What history book are you reading or planning to read?/ The history bookreview thread

[Moros]

A bit of topic perhaps, but still interesting as it might give people some ideas on what to read next and to compare each other opinions on certain books. Though we shouldn't go to far with the latter not to derail the thread too much of course. Of course the EBI forums still have the bibliography threads which has many good suggestions and where you can still give your recommendations. But it's a bit dead and doesn't have exact the same use. Also the EB II forum could always use more off topic thread that actually content-wise have something to offer, at least I think.

Personally I'm working on a paper on the revolution of Judah Maccabee and hence I've been looking up a lot in quite a few books. But the only one I'm really actually reading of those is Jews, Idumaeans, and Ancient Arabs by Aryeh Kasher, as it touches more of my pet subject; the Ancient Arabians. Though I'm not done with it yet it looks like a good book, though I do feel like the author likes to see the positive things in the Hasmoneans a bit too much. Still it has good information on a topic which he is right to call a bit neglected.

This Summer I'm thinking of reading:
The last pharaohs : Egypt under the Ptolemies, 305 - 30 B by Joseph Gilbert Manning, which has recieved some good reviews.
I also noticed another book in the new addition shelf of our Library about Pyrrhus: Pyrrhus of Epirus, by Jeff Champion. Though I'm not sure if it is any good.

[Arjos]

Reading "Celts: History and Civilization" by Venceslas Kruta and very slowly reading "The Persian Empire" by Amélie Kuhrt...

[fomalhaut]

please let me know your impressions on the Pyrrhus book, he is a very fascinating character to me. I just have Plutarch's story of him

[Moros]

please let me know your impressions on the Pyrrhus book, he is a very fascinating character to me. I just have Plutarch's story of him
If I get to reading it, I will post my opinion and stuff.

[Ichon]

I just got into "The Victors and the Vanquished: Christians and Muslims of Catalonia and Aragon, 1050-1300" Cambridge University Press, 2004 and so far its interesting. Not really the EB time period but still... if anyone has some recommendations of books on Iberia or Roman Hispania I'd be interested.

[Moros]

I just got into "The Victors and the Vanquished: Christians and Muslims of Catalonia and Aragon, 1050-1300" Cambridge University Press, 2004 and so far its interesting. Not really the EB time period but still... if anyone has some recommendations of books on Iberia or Roman Hispania I'd be interested.

As far as I'm concerned books posted here shouldn't need to be from the time period. I'd wish I could anwser your question, but alas I've never really read books specifically on Roman Iberia or other Iberian history.

The EB bibliography recommends the following three books though:
The Romans in Spain, 217 BC – AD 117, C.H.V. Sutherland
Roman Spain: Conquest and Assimilation, Leonard A. Curchin
Hispaniae: Spain and the Development of Roman Imperialism, 218-82 BC, J. S. Richardson

[fomalhaut]

If I get to reading it, I will post my opinion and stuff.

reading a pretty nice review on amazon seems to put it in high regard, apparently the author constantly notes the limitations of each sources and doesn't put Pyrrhus on any pedestal (of note is that the other review saw the not constant praise of the eagle as a bad thing :P )

[Moros]

reading a pretty nice review on amazon seems to put it in high regard, apparently the author constantly notes the limitations of each sources and doesn't put Pyrrhus on any pedestal (of note is that the other review saw the not constant praise of the eagle as a bad thing :P )

Hmmm that's indeed always a positive thing.

[Arjos]

Oh any time period?
Then I just finished The Vikings by Else Roesdahl, quite a nice read...

[Publio Cornelio Escipión Africano Mayor]

A critical history of early Rome; Gary Forsythe

[moonburn]

if historical romances count ... (well do they ? )

last one i read pertaining these subjects was mythology in the ancient world can´t remember the author but basically deals with the diferent pantheons of gods from ancient cultures around the world

[geala]

I usually read some books in parallel. I'm just reading "A war like no other" by V.D. Hanson, "Reinstating the Hoplite" by A. Schwartz and "Weapons and Warfare in Renaissance Europe" by B.S. Hall (a very good book with a very misleading title). And some German books (presumably of less interest for the most :smug2: ), one about the house and family in ancient Greece and one with new studies about early and high medieval fortifications.

[M to the A]

- The Celts, the history of a European people - John Haywood
Some basic history

- The Celts, history and culture treasures of an ancient civilization - Daniele Vitali
Nice pictures :P

- The making of the Slavs, history and archaeology of the lower Danube region c. 500-700 - Florin Curta
Not sure what to think of that one. It says that the book offers an alternative approach to the problem of Slavic ethnicity in south-eastern Europe between c. 500 and c. 700, from the perspective of current anthropological theories. Didn't start reading it yet so guess I'll see

[Biowulf]

A few months ago I read The Celtic Empire, The First Millenium of Celtic History 1000BC - 51 AD by Peter B. Ellis, and from there I began reading Henri Hubert's books on the Celts but I didn't have the time to finish them (they were from the library). Those were very good and I wish I had more time with them because I love reading about the Celts.
I also began China Through the Ages: History of a Civilization by Franz Michael. It's a good overview and beginning point of one wanted to study China. A pity I have to return it, too.

[jackie_fish]

You should read these books they are really good.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=scarrow+simon+eagle+series&tag=googhydr-21&index=stripbooks&hvadid=10509086034&ref=pd_sl_5zufi2wbbh_b

[Skullheadhq]

Historiae - Tacitus

[TheLastDays]

Bengt Hägglund - History of Theology (Basically a book on church history, concentrating on the development of different doctrinal views)
Good book if one is interested in that kinda stuff

If anyone could recommend a book about Pre-Alexander Middle East (Assyria, Babylon...), I'd be grateful

[Constantius III]

I finally found a copy of Nick Sekunda's Hellenistic Infantry Reform in the 160s BC via a university library consortium.

For coursework, I'm slogging through David Rollason's Northumbria 500-1100: Creation and Destruction of a Kingdom. It's pretty good, though I wish there were more in the bibliography on the site at Yeavering.

[athanaric]

And some German books (presumably of less interest for the most :smug2: ), one about the house and family in ancient Greece and one with new studies about early and high medieval fortifications.
Do post them. Some of us are actually fluent in German.



If anyone could recommend a book about Pre-Alexander Middle East (Assyria, Babylon...), I'd be grateful

Try A History of the Ancient Near East (http://www.amazon.com/History-Ancient-Near-East-3000/dp/1405149116/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1303460699&sr=1-1) by Mark van de Mieroop. It's a good introduction and has been recommended to me and my fellow students by another expert on the field.

[TheLastDays]

Thanks, I'm going to see if I find it at the library... I can't really afford to buy expensive books at the moment ;)

[Moros]

Try A History of the Ancient Near East (http://www.amazon.com/History-Ancient-Near-East-3000/dp/1405149116/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1303460699&sr=1-1) by Mark van de Mieroop. It's a good introduction and has been recommended to me and my fellow students by another expert on the field.
Yes indeed I've heard good things about that book as well. It was also in the recommended bibliography list from my classes on ancient Mesopotamia. Though that may also be the case because the guy is Belgian and got his bachelor over here. Chauvinism, chauvinism everything is chauvinism.

Edit: books in other languages, especially the well spread ones can always be suggested as well. Translations of them often exist as well and a good historian should be able - or willing to learn - to read more than one language anyway.

[TheLastDays]

Very true... if you wanna study a subject, like for example theology, you'll find a lot of books in German for example... I'm of course lucky with that but you know what I mean...

[Moros]

Very true... if you wanna study a subject, like for example theology, you'll find a lot of books in German for example... I'm of course lucky with that but you know what I mean...
German might very well be the second language in numbers of writings when it comes to archaeology and history of a lot of places. Though of course it does depend on the region, literature on the ancient Iberians for example is mostly Spanish and Portuguese I think. English might be the most well spread language and all, but having at least two other big languages really helps a man's research possibilities (German, French, Italian,...).

[gamegeek2]

The Rise of the West by William McNeill. Old, interesting to see 50+ year old perspectives on world history.

[DeathFinger]

I'm reading a lot of articles those last times, but the last book I read was :Baratin, C, Les provinces orientales de l'empire parthe, Lyon 2009, a thesis in French on the Eastern borders of the Parthian Empire.

And the last book in English (^^) was Karttunen, K, Indian in the Hellenistic World, Helsinki 1997. A very good one if you're interesting in this area not only for the political facts.

[TheLastDays]

I have now started to slowly read "A History of the Japanese People From the Earliest Times to the End of the Meiji Era" - Frank Brinkley and Dairoku Kikuchi

I'll post my opinions on it when I'm done, which might take a while because it's more of a "reading side project".

[athanaric]

I'm currently reading Les Sarmates. Amazons et lanciers cuirassés entre Oural et Danube by Iaroslav Lebedynsky. Progressing slowly because I technically don't speak French (Latin and English helps a lot though). Any opinions on that book?

[geala]

Do post them. Some of us are actually fluent in German.

....

Ok, your risk. :laugh4:

- Haus und Familie im antiken Griechenland, Winfried Schmitz, 2007: a short introduction into the structures of the family, education, inheritance law in Athens, Sparta and the Hellenistic times, lots of information about continuative literature.


I will start to read tomorrow:

- War in the Hellenistic World, Angelos Chaniotis, 2005 (I started the book a year ago but for some reasons stopped after a third)

- Krieg, Handel und Piraterie: Untersuchungen zur Geschichte des hellenistischen Rhodos, Hans-Ulrich Wiemer, 2002


BTW, this thread was already very helpful for me, just ordered the book about Pyrrhus. :2thumbsup:

[Nirvanish]

Today I just started The Poison King: The Life and Legend of Mithradates, so far it seems pretty good.

[fomalhaut]

I'm currently reading Les Sarmates. Amazons et lanciers cuirassés entre Oural et Danube by Iaroslav Lebedynsky. Progressing slowly because I technically don't speak French (Latin and English helps a lot though). Any opinions on that book?

i am having a hard time believing that Latin and English are allowing you to read a french history book, how are you doing this?

[Cyclops]

Keep going back to Robin Lane Fox, the guy is a tweedy provacateur. Love it.


...my pet subject; the Ancient Arabians. ...

Have you read this one? Probably you know it, but as an outsider I found it a fascinating ramble on a thorny subject.

The Arabs in Antiquity: Their History from the Assyrians to the Umayyads Jan Retso

He gets all interesting and speculative just at the end bit (and he parenthesises it, saying hes dropping the scholarly paradigm for some fun) talking about Hud and arab druid/bard equivalents. Not saying Arabs had druids, just my take on the sort of notions he was prepared to have a flaky stab at in an afterword kinda way.

[athanaric]

i am having a hard time believing that Latin and English are allowing you to read a french history book, how are you doing this?
French is based on Latin, and advanced English contains an awful amount of French loanwords. Add some very basic knowledge of French and it will work.

[Mr. Stuka]

If any of you are into fiction, there's a nice, short read on Varus and the Germans by Harry Turtledove. It's called Give me Back My Legions!

[fomalhaut]

French is based on Latin, and advanced English contains an awful amount of French loanwords. Add some very basic knowledge of French and it will work.

yes surely i know this, but this bolded was the crux i was looking for. sorry to go OT just was wondering.

