View Full Version : XCOM: Enemy Unknown
OH GOD. OH JEEZE. OH :daisy:
XCOM DEMO OUT ON STEAM. DIDN'T YOU HEAR ME?! WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR.
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
please dont be a let down!
edit: Played through the entirety of the demo, as expected it's essentially the first two tutorial missions. Mission 1 is entirely linear and teaches you the fundamentals of the game. How to move, how to shoot, ect. In mission 2 you get your choice of one of two maps responding to abductions. At the start of mission 2 your mission controller guides you a bit but after the initial engagement the game abruptly stops holding your hand and allows you full tactical control. It was like the game was teaching me how to ride a bike and just as i started to wobble a bit, it let go.
The demo was fairly easy I think, but I have a feeling it was set on the lowest difficulty (and I still managed to lose my best guy in the second mission), but despite the difficulty it was a lot of fun. It also ends way too soon. Just as you're getting comfortable and the narrative of the game is unfolding, the demo ends.
Despite being a tutorial mission 2 had some fun moments. I couldn't help but roll my eyes at my sniper who missed two shots that needed to be made on floaters. Two shots that were outdone by my medic with a normal assault rifle, who ended up gunning down the entire alien recon team. :laugh4: I saw my veteren (who is given for free from mission 1) taken down by Thin Men, who was avenged by my assault specialist who was packing a shotgun. Watching Thin Men erupt into poison clouds after taking a slug to the face? Priceless.
Damnit. I want this game, now.
Double post:
http://asia.gamespot.com/shows/now-playing/?event=xcom_eu20120924
Two hour stream of the game with commentary was just posted at the link above. I haven't watched it fully but it includes early game stuff as well as "late game" missions. Be warned though, most people directing me toward it warned the guy playing was "pretty bad" :laugh4:
And! The demo seemed a bit large for just two missions, both of which were the game's tutorial. 6gbs! Wonder why that was? Well, it's because they included every .bik video from the campaign in the demo. Obvious spoilers contained there, but if you have a video player that can open .bik files and don't mind spoils, have at it!
easytarget
09-25-2012, 01:01
I'm getting very impatient at this point...but fortunately, I've not got expectations set too high. I simply want to start playing the game, and I'll take it on it's own terms and not compare it to the original.
Thing is, been hanging out too much on the 2k Xcom forum, so I've seen a couple week's worth of videos of other people playing the game, and I want to too!
I'm getting very impatient at this point...but fortunately, I've not got expectations set too high. I simply want to start playing the game, and I'll take it on it's own terms and not compare it to the original.
I think that's a very healthy attitude to have, honestly. From what I've seen and experienced with the demo (modded the ini files to let me play on impossible) the gameplay isn't exactly the same as the originals. There's noticeable differences and changes in the design philosophy that become apparent the more you watch footage, and the more you play. However it does come very close and doesn't lose the same 'xcom feel', imo. For example I've been playing Xenonaughts a lot. Xenonaughts has been striving to be as close as possible to the original games, and while both new efforts have much different systems (Squad size, inventory management, and action points all handled differently) they still invoke the same feelings and emotions in me, as a player. Which is probably the most important thing they can strive for.
The one negative I have to say about Firaxis' efforts is the UI. I really don't like it, it just feels very clunky with a mouse and keyboard. It doesnt get in the way, exactly, but it does take serious getting used to.
Alexander the Pretty Good
09-26-2012, 00:20
You can mod the demo to be more difficult:
http://forums.2kgames.com/showthread.php?139306-How-to-change-Difficulty-Settings-here
Managed to beat it on the hardest (I guess?) difficulty, but lost 3 of 4 squaddies on the second mission. Stupid floaters.
Also, the UI is very odd. I might have to invest in a gamepad. :/
You can mod the demo to be more difficult:
http://forums.2kgames.com/showthread.php?139306-How-to-change-Difficulty-Settings-here
Yup I did that too. +3.0 is indeed 'impossible.' I managed a perfect score on the second mission but had 3 out of 4 squadies critically injured, putting them out for weeks. Because i had meta knowledge of alien placements I dealt with the sectoids with a well placed grenade, took out the floaters with a rocket, and moved in on the Thin Men. They proved to be my downfall. Two really bad shots and their poison is absolutely nothing to joke about.
If i didn't have that meta knowledge (and the encounter wasn't scripted) it probably would have gone much worse.
As for the UI, yeah I hear you. I'll stay with mouse and Keyboard personally but it doesn't feel at all like they put much effort into it. In a lot of ways it reminds me of Skyrim's UI. Can you use a mouse/keyboard for it? Yes. Was it designed with it in mind? Noooo.
I love modders, i really do:
just found if u rename or change Act2_Bar_script.upk to Act2_Pier_script.upk, you will start the second mision without tutorial and with more sectoids , like 4 or 5 more.
Yeah there is already one , i rename Act2_Pier_script.upk to Act2_Pier_script_backup.upk, then rename Act2_Bar_script.upk to Act2_Pier_script.upk.
Sorry for my grammar, english is not my natural tongue.
The file in question can be found at steam/steamapps/common/xcom demo/xcomgame/cookedpcconsole
Also - Demo editor: http://forums.2kgames.com/showthread.php?140536-Demo-Editor-I-just-Made
Change the aliens you face. Obvious spoilers for unit/alien types, so dont use if you want to be surprised by the enemies you face in the retail version.
Alexander the Pretty Good
09-27-2012, 12:56
Dare I try it on impossible? Perhaps during lunch...
easytarget
10-05-2012, 16:51
Well, one more weekend to wait through and then it's game on saving the world from aliens!
Certainly hope steam kicks on early download, Jake from Firaxis confirmed that would be the case, we shall see.
I'm quite happy seeing some signs of life in turn based gaming. It warms the cockles of my heart. And they did in fact need warming.
Certainly hope steam kicks on early download, Jake from Firaxis confirmed that would be the case, we shall see.
I think the more important question is why is he so charming and likable?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1pyJxcETmc
Seriously. Could they have picked a better face for this game? Firaxis' marketing and PR has been pretty awe inspiring. Also, if you guys have the time (ie, an hour of you life) I seriously suggest giving a listen to their PAX panel, aptly titled "A Thousand Stupid Ideas on the Road to Glory." Quite insightful and a fair bit entertaining after the initial introductions are over.
I'll try to embed here, but it may not work due to age restrictions. Track it down if the embed fails for you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AmaMn3xb7U
I played around with the modded demo quite a bit over the last week, it was impressive enough to convince me to cave and drop down money for a pre-order. Well, that, and the extra customization options that come with the Elite Soldier pack. What can I say? I'm a sucker for helmets. :grin2:
X-COM: Enemy Unknown is also the top seller on steam and has been for three days, after spending a week at the number two spot.
Double post to say...
Soon.
https://i.imgur.com/JpoMY.png
Preloads have begun for pre-orders, word from 2k is Xcom is getting a midnight EST activation. Not sure if this is true or not but either way I am excited. :yes:
Alexander the Pretty Good
10-06-2012, 21:21
Curse my decision to preorder from newegg at a lower price!
A glorious review from the always excellent eurogamer http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-10-08-xcom-enemy-unknown-review_3
Man are we gamers getting spoiled lately
A glorious review from the always excellent eurogamer http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-10-08-xcom-enemy-unknown-review_3
Man are we gamers getting spoiled lately
XCOM is getting almost universal acclaim, which is really surprising given the shoes it's trying to fill. The lowest score i've seen so far is from PC Gamer and that was an 87.
Rock Paper Shotgun's review (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/10/08/xcom-review/), which is nonscore based, paints an almost insanely positive picture with a few caveats, which are mostly aimed at the interface, camera and localisation for the game.
Release for North America is in 12 hours, rest of the world in a couple days.
I have been waiting for something like this since the hilariously flawed but oh so fun Silent Storm. Don't tell my mom but the most fun is dressing up your squad.
I have been waiting for something like this since the hilariously flawed but oh so fun Silent Storm. Don't tell my mom but the most fun is dressing up your squad.
:laugh4: I'm with you there, that's exactly one of the reasons i pre-ordered. More customization options is incredibly hard to say no to.
Steam says I have about 7 hours played. To be honest I am shocked. It did not feel like 7 hours, but I certainly felt time slipping away as I just kept telling myself "Okay okay, seriously, THIS is the last mission." I'm on my way out the door but I wanted to take a moment and reflect upon those 7 hours of gameplay, my failed attempt at saving the world.
The game is fantastic, I have to say, but the deeper you get into the game the much more apparent that it becomes: This is not a remake of XCOM, at all. In my opinion that same spirit is captured in the game's narrative, the feel of fighting against the unknown and the pain of loss from your soldiers, but it is very much it's own game. Perhaps far more than could ever have been observed from watching videos or playing the demo, once you're about a month into the game doing missions it becomes quite clear. XCOM is it's own game, fully and apologetically. It's XCOM in so many places that when you arrive at something that is different, it almost takes you by surprise.
In my opinion, I think it keeps just enough of the old mixing with the new to be something really incredible, but others may disagree! I think whether people will truly enjoy XCOM: EU, if they are an XCOM fan, comes down to whether they can accept that or not. If not, well, there's always Xenonauts to look forward to. ~:)
I played the game on classic, no ironman mode but it may as well have been because I didn't reload/save once. Crusader Kings II taught me the value of loss in a real way. It' was hard to resist hitting that reload button and before CK2 came along, i have to admit, I used to do it more than a few times. XCOM feels like a game that demands you play it 'fair'. No reloads, taking every shot it gives you on the chin without flinching.. but let me tell you, it can be tough. Over the course of my 7 hour attempt to stave off the end of the world I started to get really attached to my forces. I liked these guys, and after we ran all over the first 6 missions without any problem, I thought I had a venerable A-team.
