Never mind an Heil to Blair......

[InsaneApache]

and you thought that Gordon 'The Mentalist' was a sociopath?

Ladies and Gentlemen, I bring you the leader of Her Majesties Opposition.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-13971770

face/palm

[HoreTore]

Worried about your pension eh, gramps? :laugh4:

[Kralizec]

"This strike is wrong"
"Negotiations are still going on"
"The government has acted in a reckless and provocative manner"
"Parents have been let down"
--> repeat

I know repetition can be a useful trick in rethoric (repeat that last word), but sheesh...

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

The eyes are completely dead.

Never trust a man who commits fratricide, even if it is only political.

[Rhyfelwyr]

It's sad when these guys try to look like they have conviction, he looks like he feels dead on the inside.

I guess he was going for the 'say it until you believe it' approach?

[tibilicus]

I would have thought it was a gag video if it wasn't on the BBC website. Milliband clearly adopts the view that the best way for him to have any chance of winning an election is to keep his mouth shut and hope people are so turned off by Cameron they turn to him. Does anyone even know the current Labour policies which should be alternative to the apparent "reckless" spending cuts"? Nope, no idea either..

[Louis VI the Fat]

Does anyone even know the current Labour policies which should be alternative to the apparent "reckless" spending cuts"?The 'apparantly' reckless cuts have one reckless result throughout Europe: the birthrate of educated women has plummeted. While those of the uneducated has gone up.

Yes.

From Spain to Greece to Ireland and the UK birthrates have plummeted - for the educated natives. Any European woman who can spell her own name correctly is currently postponing childbirth. However, childbirth age is so high, that there is hardly any opportunity for postponement. Especially when the recession is the worst and longest since before WWII.
So birthrates for native, educated Europeans have collapsed. Such is the result of the irresponsible destruction of European society by the ultraliberal plunder of the past three years. We are replacing moderate, advanced, socialdemocratic European civilisation for a brutal jungle not just by the replacement of governmental structures for Hobbesian strife, but by the very replacement of advanced Europeans for uneducated non-Europeans.


The global economic recession of 2008-09 has been followed by a decline in fertility rates in Europe and the United States, bringing to an end the first concerted rise in fertility rates in the developed world since the 1960s, according to research published today.

"In a new study, scientists from the Vienna Institute of Demography of the Austrian Academy of Sciences (VID) and the International Institute for Applied Systems Analysis (IIASA) identify that economic recessions tend to be followed by a decline in fertility rates - and also identify how specific groups of people are influenced by a recession."

The 2008-09 global economic recession, the first major recession since that caused by the oil shocks of the 1970s, brought a sudden trend reversal to the previous pattern of rising fertility rates in several highly developed countries, including Spain and the United States. A larger group of countries including England and Wales, Ireland, Italy, and Ukraine experienced stagnation of fertility rates, following a decade of generally rising fertility after 1998 (see figure below).

The study found that individual reactions to the recession vary by sex, age, number of children, education level, and migrant status.

[...]

The recent global economic recession has brought to an end the first concerted rise in fertility rates across the developed world since the 1960s. Of the 27 countries of the European Union, fertility rates increased in 26 countries in 2008 (with stagnation in Luxembourg). In 2009 as many as 13 countries saw their fertility rates decline and another four countries experienced stable fertility rates. A rise in unemployment and employment uncertainty was a key factor behind this trend. In many developed countries cuts in social spending driven by the need to address ballooning budget deficits may prolong the fertility impact of the recent recession well beyond its end.

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2011-06/iifa-fra062811.php
Support the end of Europe - support the cuts! :yes:

[econ21]

We are replacing moderate, advanced, socialdemocratic European civilisation for a brutal jungle not just by the replacement of governmental structures for Hobbesian strife, but by the very replacement of advanced Europeans for uneducated non-Europeans.

Forgive me, Louis, but of late you seem to be a risk of metamorphosising from my shining hero of European liberalism into something darker. Do not despair - there have been recessions before and there will be recessions again, European civilisation will endure. And yes, less educated people may have more children: it was ever thus. But the average education - and IQ - of the world will continue to rise nonetheless. And yes, Europeans may be advanced, but in the last three decades we have observed many non-Europeans advancing at a faster rate and I suspect they will catch us up or even overtake us, if they have not already. And do remember - those that have migrated to Europe and their offspring will become Europeans, if they are not already.


Back on topic: Ed Milliband is in tricky place with strikes, as all Labour leaders have been. He came to lead Labour on the back of trade union support but he cannot be elected to lead Britain if he is seen as their pawn. He has to assert is independence and so is doing so, albeit awkwardly. The fact that the recent strike seems to have divided the trade unions (in private, if not in public) provides an opportunity for him to do so, but I agree it's ungainly. My sympathies for the strikes were a little eroded yesterday, finding out the fireman's union leader was (is?) a member of the Militant Tendency (i.e. a Trotskyist). Ed's father may have been a Marxist, but his son is not and does not need to act like one.

[rory_20_uk]

The lower orders have bred like farm animals, but the high mortality rates helped alleviate this.

Ed is in a tricky place. Labour dogma insists that printing money is always the answer. Where it comes from never seems to matter.