[Klemens]

Vienna 1814 How the Conquerors of Napoleon Made Love, War, and Peace at the Congress of Vienna

http://ebooks-imgs.connect.com/ebooks/product/400/000/000/000/000/081/263/400000000000000081263_s4.jpg

It's a great book and reads like a novel instead of a textbook, I'd definitely recommend it to anyone interested in the Napoleonic era.

[oudysseos]

Just started Alexander the Great by Krystof Nawotka. So far so good. Not as slanted as Green.

[DionCaesar]

I recommend the books of Adrian Goldsworthy. I've read three of his books so far, and I fully enjoyed every single one of them. His language is easy to understand, yet he mentions everything worth telling. He's also rather objective, and uses many different sources.

If you're interested in ancient Rome and want to learn more than some basic and already well known facts, I suggest reading these books:

Caesar
The Fall of the West
The Fall of Carthage

Especially the book about Caesar greatly amused me, but the Fall of Carthage contains a lot of information that I believe is rather unknown.

[fomalhaut]

I have Fall of the Roman Empire and The Punic Wars by him. I love his writing style, you can just turn page after page yet still not miss anything of significance.

[Constantius III]

Eh. Goldsworthy's all right but his books seem a little...superficial. His attempts at wading into late antique scholarship haven't exactly gone well, either.

[fomalhaut]

he does his stated purpose with great skill; distilling all the complexities of ancient history and some of its ambiguities to a wide, mainstream audience. He states that specifically in the intro for the Punic Wars, saying that because classical antiquity is no longer a part of our socialization process in schooling that other venues must be sought to bring important history (not myth) to a wide audience. though he also says its sort of a lost cause but that's not the point

it is very useful resource to me who is not on a the sub level or actual historian (hobby or profession) level like many here.

[oudysseos]

I'm not Goldsworthy's biggest fan. I know it's terribly snobby of me, but he seems willing to churn out any ole crap for a buck.

[Constantius III]

The comparison of the creation of the Notitia Dignitatum to Hitler maneuvering imaginary divisions on the map in the Führerbunker in 1945 was what got me. I mean, I know the guy's a bit of an enthusiast for the Republic and the early Empire, but really?

[strategos roma]

I've read Goldworthy's books and they're fine but lacking in detail. It just seems sort of shallow so I'll recommend it for amatuers and beginners but probably not for more advanced readers. I'm currently reading R. Malcolm Errington's 'A History of the Hellenistic World', John Julius Norwich's 'Byzantium' and Bryan Ward Perkins' "The Fall of Rome and the End of Civilisation'. All three seem fine but for style Norwich's is definitely the best.

[fomalhaut]

I've read Goldworthy's books and they're fine but lacking in detail. It just seems sort of shallow so I'll recommend it for amatuers and beginners but probably not for more advanced readers. I'm currently reading R. Malcolm Errington's 'A History of the Hellenistic World', John Julius Norwich's 'Byzantium' and Bryan Ward Perkins' "The Fall of Rome and the End of Civilisation'. All three seem fine but for style Norwich's is definitely the best.

his intended audience

[jabarto]

Kiev Rus by B. Grekov is my current challenge. It's big, about 600 pages, but it looks to have an incredible amount of information not only on the Rus, but also the Slavic tribes that preceded them.

Also, I'm going to check out Schutz' Prehistory of Germanic Europe from the local university library tomorrow, along with some books on the Celts and Vikings. I'm probably spreading myself way too thin here, but there's so much to learn I can hardly help it. :beam:

[Constantius III]

I've read Goldworthy's books and they're fine but lacking in detail. It just seems sort of shallow so I'll recommend it for amatuers and beginners but probably not for more advanced readers. I'm currently reading R. Malcolm Errington's 'A History of the Hellenistic World', John Julius Norwich's 'Byzantium' and Bryan Ward Perkins' "The Fall of Rome and the End of Civilisation'. All three seem fine but for style Norwich's is definitely the best.
Interesting that you say that Goldsworthy's for "amateurs and beginners" and then state you're reading Norwich and Ward-Perkins. :snobby:

Treadgold, Haldon and Vasiliev would be the Byzantine texts for a properly hardcore hobby-historian.

[Cyclops]

Norwich is really just a blender, but he does make a nice history-flavoured smoothie. Ruderless his stories veer from gossip to battles to art, academically spineless but a nice treat.

I'm re-reading The Career and Legend of Vasco da Gama by Sanjay Subrahmanyam. He offers enough opinion and source criticism as well as narrative and I feel like a grown-up when he pulls back the curtain on juicy knots like the state of trade in the Indian ocean in the 15th century and the politics of monarchy, greater and lesser nobility and the knightly orders in reconquista Iberia.


.. Vasiliev ..the Byzantine ...historian.

Makes me think hard. Good for a flabby mind like mine.

[HFox]

If anyone could recommend a book about Pre-Alexander Middle East (Assyria, Babylon...), I'd be grateful

Persian Fire - a great read and contextualisation of the timeline.....not sure all the assumptions and interpretations are correct but pays great respect to heroditus in the content used.

Really enjoyed reading it and found informative especially in terms of fitting all the persian/greek social/political/military developments together into an enegmatic timeframe.

[strategos roma]

I've read Treadgold and Vasiliev and I'd in fact highly recommend the former. I'm just re-reading Norwich for leisure.

Ward-Perkins is indeed a bit shallow but I like his more personal style when compared to older authors like Bury.


Interesting that you say that Goldsworthy's for "amateurs and beginners" and then state you're reading Norwich and Ward-Perkins. :snobby:

Treadgold, Haldon and Vasiliev would be the Byzantine texts for a properly hardcore hobby-historian.

[geala]

Just have been a week in Scotland and read beneath (again) Kyrou Anabasis the book "Clan Donalds Greatest Defeat: The Battle of Harlaw 1411" by John Sadler. He's not a historian but it is a nice small book for train or plane, gives some insight in Scottish inner politics. Some infos about the weapons and the feeling of battle. Most is correct as far as I can judge, however, some strange statements are also included (e.g. mail is relatively light as armour ... häh??).

PS: Given the fact that it is not so clear who had won the battle at Harlaw the title of the book is a little bit weird.

[Lusitani]

Just finnished Philip De Souza (ed.), The Ancient World at War: A Global History, Thames & Hudson Ltd, 2008. Pp. 320. ISBN 978-0500251386. Great book which i highly recommend.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/World-At-War-Mark-Arnold-Forster/dp/0712667822

V.

[Heir_of_Alexander]

I wanna get Bezalel Bar Kochva`s The Seleucid Army: Tactics and Organization during the Great Campaigns.

What do you guys think about it?

[Moros]

Isn't that one completely avaible at google books? (could possibly be only just because I'm on my campus network)

Anything Bar-Kochva wrote is worth the read, imo. Might be a tad dated though.

[GenosseGeneral]

I just got into "The Victors and the Vanquished: Christians and Muslims of Catalonia and Aragon, 1050-1300" Cambridge University Press, 2004 and so far its interesting. Not really the EB time period but still... if anyone has some recommendations of books on Iberia or Roman Hispania I'd be interested.

Hispaniae: Spain and the Development of Roman Imperialism 318-82 B.C. has been posted before, and I can recommend it. Also worth a look is in my opinion Aspects of the Roman Experience in Iberia 206-100 B.C. by Robert Knapp.

[Julianus]

Just finished W.H. Prescott's The History of the Conquest of Mexico, now reading his next book on La Conquista, The History of the Conquest of Peru.
I really love reading those 18- and 19-century historians such as Prescott and Gibbon. They may be somewhat outdated, not so scientific or analytical by modern standards, but their storytelling, no matter on whatever subject, is always so dramatic and enjoyable, almost as much fun as reading Treasure Island.

[Heir_of_Alexander]

Isn't that one completely avaible at google books? (could possibly be only just because I'm on my campus network)

Anything Bar-Kochva wrote is worth the read, imo. Might be a tad dated though.

It is not fully available, only a bit

[Constantine the Great]

I'm working on Norwich's Byzantium at the moment. It's nice light reading for the summer

[Moros]

I guess I had full acces thanks to having internet provided by the university, which automatically gives acces to a whole lot of databases, full text articles and stuff.

[Kival]

I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask but nonetheless i'd like to know if anyone has a recommendation on a good book about Syracuse. It's political developing but also about the day to day life in about 400-200 b.c. As far as I know it was enourmesly influential and big (I've read about more than half a million inhabitants) and i'm very interested in it's history until it's domination by rome.

EDIT: English and german is ok, other languages will probably trouble me ;-).

[Moros]

I personally don't know about many books that cover that. I've seen a couple of more specific subjects (on the destruction of the Athenian fleet for example).
Perhaps this one might interest you though:
http://books.google.be/books?id=tBudcQAACAAJ&dq=Syracuse+in+Antiquity+:+history+and+topography&hl=en&ei=6HvdTaPlHIiDOtTT_ZMP&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCoQ6AEwAA

[Kival]

Thanks. I'll try to get my hands on this book, sadly it can not get it in my university library. Can you recommend any of this more specific books?

Also I'd be grateful for any further recommendation.

[Lvcretivs]

Thanks. I'll try to get my hands on this book, sadly it can not get it in my university library. Can you recommend any of this more specific books?

Also I'd be grateful for any further recommendation.

Have you tried searching the DAI Zenon catalogue (http://opac.dainst.org/F?RN=521098646)?

If you're looking for a more specific german publication maybe
'Syrakus unter Agathokles und Hieron II. : die Verbindung von Kultur und Macht in einer hellenistischen Metropole' Caroline Lehmler (Frankfurt am Main,Verlag Antike, 2005) (german review (http://www.h-net.org/reviews/showrev.php?id=20275)) could be of interest.

[Constantius III]

Wading through Tarn's The Greeks in Bactria and India for a bit of a refresher. Would like to know if there are any decent, modern (English or German) books out on Greek Baktria and/or the Indohellenic kingdoms other than Sidky, Tarn, Narain, and Holt. Would like to read Bophearachchi, but don't have enough of a command of French.

[Subotan]

Wading through Tarn's The Greeks in Bactria and India for a bit of a refresher. Would like to know if there are any decent, modern (English or German) books out on Greek Baktria and/or the Indohellenic kingdoms other than Sidky, Tarn, Narain, and Holt. Would like to read Bophearachchi, but don't have enough of a command of French.
The British Museum is currently hosting an exhibition of Bactrian artefacts that were rescued from the Taliban.

Currently reading Edmund Morris' three volume biography of Theodore Roosevelt - it's my fifth biography this year, and fourth of a US President, and I can't decide whether he was insanely brilliant or brilliantly insane.

[jirisys]

Anabasis (greek and english)
Comentarii de Bello Gallico (latin and english)

Just to jumpstart my ancient languages.

Then I will read Geographika (english, I doubt my greek will progress that much).

Though I will read em when I finish college, big time spender there.

~Jirisys ()

[Constantius III]

The British Museum is currently hosting an exhibition of Bactrian artefacts that were rescued from the Taliban.
I wish, I wish, I wish I were in London right now. :( Though I did see a lot of cool Yuezhi stuff at UPenn a few months ago as part of a Silk Road exhibition that included the Beauty of Xiaohe. Almost as awesome.

[fomalhaut]

The British Museum is currently hosting an exhibition of Bactrian artefacts that were rescued from the Taliban.