And that's when a UFO landed in Nigeria. Landed UFOs are a mission type where the xenos have landed in a nonpopulated area for unknown reasons, so you send a team in to find out what they're up to. It's like crashed ufo missions except with maaany more enemies.. and my poor A-team got decimated. Not a single one survived, only one of my vets, Abby Robinson, aka "The Duchess" wasn't KIA. She had been in the infirmary from a previous mission. Losing so many of my best troops was hard, but i battled back and was making a really spirited comeback, likely due to still having one good core member to build around. I was able to progress for quite a few more missions.. and then the terror missions started.
The first one we took out with only one dead, but on the next.. oh my god. A broken overpass, fending off wave after wave of crysalides and zombies. It was like L4D if the zombies turned into mutant bugs if you didn't kill them fast enough. I finally got the upper hand, my troops were shot up but still going strong. And.. well.. let's just say XCOM is a game that likes to pile it on...
http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/560954765837437945/2B53715F3C0DFEBA8E340C12D8AE75D0503E2FCB/
Needless to say.. the heroic last stand, felt like a pointless waste of life. When The Duchess got a plasma bolt stuck in her chest and the mission was all but done.. I sort of had to just stop playing. Not that I didn't want to keep going, but I knew that was it. No more vets, my best soldier KIA, and only rookies back at base to face the ever increasing brutality of the xenos. 7 hours. 3 months of missions, the world had ended. And that.. was the most fun i've had in a while.
Alexander the Pretty Good
10-10-2012, 16:54
So yeah, classic ironman is pretty fricken hard. I was lulled into a false sense of security - a half dozen missions and only 1 casualty, then an abduction mission I *really* needed to win ended in 4 of my best troopers KIA. There were just too many enemies and they overran us. :(
White_eyes:D
10-10-2012, 20:31
After sinking 8 hours into this, I can safely say this is the most fun game I have played this year.(Before CK2 of course:knight:)
Nothing is more soul-crushing then watching one of your Veteran soldiers receiving that one-shot kill, nothing is more satisfying then getting that unlikely kill for a particularly annoying enemy. It also seems to punish you if you rush too much and rewards you for patience. When in doubt; Overwatch and reload.
There was only one enemy in the game that was extremely tough to kill and you only encounter it 3 times throughout the game. As far as I know anyway, could have been a random enemy...:shrug:
Now I know you need about one of each class in your unit but my favorite was the assault class. "Run and gun" mixed with "Rapid fire" and a dash of "Quick reflexes", makes them the perfect killing machines.(My best Assault class Soldier is sitting at 60 career kills)
Monk: I feel your pain on that terror mission....there was a difficult mission before that where you had to hit a supply UFO, which saw most of my Veteran team killed or in the hospital for a number of days. Had to take that terror mission with only my Best man and mostly recruits. Lost China(?) and only just barely made it out with my best unit, had to buy a bunch of recruits after that one.:sweatdrop:
Nothing is more soul-crushing then watching one of your Veteran soldiers receiving that one-shot kill, nothing is more satisfying then getting that unlikely kill for a particularly annoying enemy. It also seems to punish you if you rush too much and rewards you for patience. When in doubt; Overwatch and reload.
Absolutely. :grin2: A lot of the actual firing comes down to that randomness, but the game will reward you if you play well. You're always outnumbered, and for most of the game you are outgunned. But with skill and a little luck, you'll never be outfought.
As for skills, Hunker Down has got to be the most underrated skill in the game. Overwatch is grand for the front line troops, but when I am unsure and expecting an attack, Hunker Down is such a great move. An instant double to your defense while in high cover is no joke!
On my second on classic, this time Ironman. In the initial mission we were fighting in a convenience corner store, and after clearing out the first room we could hear sectoids scurrying around on the other side of a wall. So. I did what any red blooded American would do while in charge of a clandestine international para-military organization....
I told my Russian point-man to whip out his grenade and blow the wall separating our forces down BECAUSE WE'RE X-COM :daisy: AND THAT IS HOW WE ROLL. We mopped up local resistance and suffered only one wounded. It's gonna be a good game, i feel.
Now I know you need about one of each class in your unit but my favorite was the assault class. "Run and gun" mixed with "Rapid fire" and a dash of "Quick reflexes", makes them the perfect killing machines.(My best Assault class Soldier is sitting at 60 career kills)
Assaults have got to be the greatest example of XCOM's risk vs reward gameplay. Run & Gun is by far one of the best abilities in the game because of how much it changes the entire dynamic of a mission. Combined with Lightning Reflexes your assault troopers are the stuff of legends, I don't care what world you're from, a shotgun to the face will hurt.
Papewaio
10-10-2012, 23:10
Game downloaded via Steam: Check
Shortcut on Desktop: Check
Outside USA: Check
Can't play until the 12th of Oct local time...
BTW The game retailed in Australia on Steam for $69.95 US... What was the price for other countries?
I'm so used to paying $100-$120 AU (107-134US) as an Aussie tax.
easytarget
10-11-2012, 00:28
I'm having a blast as well, I spend more time talking about it, but that'd be more time spent not playing, and work is interfering here enough as it is. Maybe after 3 or 4 run throughs I'll calm down and come back and chat about it. Ha!
Game downloaded via Steam: Check
Shortcut on Desktop: Check
Outside USA: Check
Can't play until the 12th of Oct local time...
BTW The game retailed in Australia on Steam for $69.95 US... What was the price for other countries?
I'm so used to paying $100-$120 AU (107-134US) as an Aussie tax.
Ouch, that's absurd.. I paid $50 US. ~:(
Second playthrough has ended in disaster. I can't get over the June hump in Classic, as that seems to be the month Cyberdisks start appearing. Does anyone have advice as to how to avoid wiping constantly on them? They totally rocked me just now.
Also.. i was forced to watch my best soldier turned into a chrysalid. You want to talk heartbreaking.. I Got pinned down really quickly in a Terror Mission and things went badly, really quickly. Dealing with floaters/Chrysalid packs pinning me and then out of nowhere a Cyberdisk warps in on my flank. You can guess what happened next.. :sweatdrop:
easytarget
10-14-2012, 23:55
I rather like snipers with the plasma sniper rifle at the moment. It does upwards of 19 HP in one shot.
Papewaio
10-15-2012, 00:22
Playing Normal Ironman (NI)
I've already played had a few starts. Second mission was all female so I got the Valkyrie achievement. Purposely loaded up a new game to get the tutorial achievement.
Anyhow sat down to maximize the economy. Essentially only buying enough items for a single squad load out until the cash flow is running hot. Prioritizing health and armour upgrades. And keeping my rooster rotation happening in full swing.
First the economy. Satellites, satellites and more shiny orbital things. A typical satellite will pay for itself in a month, the uplink in the second and add pure gravy from there. Despite all the money, I'm trying to minimize panic so I keep a bird in the hand until the end of the month before deploying in the worst area. This would be USA or Russia by end of month two. That means I focus my abduction choice of three missions outside of NA or Europe and then on the cash.
By the end of the first month I had scored 402 credits in mission extras. By the end of the second month I was about to choose US or Russia when a special proposal popped up. USA offered me 200cr for satellite coverage. So I now have 4 birds in the sky, plenty of cash and a double steam vent asking to be tapped.
On the tactical side: I rotate squads and individuals in those squads too. Not only do I bring a rookie on every mission I alternate squads. Alpha and Bravo are my two line squads. Charlie replaces anyone WIA, Delta KIA.
Alpha has the armour plate style. Bravo the classic fatigues look. Charlie alternates.
I always pack two medi-kits, frag on rookie, nano vest on the fourth and fifth. With armour prioritized I managed to create 5 carapace suits and my first combat with them is a terror mission. The high armour has already saved one heavy from a 9 point hit. This mission has one Delta rookie, 2 Charlie squad heavies, one Support and one Sniper (cant remember which squad is on rotation.
To make things easier I rename all my troopers A.Lastname or B. or C. So I know which squad they belong to. By naming the Lastname this way you can see easily in the mission screen who is who.
Colour scheme depends on role and somewhat on squad
Rookies are hot pink
Assault are red
Heavies are yellow
Support are white if a medic, off white if an overwatch specialist (may change this to blue)
Snipers are black
I rather like snipers with the plasma sniper rifle at the moment. It does upwards of 19 HP in one shot.
I have found Snipers to be the polar opposites of Assaults. While Assaults are amazing from day one, Snipers take a bit of work to rank up into something worthwhile. Once their abilities (Squad Sight) and tech catches up they become absolute beasts. Until then, though, I find them very hard to use effectively.
First the economy. Satellites, satellites and more shiny orbital things. A typical satellite will pay for itself in a month, the uplink in the second and add pure gravy from there. Despite all the money, I'm trying to minimize panic so I keep a bird in the hand until the end of the month before deploying in the worst area. This would be USA or Russia by end of month two. That means I focus my abduction choice of three missions outside of NA or Europe and then on the cash.
By the end of the first month I had scored 402 credits in mission extras. By the end of the second month I was about to choose US or Russia when a special proposal popped up. USA offered me 200cr for satellite coverage. So I now have 4 birds in the sky, plenty of cash and a double steam vent asking to be tapped.
