Reality Check

[CaPeFeAr]

do you guys remember how long it took before you got good at this game....

i simply dont trust any rewiew to tell me what the best new units will be or how they match up vs. the old ones. the game testers dont spend enough time playing to really know the units....and im sure the ones they call worthless are the one they cant figure out how to use properly. i imagine that they considered ca worthless when the game first came out..or other mistakes...( i wasnt around so some1 who was could possibly give examples) in the right hands any unit can be deadly..

as far as the current disscusion on the disapline thing....some units work best when not in close well disaplened ranks..ie.. hc, wm, nd however yari need disaplne and so do missle units. since most players keep the heavy hitters on the flanks anyways im not sure their game style will need to change much due to disaplne... however it does sound like magy wont be able to in-circle us using the whole map in 1v1 anymore...(thank goodness) http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/smile.gif (never really did find a good counter for this but mags 100 tips for victory includes something like " if your oppenent attacks on many fronts meet him in battle on many fronts ")

one concern i have is that in 1v1 with the larger maps....camping will become an even bigger problem...with so much distance to cover yuor troops will be tired when they get to the fight... http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/frown.gif not to mention that you must then climb a hill or whatever.. so i propose a new system of honor...this is not a new idea but one that i think needs rekindled.."why have attacker and defender" why not both sides attack one another...it is silly for one person to just sit there...i think the games are much more enjoyable if both players attack.....in the upcoming days i will try and host attacker only battles...hopefuly with honorable players this new game style will be very fun..

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[MagyarKhans Cham]

ha CAPE good point, my Khan likes to be a defender in the game, you know why? A defender is allowed to attack as well...

as he stated many times... with naming a side defender u encourage him to be a defender. Why not state both sides as player. And both sides attack. The battles are most beautifull when played in the centre of the map.
And why not let the side with the less spent koku decide what weather it is.... so gamble on using less koku...

So he fully agrees to what you say here, but one thing. Who will listen? Sadly a good idea has just a minor change to be implemented. And also he thinks a lot of players think this is all nonsense and shouldnt be changed. And you are smart enough to figure out why.

An other suggestion he had was to let the database keeping track of all battles and creat a maprating for each map based on the last 100 battles fought on it. Just like the method we using in teh campaign but more dynamic.



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http://home-4.worldonline.nl/%7Et543201/web-mongol/mongol-images/mongolsmiley.gif Quote Although the enemy moves fast, a mongol arrow will kill him at last[/QUOTE]

[CaPeFeAr]

the idea about mapratings based on previous battles is excellent....to whom did you mention this to ?

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[shingenmitch2]

Cape -- about the camping

Single players will do it anyway so no difference there -- but with bigger maps in multies, you camp, then u are too far away to help ur allies and doubles become harder to avoid. I think the bigger maps will force more shifting (if only to camp nearer ur ally)/ and full blown movement.

[Hawkeye]

I am not sure how applicable this is, but here goes. Why not have some sort of a marker(s) on the map. The idea is to get to the marker(s) and control it(them). It could give you added bonuses at the end of the game. This would force both sides to actively engage each other as opposed to one side sitting in the shade and slurping sake and eating monju while the other side is dryheaving in the sun, labouring up the mountain. This idea is like in the game Combat Mission: Beyond Overlord... What do you think? Again I don't know how easy or hard it would be to programme that into the game.

Japan, a country of extremes.

[BakaGaijin]

I don't like the whole "Defenders win when time runs out" scenario, anyway. Never have. But then again, I'm an offensive person. http://www.totalwar.org/ubb/wink.gif

To solve the camp problem, play only games with no time limit. Take your time to position your (attacking) troops in a position from which they can defend well. With no time limit, the Defender cannot win by camping alone. Tease your opponent some to entice him to move. Sit a high-honour unit on his flanks without attacking to frighten the peasants. Wait patiently for the enemy to show a weakness while enticing him to divide his forces.

Of course, my advice is moot when a time limit is in place. Hence my initial comment that you should play only games with no time limit if you wish to avoid campers.

Also, the above applies to 1v1 games only, or to team games in which both enemies are camping. If only one of a pair camps in a team game, both have already lost.

[Koga No Goshi]

I want an option like "signal allies" like in Age of Empires II where you can point at a specific point of the map and it brings up a highlighted x mark on your allies' maps. This is useful for "move here" or "rally here" or "flank him from here".



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Koga no Goshi

"Insolent Horses!!!!"

[Kraellin]

magy,

your idea of rating the maps is intriguing. what would you be rating, attacker won/lost, defender won/lost and by how much, game lenth time, how many players involved and honor of each at end?

i also like the idea of capturing and holding strategic points and they may actually be doing something like that in the expack since they've mentioned having various game types. i think capture the flag was one of them, wasnt it?

and the thing with signalling allies is also a good idea. shldnt be too hard to use the radar map to do this with. just click on it or click with another key held down to indicate what yer x on the allied map means.

good stuff guys. keep it coming :)

K.

[Vanya]

Me thinks rating on win/loss only is short-sighted. You could win 100 games in a row, but still barely win. I thinks you would need to...

1. Include a rating for each MP calibre played. IE, a rating for 1v1, a rating for 2v2... a rating for 4v4... etc.

2. You'd need to include kills/losses as well. A win where the loser killed more than you speaks differently than a win where you trounced the enemy 10-1.

My log reader rates maps by taking into consideration wins/losses, kill ratios, and army sizes for each calibre (1v1, 2v2, 2v3, etc) and gives you a number between 0 and 100. Of course, I have not released this latest version to anybody...

[MagyarKhans Cham]

ha good point too about the signalling, we like it

krae, it should be kept plain simple cause if u have taken a lot of games in to account it will not be that dominant. every rating will do.

-what us concerns also is the larger maps, where defenders have a bigger advantage
-the discipline thing, what about large flanking moves
-and all this capture the flag stuff wont work that nice. it would be better if we could give several points on the map a victorylocation like in gettysburg from sids.

howl


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http://home-4.worldonline.nl/%7Et543201/web-mongol/mongol-images/mongolsmiley.gif Quote Although the enemy moves fast, a mongol arrow will kill him at last[/QUOTE]

[Conquistador]

I really hope they'll minimize the deployment area, so that we have to deploy more towards the centre. I also hope they add the feature that common soldiers(one without flag) will always try to run away, so and one will receive a sudden drop of number in his troop which is deployed at the end of the map. Just like penalty for camping in Counter-strike.