Focus on... Yakuza! (Mafia game) - Concluded

[Visor]

Bahaha, and what will happen if the mafia yak you or kill you then hey?

I'll STILL be scanned suspicious. Or if you die, I'll be blamed!

Your scans are pointless.

[Montmorency]

Uh, no: if you're innocent, you'll still scan innocent, like the first time. If you're the yak, you'll scan suspicious.

[Visor]

What happens if you get killed/yakked then, eh?


2x yakuza. They can kill one person per night (unless this person is protected) as a mafia kill. Instead of kill, starting on night 2, one of them can ‘yak’: he kills himself, and targeted player becomes mafia member(there is no mafia kill this night; the only dead person is yakuza player himseif). Everyone can be targeted and there is no way to stop it. The second yakuza can use his ability later, in place of another mafia kill. If yakuza is protected while ‘yaking’, he is alive AND his target becomes mafia! Yakuza can, then, ‘yak’ another player at following night. All townies (including policeman) can be 'yaked'.
Mafia member (none at start): can perform mafia kill (one kill for entire mafia per night)

I think Scotty was not a yakuza.

[Montmorency]

:laugh4:

Did you not see the "Mafia member" PART?

[Visor]

Arjos was Oyabun, but scottish was a Mafia Member.

Does that mean the Kobun is the living mafioso, or does only the Oyabun get identified by a title?

Eh, Jarema?

My opinion on this.

[Montmorency]

So you believe "Mafia member" is just a type of Town power role, then?

[Visor]

No. I mean he was the guy Arjos killed himself to recruit.

[Montmorency]

Uh, yeah - ergo mafia.

[Visor]

Yeah but not one of the orignal Yakuza. That's what I'm trying to say.

[Montmorency]

We'll see about that tonight. Don't think you can weasel out of a scan. :smug:

[Visor]

Edited because it's not true and I do not need to be lynched on the next day because I act like a total scumbag.

[Jarema]

Arjos was Oyabun, but scottish was a Mafia Member.

Does that mean the Kobun is the living mafioso, or does only the Oyabun get identified by a title?

Eh, Jarema?

Scottish was mafia. He was not yakuza.
Arjos was mafia. He was yakuza. Oyabun is a title, meaning that he was the one in lead.

[atheotes]

Monty, what was your scan result on Auto?

[Jarema]

Once again, one of town residents was found sitting at his house. His entrails were lying on the floor in front of him. In right hand, he held a short sword. It was not clear, if he killed himself, or if somebody ‘helped’ him.

Autolycus was Yakuza member! He yaked!




living players [5/16]:
1 Atheotes
2 Montmorency
3 Zack
4 Visorslash

Dead:
BSmith (killed night 1)
Chaotix (lynched day 2)
Riedquat (killed night 2)
ATPG (lynched day 3)
Yaropolk (killed night 3)
LazyMcCrow (lynched day 4)
Daveshack (killed night 4)
SalmonSoil (lynched day 5)
Landlubber (WoGed day 5)
Arjos (yaked night 5)
ScottishRanger (lynched day 6)
Autolycus (yaked night 6)

[Zack]

Vote: atheotes

I'm still not the cop, ergo Montmorency is still the cop. It was looking like Visorslash was going to be lynched today, so yakking him would have been unwise. The only person left is atheotes.

[Visor]

Monty? Results please.

[Montmorency]

It seems Visor has scanned scum.

Just as I had anticipated. Bad move, scum.

:wink:
:laugh4:
:stare:

Vote: Zaccino

[Montmorency]

Zack scanned suspicious, when previously he was innocent. Read the Rule Post and vote him.

[Visor]

I'm pretty happy with that, it seems to tick all boxes. In the end your (mistake?) fooled Autolycus.

Now for those of you playing at home. I am not mafia cause I was looking like the lynch for today, so cross me out. Monty is apparently the cop. Zack is apparently the backup cop. Now, we would know if either Zack, or Monty turned. But we wouldn't know if I had or Atheotes. But because I would not be chosen (even though I was the best choice, you guys made a mistake there mafia), then if Zack remained innocent, they would know that atheotes had been converted. Correct?

Vote: Zaccino

[Visor]

I can also understand the logic behind choosing the backup cop. Because who would know? Well played there Monty.

Town comeback!

[Montmorency]

That's why you don't mess with Network Monty, suckas!