Currently reading Edmund Morris' three volume biography of Theodore Roosevelt - it's my fifth biography this year, and fourth of a US President, and I can't decide whether he was insanely brilliant or brilliantly insane.

teddy really is an either or in that regard.

and WOW at the British Museum exhibition, i freaking wish man. how long will the exhibition last? I'll be in Europe in a few months, i need to see these new Bactrian artifacts.

[bobbin]

It's a collection of many artefacts from all over Afghanistan, it's not just Baktrian (as in Greco-Baktrians) items, there is plenty of Saka, Yeuhzi/Kushan and other culture's stuff too. I hope to be able to see it before it closes (17 of July), although I might not have the time.

http://www.britishmuseum.org/whats_on/exhibitions/afghanistan.aspx

[WImPyTjeH]

Bambi, a Life in the Woods by Felix Salten

No, serious: Polis: An Introduction to the Ancient Greek City-State by Mogens Herman Hansen. Title says it all, but I've got to read this for my oral exam. A very interesting book about the fuction of a polis as both city and state.

[Subotan]

It's a collection of many artefacts from all over Afghanistan, it's not just Baktrian (as in Greco-Baktrians) items, there is plenty of Saka, Yeuhzi/Kushan and other culture's stuff too. I hope to be able to see it before it closes (17 of July), although I might not have the time.

http://www.britishmuseum.org/whats_o...ghanistan.aspx

I might just be able to get down to see it then, as I have to be in Kent for university business on the 15th! Also, there's a sweet comic book shop just around the corner, which automatically makes any trip to the Museum worthwhile, regardless of how many times I've seen the marbles.

Alternatively, there's an exhibition of artefacts from Makedon, (http://www.ashmolean.org/exhibitions/heracles/) as well as a load of permanent exhibitions on trade in the Ancient World (i.e. lots of Bactrian stuff) in the Ashmolean Museum in Oxford - it's like a little cute British Museum (And I get in for free! Mwahaha)

[Arjos]

Been reading the Pyrrhus' book (I'm at Asculum aftermath) and must say I'm enjoying it a lot...
I like the "anthropological" aspect to explain his decisions, and making the Epirot Eagle an even more fascinating figure, trully a one man faction :P

[Seyavash]

that exhibit is definitely worth seeing if you can get to London. I saw it here in NYC two years ago when it was at the Metropolitan Museum. Unfortunately it appears that the British Museum is the last stop
http://www.nationalgeographic.com/mission/afghanistan-treasures/where_to_see.html

I am currently reading The History of the Alans in the West by Bernard Bachrach
.

Anyone know if a good book on their eastern history?

Also finally found a copy of Studies in Christian Caucasian History by Cyrile Toumanoff. It's old but since it appears to be a source for a number of my other related books it should be worth a look.

[DeathFinger]

Wading through Tarn's The Greeks in Bactria and India for a bit of a refresher. Would like to know if there are any decent, modern (English or German) books out on Greek Baktria and/or the Indohellenic kingdoms other than Sidky, Tarn, Narain, and Holt. Would like to read Bophearachchi, but don't have enough of a command of French.

Well, the best books on the subject are today in French. If you can read Italian, there's Da Alessandro a Menandro. Il regno greco di Battriano from Omar Coloru (2009). If not, here (http://bmcr.brynmawr.edu/2010/2010-10-33.html)'s a link to the Bryn Mawr review of this book, better than nothing. One other good book is the India and the Hellenistic World of Klaus Karttunen (1997), less politic but more interesting on cultural contacts.

Without any surprises, google books has some nice ones too. Check for example Foreign Influences on Ancient India (http://books.google.com/books?id=0UA4rkm9MgkC&printsec=frontcover&dq=foreign+influences+on+ancient+inida&hl=fr&ei=KDrqTeS5K9HKsgbFoMHnCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCwQ6AEwAA) from Sagar. It's not just about Greeks in Central Asia, what's even better :p

Tarn is still a must-read, even if you cannot follow his chronology anymore.

[cezarip]

I was thinking to buy Timothy D. Barnes - Constantine and Eusebius. Anyone read it?

[Moros]

Been reading the Pyrrhus' book (I'm at Asculum aftermath) and must say I'm enjoying it a lot...
I like the "anthropological" aspect to explain his decisions, and making the Epirot Eagle an even more fascinating figure, trully a one man faction :P
Which one are you talking about?

[Kival]

And what do you mean by "anthropological" aspect? How can it explain decisions of a single person?

[Arjos]

I'm talking about Champion's book and by anthropological is how the author managed to describe Pyrrhus actions and behaviour thanks to his exiled experiences and his character...

For example his restlessness in peace (argued by his solely interest in war studies) to explain his incapability to "complete" his campaigns...
Also the way he deployed elephants was learned at Ipsus...

Book is short, but imo very valid...

And yeah I should have used "psychological" maybe, I meant anthropological in it's social aspect, sorry :P

[Kival]

I see, you mean psychological issues. That's at least interesting though I would not overrate the influence of a sole person.

[Arjos]

It's more about how events and people he met shaped the general he turned to be...

[Moros]

I'm talking about Champion's book and by anthropological is how the author managed to describe Pyrrhus actions and behaviour thanks to his exiled experiences and his character...

For example his restlessness in peace (argued by his solely interest in war studies) to explain his incapability to "complete" his campaigns...
Also the way he deployed elephants was learned at Ipsus...

Book is short, but imo very valid...

And yeah I should have used "psychological" maybe, I meant anthropological in it's social aspect, sorry :P

Ah good to know that it is indeed a good read. Can't wait for summer vacation.

[Brave Brave Sir Robin]

Currently reading The Poison King which is a nice easy summer read.

[Moros]

Currently reading The Poison King which is a nice easy summer read.
On Mithridates VI Eupator, right? I think I've read that book or at least parts of it in the past when working on a minor paper on the man.

[Skullheadhq]

I was looking for some books on early Byzantine history, particulary Justinian the Great. Anyone has some hints?

[Brennus]

Just finished Stephan Fichtl's "Le Ville Celtique", very informative. Started Ian Ralston's "Celtic Foritifications" a day or two ago. Spent half of the year reading through Barry Cunliffe's Magnum Opus "Iron Age communities in Britain".

Can anyone recommend any good books about the Belgae aside from Stephan Fichtl's "Le Gaulois du Nord de Gaule"?

[ayekides]

Just finished reading Xenophon's Anabasis and all I have to say is holy :daisy:!!!! Why this has not been made into a movie I do not understand hahaha. Also finished The Annals by Tacitus and have been working on The Histories. (Most Emperors seem crazy, extremely paranoid, from his point of view.)

[bobbin]

It already has, well kind of.... (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MV4cgs-bPic)

[moonburn]

Just finished reading Xenophon's Anabasis and all I have to say is holy :daisy:!!!! Why this has not been made into a movie I do not understand hahaha. Also finished The Annals by Tacitus and have been working on The Histories. (Most Emperors seem crazy, extremely paranoid, from his point of view.)many modern movies are based on it like gangmembers trying to return to their turf trough enemy territory

sorry i hadn´t seen the youtube link but there are at least 10 others

[Skullheadhq]

many modern movies are based on it like gangmembers trying to return to their turf trough enemy territory

sorry i hadn´t seen the youtube link but there are at least 10 others

Oh come on, comparing gangs with a Greek mercenary army.

[fomalhaut]

don't be dense, the general idea remains. A group of warriors trapped in enemy territory after their connection to the region dies have to make it back home with lots of obstacles

THE WARRIORS is the best one though, easily. great film

[bobbin]

Oh come on, comparing gangs with a Greek mercenary army.

The Warriors is actually loosely based The Ten Thousand, very loosely though.

[geala]

I think I actually wouldn't like to watch a modern movie based on the Kyrou Anabasis. The real advantage and benefit of the book is that it gives a lot of informations about the peoples involved, the kind of fighting, customs and a lot of hints to human behaviour, sometimes not in favour of the Greek soldiers involved. I fear it's impossible to show the real value of the book in a commercial movie. There are no villains and no heroes (except perhaps Xenophon, but ok, it is his book...), so it may be difficult to understand by many. It would even be impossible to accept for many that Xenophon was not the leader of the soldiers, but only one of 10 strategoi and not the most important one. The story in itself is, I dare to say, rather boring, a group of people trying to march through a partly hostile country. Good opportunity to pack the movie with slow motion fighting szenes however... You see, I'm not very impressed by modern movies.
That said, of course I would watch the movie and buy a copy. :laugh4:

[fomalhaut]

would you recommend the book? does it read like a narrative?
i'm not necessarily interested in Herodotus writing style, I like the style of Arrian and Plutarch and Luke (of the gospels) if that helps.


Also I've found myself enamored with Persian culture lately and i thought i'd ask the experts here which is a good general book on the history of the Persian people, language, culture (pre and post Islam) but definitely on Cyrus the Great who interests me very much. I'd rather not get a poor book from a chain bookstore on the subject, but trust in you

[Basileus_ton_Basileon]

Rupert Matthews - Alexander at the Battle of the Granicus.

I quite like the detailing of how the individual units are armed and organised (virtually identical to EB specifications :D). I also find Matthews' speculation on how the Hetairos fought in combat somewhat convincing. Matthews essentially portrayed Alexandros (at the time of the Granikos campaign) as an untested noob (his enemies certainly saw him as such)... with results contrary to his foes expectations.

[moonburn]

would you recommend the book? does it read like a narrative?
i'm not necessarily interested in Herodotus writing style, I like the style of Arrian and Plutarch and Luke (of the gospels) if that helps.


Also I've found myself enamored with Persian culture lately and i thought i'd ask the experts here which is a good general book on the history of the Persian people, language, culture (pre and post Islam) but definitely on Cyrus the Great who interests me very much. I'd rather not get a poor book from a chain bookstore on the subject, but trust in youlast year i read the entire wiki article about persia/iran and it´s very interesting since it aproaches several cultures that antecipated the sassanids altough it doesn´t go to the merrow of the stuff (it took me almost 2 days but must admit xx century iranian history is what takes the longer)

[fomalhaut]

I have a pedestrian/wiki understanding of Persian history and culture, osmosis from Alexander and Herodotus and of course I know a bit more in depth the history of the modern Islamist State and its predecessors but I think me and you both would benefit from an EB quality recommendation! i'm going to look on the EB Bibliography right meow

[geala]

would you recommend the book? does it read like a narrative?
i'm not necessarily interested in Herodotus writing style, I like the style of Arrian and Plutarch and Luke (of the gospels) if that helps.
...


Do you mean Kyrou Anabasis by Xenophon? Absolutely, it's a very easy and enjoying read, like an adventure novel written by an experienced soldier.

[athanaric]

Also I've found myself enamored with Persian culture lately and i thought i'd ask the experts here which is a good general book on the history of the Persian people, language, culture (pre and post Islam) but definitely on Cyrus the Great who interests me very much. I'd rather not get a poor book from a chain bookstore on the subject, but trust in youTry From Cyrus to Alexander. A History of the Persian Empire by Pierre Briant. Also, there is more stuff of the same quality in the EB bibliography.

[fomalhaut]

ja ich bedeute das Buch geala! I was sad to see it not included in my Britannica book collection, but Thukydides is in here so that almost makes up for it.

and athanaric that's actually a book from the EB bibliography, believe it or not! so it must be good since it's been independently verified, sweet! Another EB fan got me into studying Persian and i'm loving it, so now i'm wanting to get a more than pedestrian understanding of the Achaemenid to Sassanids :-)

[DeathFinger]

Try From Cyrus to Alexander. A History of the Persian Empire by Pierre Briant.