Impressive work, Pape :bow:
One of the harshest lessons i've learned playing this iteration of XCOM is that it will severely punish you if you aren't thinking ahead. You absolutely cannot play the game on a month by month basis, especially on Classic where Panic rises very fast. You really need a meta gameplan from the start that details what you're going to do, not only do you need to know what you're doing this month, but you need to be thinking about what you're doing next month. The economy can really get you if you're not careful.
Good to hear you've mastered it to some extent :yes:
Colour scheme depends on role and somewhat on squad
Rookies are hot pink
Assault are red
Heavies are yellow
Support are white if a medic, off white if an overwatch specialist (may change this to blue)
Snipers are black
:laugh4: I'll bet your Rookies just love looking so fabulous.
I've settled on a more uniform color for my team, trying to play into some kind of idea of "realism," or if not that very much an in-character way of approaching it. All troops wear a dark greenish color (tint 22) uniform to avoid the aliens singling out who does what on a color scheme. Yes, the AI can't do that, but I always think of the Starfleet uniform conundrum. Dress all your command officers in red and sooner or later, your opposition is going to figure it out and prioritize targets.
The one change that puts my units apart, if you could consider that, is all rookies are forced to wear helmets until they rank up to sergeant and get a nickname. Until they prove themselves to me in some way I don't want to know their name. They are expendable. Demolition experts (heavies with shredder rockets, Grenadier, ect) always keep their helmets due to the volatile nature of their ordinance.
HopAlongBunny
10-15-2012, 08:46
Took the plunge!
No love from eb games or any of the other locals so downloading now.
I am soon to be a corpse near you :p
How exactly do I change the color of the armor?
How exactly do I change the color of the armor?
Unfortunately, 2k pulled perhaps the biggest :daisy: move of recent memory and put color customization and helmets for your squad in the pre-order bonus. The Elite Soldier Pack that came with all digital pre-orders, and I think, all physical copies has the DLC.
Unfortunately, 2k pulled perhaps the biggest :daisy: move of recent memory and put color customization and helmets for your squad in the pre-order bonus. The Elite Soldier Pack that came with all digital pre-orders, and I think, all physical copies has the DLC.
I don't get helmets because I didn't pre-order? I am hoping that these helmets are decorative only.
I don't get helmets because I didn't pre-order? I am hoping that these helmets are decorative only.
Oh no, don't worry the helmets and colors are purely cosmetic and don't offer any in game bonus. The only benefit they provide me is shielding me from the faces of all the starry eyed men and women I've sent to their death. :sweatdrop:
Ok, I'm not too bothered then. Extra character customization options seem to be standard pre-order bonuses these days, so I don't think it's particularly bad. I didn't even really care until Pape mentioned his color-coding scheme for easier specialist identification. That sounded like a really good idea to me, which is why I asked.
Papewaio
10-15-2012, 22:03
It's useful in the aliens turn. However as this is turned based it doesn't create a disadvantage as long as you look around at the start of your turn. I think they should have released at least the first third of the colour schemes.
Finished the terror mission, 10 Aliens killed, 8 civilians killed, 2 Soldiers WIA and 3 walked away. Yay for carapace! I now with my squad rotation have a Lt. 4 birds are being built and I will be building two more uplinks to form a block of four.
I'm saving all my alien autopsys for when I put two birds above South America... This should auto unlock them. So right now research is on getting some weapons to go along with the armour.
White_eyes:D
10-16-2012, 00:52
Does anyone find a use for the more upgraded versions of the power room or satellite nexus, when you can just get to a steam area for power or link satellite up-links together? I only ever built one nexus...it was expensive and getting enough satellites and materials was just a pain.
The Psy lab remains the most unlikely building I thought I would have a use for...until I saw how OP some of the psy ability's can be. Even the most basic attack saved my bacon, when we run out of ammo and couldn't waste a turn reloading.
HopAlongBunny
10-16-2012, 04:54
Got it loaded!
I seem to be building up a fair pile of corpses already (mostly mine) good fun :)
Whenever I go to the base I seem to get stuck ie: go to Barracks; cycle through soldiers; cannot get out of barracks. "esc" does not take me out, nor does it give me the menu_cntrl-alt-del to exit game!? really!!?? Gah!
I must be missing something obvious but I can't find it. edit: it was obvious :p follow what the tutorial asks you to do!?
Ok, I have a complaint. There should be an easier way to transfer loadout items from inactive soldiers to those who are on your mission list. It's annoying to have to find the inactive soldier with the item you want, load them up, remove the item, load up the soldier you want, and then equip the item. I cannot find any in-game reason to have more than one squad's worth of any item, other than the convenience of not having to do this item swap dance, and money is so tight that I need to save every credit I can. That means not buying more equipment than I need.
therother
10-16-2012, 14:25
Does anyone find a use for the more upgraded versions of the power room or satellite nexus, when you can just get to a steam area for power or link satellite up-links together? I only ever built one nexus...it was expensive and getting enough satellites and materials was just a pain.They are more useful later in the game, when you are running out of room for new facilities, and the extra energy and satellites/per slot makes a difference.
I'm just about to complete my second run through, am almost ready for the final mission but want to have 6 psi operative colonels in my team so am playing on for quite a while after I could have completed it. One additional benefit is that I have the time and resources to play around with my base.
Foundries can be moved, but you lose the already completed projects. Same goes for the Officer school. You can get rid of Alien containment once you've interrogated the alien necessary for the "plot" and if you don't care about the research bonuses interrogations allow, and can scale back on labs entirely once you have enough scientists/research bonuses. For instance, with no additional labs I researched fusion in two days. In terms of planning to group facilities, squares are better than lines, and I prioritise uplinks then power then workshops then labs.
I was beginning to get a little blasé about the missions until I assaulted a cargo ship laden with 20+ aliens including muton elites, beserkers, cyberdisks, sectopods, heavy floaters and an ethereal. Twice I encountered serious firepower activating all at the same time. Nearly lost two (stabilised them just in time) and all 6 spent time in the infirmary after that encounter. Have changed my tactics and loadout ever since, moving away from titan to ghost armour for the ground crew and archangel for the snipers, and thinking about restricting having two snipers to only those missions where I know there will be mostly open ground or where the second sniper is a gunslinger (up to 7 damage with their plasma pistol). Definitely not two snipers for large ship assaults.
Similarly, I was happy enough with EMP-armed Firestorms, one per continent, but an encounter with a battleship has more than persuaded me to construct some fusion lances. I now have a relative abundance of resources, but losing a Firestorm would still hurt, and it was only a bit of luck and the dodges from the defence matrix that saved it. Now I'm begging for another battleship because I want another fusion core to construct another blaster launcher. Those things are serious weapons.
Oddly, though, I've not had an alien abduction mission in months, so world panic is not an issue. Don't know if this is because I'm ready for the final mission, I have worldwide satellite coverage, there are only a set number of them, I've been extraordinarily lucky or it's just a bug...
The Psy lab remains the most unlikely building I thought I would have a use for...until I saw how OP some of the psy ability's can be. Even the most basic attack saved my bacon, when we run out of ammo and couldn't waste a turn reloading.Psi abilities are extremely useful, plus are required for the final mission, where you get some seriously powerful psi powers. All of them are useful, although I tend to go with panic over inspire and MC over telekinetic field. There is nothing more satisfying than MCing an ethereal...
therother
10-16-2012, 15:21
Ok, I have a complaint. There should be an easier way to transfer loadout items from inactive soldiers to those who are on your mission list. It's annoying to have to find the inactive soldier with the item you want, load them up, remove the item, load up the soldier you want, and then equip the item. I cannot find any in-game reason to have more than one squad's worth of any item, other than the convenience of not having to do this item swap dance, and money is so tight that I need to save every credit I can. That means not buying more equipment than I need.
Yes, it does have a number of UI quirks. For instance, would be nice to have easy access to a soldier's stats on the battlefield, especially will, without having to go into the info panel. Also, a tooltip over the ability icons would be handy. Not being able to ghost after selecting run and gun is strange, but have now trained myself to do it in the right order. Having to remember to rearm a newly constructed Firestorm after transfer is annoying, I often forget and then only have avalanche missles on hand when a UFO is detected. I also don't understand when you get the alien spotted sound during a movement but if you can't see it from where you end up you don't get any information about where it was. A little map would be great as well.
Edit: But for me the biggest issue by a country mile is controlling your soldiers movement when the terrain has different levels, especially larger ships. It's a real pain to have to get the right zoom and rotation settings to allow to move where you want to go...
HopAlongBunny
10-17-2012, 01:46
So far I'm impressed. This has to be the cleanest game I've played in a long time.
Transferring equipment is a bit fiddly ie: "where did I put that other Medkit?" In a tight place camera control is painful. No game breakers that I can see so far; a very welcome relief after Skyrim. Now if I could just get "assault" units to live a little longer....
Alexander the Pretty Good
10-17-2012, 23:16
Give them rifles and use run and gun for conservative flanking, not bum rushing.
Give them rifles and use run and gun for conservative flanking, not bum rushing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bOKsOveYD0
White_eyes:D
10-18-2012, 06:20
I have just made it half-way though one of the bloodiest months I have played on "X-COM:Enemy Unknown". It's like the game sense's that if it let's up for a few days, I am going to get my second wind and crush all opposition. I have had two UFO landing missions, another small scout that I shot down, 4 abduction missions, 1 terror mission and I also assaulted the alien base to get the panic levels down.
After that 4th abduction mission came swinging down when I was at my weakest, I had to ask the question if the game is trolling me or not...:wall:
I have over 500 alien alloys, 200 weapons fragments and tons of other stuff I will need later on. I am hurting bad after I lost three of my veterans with 5 going into critical care. Should I try it and risk losing 3 recruits and a newly minted squddie or just ignore it and hope panic levels don't go though the roof?