:smoking:

[Visor]

And this is why you let me act as a complete scumbag. So I am not yakked. :tongue:

[atheotes]

feel sorry for Zack

Vote: Zaccino

[Montmorency]

Don't. He was in the service - he knew his duty.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Should have let me live and yakked me, silly yaks.

[Visor]

Should have let me live and yakked me, silly yaks.

Really now. You set yourself up to fail Pizzaguy. You should've just kept chugging along quietly without the whole anti-town movement. Maybe then.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Really now. You set yourself up to fail Pizzaguy. You should've just kept chugging along quietly without the whole anti-town movement. Maybe then.

:rolleyes:

I win if town wins, silly banana. I'm playing this game to win. I managed to convince the mafia not to yak me and died while townie. Then I let you people do all the work for me.

Strategy!

[Visor]

:rolleyes:

I win if town wins, silly banana. I'm playing this game to win. I managed to convince the mafia not to yak me and died while townie. Then I let you people do all the work for me.

Strategy!

:cry:

For shame.

Speaking to those who had died, did you actually have any faith in the town winning?

[LazyMcCrow]

:cry:

For shame.

Speaking to those who had died, did you actually have any faith in the town winning?

Unshakeable. I just didn't expect you to be part of it ;P

[LazyMcCrow]

dopplepost

[Visor]

Unshakeable. I just didn't expect you to be part of it ;P

Why unshakeable? And no-one ever does. Sorry for messing with you, though, I thought you would've heard of the five stages of grief. :tongue:

[SalmonSoil]

I just couldn't imagine how you guys could win without my intellect.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I never had any doubt in my mind that town winning the game was one of the possible outcomes.

[Visor]

I never had any doubt in my mind that town winning the game was one of the possible outcomes.

*facepalm*

I am asking how much faith/belief you had that the town would win, not whether you thought there was a chance.

[atheotes]

Did i miss the announcement that we won the game? :juggle:

[Askthepizzaguy]

Did i miss the announcement that we won the game? :juggle:

Well, since Zack is set to be lynched, and atheotes is always mafia, then yeah, you won the game. :P

[Visor]

I am making assumptions, because we might as well assume. Backup cop isn't dead, so one of us is the backup cop. The cop ain't dead, so one of us is the cop.

I'm not mafia. Zack changed from innocent to suspicious. You're not mafia. Cop (Monty) ain't mafia.

SO even though I might be wrong, I don't think I am.

[Askthepizzaguy]

*facepalm*

I am asking how much faith/belief you had that the town would win, not whether you thought there was a chance.

I have 100% faith that if town lynches all the mafia, town will win. I believe it to be so with every fiber of my cheesy being.

[Visor]

I have 100% faith that if town lynches all the mafia, town will win. I believe it to be so with every fiber of my cheesy being.

*sigh*. SO why did you publicly say that you're all neutral, etc?

[Askthepizzaguy]

*sigh*. SO why did you publicly say that you're all neutral, etc?

I wanted to provoke the other players and see what they would do, so that I may better predict their behavior in future games.

[Visor]

But all game situations are different. What you learn now may not have any kind of use.

[Riedquat]

I wanted to provoke the other players and see what they would do, so that I may better predict their behavior in future games.

Good luck predicting my behaviour... :P

[Askthepizzaguy]

But all game situations are different. What you learn now may not have any kind of use.

I've observed that people believe their behavior is unpredictable, and consciously attempt to make it so. That said, their subconscious does not make such an attempt, and because the human mind is a pattern-recognizing and pattern-copying machine, people will subconsciously repeat certain behaviors naturally.

The best "tells" in any behavior-predicting game are the ones that people are not aware that they are exhibiting. You may be attempting to be unreadable and dynamic, but you are still who you are and some things don't change until you become aware of those patterns and work to change them.

This applies to townies as well; often times mafia successfully manipulate hapless townies because they successfully read a person and attempt to behave in a manner which will trigger less of a hostile reaction. You'll note that townie and mafia play is 95% reactive or more; the mafia change their behavior in reaction to the townies they hope to defeat, and townies react to other's posts, reasoning, and votes in an attempt to defeat the mafia.

Because the play is reactionary, knowing which reactions to provoke would turn an ordinary mafia player into a god. I've pulled off some tricks in my time but there's always room for improvement on that front.

[Montmorency]

I've observed that people believe their behavior is unpredictable, and consciously attempt to make it so. That said, their subconscious does not make such an attempt, and because the human mind is a pattern-recognizing and pattern-copying machine, people will subconsciously repeat certain behaviors naturally.

