown at this point, given the hardships the average American faces, virtually guarantees a 2nd term for him.

[Louis VI the Fat]

Personally, I think Pelosi and Reid are praying to whatever gods they hold dear that the Republicans will be this short-sighted. I'm surprised Obama can contain his excitement at the prospect, as a shutdown at this point, given the hardships the average American faces, virtually guarantees a 2nd term for him.Me, I'm not so optimistic. For two years now the GOP has had a policy of 'obstruct the functioning of government, regardless of any negative consequences for America'. Irresponsible and well outside US political tradtion. The Republicans were well rewarded for it last November.

It creates the (carefully directed) impression of Obama as incapable of delivering on his promises. It is easy to spin within the strategic narrative of the GOP trying to limit Obama's big spending, big government.

[Beskar]

Would the cuts affect the emergency services such as Police, Firebridages, Hospital, etc? In a way that anarchy would ensue?

[Crazed Rabbit]

No, I don't believe so. Those aren't federally funded.

CR

[Tellos Athenaios]

My thoughts too: municipalities will continue to function as normal. It's just all those inter-state bits which take a hit, like FBI/FDA/DEA and so on.