Movie or Mini-series about First Fitna

[Noncommunist]

Over the past couple days, my wikipedia meanderings led me to the early days of Islam as the empire was expanding and the first few Caliphs came along and ruled. It seemed most of the people involved were interesting characters who could definitely be seen in a number of different lights depending on who was writing the story.

So why haven't I seen any movies or mini-series about it? It seems like it could make an interesting plot with compelling characters and an end that starts the first major division in Islam. And in recent years, several other HBO mini-series have come out about the Borgias and the Tudors. Also, in recent years, people have probably learned a little more about Sunni and Shia simply from the news in Iraq and now Syria where those religious tensions have exploded into violence.

Could it be something that has a chance to catch on in the near future, or will it be too esoteric or religiously charged to be viewed by audiences or made by directors and producers?

[The Lurker Below]

There's no such thing as bad publicity - Phineas T. Barnum

frequently untrue.

[johnhughthom]

Who would want to make a mini series that would risk a fatwa being issued for some minor detail in the plot, then you change the detail and some other group issues another fatwa.

[Lazy O]

First fitna meaning the revolt right after the Prophet's death?

[Noncommunist]

First fitna meaning the revolt right after the Prophet's death?

The one that took place about 25-30 years after his death though pretty much everyone had known the Prophet. And it involved several people becoming and ceasing to become the Caliph till the Ummayads finally had a hold on the title.



Who would want to make a mini series that would risk a fatwa being issued for some minor detail in the plot, then you change the detail and some other group issues another fatwa.

I suppose you'd get that, not sure how effective the fatwa would be.

[Lazy O]

The one that took place about 25-30 years after his death though pretty much everyone had known the Prophet. And it involved several people becoming and ceasing to become the Caliph till the Ummayads finally had a hold on the title.




I suppose you'd get that, not sure how effective the fatwa would be.

Now I cannot know which event you are referring to ... Can you be a bit more specific? The Umayyads murdered Ali, the previous caliphs had also been murdered apart from Abu Bakr, thats a very long span of time .

[Noncommunist]

Now I cannot know which event you are referring to ... Can you be a bit more specific? The Umayyads murdered Ali, the previous caliphs had also been murdered apart from Abu Bakr, thats a very long span of time .

I was thinking of the point from when the Caliph Uthman was murdered to the point to where Muawiyah took power. So that would encompass the reign of Ali, the rebellion of Aisha and then the battles between Ali and Muawiya and then the Khajarites rebelling assassinating Ali till Hasan was forced out of the Caliphate.

[Lazy O]

Wow, would that be one heck of a controversial movie ;D

[Fisherking]

What ever as written it would upset someone.

I doubt you will ever see a movie made in the west about that topic.

It is much safer to pretend Islam dose not exist than to write anything at all.

It is not PC to make them bad guys and someone has to be less of a good guy than the other one, so it just won’t happen.

[Noncommunist]

What ever as written it would upset someone.

I doubt you will ever see a movie made in the west about that topic.

It is much safer to pretend Islam dose not exist than to write anything at all.

It is not PC to make them bad guys and someone has to be less of a good guy than the other one, so it just won’t happen.

But you don't think the producers would be able to take advantage of the fatwa to get more publicity? After all, I don't believe I would have heard of Salman Rushdie had he not published the "Satanic Verses".

I suppose the alternative would be to make both sides sympathetic though I'm not sure whether that would induce apathy in the audience without any sort of clear cut good or bad guy.

[Fisherking]

But you don't think the producers would be able to take advantage of the fatwa to get more publicity? After all, I don't believe I would have heard of Salman Rushdie had he not published the "Satanic Verses".

I suppose the alternative would be to make both sides sympathetic though I'm not sure whether that would induce apathy in the audience without any sort of clear cut good or bad guy.

The producers, the film company, the actors, and everyone involved would need guards for the rest of their lives, short or long.

Even if you tried to make it sympathetic to both sides some cleric is going to get upset.

It is a no win proposition.

Besides, if you want history you want both sides portrayed as they were, and likely both sides were bad-guys.

You may as well remake a Sinbad the Sailor movie if you are just making pretty stories.

[Mouzafphaerre]

​

Who would want to make a mini series that would risk a fatwa being issued for some minor detail in the plot, then you change the detail and some other group issues another fatwa.