I am hoping that for the rest of the month after this, it's quiet and just lets my men get out of the hospital and get some new equipment researched...or this might be as far as I can go.:sweatdrop:
I have just made it half-way though one of the bloodiest months I have played on "X-COM:Enemy Unknown". It's like the game sense's that if it let's up for a few days, I am going to get my second wind and crush all opposition. I have had two UFO landing missions, another small scout that I shot down, 4 abduction missions, 1 terror mission and I also assaulted the alien base to get the panic levels down.
After that 4th abduction mission came swinging down when I was at my weakest, I had to ask the question if the game is trolling me or not...:wall:
I have over 500 alien alloys, 200 weapons fragments and tons of other stuff I will need later on. I am hurting bad after I lost three of my veterans with 5 going into critical care. Should I try it and risk losing 3 recruits and a newly minted squddie or just ignore it and hope panic levels don't go though the roof?
Yeah. The game is certainly an attrition battle once you get out of the early game, to the point where if you've had a squad completely wiped out even once in the first few months, it's almost not worth continuing. You need higher ranked guys to face down the Cyberdisks in the mid game. If you're cutting corners with explosives on the battlefield as well, you're also missing out on resources that you will desperately need when you hit laser tech. You'll find yourself in that awful spot where you're bloodied and beat up with only squadies and rookies to face down Mutons (with heavy plasma) and Cyberdisks. It's a terrifying position to be in.
I'm on my 10th attempt at classic after a run through normal. This time I am doing much better, as playing on Normal allowed me to formulate a much more viable long term strategy. Rushing sats, engineers and laser tech seems to be a good plan for the early to mid-game. With smart tactics you can really decimate the enemy no matter what they send at you. Still, classic being classic, you're always one shot away from disaster at any time. Love the tension.
I lost my best sniper and one of my favorite characters last night, code-named Garrote. It was nearing the end of April and laser tech was just starting to come off the line, but no carapace armor as of yet when the council wanted an escort. It was the alley way map. Two tall buildings seperated by a narrow alley. We elected to move over the rooftops with the VIP and all was going well, until time came for the decent. Thin Men had been dropping in the mission periodically and I'd nailed a few, but as we neared extraction i made a grave error and placed the VIP in a really vulnerable spot.
You can imagine my dismay when a sectoid group showed up when half of my team were out of actions. The vip took a plasma shot to the chest, but he survived! Unfortunately.. he was in a spot where the next turn he was a dead man for sure. We took out two of the sectoids but one still had a good shot on him. I knew the mission was gonna be a failure if I didn't find a way to save him.. so I had to make the ultimate sacrifice. Garrote was in position on the roof still and was the only unit with an action, she dropped down and ran in close to the sectoid and pulled out her pistol. Without bothering to take cover, she popped a few rounds off at the nasty little grey. Not enough to kill it, but more than enough to get it's attention...
The AI doesn't consider things like who the VIP is or what the objective is, it seems to prioritize targets by what type of covor your men are in and their overall chance to hit you. Garrote was in the enemy's face the chance to hit her was super high. The enemy took the bait, the sectoid turned and fired, and my sniper died a hero's death. Next turn I got the VIP into heavy cover, hit run and gun on my assault and blasted that little piece of :daisy: into oblivion... Rest easy, Garrote.
HopAlongBunny
10-18-2012, 17:57
Yeah. The game is certainly an attrition battle once you get out of the early game, to the point where if you've had a squad completely wiped out even once in the first few months, it's almost not worth continuing.
I have learned this more times than I care to admit :p
I am slowly realizing that motion does not have to always be forward; I can't imagine the game would be playable with limited ammo.
Papewaio
10-18-2012, 23:03
Still playing NI. Almost had a total squad wipe with Bravo. I had shot down a large UFO after taking 90% damage to two interceptors.
I landed Bravo squad with members of Charlie to fill gaps and a rookie to learn the ropes.
My first encounter was two of the crystal energy guys, then I triggered two floater packs. My sniper missed every shot. Assault was under pressure, support was outside the ship, heavy was maintaining pressure and the rookie was racking up the kills. Wiped out the two floater packs and a third. Assault was on two health and we were out of med packs. Stumbled into the next chamber and was setting up my guys at the sides of doors when a corridor between them was defogged.
Three chrisalyids procceded to munch on my heavy and sniper. Support, assault and rookie fell back firing as they went. However after killing one of the aliens the support died. Two more firing retreats with 3 zombies and 1 chrisalyid left and the rookie was poisoned. She died soon after as she made a retreat and shoot maneuver. At that point the assault run and gunned to the extraction zone.
Luckily with those in the infirmary I still have 2 active Bravo squad (promoting a Delta to Bravo), assault in the infirmary and enough troops in Alpha and Charlie to field a battle experienced squad.
Papewaio
10-18-2012, 23:03
Still playing NI. Almost had a total squad wipe with Bravo. I had shot down a large UFO after taking 90% damage to two interceptors.
I landed Bravo squad with members of Charlie to fill gaps and a rookie to learn the ropes.
My first encounter was two of the crystal energy guys, then I triggered two floater packs. My sniper missed every shot. Assault was under pressure, support was outside the ship, heavy was maintaining pressure and the rookie was racking up the kills. Wiped out the two floater packs and a third. Assault was on two health and we were out of med packs. Stumbled into the next chamber and was setting up my guys at the sides of doors when a corridor between them was defogged.
Three chrisalyids procceded to munch on my heavy and sniper. Support, assault and rookie fell back firing as they went. However after killing one of the aliens the support died. Two more firing retreats with 3 zombies and 1 chrisalyid left and the rookie was poisoned. She died soon after as she made a retreat and shoot maneuver. At that point the assault run and gunned to the extraction zone.
Luckily with those in the infirmary I still have 2 active Bravo squad (promoting a Delta to Bravo), assault in the infirmary and enough troops in Alpha and Charlie to field a battle experienced squad.
White_eyes:D
10-19-2012, 03:23
The AI doesn't consider things like who the VIP is or what the objective is, it seems to prioritize targets by what type of covor your men are in and their overall chance to hit you. Garrote was in the enemy's face the chance to hit her was super high. The enemy took the bait, the sectoid turned and fired, and my sniper died a hero's death. Next turn I got the VIP into heavy cover, hit run and gun on my assault and blasted that little piece of :daisy: into oblivion... Rest easy, Garrote. I think you should have hit "Hunker down" and she might have survived....but I understand wanting to kill him and not waste two weeks in the hospital.:shame:
Made it though the month very smoothly after that last abduction mission. I have Laser weapons, tons of other stuff researched, 3 of my best men/women being "tested" for psy power and a firebird nearly fresh off the line. In short, it was a VERY slow month and now I can curbstomp some Xenos. I missed that alien supply ship though...which just about destroyed my satellite.:wall:
That is going to hurt my material gathering efforts later on...:sweatdrop:
HopAlongBunny
10-19-2012, 07:42
Found this tech tree in a post at strategycore:
http://i.stack.imgur.com/NGLEJ.gif
For me it makes the whole tech thing a lot easier to understand :)
Found this tech tree in a post at strategycore:
http://i.stack.imgur.com/NGLEJ.gif
For me it makes the whole tech thing a lot easier to understand :)
Saved. Thanks hopalong :D
Killed my first berserker tonight. Felt damn good. I have this picture in my head that my troops pried the sucker's helm off and mounted it in their rec room for the sole purpose of telling stories to scare the crap outta the rookies. :laugh:
Figured out the hard counter to Cyberdisks, no surprising it's Heavies equipped with the HEAT ammo passive. Good god. You wanna talk about wrecking machines, these guys put Ivan Drago to shame when it comes to destroying robots. A normal LMG with HEAT ammo does 10 (!!) damage to all robotic enemies, non crit. The trick is keeping your heavies alive long enough for them to get the ability in the first place. I've been putting Nano-fiber on the heavies to try to give them the extra survivability, but honestly, I'm finding SCOPEs to be even better. A heavy with a scope on high ground is ridiculous.
This is the first time i've made it passed June on Classic and I am starting to really hit my stride, having gotten plasma tech and on a real roll with my sat coverage I think i've finally turned the corner. I'm starting to understand what most people mean when they say the early game is the hardest. Once you get full coverage on one or two continents the abduction missions really slow down. Then it becomes a game of fighting off UFOs and raiding the ones that land, which I have to say, is much less arduous than constantly going into abduction missions where 2 out of 3 continents are gonna get panic. :sweatdrop:
Out of curiosity, who are some of your guys' best soldiers? Right now the leader of my troops is a particularly intimidating Assault trooper from Scotland. She's the only survivor of the original 4 man squad the game gives you for the first mission and is nearing on 50 kills now.
https://i.imgur.com/3wSMt.jpg
Only thing that sucks about her is her low Will. She got critically wounded a few missions back and knocked unconscious so she has to live with the permanent negative to her stats. Still, it didn't stop her from gunning down 4 chrysalids on the last Terror mission :on_getsome:
easytarget
10-20-2012, 00:37
Yes it is. If I had a better fix on LOS, I could probably tolerate how hard it is, but since the approach is more DND in determining hit, if I get unlucky and the aliens get lucky, the mission can go ugly just way too fast for my tastes. So, I'm backing off classic ironman, just annoying me too much. If however I had a way to determine LOS that worked like combat mission, well, then I'd be up for it.