The strikes as always never seem to concern themselves with even the most basic tenants of Economics. Public servants should work for less and get a larger pension because... well - because. GPs feel hard done by if they can't retire at 60 with a final salary pension as somehow they deserve all this money. It is madness.

~:smoking:

[HoreTore]

Printing money is a Friedman dogma, rory.

So....what you hate is actually right-wing financial policy. As ever, the real choice for England is of course more socialism ~;)

[Beskar]

Did anyone see the GMTV with some loud mouth guy and a teacher about the strikes?
http://www.itv.com/itvplayer/video/?Filter=251878&module=whatson&title=this-morning&day=today&channel=itv1

[Beskar]

The strikes as always never seem to concern themselves with even the most basic tenants of Economics. Public servants should work for less and get a larger pension because... well - because.

Teachers are underpaid and to compensate for this, they get a good pension. Sort of "short term loss for long term stability" rationale only possible because public sector usually has "jobs for life" and if they don't, they lose a large chunk of their pension plans.

Majority of the teachers if they were in the private sector (in other jobs as well) would easily be earning double their salary, which in turn, can pay for very good pensions anyway. Big down side to this, we have a shortage of good teachers already, you want to get rid of more or as Rob said "Make it financially unreasonable to even consider teacher as a career".

So what you have is people who are underpaid and only compensated with their pension, having a big reduction to their pension.

[gaelic cowboy]

The 'apparantly' reckless cuts have one reckless result throughout Europe: the birthrate of educated women has plummeted. While those of the uneducated has gone up.

Yes.

From Spain to Greece to Ireland and the UK birthrates have plummeted - for the educated natives. Any European woman who can spell her own name correctly is currently postponing childbirth. However, childbirth age is so high, that there is hardly any opportunity for postponement. Especially when the recession is the worst and longest since before WWII.
So birthrates for native, educated Europeans have collapsed. Such is the result of the irresponsible destruction of European society by the ultraliberal plunder of the past three years. We are replacing moderate, advanced, socialdemocratic European civilisation for a brutal jungle not just by the replacement of governmental structures for Hobbesian strife, but by the very replacement of advanced Europeans for uneducated non-Europeans.

Support the end of Europe - support the cuts! :yes:

Cheer up Louis were not done in yet (http://www.cso.ie/census/documents/Prelim%20complete.pdf)

[InsaneApache]

Teachers are underpaid and to compensate for this, they get a good pension. Sort of "short term loss for long term stability" rationale only possible because public sector usually has "jobs for life" and if they don't, they lose a large chunk of their pension plans.

Majority of the teachers if they were in the private sector (in other jobs as well) would easily be earning double their salary, which in turn, can pay for very good pensions anyway. Big down side to this, we have a shortage of good teachers already, you want to get rid of more or as Rob said "Make it financially unreasonable to even consider teacher as a career".

So what you have is people who are underpaid and only compensated with their pension, having a big reduction to their pension.

There you have it ladies and gentlemen. The thoughts from the left.

Now where on earth did I mislay my magic money tree?

:disguise:

[InsaneApache]

Cheer up Louis were not done in yet (http://www.cso.ie/census/documents/Prelim%20complete.pdf)

There's only four and a half million of you in all that land. I'm jealous.

[gaelic cowboy]

There's only four and a half million of you in all that land. I'm jealous.

It's still going up the though on pretty much all factors the CSO were way off by 100,000 in there initial guesstimate, if a man were still around in 2050 the population of the island as a whole will be well over the pre-famine figure or 8.1-8.2 million in fact it's only off it by 1.8 million as it is already. (which is prob about the time we start to have rows over TOO generous pension entitlements like you lot are now)

[HoreTore]

There you have it ladies and gentlemen. The thoughts from the left.

Now where on earth did I mislay my magic money tree?

:disguise:

The middle class.

An established middle-class guy with no risk should be taxed to death.

I also find it hilarious when people make the connection that government run stuff is spending money, while privately run stuff creates money...

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

The middle class.

An established middle-class guy with no risk should be taxed to death.

I also find it hilarious when people make the connection that government run stuff is spending money, while privately run stuff creates money...

The doctrine of Oiberal equality says he should be taxed as much as anyone else.

[gaelic cowboy]

I also find it hilarious when people make the connection that government run stuff is spending money, while privately run stuff creates money...

Indeed I remember Louis pointing out before that a contract cleaning company in a school consumes public money same as the school.

[Louis VI the Fat]

Forgive me, Louis, but of late you seem to be a risk of metamorphosising from my shining hero of European liberalism into something darker. I know. Now imagine the fright it gives me.... :shame:

All is not lost! I often do not take the time anymore to write balanced, carefully thought-through posts. There is still some sanity deep down.