Actually this is the reference on Achaemenids. And it's partially digitalized on Google Books if I remember well, but in fact, I couldn't advice you more than to read it from the beginning to the end (it 'll take you some times btw :yes:) . And if you can, burrow The Persian Empire: A Corpus of Sources of the Achaemenid Period from Amélie Kuhrt, which's a perfect compilation of sources on Achaemenids, and in this matter complets Pierre Briant's books.

[fomalhaut]

Just about to finish "Caesar's Legion", the history of the X Legio by Stephen Dando Collins. Pretty good, meant for a general audience as it's very readable but i think it serves rather than detracts from the history. i wouldn't expect a book about a specific legion to be anything but meant for casual lovers of history

The life and death of Centurion Crastinus was the most memorable part, "In death or life, Caesar, I will earn you gratitude!"
:(

[athanaric]

ja ich meine das Buch, geala! Fixed. "To mean" is a false friend when translating English to German and vice versa. The common equivalent would be "bedeuten" (= it means), but sometimes it's "meinen" (= I mean; also I guess).

[Loofa]

In general I tend to stay away from general histories that try to talk about everything in one volume. "Rome: a complete history" or something like that (Except for anything by Oxford University press, they are damn fine!). By nature they will be lacking details. But right now im reading The Poison King: The Life and Legend of Mithradates, Rome's Deadliest Enemy (not Hannibal or Arminius lol?) by Adrienne Mayor. I like it... Es geht

und die meistens Buecher sind auf English lol, es gibt keine Deutsche uebersetzt variant diesem Buch. und naja, wir benutzen "bedeuten" und "meine" nicht so viel. ausser.... "meine" ist in der regel mehr persoenlich. zum beispiel "nenene ich meine dass du das nicht machen kannst". hier in Sachsen sagen wir nur "mein" lol >_> . Saechsisch ist ganz chaotisch...

[fomalhaut]

Fixed. "To mean" is a false friend when translating English to German and vice versa. The common equivalent would be "bedeuten" (= it means), but sometimes it's "meinen" (= I mean; also I guess).

oh wow, i never would think that'd be a false friend. thanks!


Well Caesar's Legion wasn't really a general history book, it was solely about the X Legio from it's raise by Caesar in Cordoba to its near dissolution under Piso, its revival under Corbulo during the Armenian and Parthian campaigns. delves into why it was one of the only legions without an official title (like Gemini, Gallica, Augusta), pretty good.

How do Gibbon's Decline of Rome hold up? I just got a Brittanica 54 book collection which has his books in them. (for only $20 usd no less) ^_^

[Morte66]

I(Except for anything by Oxford University press, they are damn fine!)

Speaking of OUP, I'm readingClassical Olbia and the Scythian World: From the Sixth Century BC to the Second Century AD (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Classical-Olbia-Scythian-World-Proceedings/dp/0197264042). Well, I'm actually reading the PDFs (http://www.proc.britac.ac.uk/cgi-bin/somsid.cgi?page=volumes/pba142) on the British Acandemy website.

[geala]

I started some new (to me) books to read:

"Blood and Soil. A World History of Genocide and Extermination from Sparta to Darfur", by Ben Kiernan, 2007
A dampening view at mankinds niceness through the times. Good overview. I'm still not sure wether I can accept the authors main theory.

"Homosexuality and Civilization", by Louis Crompton, paperback ed. 2006
Another overview from the Old Testament to the 19th c. AD, with plenty sources for antiquity. Extremely thin-skinned Christians should perhaps not read but remain in a state of innocense.

"The Greek State at War" Part II (1974) and Part IV (1985), by W.K. Pritchett
The five books by Pritchett a imho more or less a must have because of the sources given.


BTW: can someone give me a recommendation for a good book about late medieval and early modern Japanese military history (lets say 1400 to 1650, so reaching a bit after the Sengoku period)? I know nearly nothing about it except common conceptions from popular sources. I bought "Handbook to Life in Medieval and Early Modern Japan" by William E. Deal, but I would like to concentrate more on the military side. I would prefer a book that deals not only with the pure dates and events but also examines the weapons, methods, theories and structures of war.

[Moros]

Currently reading and enjoying:
The Wars of Alexander's Successors 323BC-281BC (2 volumes), BENNETT & ROBERTS, Barnsley, 2008.

[geala]

Nice book, one of the not so many readable books in Engllish with a scientific approach to the Japanese period of the warring states (Sengoku): The Culture of Civil War in Kyoto by Mary Elisabeth Berry.

[I_damian]

At the moment I'm making my way through John Julian Norwich's trilogy about the Byzantine Empire. I'm on the final chapter of book one - The Early Centuries and about to start reading the second book - The Apogee. The third - The Decline and Fall, is on its way to me from Amazon.

Very interesting and fascinating books, focus mostly on the emperors and court intrigues and relations with foreign kings and the popes in Rome, as well as the impact of wars on the empire overall, actual battles only get a passing mention.

[Cadwalader]

"Homosexuality and Civilization", by Louis Crompton, paperback ed. 2006
Another overview from the Old Testament to the 19th c. AD, with plenty sources for antiquity. Extremely thin-skinned Christians should perhaps not read but remain in a state of innocense.

I just got started on this book. Very interesting so far. It never occured to me before that Achilles and Patroklos might have been lovers. Makes sense when you think about it, though.

[Titus Marcellus Scato]

Currently reading and enjoying:
The Wars of Alexander's Successors 323BC-281BC (2 volumes), BENNETT & ROBERTS, Barnsley, 2008.

Nice one! Let us know what it's like.

I've just bought "Great Battles of the Hellenistic World" - Joseph Pietrykowski, and I've got "Twilight of the Hellenistic World" by Mike Roberts and Bob Bennett on order. (Inspired by playing my EB Seleucid campaign.)

[Cyclops]

Just picked up Robin Lane Fox's Travelling Heroes. His other works so far (Classical World and Unauthorised Edition) have been pretty compelling so this gets a shot. Really should get Alexander though.

[Moros]

Nice one! Let us know what it's like.

Half way through vol. I (I only read it when travelling by train), I must say it's quite good. Doesn't talk about the battles itself, but does about strategy. It gives the general history of the warring diadochi and is a nice introduction to EB I and II's campaign. It tells exactly how the EB campaign came to be after big Al died. The books does a marvellous job at analyzing the main characters (Ptolemaios I soter, Cassander, Perdiccas, Eumenes, Antigonos, Pyrrhus,...) and illustrate well what kind of persons they were. But for those looking for in depth military analyses should pick up a different book.

[Ptolemaios]

I read the first vol. some time ago. I liked it very much, gave me some new insides of the diadochi.
It also lights up some characters like Lysimachos, who doesn´t get much attention (at least in the other books I read so far).
If you are interrested in Hellenism I would highly recommend it

[TiberiusClaudiusMarcellus]

Not in period but I am reading "The Poetic Edda" as compiled by Lee M. Hollander.

I play a Viking persona in a hobby of mine (www.belegarth.com) and it really gets me into the mood.

[Stark]

Has anyone read Gates of Fire by Steven Pressfield? The book is fantastic, but is it realistic? Did he show Spartan society as correctly as he could with available information?

[Antiokhos II Theos]

Has anyone read or do they know where to get an electronic copy of "From Samarkhand to Sardis: A New Approach to the Seleucid Empire" by Susan Sherwin-White, Amelie Kuhrt, its very expensive and I can only get limited extracts

[Arjos]

That's actually a book I'm looking for myself, I don't like to read it on a screen XD

Here's (http://books.google.com/books?id=IZ65PED6ykMC&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false) the eBook on google :)

[Antiokhos II Theos]

Thank you very much. How much is missing? I mean due to copyright

[Arjos]

It should be complete, I think the book went out of print...

[Antiokhos II Theos]

Even better, if only I could download it to an E reader! Thank you again...I think I saw it on amazon for £250- but it's always out of stock, but if its out of print that would explain it

[Ludens]

It should be complete, I think the book went out of print...

For the record: "out of print" does not equal "out of copyright". Just because the rights-holder chooses not to sell it, does not mean everyone else is free to profit from it. IIRC copyright expires 75 years after the death of the creator, regardless of whether the creator granted the rights to someone else. (I agree that's too long, but otherwise I am all in favour of copyright. It's only fair that the creator of a work gets to say what happens with it. Without copyright the rewards of any creative work, whether money or fame, would go to the biggest thief.)

[Arjos]

Yeah, sorry my legal knowledge goes as far as "respect one another XD"...
But seems it's indeed out of print (http://www.ucpress.edu/op.php?isbn=9780520081833), I think the UC press made it available online :)

[Antiokhos II Theos]

Indeed, I had no intention of reproducing huge chunks here! I was just asking, where I could find it- but also if its available to download to an E-reader?

Edit: Just bought three new books that I think people might enjoy..." The Cambridge History of Greek and Roman Warfare. Vol I :Greece, the Hellenistic World and the Rise of Rome" Philip Sabin et al.
And " Archaic and Classical Greece: A Selection of Ancient Sources in Translation" Michael Crawford, David Whithead. Cambridge
"The Hellenistic World from Alexander to the Roman Conquest: A Selection of Ancient Sources in Translation" Michael Crawford, David Whithead. Cambridge

EDIT2: Found it for sale, at least that is what it says http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/from-samarkhand-to-sardis-susan-sherwin-white/1000554233?ean=9780520081833&r=1&afsrc=1&

[Victor1234]

Has anyone read Gates of Fire by Steven Pressfield? The book is fantastic, but is it realistic? Did he show Spartan society as correctly as he could with available information?

I remember one thing that particularly stuck in my mind as inaccurate is that in one part, the wife of one of the characters is supposed to have entered a gymnasium, demonstrating her fiery spirit as he implies women were not allowed inside. I then recalled from EB that one of the character traits Hellenic characters could get was the supervisor of naked women at the gymnasium. :P

[Antiokhos II Theos]

Has anyone read this http://www.anabasis.org.uk/ http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/customer-media/product-gallery/190495992X/ref=cm_ciu_pdp_images_0?ie=UTF8&index=0

[Brave Brave Sir Robin]

Even better, if only I could download it to an E reader! Thank you again...I think I saw it on amazon for £250- but it's always out of stock, but if its out of print that would explain it

If you go to college or a university check your library. I found the book in mine and I'm going to take it out over Christmas break!

[Antiokhos II Theos]

If you go to college or a university check your library. I found the book in mine and I'm going to take it out over Christmas break!

That is a plan! I don't go that often, mostly work at home.

[Brennus]

Can anyone recommend any books which examine the Kushan Empire or China during the Iron Age?

[Shadowwalker]

I remembered someone recommending Richard Miles' "Carthage must be destroyed" a few months ago (infact I bookmarked the amazon link :laugh4: ) and ordered it when I finished "persian fire" (by Tom Holland; nice read about persia, the greeks and some rather famous war...).

Got it on thursday and have spent quite some hours with it by now.
Despite the fact that I have to read it in english I am glad that I did. Very nice read so far (am at about half of the book at the moment).

After finishing it I will reread "Vom Reich der Franken zum Land der Deutschen", a rather detailed study about the Merovingian/Karolingian dynasties.