The best "tells" in any behavior-predicting game are the ones that people are not aware that they are exhibiting. You may be attempting to be unreadable and dynamic, but you are still who you are and some things don't change until you become aware of those patterns and work to change them.

This applies to townies as well; often times mafia successfully manipulate hapless townies because they successfully read a person and attempt to behave in a manner which will trigger less of a hostile reaction. You'll note that townie and mafia play is 95% reactive or more; the mafia change their behavior in reaction to the townies they hope to defeat, and townies react to other's posts, reasoning, and votes in an attempt to defeat the mafia.

Because the play is reactionary, knowing which reactions to provoke would turn an ordinary mafia player into a god. I've pulled off some tricks in my time but there's always room for improvement on that front.

++++++++++++++++++++++

:bow:

[Jarema]

Following lead of police oficer, Montmorency, remaining townies surrounded Zaccino.
'You have to die, your bloody murdserer!'
'Wait... wait...', Zaccino answered. 'I never killed anyone!'
'we know well that you have changed sides! Zack, that was good and loyal man. Zaccino, that one has to hang'
And they hanged him.


Zack was mafia member!

Town Victory!

Living players:

Atheotes
Montmorency
Visorslash

dead qt (nothing really there):
http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/J2fWmzqnxTg

mafia/yakuza qt:
http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/6ZCRpK29WVPB

[Jarema]

Please, tell me now:

1. what you think about this game

2. what you think about my hosting

3. and, because one of my reasons of this game was to look closer at yakuza role, what you think about this role? did this game show us something about it? I have my opinion on this subject, and I will post it later...

thanks for playing!

[Montmorency]

I don't really have any substantial comments. :shrug:

Longer writeups are always nice though.

Thanks for hosting, GG well-played and all the rest!

[Jarema]

Longer writeups are always nice though.

Yeah, I know. it is my weakest point. My english skills are weak (but I feel I am improving steadily)
TBH, those are the longest writeups I ever made (it is second game in which I tried to write anything 'in character'; in most of my games I didn even try) :yes:

[Zack]

I'm bitter I was brought on to the losing side at the last second to share in the defeat.

Also, I obviously wouldn't have posted that Monty was still the cop if I had known I was mafia at the time...

[Jarema]

Yes. sorry about that, my mistake. I should first write to you, and then post night end in a game thread

[Visor]

I'm bitter I was brought on to the losing side at the last second to share in the defeat.

Also, I obviously wouldn't have posted that Monty was still the cop if I had known I was mafia at the time...

Well, even if you had known, it would've meant nothing,as Monty had still scanned you.


1. what you think about this game

It was a good and enjoyable, personally, I like the yakuza role, it's something different, though very, very powerful when used correctly. It was a tight game, and even though town won in the end, we almost didn't. I had fun in it.


2. what you think about my hosting
You were on time with writeups, you Wog'ed when necessary (almost costing us the game :tongue:) the only mistake you made that I can see was the Zack thing, which wasn't a game changing mistake at all, no matter what, we had Zack down. Good hosting.


3. and, because one of my reasons of this game was to look closer at yakuza role, what you think about this role? did this game show us something about it? I have my opinion on this subject, and I will post it later...

I think it is a very powerful role, and can be devastating against the town. The cop was a needed addition in my opinion.

Good game all, good job Monty and thanks for the game Jarrema.

[Montmorency]

It's alright, it didn't affect the outcome in the least.

I figured that autolycus would be very hesitant to yak Visor (thank goodness Arjos wasn't allowed to dissuade him!), so I investigated Zack (known 1st-scan innocent). It was quite clear what had to be done from the moment I checked my PMs; I hadn't even read the new in-thread posts yet.

It's quite amazing, really. My mistakes brought the scum to the Gates of Victory, but by sheer fortune I was able to open up a trap-door beneath them.

I didn't even remember to scan on nights 1 and 3! On D5 I became overconfident and needlessly dissuaded Arjos from a vote on Zack by revealing everything - to an unknown! A rookie mistake. I quickly realized by Arjos' behavior that he was scum. Instead of doing the smart thing and scanning one of the confirmed to at least rule them out of the inevitable yak (or maybe even catch it!), I went with my gut and scanned auto, though it obviously could not have given a useful result unless it happened to fully clear him as innocent.