Minor quibble, rather like working your way through multi-level ships and having the damn UI flip out on you constantly.
All in all though, my first run through to completion on a campaign was the most fun I've had in a long time. Put a big smile on my face. Just as my 66 kill PSI sniper Colonel with pink archangel armor amused me so much that I went out of my way to put him in harms way so he could find some more new and interesting ways to "reach out and touch" aliens and relieve them of their earthly burden. ;)
Alexander the Pretty Good
10-20-2012, 03:42
Because I'm a huge wimp I beat the game on Normal/Ironman. Pretty awesome, though I was getting tired of supply ship attacks by the end with the multi-level UI.
When I'm less emotionally drained I'll start up a CI game with the cutscenes and glam-cam off.
HopAlongBunny
10-20-2012, 04:05
I am an even bigger wimp:p
Monk is at the point where all my "normal" campaigns fall apart; got plasma, good sat coverage, next level of armor researched (beyond carapace). All my "vets" die gloriously in a mission and just no way forward.
Changed up this go through. More interrogation, more sats early, got and did the alien base while still using bullets. I might even get to the end this time :)
frogbeastegg
10-20-2012, 13:52
Well, thanks to circumstances I got XCOM on day 1 and have barely had chance to play it. What I have played, I really enjoyed. There's a few things I'm not sold on, but I'll wait and see how they pan out across the game. Regardless, despite looking in askance at several large aspects of the design, I'm having a great time and can see myself replaying it quite a few times.
I'm at the beginning of month 3 now. Haven't even captured an alien yet. Took me about 4 hours to get that far ... I've actually left the game on standby for longer than I've played it. Well, could be worse. I've only managed to play 15 minutes of Dishonoured. :embarassed:
I've got 1 assault trooper on my team, and I will be completely heartbroken if anything happens to her! She's got the highest kill-count by far. Run and gun = dead alien. Pot shots from cover = dead alien. Reaction fire = dead alien. Shooting halfway across the map with a shotgun after my entire squad misses = dead alien! I can't believe some of the shots she has pulled off. The game named her 'android' and she's more than lived up to it - she's a total no-nonsense killing machine. Meanwhile my sniper misses plenty of shots, even with a scope and several promotions.
Terror From the Deep expansion now, please. I preferred that game's setting to the original's.
Attempting a stun on Classic Ironman is quite possibly the most nerve-wracking thing I have ever done in any game, ever.
HopAlongBunny
10-20-2012, 15:21
I am glad the game does not model friendly-fire casualties. I just had a Chrysallid vault from a second story; landed at the "five-spot" amidst a tight 4-pack of my soldiers; all were on overwatch, "bowed to their corner", and unleashed a storm of plasma!
That should have been mission over :p
I am glad the game does not model friendly-fire casualties. I just had a Chrysallid vault from a second story; landed at the "five-spot" amidst a tight 4-pack of my soldiers; all were on overwatch, "bowed to their corner", and unleashed a storm of plasma!
That should have been mission over :p
Unfortunately, friendly fire did result in mission over for me on an earlier Ironman attempt. I was on a VIP escort mission with everyone in cover and the VIP completely secure inside a storage container with a Heavy in full cover on overwatch standing guard over him. I moved up an assault, which revealed a previously unknown Thin Man on a nearby roof. The Thin Man took a reaction shot and killed my assault. Which caused my Heavy to panic and gun down the VIP. Ugg...
That's not as bad as what made me abort an otherwise decent Ironman attempt either. It was a bomb mission and I was doing pretty well. I had one man down on an all-vet squad of four, but he had been stabilized and there was only one sectoid left right by the bomb inside a building, with all 3 of my remaining soldiers ready to burst into the room, kill the sectoid, and defuse the bomb. On the sectoid's turn, he ran out of the door of the building that only had a single man guarding it (not on overwatch, due to rushing to get to the bomb), resulting in flanking of my guy. By a bloody miracle, the sectoid's follow-up shot from near point-blank range missed. The first thing I did on my turn was take the flanked assault guy up to point blank range and finish the Sectoid with a single shotgun blast. Unfortunately, I had not checked movement distances, and he was the only soldier who could get to the bomb without dashing. Both of the other two soldiers ended 1 square away from the bomb and thus couldn't defuse it before it charged. And since all three of my men were right at the bomb when it charged, I couldn't get them back to the evacuation zone and the entire team was killed when it went off.
I'm currently farther along in Classic Ironman (attempt 28, only about 5 of which I played past mission 2), but I'm down to about 8 soldiers on rotation and am losing men regularly. I may have to give Ironman a try on Normal instead... I'm just not good enough for this. It feels like no matter how careful I am, there's nothing I can do to prevent sheer bad luck from causing the death of critical soldiers.
I'm currently farther along in Classic Ironman (attempt 28, only about 5 of which I played past mission 2), but I'm down to about 8 soldiers on rotation and am losing men regularly. I may have to give Ironman a try on Normal instead... I'm just not good enough for this. It feels like no matter how careful I am, there's nothing I can do to prevent sheer bad luck from causing the death of critical soldiers.
When i played the game initially I thought that Ironman was the way to go, it just felt so.. visceral. So intense. It is no exageration to say every moment was an edge of your seat experience in Ironman. The fate of the world literally hangs upon every single shot you take, and that is not an experience that you can find in games very often.
The problem comes in how small scale your operation is. When you have a max of a 6 man squad (starting at 4), you can suffer a complete Pearl Harbor in a matter of seconds. The limited number of soldiers you have at your disposal means things need to go perfectly every single mission, if not? A Muton scores a lucky crit on your star assault and kills him, your sergeant heavy freaks the hell out and guns down another squadie, or worse, a VIP. End of game right there.
Those kinds of scenarios can happen in the blink of an eye, and you'll be sitting there completely stunned that the game is, effectively, over. It's a harsh sting largely because when you sit back and ask yourself, "Okay, why did I lose?" you will invariably come to the conclusion, "The dice just weren't on my side," and that is one of the worst feelings in gaming. You did everything right, it was just bad luck.
May/June is really the terminal point in my opinion, if you lose a single beefy squad on Ironman? You might as well just pack it in right there because you are now effectively so far behind you'll never win.
Ironman is an incredible experience because it gives you that tension.. but when your total failure state is, at any time, a single dice roll away (and you are literally rolling dozens upon dozens of dice every mission) it can quickly turn into an exercise in frustration. Everyone should without a doubt play Ironman to get that feeling I described, but if you want to keep your sanity? Play on regular. Trust me. You'll scream less obscenities at your monitor.
HopAlongBunny
10-20-2012, 18:11
. Which caused my Heavy to panic and gun down the VIP.
Ouch! Which brings up another reason why a mid/late game wipe is so devastating.
Rookies/Squaddies spend most of their time in "panic" mode when faced with the storm of firepower you end up facing. I guess that's why one reviewer noted you can become more "attached and protective" of your veterans than your own children.
Attempting a stun on Classic Ironman is quite possibly the most nerve-wracking thing I have ever done in any game, ever.
I just captured a Muton, in CI, and I still have no idea how I did it lol
Papewaio
10-21-2012, 01:00
Still playing the same NI game. My roster rotation is absorbing my worst mistakes at the tactical level.
I encountered my first berserker. The heavy went into high cover and activated him within dashing range. He opened fire, then my top support shot at him and he kept on charging. Right into the arms of the squads assault with arc thrower. Took the live puppy home to the Doc.
Got through a couple months on Classic Ironman, much further than I ever did before. Attrition started to take a toll, however. Lost my only good sniper to bad luck. He was at full health in full cover, and got nailed by a critical hit that killed him instantly. Got out of that mission okay, but in the next mission my top Support got critically wounded and was down for a while. As a result, I ended up going into my first terror mission with three lowly squaddies accompanying the my veteran heavy and assault. I did pretty well, clearing about 2/3 of the map without issues. I'd lost about 1/3 of the civilians, but few of those losses were anything I could have prevented. I started to move into a warehouse to save the last of them. moved into a small entry room with two closed doors, rescuing a civvy who was inside. I stationed my experienced assault and my backup support at the door, ready for a breach entry with another backup inside and the other two on overwatch outside. Before I could open the door, a zombie rose up from the ground on the same square as my vet assault and killed him in one blow before I even got a chance to react. I have no idea how the zombie got there; both doors to the room were closed when I entered and the civvy was alive, meaning no aliens had ever entered. I managed to dispatch the zombie, but two Chrysalids showed up in the middle of it right next to my men. I knew none of my men would survive at that range, so I charged everyone I could into as close range as possible to try and blast them all down before they got to move. I got one, but the second didn't go down. It took down my support, critically wounded. Unfortunately, the only med kit available to stabilize him was on his body, which mean I was screwed. Then two zombies appeared. I actually managed to kill them both with my remaining 3 men before the support bled out, but in the process lost another assault. After that, I aborted the campaign. I had three three vets left, but two were wounded and wouldn't be available for the next mission, meaning I'd have to go in with a veteran sniper and four rookies. I wasn't even going to bother trying to play like that.
So, I started a Normal Ironman game, and I've breezed through my first two months without a single loss taking the hardest missions thrown at me. It's startling how much a jump there is in difficulty between Normal and Classic. I wish there was an intermediate level.
Papewaio
10-21-2012, 02:56
2k forums there is a few mentioning the large jump in difficulty.
One guy is playing impossible and once his squad is on the ground switching to normal. That way he gets lots of aliens but not the +/- modifiers for higher difficulty.
My biggest squad killer so far has been exploding cars. Particularly from suppression fire through vehicles other team members are hiding behind... Stupidity on my part.
HopAlongBunny
10-21-2012, 05:47
One thing that really annoys me is the lack of a manual (dl version)
I am building stuff that does not appear to have any use: alloy cannon, blaster launcher. They certainly sound cool but no one/thing can equip them.
I really don't like playing the game like "blindmans bluff"
edit: ok, finally found the slots for those; I thought I had checked everything...but...there are an awful lot of slots :p So 3months after I built them I'll start to use them
I am building stuff that does not appear to have any use: alloy cannon, blaster launcher.
Two of the best weapons in the game!
HopAlongBunny
10-21-2012, 15:23
Two of the best weapons in the game!
Yes! Yes they are!!! Now that I know who equips them I don't know how I lived without them :laugh4:
That final mission was a bit of a shocker, but now I can see a clear use for the Mind-shield I had been ignoring.
Life with the carapace armour feels good lol
I assaulted the alien base with the normal one, succeeded, but boy that was tough, never played so defensively XD
easytarget
10-21-2012, 22:53
LOL, on my last mission in current campaign I stunned a muton beserker and an outsider, but forgot I still had 3 days till the containment was built.
And my new best approach to getting soldiers dead: having one them get PSI'd and shoot up the rest of the team while I mess about trying to stun an Ethereal.
Greyblades
10-22-2012, 05:04
My best death: I got so used to having titan armoured squaddies I forgot my starting rookies' armour is useless, I started a new game, made my team stand out in the open and-
*PSSHH*
~:eek:
...It's kinda embarassing to have 3 of my best men mere 2 hours after taking out the final boss killed by sectoids and thin men.
HopAlongBunny
10-22-2012, 06:53
A more complete tech-tree:
7463
Much thanks to xdude whoever he/she/it happens to be :)
A more complete tech-tree:
7463
Much thanks to xdude whoever he/she/it happens to be :)
Looking at the full tech tree i'm wondering how effective a full rush to light plasma would be that skipped lasers entirely. I spent a LOT of time slogging through laser tech in my current game, but if I focused on containment right out of the gate and gave half the squad arc throwers, stocking up on Light Plasma Rifles wouldn't be that hard. It would just require clever tactics and a bit of RNG luck. Hm. This demands some experimenting on my next play through!
HopAlongBunny
10-22-2012, 12:23
Looking at the full tech tree i'm wondering how effective a full rush to light plasma would be that skipped lasers entirely. I spent a LOT of time slogging through laser tech in my current game, but if I focused on containment right out of the gate and gave half the squad arc throwers, stocking up on Light Plasma Rifles wouldn't be that hard. It would just require clever tactics and a bit of RNG luck. Hm. This demands some experimenting on my next play through!
I've done that on Normal. You miss the lasers a little bit, esp for your sniper. You save time and more importantly resources "skipping ahead". On Normal I can't see bothering with lasers, it might not work on higher difficulty.
Sir Moody
10-22-2012, 13:19
in Normal you can easily skip right passed lasers
in Classic you cant afford to wait
All enemies except Sectoids have ramped up health and accuracy - you need them dead NOW - and your soldiers have reduced accuracy bullet weapons just wont cut it after the first month
Similarly in Normal you never need to use anything but light plasma rifles (for the +10 aim buff) but in classic as soon as the trooper has leveled enough not to need the bonus (captain and up in my experience) they should swap to a full plasma rifle for the extra damage (elite mutons have 14 health and come in groups of 2 or 3)
From my own experience Normal is cake walk - Classic is a true challange
From my own experience Normal is cake walk - Classic is a true challange
It is startling just how much of a difference there is. The numbers on my save games tell me that I tried Classic Ironman 37 times, with probably only about 5 of those going beyond mission 2, and only two beyond month one. In every case I lost important soldiers when I could not afford to do so, to the extent that I didn't think it worth continuing.
For attempt 38, I did Normal Ironman. I'm now many months into this game, my first on Normal Ironman, and have only lost 3 soldiers, all rookies, and have multiple Colonels. Satellites everywhere with terror levels low, and only lost two countries early on. Half the missions I go on no one even gets hit. I've gotten myself into serious trouble which, on Classic, would almost certainly have led to 3+ deaths, and emerged without any casualties. Indeed, of my 3 deaths, 2 occurred on a single mission when nearly all of my vets were wounded, forcing me to assault a landed UFO with a veteran sniper and 4 rookies. I finished the alien base assault mission almost effortlessly.
It's kind of amazing that I can do this well this easily on Normal Ironman, but can barely get off the ground on Classic Ironman.
It's kind of amazing that I can do this well this easily on Normal Ironman, but can barely get off the ground on Classic Ironman.
Agreed. I really think there needs to be a difficulty between classic and normal, something like "Normal+" or "Advanced" difficulty. Not quite Classic but not quite normal either.
Just got back from the UFO raid from hell. 3 sectoid commanders, 3 elites, 1 berserker and 2 mutons. I was feeling pretty cocky so I had rotated in two rookies to help clear it, boy was that a mistake. Had to gun one down because it was mind controlled (and I couldnt get a shot on the commander) and the other got turned into paste by a Berzerker. Poor rookies :no:
Sir Moody
10-22-2012, 14:49
don't mourn them - that is what they are for :laugh4:
seriously however you should rotate rookies into your ranks early on to build up a solid core of troops - later it really isn't possible since they will panic CONSTANTLY
if you spend the first few months rotating in rookies you should be able to take a few hard knocks and be able to replace losses without having to fall back on rookies
on my own campaign - classic of course (I got bored with the Normal one so never finished it) - I am now able to start the final mission - its November and I only lost 9 men - only 2 higher than captain (a major and a captain - the major (my sniper) died in what I like to call the "mission from hell" - an abduction which saw me facing 9 Mutons and a Berserker ... at once - frankly I am amazed he was my only loss)
playing classic takes a completely different mindset - in normal you can easily push forwards and rarely have to stop - in classic you have to play a LOT more defensively - often you move a single unit forwards to the limmit of his first move - spot enemies and then retreat and move the rest of the unit into "crossfire" positions where they over watch - if done correctly the enemy will not see any of your men and thus will charge after you - right into the waiting crossfire
there is no feeling worse in classic than rushing a soldier forwards only to expose a Sectopod... those guys are just EVIL
therother
10-22-2012, 15:24
Yeah, retreating to strong defensive positions is the key tactic on classic and impossible. You are often faced with 2 or more groups of aliens activating at the same time and you need all the help you can get.
This is made much easier when you get ghost armour. TBH, I think ghost armour is a little too good, even without the actual ghosting ability it would be a good choice: +6 to HP, high manoeuvrability (increased range plus grapple), +20 to defence (equivalent to being in half cover even in the open, full cover when in half). Then you have the ghosting itself: the ability to freely scout the battlefield, discovering alien positions without them triggering, ability to pull back from a fight with ease, and of course +100 to critical chance when firing from ghost. Which is really the icing on the cake. I often use it just to guarantee a kill: even sectopods can be taken down in one turn by one assault rapid firing their alloy cannon from ghost at point blank range.
The only drawbacks are 4 less HP than titan and it doesn't have the resistance to flame and poison. And the expense. But resources are usually easier to come by later in the game.
don't mourn them - that is what they are for :laugh4:
seriously however you should rotate rookies into your ranks early on to build up a solid core of troops - later it really isn't possible since they will panic CONSTANTLY
if you spend the first few months rotating in rookies you should be able to take a few hard knocks and be able to replace losses without having to fall back on rookies
Yeah I think I really messed up, that's been my one blunder on this go. I've got about 10 really good vets but I'm one bad mission away from being in a really tough spot. Rookies just don't have the ability to go face to face with Mind Control in the way I hoped. I should have rotated in many more rookies around June (i'm in November now, classic) instead of focusing on my A squad.
there is no feeling worse in classic than rushing a soldier forwards only to expose a Sectopod... those guys are just EVIL
I haven't had a terrible moment with Sectopods yet as I've been extremely careful (and lucky) when encountering them. I always roll with 2 heavies with HEAT rounds, suppression, mayhem and Dangerzone. If they see a Sectopod it's time to bulletstorm that :daisy: into oblivion. ~D
johnhughthom
10-23-2012, 13:51
Wow, can't believe I've never played one of these. Monk's tale of his sole surviving Scottish lass called Softie piqued my interest in the game and I dowloaded the demo on PSN. Popping out now to buy it, pity it doesn't have the full version on PSN...
Wow, can't believe I've never played one of these. Monk's tale of his sole surviving Scottish lass called Softie piqued my interest in the game and I dowloaded the demo on PSN. Popping out now to buy it, pity it doesn't have the full version on PSN...
:grin2: Yeah, you could say I've got a soft spot for Softie. :laugh4: I've been too busy working on my mod, coding some html and other stuff to play much. Hopefully that will change in the next few days!
In case you guys didn't preorder they released the customization pack today as a DLC download. To be honest I think it's a bit pricey. Color customization, helmets and 2 skins for $5. Still, I can't deny that the colors and helmets are great fun for being purely cosmetic. You be the judge. Link to the download is here: http://store.steampowered.com/app/209811/
Alexander the Pretty Good
10-23-2012, 23:45
I'm too lazy / too averse of playing God (lol) to muck about with the customization stuff, and I think the alt armor is ugly, so I wouldn't get it all if I didn't have it through the pre-order.
It'll probably go on sale for a more reasonable price.
Papewaio
10-24-2012, 00:29
I'm constantly using my crayons to colour them in. One thing the game does it forgets the armour customization type.