(By the way: reading books about Carthage - still my favourite faction in EB - doesn't help at all when you try to stay patient about the EBII release... :laugh4: )

[Teres]

I would recommend Christian Cameron's series "Tyrant", Tyrant: Storm of Arrows" etc as being good historical novels (the second book is a bit far-fetched though) that are directly releveant to the mod. It's about an Athenian mercenary commander who moves to one of the Black Sea Colonies and fights Alexander (or his minions).

"Gates of Fire" has one clanger: at one point, he mentions washing with soap, which was invented by the Celts hundreds of years later and so the Greeks used olive oil + sand + a strigil instead.

I have quite a few books lined up to read, including the second Successors book and the first book in the two book series about the Tyrants of Syracuse.

Lastly, dare I mention "The Gods of Battle" as a book of interest to anyone who is interested in Ancient warfare, particularly cavalry, peltasts, and light troops?

[Brennus]

Just finished Tom Holland's "Rubicon" and "Millenium" about the end of the Roman Repbulic and European Dark Ages, respectively. Also read his "Persian Fire" about the invasion of Xerxes. I would thoroughly recommend all of them, great historical narratives. Even if your not escpecially interested in one of these time periods he has a writing style which thoroughly engrosses you.

[Shadowwalker]

Thanks for that suggestion, Brennus!
I absolutely agree about Holland's writing skill ("Persian Fire" is a very fine read indeed) and therefore have to look out for those other two books. :2thumbsup:
Just finished reading "Die Merowinger und das Frankenreich" ("The Merovingians and the Frankish Empire") and need new books again.
(Have to cover about 2 hours everyday driving to/from work by train so there is quite some time to read...)

[Ludens]

Holland is a very good story-teller, but as a historian... The more you know about the topic, the more you realize he's blasting past uncertainties and contradicting sources in order to tell an epic tale. His view of events also isn't quite as original as he makes it appear.

But "Rubicon" and "Persian Fire" do make for very good reading. I don't like "Millennium" very much. I think the story's too unfocused: it skips from reign to reign, so the characters don't come to life.

[Brennus]

Thanks for that suggestion, Brennus!

Glad to be of assistance Shadowwalker!


Holland is a very good story-teller, but as a historian... The more you know about the topic, the more you realize he's blasting past uncertainties and contradicting sources in order to tell an epic tale. His view of events also isn't quite as original as he makes it appear.

But "Rubicon" and "Persian Fire" do make for very good reading. I don't like "Millennium" very much. I think the story's too unfocused: it skips from reign to reign, so the characters don't come to life.

I agree Ludens, there are times when Holland leaps to conclusions which the evidence doesn't support. I wasn't impressed by his depiction of the Gauls in "Rubicon", he seemed to base his description of Gallic shields (Which he describes as being jewel encrusted) a bit too much on the British battersea shield, for the sake of argument it's neither a shield intended for battle nor contemporary with the Gallic wars. But on the whole his ability to bring charactes to life makes up for his occasional assumptions.

I did like "Millenium" alot although like you I think it suffered a bit from being unfocused, if you are unfamiliar, as I was with many of the Papal figures, it becomes difficult to remember who is who and how they relate to each other. I thought Holland's descriptions of the Norse and Anglo-Saxon characters was fantastic though, even if the story of Anglo-Nordic interaction seemed a bit tangential to the overall story of Christendom's evolution. I never knew Harald Hardrada was such an interesting character (in British schools he appears as little more than a supporting character to the drama played out between Harold Godwinson and William of Normandy).

[moonburn]

hardraada the kievan as quite an amazing story he went everywhere in europe and ended up king of the norgés and got many kingdoms to bow to him as vassals including the english wich had promissed him the kingship once their old king died

also the batle he lost he was clearly outnumbered and even then the english had to resort to cunning to take the bridge wich was defended by 1 single warrior wich was cutting them to pieces

had hardraada fighted against the normans i think he would have won i mean he knew the normans very well he participated in the conquest of sicily and his warriors aslong as rested and fully equiped where the best heavy infantry in europe

[geala]

I'm momentarily occupied with some Celtic affairs, for some reasons I had always deep sympathy for them:

"The Picts, A History" by Tim Clarkson, rev. ed. 2010: A short introduction to Pictish history. I'm not able to judge the quality of the book in deep, but for me the author has a scientific method and good argmuents, I like it.

"Irish Battles: A Military History of Ireland" by G.A. Hayes-McCoy, 1969: ranges from Clontarf 1014 to Arklow 1798, just started reading, seems to be a nice book which offers also some background informations.


and I'm reading a book which is not a typical history:

"A History of Violence" by Steven Pinker ( I read the German translation "Gewalt: eine neue Geschichte der Menschheit", 2011): quite interesting, because some common and also scientifical (mis)conceptions are dealed with. For the politically correct person some theses of the book might be problematic. I'm not through the book and I'm not sure wether I buy all the author wants to sell us, but it is worth reading. For me it is especially interesting cause I studied also criminology. One problem of the book is the reliability of the data used (data often from very old times), which come mostly from other scolars.
A few days ago I once read again some Islandic sagas and immediatly had to think of Pinker because the frequent murdering in the sagas without any srupulosity fits well to Pinkers data and assumptions.

[Cyclops]

Just finished Geoff Blainey's woolly History of Christianity, a really lame bit of halfbaked rubbish.

Also finished Robin Lane Fox's Travelling Heroes, a tiny bit wishy washy, more like a Robert Graves bit of imagination than history. Fox's orst book I'd say, still not bad, but not up to his usual high standard.

Going back to a Robert Graves novel I Claudius, pretty much counts as history;)

[EB rocks]

I am reading Men of Waterloo which i cant find :sweatdrop: Alexander The Great Failure by John D. Granger, and Ancient Rome a New History by David Potter.:book2:

[I_damian]

Well I finished the trilogy on Byzantium by J.J Norwich (I posted the book names on page 3 or 4) and can recommend all 3, all were wonderful. I'm on the final pages now of Rubicon and that is also brilliant and tonight or tomorrow will be starting Persian Fire.

[Daeres]

I'm currently researching for a thesis on Bactria, so I am reading a LOT of historical works at the moment.

Recently i've read From Sardis to Samarkhand, which is a great introduction into more modern studies of Hellenic culture post-Alexander and the Seleucid Empire. Since 1994 however, a lot of work has been done on the subject and so a few elements are outdated.

I've read 5 out of 10 volumes of Fouilles D'Ai Khanoum, which are the archaeological reports of the French team that excavated Ai Khanoum (i.e Alexandria-on-the-Oxus). It's very dry, but it is absolutely packed with information, analysis, drawings and photos, floor plans and maps.

At the moment I'm looking to get hold of the second half of the Ai Khanoum volumes. Unfortunately, there are very few books on Bactria that are approachable and offer and overview of the subject, let alone with the kind of prose that Tom Holland's books can offer. Hopefully that will change in the future.

[The Wizard]

I recently had the displeasure to read "The Rise and Fall of Ancient Egypt" by Toby Wilkinson, a popular history book which was much lauded in the general press. I read it because I knew little about Ancient Egyptian history in detail and had the (ultimately vain) hope that perhaps here was a popular history book that managed to marry engaging writing with cutting-edge historical analysis. The author, after all, is an Egyptologist and Fellow at Cambridge.

Sadly, I was mistaken. It is apparently impossible for any author in the popular history genre, even an academic one like Wilkinson, to write a good book that at the same time deals with historical issues academically. Wilkinson's offering was chock full of gross oversimplifications (the issue of Ancient Egyptian chronology, for example), hapless generalizations (decline and prosperity are presented in an archaic duality of oriental decadence and youthful vigor), glossed-over debates (Akhenaten's reign is a good example, as is most of the Old Kingdom's history, alongside the entire issue of the Hyksos, the Bronze Age Collapse, or the Third Intermediate Period), selective interpretations of primary source material (most pharaonic reigns, as well as wars, are only interpreted according to reliefs on royal tombs, i.e., by taking pharaonic propaganda at face value), and complete omissions (no mention whatsoever about the fascinating relationship between Egypt and the Jews, and its implication for the latter's ethnogenesis). Almost every page had something to criticize. I myself was educated in modern history, with no formal introduction to ancient history whatsoever, and even I was able to see all of this!

Not only was the book marred by this, but it was also deeply flawed by transparent attempts to make Ancient Egyptian history relevant to a modern layman reader, alongside clumsy, ham-fisted attempts at analyzing Egypt's long-term legacy (the author attempted to nuance his history with a cliched bit on the "dark side" of Egypt, i.e. the absolute nature of pharaonic power; Wilkinson's claim, meanwhile, that Egypt "invented the nation-state," is preposterous).

I was thus deeply disappointed by the book. I was left wondering how a prominent academic could write something this bad. Perhaps it's the fact that his expertise seems to lie in Egyptian architectural history, rather than political or social? Maybe. But whatever the reason, "The Rise and Fall of Ancient Egypt" does not manage to escape the typical pitfalls of popular history: to write something that appeals to the general public apparently means writing something that obscures major issues and thus relegates the dynamism of our past to narratives of reigns, monuments, and wars. Much like Tom Holland or John Julius Norwich, and many other popular historians, Wilkinson merely presents a reworked and retold version of traditional histories that are almost as old as the subject itself. The only thing that makes Wilkinson a trifle better than a Holland or a Norwich is that he is slightly less affected by the fetish the latter two seem to have for battles, wars, and "great deeds." Wilkinson, at least, leaves some space to write about the lives of ordinary Ancient Egyptians, even if he does spend half a chapter on a Hollywoodesque description of the invasion of the Sea Peoples. If this is what it takes to popularize history, then the result is that our past is obfuscated rather than illuminated.

[Moros]

I recently had the displeasure to read "The Rise and Fall of Ancient Egypt" by Toby Wilkinson, a popular history book which was much lauded in the general press. I read it because I knew little about Ancient Egyptian history in detail and had the (ultimately vain) hope that perhaps here was a popular history book that managed to marry engaging writing with cutting-edge historical analysis. The author, after all, is an Egyptologist and Fellow at Cambridge.

Sadly, I was mistaken. It is apparently impossible for any author in the popular history genre, even an academic one like Wilkinson, to write a good book that at the same time deals with historical issues academically. Wilkinson's offering was chock full of gross oversimplifications (the issue of Ancient Egyptian chronology, for example), hapless generalizations (decline and prosperity are presented in an archaic duality of oriental decadence and youthful vigor), glossed-over debates (Akhenaten's reign is a good example, as is most of the Old Kingdom's history, alongside the entire issue of the Hyksos, the Bronze Age Collapse, or the Third Intermediate Period), selective interpretations of primary source material (most pharaonic reigns, as well as wars, are only interpreted according to reliefs on royal tombs, i.e., by taking pharaonic propaganda at face value), and complete omissions (no mention whatsoever about the fascinating relationship between Egypt and the Jews, and its implication for the latter's ethnogenesis). Almost every page had something to criticize. I myself was educated in modern history, with no formal introduction to ancient history whatsoever, and even I was able to see all of this!

Not only was the book marred by this, but it was also deeply flawed by transparent attempts to make Ancient Egyptian history relevant to a modern layman reader, alongside clumsy, ham-fisted attempts at analyzing Egypt's long-term legacy (the author attempted to nuance his history with a cliched bit on the "dark side" of Egypt, i.e. the absolute nature of pharaonic power; Wilkinson's claim, meanwhile, that Egypt "invented the nation-state," is preposterous).

