Vacillating loyalty

[Gilrandir]

Playing MTW, the first thing I do every turn is check the loyalty of provinces and improve it in case it is below 100%. Then, after I'm done with all movements and buildings, I check it once again before ending the turn. Performing this double-checking I discovered a strange thing: the loyalty of a province which was more than 100% after the initial adjustment may drop below this figure, although I withdrew no troops and did nothing to cause it. It just dropped because of no actions of mine. So, the loyalty does not remain stable within the same turn. What could be the reasons of it?

[drone]

I've never checked like this, usually I'll just re-verify the loyalty if I move a lot of troops out of a province. Are you moving your faction leader around? Moving spies/assassins into or out of the province?

[Gilrandir]

I've never checked like this, usually I'll just re-verify the loyalty if I move a lot of troops out of a province. Are you moving your faction leader around? Moving spies/assassins into or out of the province?
Nope and nope. That's why I wonder. The province is not influenced by any in- or out- goings. Usually such a thing happens with recently conquered provinces or when you are excommed, in a word, if your kingdom is in turmoil. Before I adopted this double-checking rule I often had rebellions on my hands if I checked the loyalty only at the beginning of the turn and was satisfied and careless.

[Madden]

The only ways I know of to raise/lower province loyalty on the campaign map are:

1. Assign, remove the Govern Title of that Province.
2. Move your King.
3. Move your troops in and out of that province.


If you are afraid of loyalty issues durring your strategy on the map.. then just hold down shift before and after you make an adjustment.. you can easiliy see the "Green" provinces turn "Yellow or Red" or stay "Green" after your move. Those colours will assist you to find out what it is your doing that is causing this.

There are 100's of different ways the AI will change your percentages after you press "End Turn" also.

[Gilrandir]

The only ways I know of to raise/lower province loyalty on the campaign map are:

1. Assign, remove the Govern Title of that Province.
2. Move your King.
3. Move your troops in and out of that province.


There are other ways like changing tax regime, moving a spy in or out, having a natural disaster (earthquake, flood, femine) etc.

[Gilrandir]

There are 100's of different ways the AI will change your percentages after you press "End Turn" also.
You mean to say that when you have 110% loyalty in the province it may go below this figure AFTER you end your turn?

[Stazi]

I've noticed this problem too. It happens from time to time. I don't know if it's a bug or feature. Happiness in all provinces occasionally drops by 20-40% without any known reason. That's why I always make a quick-save before the end of the turn. Things get recalculated after loading the game so it helps to know the real and actual happiness in your provinces.

[drone]

End-turn stuff off the top of my head:

You can get an event that will lower happiness or destroy buildings that have a happiness effect.
An AI faction can move spies into your province to kick up unrest.
Depending on the religious mix in a province, an AI faction's proselytizer can stir up trouble.
Something untoward can happen to your faction leader or governor.


I try to keep happiness above 120%. This gives me a little wiggle room for the unexpected, and also prevents re-emergences from dragging in my provinces. Don't know why you would see unexplained shifts before hitting end-turn though. :inquisitive: Are ships (and the moving thereof) involved?

[Gilrandir]

End-turn stuff off the top of my head:

You can get an event that will lower happiness or destroy buildings that have a happiness effect.
An AI faction can move spies into your province to kick up unrest.
Depending on the religious mix in a province, an AI faction's proselytizer can stir up trouble.
Something untoward can happen to your faction leader or governor.


I try to keep happiness above 120%. This gives me a little wiggle room for the unexpected, and also prevents re-emergences from dragging in my provinces. Don't know why you would see unexplained shifts before hitting end-turn though. :inquisitive: Are ships (and the moving thereof) involved?
I can't say I was too observant to notice all of the things you think might be the reason. Certainly not events that influence happiness or destruction of buildings are involved. No trouble with faction leader. Not sure about religious agents or spies (you can't see others than your own). Not sure about the ships either, but I believe not, as it may equally happen to inland provinces without a sea coast. But all these things can influence the loyalty AFTER you end your turn, not DURING the same turn.

[Stazi]

I think it's a simple bug but it may be some kind of hidden rebellious feature too. Some factors change the happiness but numerals shown are not immediately changed. As I said, you can sometime notice this by simple saving and immediately loading the game. You do nothing but happiness changes. It's not easily spotted because it doesn't happen more often than every @50 years.

[Trapped in Samsara]

Hi

Probably already inferred, and does not happen during the player's 'activity' phase, but a governor can acquire V&Vs which significantly (like 40%, IIRC) impact on his province's happiness.

Best regards
Victor

Sapere aude
Horace

[DEB8]

I can't say I've seen this "bug" yet; but then I'm still on my first Campaign! I'll look out for it though...

I try to keep my provences at a minimum of 120% ( as the beginner's guide suggusts ), but even so, some of the "built in" loyalty drops ( after clicking on the Year End button ) can drop loyalty 20-30%!! Usually a cut in the tax rate, or some troop movements can solve a drop to ( around ) 90%. Running at 100% is rather risky...

Also, generally, I tend to move around my units before I review the tax rates, it's rather pointless ( IMHO ) doing it the other way around.