Mind that the cuts and the plunder of the past few years really do have some far-reaching effects. Europe really is changing. I was hoping to scare conservatives with the results of their wanton destruction of our societies. Demography shows that it is not the 'leftist multicultural social engineering mafia' which replaces natives for a multicultural society. It is rightwing anti-governmental free market which does so. :yes:

[Louis VI the Fat]

Indeed I remember Louis pointing out before that a contract cleaning company in a school consumes public money same as the school.The publicly funded teacher consumes wealth when he teaches children. Whereas the toilet lady from the private cleaning agency adds wealth when she cleans the school toilets. Or so says the thesis 'public means wealth consumption, private means wealth creation'.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Indeed I remember Louis pointing out before that a contract cleaning company in a school consumes public money same as the school.

It's quite true - which is why you need an actual private sector, not just subsidiaries serving the state.

Louis, you may be correct about the current situation but it does not necessarily follow that current Right-Wing policies are to blame, over-inflated public sectors, lack of cash reserves, and national deficits have necesitated tightening of both public and private purses. Those conditions all evolved under Left-Wing domination of European politics.

It's no wonder people are angry at the Left now.

[HoreTore]

The doctrine of Oiberal equality says he should be taxed as much as anyone else.

Yes, there are plenty of doctrines out there which doesn't further economic growth.

[HoreTore]

It's quite true - which is why you need an actual private sector, not just subsidiaries serving the state.

That's quite irrelevant. A private sector schools cleaning service still uses up public money just like a public school would.

[InsaneApache]

That's quite irrelevant. A private sector schools cleaning service still uses up public money just like a public school would.

That's correct. However it does so to make a profit for their shareholders, which they have a legal duty to do so. On the other hand the public sector has no such requirement. The public sector is wholly reliant on the taxpayer, whereas the private sector, who is the taxpayer, is not.

Quite simple really.

[HoreTore]

Indeed.

The private sectors aim is to create a profit. The public sectors aim is to gt reelected, which it can only do with good services.

Thus, the private sector works best on some areas, the public sector in other areas.

Quite simple really.

[Fragony]

'Such is the result of the irresponsible destruction of European society by the ultraliberal plunder of the past three years. We are replacing moderate, advanced, socialdemocratic European civilisation for a brutal jungle not just by the replacement of governmental structures for Hobbesian strife, but by the very replacement of advanced Europeans for uneducated non-Europeans.'

Only the last 3 years, it has been set in motion decades ago and we have no alternative for making the best out of it. No idea why it had to be this way but such is the way when simply being reasonable collides with the leftist churches' most holy texts. They simply can't accept that some cultures are superior to others. The typical gutmensch is a babyboomer, better educated than his parents, not used to being disagreed with. He cannot look at himself in a critical manner as being wrong is a concept that is beyond his grasp, it's simply not possible for him to consider he's wrong, nobody ever told him how to deal with that.

[rory_20_uk]

Teachers are underpaid and to compensate for this, they get a good pension. Sort of "short term loss for long term stability" rationale only possible because public sector usually has "jobs for life" and if they don't, they lose a large chunk of their pension plans.

Majority of the teachers if they were in the private sector (in other jobs as well) would easily be earning double their salary, which in turn, can pay for very good pensions anyway. Big down side to this, we have a shortage of good teachers already, you want to get rid of more or as Rob said "Make it financially unreasonable to even consider teacher as a career".

So what you have is people who are underpaid and only compensated with their pension, having a big reduction to their pension.

Really??? If it's so bad, and they can easily get better jobs elsewhere, then go get them!!! But they don't - which seems to point to the fact they know there's nothing else better that they could do, so they'd better cling on to what they've got.


The publicly funded teacher consumes wealth when he teaches children. Whereas the toilet lady from the private cleaning agency adds wealth when she cleans the school toilets. Or so says the thesis 'public means wealth consumption, private means wealth creation'.

The teacher is of course consuming wealth (as, of course, do I as a GP). A teacher might help their students create wealth down the line. I might create wealth by helping people get back to work (although I am viewed by many patients as a rubber stamp to give them free money via sick notes).

Both private and public can create wealth or consume wealth. The state system just has a much worse track record in doing so.


Indeed.

The private sectors aim is to create a profit. The public sectors aim is to gt reelected, which it can only do with good services.

Thus, the private sector works best on some areas, the public sector in other areas.

Quite simple really.

So simple it's completely false. Public services run themselves and even if politicians wanted massive reform - who is going to do this? The public service? Governments might set broad trends, but the quality of the services is rarely a factor. Social Services cheerfully neglects children to the point they are killed at a steady rate. Occasionally we get a really nasty one that catches the papers when we get a report after a few years... and nothing changes. Other changes take so long to make a difference that who knows who really did the positive change? We then have two sets of parameters we can use: various statistics which not only are flawed but require a legion of people to create - or we can go down the "look how great we are - we spent loads more on X - therefore it must be better, right?"

~:smoking:

[Adrian II]

[...] moderate, advanced, socialdemocratic European civilisation [...]

My my , how nice to see Louis utter these words without adding a diabolic giggle and leaving a whiff of sulphur on the air.

Socialdemocratic European civilisation, hmm yess - what a great idea, to paraphrase Gandhi.

AII

[Furunculus]

don't spend more than 40% of the economy on public services, it destroys long-term economic growth, and for a country that is suffering demographic decline at a time when its relative technological lead is being eroded......... i demand economic growth!

don't tax at any level further than 40%, because its damned illiberal!