I was thus deeply disappointed by the book. I was left wondering how a prominent academic could write something this bad. Perhaps it's the fact that his expertise seems to lie in Egyptian architectural history, rather than political or social? Maybe. But whatever the reason, "The Rise and Fall of Ancient Egypt" does not manage to escape the typical pitfalls of popular history: to write something that appeals to the general public apparently means writing something that obscures major issues and thus relegates the dynamism of our past to narratives of reigns, monuments, and wars. Much like Tom Holland or John Julius Norwich, and many other popular historians, Wilkinson merely presents a reworked and retold version of traditional histories that are almost as old as the subject itself. The only thing that makes Wilkinson a trifle better than a Holland or a Norwich is that he is slightly less affected by the fetish the latter two seem to have for battles, wars, and "great deeds." Wilkinson, at least, leaves some space to write about the lives of ordinary Ancient Egyptians, even if he does spend half a chapter on a Hollywoodesque description of the invasion of the Sea Peoples. If this is what it takes to popularize history, then the result is that our past is obfuscated rather than illuminated.

Woha great to see you post old timer! Sorry to hear about your bad reading experience. Thanks for the warning though!

[The Wizard]

I sacrificed half an hour of sleep to write that post, after I chanced on this thread while looking for news on this mod ~;)

If anything Wilkinson's book made me realize I can't read popular history anymore. I want to know about the (ancient) past and hear about it via the latest developments in the field, not read a reconfigured version of outdated traditional narratives (which is what most popular history is).

A much better book, from the point of view of historical accuracy and good analysis, is "The Beginnings of Rome: Italy and Rome from the Bronze Age to the Punic Wars (c. 1000-264 BC)" by Tim Cornell. It's extremely well-written, engaging, and unlike popular history does not avoid any of the debates or difficulties of the historical profession. It makes Rome's archaic history come alive, instead of reducing it to a caricature.

[falcons1988]

Music in ancient Rome and Greece

Music in ancient Rome and Greece is a book written by John Landels, during his retirement. He was professor in classics who lectured at both the university of Reading and Hull and what is noticeable immediately his no-nonsense approach, yet at the same time detailed and clear concise and a joy to read.

Even though he is a ‘classicist’ his knowledge and understanding of the subject matter of music is rather remarkable and even from an ethnomusicological point of view it makes sense. Then again as a classicist you are trying to understand another culture and given the amount of understanding Prof. Landels has in the subject adding in some musicology shouldn’t be too difficulty, more on that later.

At the very start of the book he puts forward the etymology of the term ethnomusicology into context from what I believe ethnomusicology to be, “the study of music in a cultural or ethnic context”. Already on the first page he is talking about the music and its uses in ancient Greece and later on in the book, that of ancient Rome and what the Romans did, like borrowing the Greek inventions and then ‘changing it’ to improve it and make it their own, or in case of music, to sit back and enjoy. However, he certainly was not disparaging towards the Roman culture, in regards to their music.

He made clear in the preface, yes in Roman culture music wasn’t such a major thing like it was with the Greeks, yet it did come with its own inventions of instruments, mainly from modern day Tuscany or even Greece for that matter. Therefore, naturally he has a lot more to say for Greece. Though what he has done and that is given Rome ‘fair treatment’ He hasn’t glossed over it with a few disparaging sentences, but done exactly the same as with Greece albeit not in such a large quantity as previously explained as previous authors and scholars have done before him.

In ancient times culture and music go hand in hand, just like they do today and musicians get up to various antics, which generally involve drinking. What I like about this book and that is some rather amusing anecdotes of musicians getting drunk ‘under the table’ and put on the back of a wagon and carted home. Although I can safely say I have never been in that situation myself, I can still relate to it after taking drunken friends home after a gig.
Instruments and inventions of the ancient world, absolutely fascinating sections (Greece and Rome), Instruments, he demonstrates a great knowledge on the instruments and the physicality of how they work. He explains how the instruments worked and with technical drawings and illustrations, which again are clear, concise and easily understandable. He also gives a basic introduction on the instruments of the period; though he covers them in greater detail later on in the book. But what is great is that the laws of physics have never changed and poses questions where would be now musically had the Western Roman Empire not fallen?

The Greeks had several instruments some of which were really complex and in many respects, with a certain amount of naivety (from a modern perspective) ahead of their time. The inventors and developers these fine examples of Greek engineering and creativity he refers to his other book called “Engineering of the Ancient World”.

To most musical cultures tuning and scales are important. It is widely document that the ancient Greek philosopher, and mathematician “Pythagoras” was one of the pioneers behind the development the diatonic scale by figuring out that if you stop a piece of string in the middle (in half) and each will side will sound an octave above that of the full length and variations on theory regarding fourths and fifths.

The author explores this in large detail the work of Pythagoras and his chord, but also Aristoxenos, and many other mathematicians and theorists of the time. He goes on to explain about the chords and scales used. He goes into great detail and it is fascinating to read about what the scales and chords which were used by the ancient Greeks and how they were devised.

The author explains how Vitruvius used this knowledge effectively when it came to designing and building new stadiums. What was known by Vitruvius two thousand year ago is just as important today as it was then.
John Landels’ final section(s) is notation and surviving scores of both ancient Greece and Rome and from an ethnomusicological point of view, certainly as an undergraduate when learning about music from cultures, for me one of the most important perspectives is that of having a base point of understanding, usually one’s own culture and comfort zone. When using pitches of instruments and note values and rhythms he has transcribed into standard western notation; which as a classically trained musician, is absolutely fantastic in trying to understand the music of these cultures.

From music to engineering and the mathematics and science behind it; it is a fantastic read for a university student studying music or a science as there is plenty of information in this book that is certainly useful. His method of delivering information is clear and detailed and keeps the reader interested. It tells you everything you need to know, and even contains transcribed surviving music of the ancient Romans and Greeks.

For a price of £23.74 paperback at Amazon it is well worth the price. It is absolute gold dust, especially if you have an interest in the music and the ancient world or a student studying anything from science to music.
Clear, Detailed and Concise!

[CountArach]

I'm currently working through quite a number of historiographical works for my thesis (of which Livy is the focus). Of late the major ones that I'm looking at:

T. P. Wiseman's classic Clio's Cosmetics. His theory (now commonly accepted) is that rhetoric was a more important basis for the writing of history than 'factual record'. I agree with the overall theory (and it is easily demonstratable with reference to Livy alone), but in terms of the details of his work I find myself constantly at odds with him. That's not really surprising for something that was first published more than 3 decades ago, however. Anyone interested in historiography and the basis for the writing of history should read this.

Another classic that I'm currently working through is John Marincola's Authority and Tradition in Ancient Historiography. He focusses on the importance of sight (witnessing events) over sound (researching written authorities). The theory once again is sound and Marincola, as I suspected, is much better when it comes to discussion of the Greek historiographical part, and it is interesting to view the ways in which we are lead to believe an author when he tells the audience something. The only major criticism that I have is his attempt to find a clear continuum running from Herodotus through to Livy and beyond, which I think just devalues the real innovations in Roman historiography and its focus on research in non-contemporary history.

Mary Jaeger's Livy's Written Rome is a work that will pretty much only appeal to specialists. It examines Livy's use of the 'space' of Rome, and the way in which height, distance and landmarks of the city are all used by Livy to guide readings of certain passages. It is really interesting when you get down to it and the way that Jaeger tackles some of the toughest sections of Livy is admirable alone.

[Brave Brave Sir Robin]

Finally getting around to reading From Samarkhand to Sardis. So far it has been worth the wait.

[I_damian]

Just making my way through the last 50 pages or so of Millennium by Tom Holland, then I'm starting "Carthage must be Destroyed" by an author I forget. Not enjoying Millennium as much as Persian Fire and Rubicon but that's because medieval history doesn't do it for me like ancient history does.

[CountArach]

Just making my way through the last 50 pages or so of Millennium by Tom Holland, then I'm starting "Carthage must be Destroyed" by an author I forget. Not enjoying Millennium as much as Persian Fire and Rubicon but that's because medieval history doesn't do it for me like ancient history does.
Richard Miles wrote that one.

[I_damian]

Yeah that sounds about right. I could have just looked at the Amazon site I bought it off as I was typing it but... you know... laziness.

[EB rocks]

sorry if this thread is to old but does anyone know of a good book to read about the teutons?

[SoFarSoGood]

Has anyone read this http://www.anabasis.org.uk/ http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/customer-media/product-gallery/190495992X/ref=cm_ciu_pdp_images_0?ie=UTF8&index=0

I always thought that the Anabasis was the Xenophon self hero worship.

I went abroad for a prolonged stay some time ago (work stuff) and having packed my clothes had to decide on books for at least 2 months as I had to rent a house before other stuff could be sent on. Was an agonising choice and hurt me alot as I regard my books as friends. In the end I chose Neitzsche's Beyond Good and Evil (I have an MA in Philosophy), The Peloponnesian War (the Melian dialogue and Pericles funeral oration), Scullards From the Gracchi to Nero: A History of Rome from 133 BC to AD 68 (for how democracy can be messed up), Tolkiens Lays of Beleriand (for fun), and Anna Comnena's Alexiad (for her despising of the Normans).

[Brennus]

Currently (in addition to the usual number of books on Iron Age Europe) "The Byzantine Revival 780-842" by Warren Treadgold. Only 5 pages and already learnt quite a bit.

[vartan]

A collection of William Faulkner's works, because each of them carries a little piece of history. *wink*

[moonburn]

you mean the dude that wrote about ww1 the sapping and counter sapping part of the war and for the 1st time (at least for the 1st time i remember) wrote about a english dude giving a nice married french girl a cunnilingus ? that one ? if not i´m confusing him with another author i can´t recall :X

[vartan]

You dishonor the great Faulkner. This calls for crucifixion of the highest Roman caliber.

[moonburn]

yeah yeah yeah it´s like saying flaubert never wrotte about a stupid country girl (provençale) whose whims and imaturity get her husband to ruin his entire life after having betrayed him with a stupid playboy count or whatever

everyone writes about the litle things of life it´s how you read them/interpret them that trully matters

besides HEY at least i read the dude :X (yeah i can read me so lucky)

[rickinator9]

Currently reading 'Dividing the spoils: The war for Alexander the Great's empire' by Robin Waterfield. It's quite interesting and is easy to read through.

[sventington]

I will be reading The Vandals by Andrew Merrils and Richard Miles shortly, after which I may dig into my 4 volume History of Sicily by Edward Freeman if I can find the time.

[moonburn]

can "here comes trouble" by michael moore be considered modern history ?

thats the last one i read moderatly aproaching history

now i´m reading bernard cornwell death of kings and it´s so good that i´m halfway trough it and i started reading it around 12 hours ago (i had to sleep in the meantime)

also does meantime means that the time is evil/mean ?

[vartan]

also does meantime means that the time is evil/mean ?

No. The mean in meantime comes from the definition of mean referring to the in-between/middle. An intermediary period.