I had been suspicious of autolycus (coming off his Byzantium victory) for a while, but on D6 all I had was a 1-scan suspicious result on him. I couldn't even be sure of his guilt, let alone anyone's innocence. I wish I could say those defeatist outbursts were carefully calculated to lull Mafia into a false sense of confidence, I;m afraid that meltdown was all-too-real. I felt defeated. I had let the town down and taken a decent network into oblivion - just in time for the endgame. But then I noticed that Visor had suddenly switched from scottish to ahteotes, and it piqued my interest. At first I felt assured that he had been converted, but thankfully decided to sit down and think it through. After 2 hours of deliberation, I had used my map to narrow it down to scot or atheotes, with 5 minutes to spare. In a fit of panic, I made a wild assumption: Zack had not been yaked. This then ruled out atheotes, and I blindly saved the day at the last second. From there it all fell into place. Scottish was a far better lynch than auto would have been. being the convertee, his lynch immediately re-cleared Visor and Zack...

In sum: the way for unassailable Mafia victory would have been an Arjos-Zack yak (wasn't voted that day, and I wouldn't have pushed for the auto lynch) or a auto-Visor yak on the last night (I probably would have gone for atheotes)

[Visor]

It's quite amazing, really. My mistakes brought the scum to the Gates of Victory, but by sheer fortune I was able to open up a trap-door beneath them.

THe town, not you led the scum to the gates of victory. And you opened the trap door. Townie MVP = Monty.

EDIT: One of the reasons I was so supicious of Atheotes, was when he suddenly piped up on the final day and started PM'ing me. I was struck by that and it seemed like he had been skating along until that day. I thought he might have been converted.

[Arjos]

A rookie mistake. I quickly realized by Arjos' behavior that he was scum.

My yak on scottish, was made to put doubt in your network...
And it worked, but auto and ranger didn't vote, if they did it would have ended 2v2 and good luck winning there...

Inactivity/unavailability, call it what you will, lost the game on that round...

[Visor]

My yak on scottish, was made to put doubt in your network...
And it worked, but auto and ranger didn't vote, if they did it would have ended 2v2 and good luck winning there...

Inactivity/unavailability, call it what you will, lost the game on that round...

In all honesty, it seems to be larger then usual problem recently.

[Montmorency]

And it worked, but auto and ranger didn't vote, if they did it would have ended 2v2 and good luck winning there...


That would have been 50/50. :shrug:

[Zack]

Well, if I had known, I could have claimed that I was now the cop and that Monty had been yakked, instead of essentially posting "I am scum." Not really gamebreaking, but just frustrating.

[atheotes]

Good game all. thanks for hosting Jarema.
I started putting more effort when it became pretty clear it was do or die on the last couple of days.
i do feel sorry for Zack. he got pulled into the losing team in the last moment and his only chance of survival was lost by the timing of his post.

On the Yakuza role, i think it was very powerful and it had been used earlier it might have been more difficult for the town

[Askthepizzaguy]

Zack, once again, you must realize that your past couple of losses have been through absolutely no fault of your own or due to a lack of skill, and everyone recognizes that fact.

In my mind you won this game as a townie. Just as I should have in that Buffy game where I got converted to the losing side in desperation.

[Jarema]

ok
as I promised, also my opinion on yakuza role:
the role is VERY powerful. Combining mafia and cult (albeit limited) abilities.
But part of it power lies in waiting for it being use. It can cripple town's effort by mere anticipation of it.
So, I think early use would be a mistake. But maybe one day earlier than now?
I wonder, how it would be if town does not know in advance that there is yakuza (but I feel it would be unfair for townies)

[Visor]

I wonder, how it would be if town does not know in advance that there is yakuza (but I feel it would be unfair for townies) Yes it would be unfair.


So, I think early use would be a mistake. But maybe one day earlier than now?

Early use is indeed a mistake. But halfway through, or even late game it can be good.

[Nauthiz]

I want to join for the next game!
Diablo 3 Guide (http://diablo3guideinferno.com/)

[LazyMcCrow]

Thanks for the game Jarema - a worthy effort with an interesting mechanic.
To host a game in a second language takes balls and you've shown you have great balls. I admire your balls.

[Riedquat]

Who could say you were going to get your first ball admirer? :rolleyes:

Ahem... Congratulations to town!

Nice game jarema!

:bow:

[Jarema]

Thank you all :bow:

I am going to request hosting another game today (requesting today, not hosting)
and this time, there would be more flavour text at summaries :yes: