Turning your enemies into your vassals: is it useful ?

[Llywelyn]

Hello everybody :) it's a long time since i've been there for the last time.

Was wondering: is it useful to turn your enemies into vassals ?

I remember having completely destroyed Carthago as the Scipii. Their past glory survived only in a rump state in Lepcis Magna.
Not willing to engage Egypt yet, I invaded them with full stacks of high end units, slaughtered all their armies and their generals, besieged their capital for some rounds, then retreated and sent an emissary to offer them to be my vassals. Not only they refused the first time, but when I came the second time with gold they just asked me to give them back 5 regions they used to control, including Carthago, and 22k gold, which was obviously unacceptable for me.

So here's my question: do you occur to turn easily a rival into a vassal ? Is it worth the shot ? (rather than destroying their faction). How much control do you have over them ?

Thanks everybody,

Cheers,

Llywelyn

[ReluctantSamurai]

I can't think of a game where I successfully got someone to become a protectorate. Always got the same silly demands of the type you got...so I don't try anymore. In your case, I would just destroy their last city and let it go rebel. Keeps you from having a common border with the Big E, just yet. It's something I do all the time (making nasty rebel settlements between me and someone I don't wish war with, at the moment).

If the settlement has a population of 12k or more, don't exterminate or enslave. Just destroy the military facilities and leave it go. In my experience, Egypt is very poor at managing loyalty, and Lepcis is a very long ways from Memphis. It is not an original Egyptian settlement, so the Pyramid will be of no help in maintaining loyalty. I've had games where Egypt has been repeatedly been thrown out of Lepcis even if they manage to take it.

My 2denarii

[wumpus]

Me, I'm an impatient person. Once, when I played Brutii, the Senate asked me to make Carthaginians a protectorate, then again in the same campaign Senate asked me to make the Britons a protectorate. In both times I was refused. So, in the last turn of the deadlines [10 turns each] I simply assaulted their last cities and wiped these factions out. You're right, Samurai-san...it seems to be silly to hope making an enemy faction a protectorate. Hawooh.

[Brandy Blue]

Maybe now and then becoming a protectorate might be useful?

Once I was playing Numidia or Carthage, I forget which. I attacked an Egyptian settlement with the intention of getting some quick cash for trashing the place, and then withdrawing and letting my easternmost province (Siwa?) go rebel to act as a buffer. I tried offering the Egyptians peace just to see if I could get some cash for it, and lo and behold they offered me a fat check if I would sign on as a protectorate and give back the city I had just trashed and was going to abandon anyway. I was quite happy to do this and use the money to help fund a war elsewhere. I set up a rebel buffer just in case, because who knows? The AI might do something like attack a protectorate for no reason.

When I was good and ready I went back and attacked the Egyptians. As far as I can see, becoming a protectorate has no downside.

[Myth]

I would say that the RTW AI on VH is so hell-bent on killing the player that anything but vanquishing the faction is not worth it. In the case of the player becoming a protectorate - hey, if the AI is giving you free gold, take it. Then kill it.

[Llywelyn]

Hi everybody,

Thanks a lot for the answers. Seems a protectorate is barely an alliance with military access, that's it.
I'll make ended making peace with Carthage and even gave them money to help them rebuild an army in case the Egyptians attacked me while I was securing the area.
Ended with me and the Eggies both attacking Carthage at the same time :D

[Brandy Blue]

I think I remember reading somewhere that your protectorate's cities count toward your victory conditions but I don't know if that's true. Of course if you have to capture every city they have except one, and then beg them with gifts to become your protectorate and almost certainly get snubbed ... well, it doesn't seem like much help anyway.

[ReluctantSamurai]

Kill them all! I say again:laugh4:

[Sacred Band]

In my opinion, there is really no point of making protectorates. First of all they never accept it and if they somehow would accept it is not worth it. Just slaughter them :yes:

[Hamata]

i say kill them all! god will regonise his own. i never seem to get vassals either