[moonburn]

No. The mean in meantime comes from the definition of mean referring to the in-between/middle. An intermediary period.
thanks i finished cornwell death of kings and went on to less historical literature but i gotta say the dude can writte

[Hamata]

post deleted

[Constantius III]

A professor - not even one of mine - recently recommended that I read Loos 1915 by Nick Lloyd and The Road to Verdun by Ian Ousby to shore up my knowledge of the Western Front between the "bookend campaigns". I'm kind of garbage on everything between (First) Ypres and MICHAEL, so these recs are welcome. It'll be nice to have something more recent than, say, Price of Glory (which was garbage). May write a review of both/either.

[Kival]

I'm starting to read "Jurgen Miethke - Politiktheorie im Mittelalter. Von Thomas von Aquin bis Wilhelm von Ockham", translated: Theory of politics in the Middle Ages. From Thomas Aquinas to William of Ockham. It's an interesting but somewhat cumbersome read about the theoratical view of politics in the Middle Ages but there does not seem to exist any english translation of it.

[Brave Brave Sir Robin]

I'm starting to read "Jurgen Miethke - Politiktheorie im Mittelalter. Von Thomas von Aquin bis Wilhelm von Ockham", translated: Theory of politics in the Middle Ages. From Thomas Aquinas to William of Ockham. It's an interesting but somewhat cumbersome read about the theoratical view of politics in the Middle Ages but there does not seem to exist any english translation of it.

Gee, I wonder why :laugh4:

[Kival]

Gee, I wonder why :laugh4:

Hm? Is this topic of no interest in the historical research and/or political sciences of english speaking countries?

[moonburn]

people just assume the prince by nicolo is all they need :\

[Kival]

people just assume the prince by nicolo is all they need :\

He's not really medieval, though. At best you can call it late medieval.

[Ibrahim]

He's not really medieval, though. At best you can call it late medieval.

personally, I'd call it timeless. It shows just how little things have really changed.

though IIRC, it was supposedly written to "troll" the people it referred to... so goes one school of thought.

[moonburn]

after reading it i just consider it very patriotic of someone being tired of being bullyed by the big bully´s and wanting to unite the entire peninsula so they could stop their inferiority complex and stoped being picked on by france germany or spain problem was uniting italy meant undermining the church secular power

[Brucaliffo]

Hello guys,

i strongly suggest this book: http://www.arsdimicandi.net/ad_1_g000378.pdf

It is a wonderful study (this is the first book of a series, this one's about monarchy legions), very interesting.
Unfortunately for many, it is in italian language..

[kdrakak]

I wanna get Bezalel Bar Kochva`s The Seleucid Army: Tactics and Organization during the Great Campaigns.

What do you guys think about it?

I am reading it right now and I find it very interesting and thorough (i am not a professional historian or anything similar... i just love reading history books... so my opinion is only my opinion). It is pretty old I guess (1976 i believe) but quite enjoyable, I definitely recommend it.

[kdrakak]

Bengt Hägglund - History of Theology (Basically a book on church history, concentrating on the development of different doctrinal views)
Good book if one is interested in that kinda stuff

If anyone could recommend a book about Pre-Alexander Middle East (Assyria, Babylon...), I'd be grateful

"A History of the Ancient Near East" by Marc Van De Mieroop. Interestingly claims the Medes never actually had an empire despite ancient greek impression that there was and it was grand.

I just saw it has been recommended to you by more than one ppl on the forum :) . A good choice then.

[kdrakak]

You should read these books they are really good.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=scarrow+simon+eagle+series&tag=googhydr-21&index=stripbooks&hvadid=10509086034&ref=pd_sl_5zufi2wbbh_b


Would this be considered history?

[kdrakak]

[QUOTE=Cyclops;2053302977]Keep going back to Robin Lane Fox, the guy is a tweedy provacateur. Love it.

The classical world. an epic history of greece and rome. Robin Lane Fox

A wonderful book with a slightly different than usual take on presentation. Absolutely loved it!!! It was given to me by one of the author's friends under somewhat odd circumstances. Very very good.

[kdrakak]

Interesting that you say that Goldsworthy's for "amateurs and beginners" and then state you're reading Norwich and Ward-Perkins. :snobby:

Treadgold, Haldon and Vasiliev would be the Byzantine texts for a properly hardcore hobby-historian.


I would second that. Definetely the best choices and probably by far...

[kdrakak]

Just about to finish "Caesar's Legion", the history of the X Legio by Stephen Dando Collins. Pretty good, meant for a general audience as it's very readable but i think it serves rather than detracts from the history. i wouldn't expect a book about a specific legion to be anything but meant for casual lovers of history

The life and death of Centurion Crastinus was the most memorable part, "In death or life, Caesar, I will earn you gratitude!"
:(

Legions of Rome by Dando Collins is a brief history of all roman legions (imperial) and focuses on the military aspects rather than history. EB fans might find it more interesting because of that.

[kdrakak]

Has anyone read Gates of Fire by Steven Pressfield? The book is fantastic, but is it realistic? Did he show Spartan society as correctly as he could with available information?

yes and no. but it's fiction not history.

[Ptolemaios]

Does anybody know a decent book an Meroe? I just want something basic about their history,
nothing too deep into the subject. My university´s library doesn´t offer much.A German book would be OK, too.

[kdrakak]

A few months ago I read The Celtic Empire, The First Millenium of Celtic History 1000BC - 51 AD by Peter B. Ellis, and from there I began reading Henri Hubert's books on the Celts but I didn't have the time to finish them (they were from the library). Those were very good and I wish I had more time with them because I love reading about the Celts.
I also began China Through the Ages: History of a Civilization by Franz Michael. It's a good overview and beginning point of one wanted to study China. A pity I have to return it, too.

Just got a used copy of The Celtic Empire by Ellis. It is in excellent condition, it probably has not been read, as the gentleman who sold me the book wrote in a note. There is an actual picture of the Waterloo Bridge helmet (the one that the Casse captains wear). A picture of a shield was also quite familiar from a number of units like the Botroas, which proves just how good a job the EB team has done.
Getting the book in the mail, as well as the note from the seller, made my day this morning.

[Arjos]

Does anybody know a decent book an Meroe? I just want something basic about their history,
nothing too deep into the subject. My university´s library doesn´t offer much.A German book would be OK, too.

Can't recommend it or anything (I'm trying to find a copy myself), but "The Kingdom of Kush: Handbook of the Napatan-Meroitic Civilization" by László Török seems to be the best around...
Google books has the first 100ish pages in its preview, otherwise I've seen it at an incredibly high price or unavailable :S

[Ptolemaios]

Thanks for the info. I will definitely look into it.

[sventington]

I am actually glad the mod isn't finished yet, as I am waiting to get around to reading The Attalids of Pergamon by Esther Hansen. It was a bit on the pricey side, but it was the most full treatment of the people I could find. I am a slow reader though, so if the release date is somehow magically linked to when I finish the book, don't expect the mod to be done until early next year :laugh4:

[Vlixes]

Mommsen's History of Rome. Already read the first lines and I am mesmerized. Put to it some ancient roman music, and spell is cast.

[kdrakak]

Antigonos the One-Eyed and the Creation of the Hellenistic State (Hellenistic Culture and Society) by Richard Willows. I was looking for Seleukos Nikator but could only find used and pricy... I am looking for some insight on the early years after Alexander's death.

[Seer7]

The Tactics of Aelian - Christopher Matthew
A Storm of Spears: Understanding the Greek Hoplite in Action - Christopher Matthew
Men of Bronze - Donald Kagan and Gregory E. Viggiano (eds.)
Greek and Macedonian Land Battles of the 4th Century B.C.: A History and Analysis of 187 Engagements - Fred Eugene Ray Jr.

Thinking about these ones. From what I understand Matthew has made quite a stir with Storm of Spears, as he challenges the traditional literature on the practicals of Hoplite warfare using empirical analysis and re-enactors, amongst other things. So really, that and Men of Bronze would have to be read together to get a good idea of the field at this point in time, for an outsider. If anyone has the time, I'd like to hear a perspective on what impact Matthew has had on the field since his book was published last year.

[abou]

Antigonos the One-Eyed and the Creation of the Hellenistic State (Hellenistic Culture and Society) by Richard Willows. I was looking for Seleukos Nikator but could only find used and pricy... I am looking for some insight on the early years after Alexander's death.

The Legacy of Alexander, Bosworth, Oxford
Between High and Low, Boiy, VerlagAntike

[kdrakak]

The Tactics of Aelian - Christopher Matthew


Which Aelian would this be?

[Seer7]

Aelianus Tacticus (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aelianus_Tacticus)

[Moros]

Antigonos the One-Eyed and the Creation of the Hellenistic State (Hellenistic Culture and Society) by Richard Willows. I was looking for Seleukos Nikator but could only find used and pricy... I am looking for some insight on the early years after Alexander's death.
The Wars of Alexander's Successors 323BC-281BC (2 volumes), BENNETT & ROBERTS, Barnsley, 2008.

Not the most academic work out there but I found it presented the early history and confrontations between his "successors" very clearly, for what is a rather chaotic part in history.

[Skullheadhq]

Lucan - Pharsalia

Don't know if it really counts, though.

[kdrakak]

antiochus the great by michael taylor

[abou]

Eh, I would avoid anything by Pen and Sword. I mean, come on -- just look at the cover: it has the RTW vanilla Seleukid faction icon on it.

[Subedei]

Arrowstorm by Richard Wadge. Bit off topic, yet if one wants to get into the subject this is a superb read. Lots bout economical backround, pay, motivation and live of the archers. Plus the logistics of supply.

[kdrakak]

Eh, I would avoid anything by Pen and Sword. I mean, come on -- just look at the cover: it has the RTW vanilla Seleukid faction icon on it.

True... it would seem they have a particular target group in mind. I did however read Pyrhus of Epirus and that was excellent light reading. If Antiochos is anything like that I do not think I'll regret buying and reading it. After all I did just finish the Odyssey....

[Antiokhos II Theos]

Aperghis, G, G. 'The Seleukid Royal Economy' (2004) Cambridge.
With regard to the above conversation about Pen and Sword books they are most often written by experts in their fields, at least the ones I have read. They are aimed at general reader, not an academic- never the less they do have bibliography and references. I find them light reading and entertaining, usually read one in on a Sunday afternoon.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

[kdrakak]

Eh, I would avoid anything by Pen and Sword. I mean, come on -- just look at the cover: it has the RTW vanilla Seleukid faction icon on it.

Just got my book.... and the icon is not on it... It only appeared that way online.

[antisocialmunky]

Greek and Macedonian Land Battles of the 4th Century B.C.: A History and Analysis of 187 Engagements - Fred Eugene Ray Jr.

How was this book? I have the 5th century version and while the overall narrative is good, the actual battles descriptions work out like math problems and statistical averages. Someone at Amazon compared the writing to weather reports. I'd guess he's right as its usually 2 walls of spearmen meet with some multiple of 5% casualties on each side plus some multiple of 5% extra casualties on retreat. A good read but makes you wonder if the author wasn't just copy/pasting excel formulas and plugging in new numbers every few pages.

I'm also quite frustrated that the author insists on using his own numbers.

Edit:

Okay, I fished reading the Land Battles in 5th Century BC Greece: A History and Analysis of 173 Engagements by Fred Eugene Ray Jr. It gets much better once we reach the start of the two Peloponnessian Wars, particularly after the start of the Achidamian War (probably better sources).