My Alpha squad are all bulky armour and helmets.
Exceptional or story elements help in colour choices.
My two team members I've picked up in missions are:
A female sniper with Nickname: Lady Grey. So instead of charcoal her uniform is a light grey.
After a VIP mission to Japan (politician suspected of joining the aliens) I picked up a Japanese Assault Captain with the Nickname "Sheriff". I could see a guy who was prepared to do the right thing no matter what in turning in a fellow citizen. So not only did I change his colour scheme from Red to Sheriff Badge gold I also picked up all the skills with a shield device in them. Sure it is non-standard/potentially sub optimized but I really like the RPG element.
HopAlongBunny
10-24-2012, 07:01
I couldn't resist.
The idea of hot pink killing machines appealed to my sense of irony. Declare! Display! Destroy!!!
Sir Moody
10-24-2012, 13:04
personally I just set them all to use the black and white scheme and never changed anything else...
I wouldn't have bought it as a DLC but since I have it via preorder I may as well change the terrible default armour to something a little more aesthetically pleasing
johnhughthom
10-24-2012, 13:40
Shop was sold out when I went to get it yesterday, they are sending me out the pre-order edition cheaper than it was in store. :2thumbsup: I am looking forward to 'hot pink killing machines' now.
Just finished the game, goodness. What a ride. The ending was a bit.. underwhelming. But it's.. well...
Sequel bait!
Steam says I have close to 50 hours played in XCOM since release.. so I suppose I'm totally fine with the ending being that. Finished the game on classic after defending the earth for 270 days, lost 15 soldiers and 6 funding countries. Killed 470 aliens, I very nearly got the "Pale Horse" Achievement all in one run through :laugh4:
I managed to keep all of NA, SA and Europe but Asia and Africa suffered. Saved Egypt and Japan, the rest left of the world the project and conspired with aliens.. dirty traitors.
HopAlongBunny
10-24-2012, 17:33
...Finished the game on classic...
Grats!!!
Grats!!!
:bow:
The last few missions were getting really tense as by the time Ethereals come onto the field, Sectopods are a common sight. It's not a rarity to encounter two on the same mission, and if you're incredibly unlucky, also not uncommon to encounter them at the same time. I had to call up a number of rookies and threw them into the fire, some of the greatest heroes of the final charge were born out of XCOM's greatest time of need.
My final memorial
What's sad is.. I remember them all. Each and every one...
https://i.imgur.com/rQ21P.jpg
"Fallout" Yadav was the greatest unsung hero of the XCOM campaign. He came in at around July and quickly found a place in the A-team next to "Lumberjack" Kohler. Both guys were heavy weapons experts and both of them provided a 1-2 knockout punch whenever things started to get intense. You needed a cyberdisk swatted out of the sky? Lumberjack will knock him down. Need a wall flattened so the assaults can rush in? Fallout's on the job. When Sectopods first started showing up these guys wreaked total havoc on them.
"Patch" Illyushin from Russia. Formerly of the Russian Airborn Infantry he was selected as the Kremlin's contribution to the XCOM project after an attempted Xenos incursion of St. Petersburg was halted in around May, if memory serves. He was the best medic XCOM ever saw, able to patch up just about any combat wound. No trooper ever died under his watch, and somehow, he always managed to get every man and woman out alive who he went into a fight with.
Operation Devil's Thorn was the attack on an Overseer UFO, rumored to house an artifact of huge importance to the war effort. While scouting the perimeter out troops ran into two Sectopods accompanied by four Drones. The terrain didn't allow for easy maneuverability, and worse yet, the Sectopods' range outpaced that of our own weaponry. Yadav occupied the high ground and blew out the surrounding obstacles around the sectopods to open up sight lines for our sniper, unfortunately, he drew the attention of the beasts in the moments that followed. The mechanical beings opened their hulls and opened fire on his position, killing him instantly. Illyushin tried to make it to the high ground but was gunned down in between cover before he could. The mission ended in success, despite the loss of two of XCOM's greatest heroes.
"Whiskey" White, Assault trooper, shotgun specialist, first pioneer of the scatter laser and first member of XCOM to score a confirmed kill on the dreaded Cyberdisks. While there were many valiant and well known assault troopers in the XCOM project, most preferred the use of rifles and a more cautious approach in dealing with the xenos threat. White never had any of it, and believed in a full on frontal attack. Her love of close-combat won her both respect and a bit of a reputation for being reckless. Her Run & Gun style made her the obvious choice for Terror Sites, where she could get in, secure civilains and then get the hell out.
Operation Blind Throne was a terror attack on Cairo as the month of June came to a close. The Xenos had unleashed a dozen Chrysalids into the city and casualties were quickly running high. Local officials were being overrun by undead and xenos forces when the call came through for XCOM, by the time boots were on the ground the situation was completely unsalvageable. What was meant to be a civilian evac quickly turned into a fight for survival against hordes of undead. White was ambushed by a Chrysalid as she and Jin "Septic" Park were clearing through a Police station. Though not stated on the official reports, local surveillance equipment later seized by government officials show Park and other operatives refusing to leave the Terror Site until they tracked down and killed the "turned" corpse of White before a Chrysalid could erupt from within.
"All Day" Chepurnova, Support gunner and widely considered the best runner in the outfit. She was the butt of many a playful rib from the longest serving XCOM operative, "Softie" Mcintyre for 'being able to leap tall buildings in a single bound.' All day was the flanking specialist, while Lumberjack or other forces pinned Xenos threats with concentrated suppression, Chepurnova would lead the flanking fireteam into position.
Operation Lone Star, an abduction mission at the end of May went incredibly bad, incredibly quickly. What began as a routine cleanup that local security forces couldn't handle turned ugly when Thin Men outfoxed XCOM's attempts to pin down a number of Sectoids. Chepurnova's flanking mission fell into cross fire, by the time operatives moved in to support, Lt. Chepurnova had already fallen.
"Jazz" Gonzalez. The first sniper we ever had for the XCOM project, and arguably one of the best to ever take up that role. He joined the project after the disastrous first mission wherein only one survivor returned from the operations and was instrumental in rallying together the rookies after such a frightening loss was incurred. The first "leader" of the troops, he reported directly to the mysterious Commander. He was the first man in human history to wield the Laser Sniper Rifle, code named the X-R12, and proved his undeniable prowess with on the battlefield against the Xeno shocktroopers, the Mutons.
Operation Empty Hammer was a response to a distressed 9-1-1 call, intercepted by the XCOM project. Construction workers had come under fire from xenos and were being taken to a ship just on the outskirts of a residential area. The call was made to move in before local law enforcement could get on the scene, hopefully securing the site and saving the workers before anyone really knew what was going on. Gonzalez took up position near an abandoned, still running car to provide overwatch as the team moved in. Unfortunately, what was not realized is that the Mutons had brought along Floaters to screen their advance. As Operatives moved in, floaters dropped in behind the lines and cornered Gonzalez. No one knows why he had a grenade on him, it was standard operating procedures to equip all snipers with the specialized S.C.O.P.E attachments. But unable to get a clear shot on his flankers, Gonzalez is reported to have charged forward close to the enemy and pulled the pin. The resulting explosion took out two cars and killed the Xeno, along with himself.
"Road-Block" Meyer from Germany, one of the most imposing men to ever dawn the armor and swear the oath of service. Heavy weapons specialist and a bear of a man, Meyer was also the friendliest guy in the barracks. He always went out of his way to help the rookies get acclimated with the stresses of the job, and was often seen in the rec room having a drink with whatever new face happened to be about to head out on patrol.
Operation Frozen King was a VIP retrieval mission. A politician in Europe had been double-dealing with the aliens, selling out earth in the hope that he would be spared whatever coming fate was planned for the Human race. Road-block took point on a roof top and lead the way for "All Day" and "Softie" to come in behind, That's when he turned a corner around an air conditioner to find a group of Thin Men awaiting in ambush. Softie barely had time to call for cover when Road Block was hit and went down.
"Septic" Park was never the same after Blind Throne. Seeing a close comrade subjected to the brutality of death by the hands of Chrysalids is.. difficult. He had been largely outgoing and friendly before the Terror mission that saw "Whiskey" White's death, afterward, he was quiet. Solemn. Most operatives gave him space, understanding the stress. He would come around with time. He'd recover. Earth needed him, Earth needed all of them, after all.
Operation Morbid Spark, two days after Blind Throne, a UFO was spotted over a missile silo in Europe. XCOM fighters splashed the UFO and the team was sent in to recover any and all artifacts they could. May and June had both seen significant losses for the XCOM project, so Park was called in to help with the clear. All able bodied veterans were desperately needed to stand on the front line. Unfortunately, it seems it was just a bit too soon for him. After action reports from his fellow Operatives paint the picture of a man who could barely hold his rifle straight. In the heat of the moment, he panicked and tried to vault over cover and make a break back for the skyranger. A muton saw him move and opened fire...
HopAlongBunny
10-25-2012, 18:46
:dizzy2:It is interesting how a RNG and an investment of time can have us attribute personalities/histories to pixels
:dizzy2:It is interesting how a RNG and an investment of time can have us attribute personalities/histories to pixels
Best part about gaming if you ask me. :grin2:
Finished on CI and meh the ending was ok, for what Monk said, but the events leading to it, let me down a bit...
Still great game and can't wait for the DLC with the missions in China ^^
Off to find mods or MP games now lol
Since in the endgame, even on CI, you become pretty much unbeatable XD
HopAlongBunny
10-26-2012, 14:45
You ppl are embarrassing me!:embarassed:
I'm still slogging away at normal :p
I have to say I wish this game was about twice as long as it is. I know what you're thinking. "Monk, you spent 40 hours on a single playthrough, how the heck can you want MORE."