Made me chuckle. ~:) Bitterly true.
​

[Brandy Blue]

Quite apart from the danger of fatwa, wouldn't it be morally irresponsible to stir up contraversy? Like the Middle East isn't stirred up enough already?

[Noncommunist]

Quite apart from the danger of fatwa, wouldn't it be morally irresponsible to stir up contraversy? Like the Middle East isn't stirred up enough already?


The producers, the film company, the actors, and everyone involved would need guards for the rest of their lives, short or long.

Even if you tried to make it sympathetic to both sides some cleric is going to get upset.

It is a no win proposition.

Besides, if you want history you want both sides portrayed as they were, and likely both sides were bad-guys.

You may as well remake a Sinbad the Sailor movie if you are just making pretty stories.

Certainly, Muslims have reacted poorly to some things in the past. However, those things usually were directly insulting. Such as showing a picture of Muhammed with a bomb for a hat, or showing women that suffer under Islam.

And certainly, both sides could be shown to be sympathetic as both sides did have understandable goals. While it's likely that some cleric would get angry, it doesn't seem that large scale violence would break out if efforts were taken not to offend.

[Vladimir]

Certainly, Muslims have reacted poorly to some things in the past. However, those things usually were directly insulting. Such as showing a picture of Muhammed with a bomb for a hat, or showing women that suffer under Islam.

And certainly, both sides could be shown to be sympathetic as both sides did have understandable goals. While it's likely that some cleric would get angry, it doesn't seem that large scale violence would break out if efforts were taken not to offend.

Well...I don't know about that. What I do know about is that there isn't a market for it. Sure, some people will watch it but there are many more profitable topics.

[Zim]

I can understand that reasoning but I'm not sure it's reason not to do a film. "Jesus Christ Superstar" was controversial to a far greater extent that most likely movies treating the beginning of the Ummayids would try to be. I bet Hollywood (or "Bollywood" or any number of non-American film companies) could do the story without going to the level of offensiveness of equating Muhammed or Islam with Terrorism. Personally I suspect Ali would be the "good guy" if it were a Hollywood film. Americans always do like their underdogs (A prejudice I'm by no means immune to).


Quite apart from the danger of fatwa, wouldn't it be morally irresponsible to stir up contraversy? Like the Middle East isn't stirred up enough already?

[Brandy Blue]

While it's likely that some cleric would get angry, it doesn't seem that large scale violence would break out if efforts were taken not to offend.

I wouldn't really expect large scale violence either. In fact I wouldn't necessarily expect even one death to be directly attributable to such a film. I just wonder if its a good idea to add to even a little when there is so much division already.

[HopAlongBunny]

I don't know. Provided it was done properly, it would shed light on divisions and factionalism. For most people (me included) it could be very educational and informative.

How much of the history is solid/contentious? That divide is really important.

[Noncommunist]

I don't know. Provided it was done properly, it would shed light on divisions and factionalism. For most people (me included) it could be very educational and informative.

How much of the history is solid/contentious? That divide is really important.

It would be nice to see people in the US think of the middle east as a place where there are people with at least reasons for violence as opposed to thinking of middle eastern people as naturally programmed to get angry at each other for generic ethnic hatreds.


I can understand that reasoning but I'm not sure it's reason not to do a film. "Jesus Christ Superstar" was controversial to a far greater extent that most likely movies treating the beginning of the Ummayids would try to be. I bet Hollywood (or "Dollywood" or any number of non-American film companies) could do the story without going to the level of offensiveness of equating Muhammed or Islam with Terrorism. Personally I suspect Ali would be the "good guy" if it were a Hollywood film. Americans always do like their underdogs (A prejudice I'm by no means immune to).

When reading through wikipedia, it did seem like Ali was the more sympathetic one though Uthman himself was also fairly sympathetic. Muawiya and his son just seemed like jerks. However, I suppose movies could even it out by showing more of how the Sunnis portray it.

Also, I kinda liked the Kharijites because of their rejection of any pre-ordained leadership and the right to rebel against anyone who screwed up Islam. I suppose sorta like Protestants. On the other hand, they were a bit violent.

[Lazy O]

How many succesful accurate historical films have been made in history?

[Catiline]

Ask and ye shall receive

Omar

http://gulfnews.com/news/gulf/saudi-arabia/tv-drama-omar-is-steeped-in-islamic-history-1.1054460


The attendent fuss:

http://gulfnews.com/news/gulf/saudi-arabia/magnet-for-controversy-and-debate-1.1054472