What I liked:
+All battles are framed in their strategic context. The author is able to paint really good pictures of how the battles fit into the overall strategy of the city-states involved.
+This book is an EXCELLENT and mostly complete reference for all tactial deployments during this period.
+The writing is easy to follow and understand. It's quite addictive to follow the chains of events.

What I did not like:
+The author's basis for estimating army size and what is and isn't an exaggerated number is from military records rather than population estimate. For example he estimates Athen's military population at 13,000 at its zenith before the invasion of Syracuse. However, this is actually the number of hoplites Athens could afford to field logistically and financially.* In fact, it seems that Hoplite armies maxed out around 14K much like medieval armies did due to command control reasons. The battle of Plataea for example degenerated into three or four different engagements and it was fairly common for the center and wings of large hoplite armies to separate from each other and go off on their own to chase their routing opponents and such.
+Because of the above, the author ignores numbers supplied by ancient historians which are internally consistent and not outside the realm of possibility. The most obvious cases are the numeric estimates for certain Italian states which he constrains to around 10K from 20K despite Italy having more arable land than mountainous Greece. In another case, the author reduces two instances of an 9000 man army fielding by a city to 6000 because the author does not want to break with his own internal model of hoplite recruiting (600 man tribal contingents) despite these cities being located in Italy. Overall somewhat bizarre and confusing but doesn't impact the work other than annoying the hell out of you.

*The citizen body of Athens wealthy enough to equip themselves as hoplites was something like 40K and their total population was somewhere in the realm of 200K to 500K including foreigners slaves when there wasn't a plague. While the author enforces his numbers, the numbers seem to be inaccurate given there's no way you could recover and field 7K hoplites as well as a brand new navy three years after losing all but 3K and a huge amount of rowers and triremes unless it was a financial rather than man power cap on the size of the military forces.

What I expected/wanted but didn't have (I split these criticisms since its not fair to criticize the book for this):
+The author neglects to introduce notable people of this era. Emphasizing when X came onto the scene, what their background was, and then they died would be nice. As it is, people with names tend to show up, disappear, and reappear without fanfare and it makes it hard to follow sometimes.
+The same goes for major events such as the great plague of Athens that just seems to be forgotten about.
+Could have used more illustrated maps.
+The author doesn't seem to have a good model of hoplite combat, mentions of 'Othismos' might as well be referring to The Force. Othismos is only one part of hoplite combat which mostly likely only took place after enough spears were broken and one formation thought it had won enough of an advantage to punch through the enemy phalanx. The author skips the likely longer period of spear fighting with little shield to shield contact.

Overall a good book despite some failings I mentioned.

[kdrakak]

Finished Antiochus the Great. Excellent light reading as expected. I recommend it to anyone specifically interested in Antiochus III's "career". A last short chapter discusses the years following the Battle of Magnesia and the unwinding of the Kingdom and raises some interesting points. It's nothing new but if one is interested in getting the Seleucids story straight (hellenistic histories are a bit of a mess) this book is enough for the second half. Find one for the Seleykos Nikator (better yet Antigonos Monophthalmos) to Antiochos III period and you are done.

On another note, I am looking for something to read on Bactria, Hellenistic and later. All I find is Frank Holt's books and other very old ones. Any suggestions? Has anybody read any of Holt's books?

[The Gypsy]

Hey all

Does anyone know any good books about the nomads like the Sauromatae or the Saka? I would be quite interested to learn about them or any of the groups on the Eurasian steppe around this period.

Cheers

[MButcher]

On another note, I am looking for something to read on Bactria, Hellenistic and later. All I find is Frank Holt's books and other very old ones. Any suggestions? Has anybody read any of Holt's books?

Sidky's The Greek Kingdom of Bactria: from Alexander to Eucratides the Great is an excellent read. I highly recommend it. The only drawback is that, as the title suggests, he emphasizes the Bactrian kings and does not discuss the later Indo-Greeks in much detail.

[kdrakak]

Thank you I think it will do.

[LusitanianWolf]

I'm currently reading the Project Gutenberg Ebook of "De Bello Gallico", by "the dude you all know".
Do anyone know of other free ebooks from classical authors around? I'm quite interested in reading the Parallel Lives of Plutarch.

[abou]

I just picked up Frank Holt's new book Lost world of the Golden King. It has some good reviews and am excited to start it.

[clone]

i thing i am going to buy this The Greeks: Their Life and Customs E. Guhl (Author), W. Koner (Author)

[kdrakak]

I just picked up Frank Holt's new book Lost world of the Golden King. It has some good reviews and am excited to start it.

Please let us know what you think of it. I bought the one with the elephant medallions and it should be in by this week. I kind of get the feeling they will all be pretty similar, being based on the same evidence more or less. This is just what I expect. I hope to be proved wrong.

[moonburn]

Please let us know what you think of it. I bought the one with the elephant medallions and it should be in by this week. I kind of get the feeling they will all be pretty similar, being based on the same evidence more or less. This is just what I expect. I hope to be proved wrong.

you would be surprised on how diferent authors interpret stuff so diferently

[kdrakak]

you would be surprised on how diferent authors interpret stuff so diferently
actually it's the same author

[moonburn]

actually it's the same author
i learned in college to consult 3 diferent enciclopedias before making a statement wich suported my arguments (given that wikipedia was the 1st one i used you can understand how some information could make me look like a conspiracy crazy theorist and grant me a c for "originality" )

i´m currently looking for a book that talks about the divinity´s i had found it free online but the next day my old computer broke and i can´t recall the title the version i was reading was free for all in wikipedia

[clone]

The Persian Empire: A Corpus of Sources from the Achaemenid Period

[kdrakak]

i learned in college to consult 3 diferent enciclopedias before making a statement wich suported my arguments (given that wikipedia was the 1st one i used you can understand how some information could make me look like a conspiracy crazy theorist and grant me a c for "originality" )

i´m currently looking for a book that talks about the divinity´s i had found it free online but the next day my old computer broke and i can´t recall the title the version i was reading was free for all in wikipedia

If you're trying to tell me something..... I don't get it :)

[Moros]

I'm currently reading the Project Gutenberg Ebook of "De Bello Gallico", by "the dude you all know".
Do anyone know of other free ebooks from classical authors around? I'm quite interested in reading the Parallel Lives of Plutarch.

Most, especially the well known works, have copyright free translations around the interwebs. They've been translated over and over again, many late 19th century and early 20th century translations hence roam the free domain.

Check out perseus for a good start: http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/collection?collection=Perseus:collection:Greco-Roman
Edit: press the blue arrow buttons left to the authors name to reveal all relevant books/translations.

[Kull]

Please let us know what you think of it. I bought the one with the elephant medallions and it should be in by this week. I kind of get the feeling they will all be pretty similar, being based on the same evidence more or less. This is just what I expect. I hope to be proved wrong.

My sister sent me that for Christmas two years ago, and it was actually quite interesting. A pretty good piece of scholarship, from what I can see, and takes you into an area known previously known only to the experts.

[LusitanianWolf]

Most, especially the well known works, have copyright free translations around the interwebs. They've been translated over and over again, many late 19th century and early 20th century translations hence roam the free domain.

Check out perseus for a good start: http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/collection?collection=Perseus:collection:Greco-Roman
Edit: press the blue arrow buttons left to the authors name to reveal all relevant books/translations.
Wow, thank you very very much :bow:

[-Stormrage-]

Does anyone have any Greek Battle Books. Particularly in the Spartan-Athenian era.

A friend suggested one to me before and I was really enjoying it , but lost it when I got a new pc, unfortunately.

[TiagoJRToledo]

Most, especially the well known works, have copyright free translations around the interwebs. They've been translated over and over again, many late 19th century and early 20th century translations hence roam the free domain.

Check out perseus for a good start: http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/collection?collection=Perseus:collection:Greco-Roman
Edit: press the blue arrow buttons left to the authors name to reveal all relevant books/translations.

Dear Lord, this is AWESOME! Thank you very much!:hail:

[Thaatu]

If you're looking for something current that should be a read for every EB fan, try "The Oxford Handbook of Warfare in the Classical World" (edited by Campbell and Tritle), Oxford University Press 2013. It features articles from almost 40 established academics, featuring issues such as leadership and command, the development of strategy, wound treatment, military intelligence, logistics and warfare's role in society. It also contains some intriguing case studies of specific battles. Also to serve as a prelude to EB, look for James Romm's "Ghost on the Throne: The Death of Alexander the Great and the Bloody Fight For His Empire" (2011), which details the events from 323 to 316, during which the Diadochi were established. Romm's book reads almost as Game of Thrones-esque and would make a great HBO show in its own right, while still being academic. I recommend both very highly, although Campbell & Tritle, while being very recent and up to date, is anything but affordable.

[sirtim]

Can anyone recommend a good biography of Sulla, or any other of the players in the late Roman Republic?

[Ailfertes]

There's the work of Keaveney on Sulla, but I wouldn't recommend it.

[moonburn]

mcloughlin an australian author wrote whats for me the best historic novel it reads very easily and it´s trully immersive particulary the caesar one wich i read 4 times already but there are 4 more and one is on or around sulla

[titus agrippa]

mcloughlin an australian author wrote whats for me the best historic novel it reads very easily and it´s trully immersive particulary the caesar one wich i read 4 times already but there are 4 more and one is on or around sulla
Christine Mc Cullough. the series I believe is called "The Masters of Rome". BTW this is the Author of "the Thorn Birds"

[kdrakak]

Sidky's The Greek Kingdom of Bactria: from Alexander to Eucratides the Great is an excellent read. I highly recommend it. The only drawback is that, as the title suggests, he emphasizes the Bactrian kings and does not discuss the later Indo-Greeks in much detail.

Finished this one some time ago. While it is an excellent read, in some ways, it's only drawback is not the small discussion of the Indo-Greeks. There are other drawbacks. For one, the author presumes that he must start the story at the battle of Gaugamela. More than two thirds of the book discuss Alexander's campaign from Gaugamela back to Babylon and the events that followed immediately after that. While the book includes all the sources that are available for Bactria (there are not that many after all) it fuses the stories of other authors from many many years ago. While I did not want to go through the books of Tarn and Narain (both of them considered towers of Bactrian studies) because I figured their information on the subject was outdated, it turns out that the best reason not to go through them is because most of it belongs to the sphere of imagination and is basically based on nothing. An idea, with less than an indication, was turned to a possibility to be decidedly accepted as fact. To be fair they did lead the way, they did raise interest and got the whole thing going on Bactria. But it's just not quite that scientific. Sidky's book does little more than reiterate and collect. Not to mention its poor editing.
I am now going through Holt's "The Lost world of the Golden King", but this one is heavily focused on numismatics, as are all Holt's books, which of course is the richest field for any kind of evidence about Hellenistic Bactria. If a book is to be written about Bactrian history it's bound to be heavily focused on numismatics, at least for the time being, since un-looted excavation sites and clear epigraphical evidence are very hard to come by in Afganistan and have been for the last couple of centuries at least. The problem is no brief review tells you that you'll be reading a book on the story of numismatists. Not so much a book on Bactria. The story about the huge golden eucratidion and how it found it's way to the west is interesting but in itself is not history. Still, far more accurate than most.

All in all, it makes me wonder how the EB team managed to create such a colorful and exotic faction as Bactria is in EB. A personal favorite. So much so that I am having trouble deciding whether I want to have a go at it from EB2 Beta or wait until things are a bit more polished.