There's a point in the game where if you're playing well, you turn a corner, and so long as nothing utterly disastrous happens you really can't lose, like Arjos said, you become unbeatable. I mean yes, Sectopods are :daisy: scary and Ethereals are a real pain, but by the time you get to that point you have so many safety nets that as long as you don't lose 5 of your squad, back to back, you're fine. It's a far cry from the early game where every shot, every grenade, every moment is a tense struggle for survival against the simplest of enemies. Once you hit Titan armor you can really play pretty fast and loose with your soldiers with almost no negative consequences to your actions, as long as the aliens can't frontload like, 20 damage a turn, nothing can really kill you. You'll always be able to put down some cover fire, fall back and heal up. I guess that's why Sectopods are so dangerous and have such cheap abilities, they are literally the only things, minus mind control units, that can kill you after you get Titan.
There simply comes a point where the tension that the game builds so beautifully in the early game gets lost. In some ways that's incredible because now it's time to throw the aliens off your world. Payback is a :daisy: and all that, but I had way more fun when it was me and a half dozen, outmatched grunts against the unknown. A fight where every square could reveal a new and deadly enemy that I've never seen before. I don't know.
I think if they ever make an expansion or a DLC that is a continuation of the story (not the upcoming DLC that is a side-story) I think they should really work hard to throw you back into that tense feeling. Some kind of strategic layer consequence needs to be there that shakes you out of your comfort zone, even when you're rocking full titan. I know they had trouble getting Base Invasions to work and those would have accomplished exactly what I am talking about. It doesn't have to be invasions, but it needs to be something.
tl;dr the first 4 months of the game are some of the most engaging and tense action i've ever had as a gamer, and the late game simply cannot compare.
HopAlongBunny
10-29-2012, 15:02
I do hope they publish a patch to deal with some of the LOS issues.
Running through the "Temple ship" I've had some bizarre results. My assault revealed a cpl of Mutons and took one down. On the next turn the remaining Muton blasts me; I move up the follow-on units-none of which can "see" the Muton (although it should have been in clear sight of at least 2)-so no shots fired. My assault moves the 3tiles to get adjacent for a "Rapid-fire" execution-Muton disappears from screen. End turn and Muton blasts my assault into oblivion-wth!
Issues like these will keep me from ever bothering with "Iron-man".
Papewaio
10-30-2012, 08:50
The orginal game allowed multiple bases. Add to that they were from a plan view it would have been easier to have base attacks with consequences but not neccesarily a game wipe for a loss.
It was interesting when a radar installation came under attack by an alien battleship with only a squad of four rookies in basic armour and laser rifles. Because in the old one you had to worry about ammunition, laser weapons had unlimited ammo and were great for base defence. Or one of your manufacturing hubs came under attack... Those bases generated more income then the council of nations and as such had a dozen well equipped veterans and a couple of tanks to guard them... I pity the fool alien for attacking those bases... It was more like alien alloy delivery then a butt kicking.
HopAlongBunny
11-02-2012, 02:49
I think it was Pape that pointed out satellites are key. My last playthrough sats kept me flush and my bottleneck was with elementium.
It seems once you get good coverage and some Firestorms the whole game settles down.
The game is addictive :) Started a "Classic" run through and have revealed the vast limits of my knowledge...
HopAlongBunny
11-02-2012, 20:51
Good luck :) I have had games go sideways at the point you are at. A ramp up in alien firepower and a bad mission can blow it all up.
A real upside to the game is you can never get sloppy; its a bit of a tight-rope right up until you are packing the best of the best in every slot.
HopAlongBunny
11-05-2012, 01:59
Owee!
Nice to get the base out of the way though :) With luck you'll have a few easier missions to cultivate some squaddies into higher ranks.
I like how you have to pay attention to all the pipelines: research, personnel, air cover; to keep things moving forward.
johnhughthom
11-06-2012, 09:48
Running fine on my PS3, only issues seem to be the universal problems, shooting through walls, animation clipping etc.
Greyblades
11-06-2012, 16:19
I have to say I don't like how when your men die you lose the equipment they were carrying. You're telling me you couldn't retrieve the body after clearing the map!? I spent a small fortune on that titan armour, dang it!
HopAlongBunny
11-07-2012, 00:05
Are you sure you lost the equipment?
I have not seen that (so far) I find that all the equipment just goes into "storage" when someone dies or ends up in the infirmary.
I am a little annoyed that when my medic gets killed I can't nab the Medkits from his body during the same mission.
Greyblades
11-07-2012, 02:40
Trust me I've lost way too many arc throwers and medkits due to my hapless goons ending the turn out in the open just to heal a veteran or snag those valuable live alien specimens, losing titan armour or plasma sniper rifles, while rare, is one heck of a noticeable blow.
I had a funny moment when I finished the game:
I had two men in critical condition awaiting medkits when my sniper finally took down that last boss and I ended up watching a cutscene where the two remaining members of my team, a medic and a sniper, hauled ass and left thier friends bleeding on the bridge of a doomed mothership. No man left behind, this outfit 'aint.
HopAlongBunny
11-13-2012, 08:00
Ghost Armor + (Run+Gun) = Awesome! :)
HopAlongBunny
11-13-2012, 09:40
You should be all set; the Sectopods are nasty! (I save at least one rocket for them) All you can really do is keep spread out and blast with everything you've got.
The final encounter is actually easier than it looks but I don't want to give anything away. Just use anything to even the score; one run through I mind-controlled the Mutons and that gave me time to get up close and personal with the Ethereals.
HopAlongBunny
11-13-2012, 10:32
I think I'm up to 3 complete run-throughs; In any case, I've had 2 Psionic soldiers each time. I take the time to test every soldier on my roster (including Rookies)
I also give everyone a Mind shield thingy; I hate having my soldiers shooting their friends; usefulness is questionable though-I have only seen 1 attempt blocked.
Is it possible to have more than one Psionic soldier?
If you mean, soldiers with the powers to mind control etc, yes, they aren't common, but you can have a few (I had a complete team of 6 for example)...
If you meant the soldier, who can access the ethereal device, I do not know tbh, didn't lost mine, so I've no idea whether another can take his place...
As for the final battle:
I had my sniper right in the middle, when I accessed the last room...
Heavy got in and shot, with holo-targeting, then squadsight took care of the rest lol
All you need to do is kill the boss, the rest of the aliens can be ignored :)
HopAlongBunny
11-13-2012, 14:54
Yay!
If you mean, soldiers with the powers to mind control etc, yes, they aren't common, but you can have a few (I had a complete team of 6 for example)...
If you meant the soldier, who can access the ethereal device, I do not know tbh, didn't lost mine, so I've no idea whether another can take his place...
As for the final battle:
I had my sniper right in the middle, when I accessed the last room...
Heavy got in and shot, with holo-targeting, then squadsight took care of the rest lol
All you need to do is kill the boss, the rest of the aliens can be ignored :)
The last fight was a bit.. anticlimactic for me. I just identified which was the "boss" and let my Squad Sight, Double Tap Sniper (with a Plasma Sniper Rifle) have at it. Two crits for 19 damage each. Nothing says "Welcome to Earth" quite like that.
As for the double Sectopods, that's where rolling with two heavies really comes into play. A Heavy Plasma Rifle with HEAT rounds does like 13-16 damage on a non-crit to sectopods. Two heavies with bulletstorm? Dear lord, the amount of damage you're putting out is insane. The trick is getting them into position and not getting killed by the magical :daisy: beam of death.
HopAlongBunny
11-14-2012, 00:59
The last fight was tough. I was lucky because the boss mind-controlled a heavy; I hate mind-control so I just focused on that Ethereal. I was shocked/relieved when everything disappeared as soon as it died :)
That encounter becomes almost trivial once you learn the "trick".
HopAlongBunny
11-16-2012, 00:56
The jump normal=>classic is huge. Playing normal you might have a couple of fights where the aliens are really tough; on Classic the AI has raised its game for every fight, and (as you note) there are more of them. I have yet to complete a game on Classic :(
HopAlongBunny
11-16-2012, 01:50
Tactically it seems to be safer to use a standard "pull to kill group"; I really like SHIV's for pulling (cheap and no skills to lose) You will lose ppl, so it is nice to "cultivate" 2 full squads to try and keep a good flow of quality troops to the front.
Strategically, you start in a deeper hole. The balancing act firepower/armour/air cover becomes a lot more important. :juggle:
Sir Moody
11-16-2012, 14:28
a few helpful tips when it comes to equipment which helps when playing classic
Which armour should I be using
Ghost > Titan
Titan armour may seem great - the massive hp boost would make this the best armour right? well no...
Ghost armour has a grapple, can phase (hiding you) and comes with a built in +30 defense - the equivalent of being in low cover when in the open... better still you can use one of the hp boosting items to put it ahead of titan in hp... its win win
The same is true of skeleton and Carapace - Skeleton comes with a grapple and +15 defense
Who should be equipping the Arc Thrower
I spent most my first run through giving this to my shotgun wielding assaults - I realized part way through my second run through I was doing it totally wrong - by giving the Assaults Arc throwers I couldn't give them HP boosting equipment which meant they would often spend more time in the med bay (when your soldiers take damage if the damage is less than the Armour + Item hp boost they wont have to go to the med bay) since they were nearly always the closest to the aliens and thus drew more fire.
The best soldier to receive the Arc Thrower is the Support (preferable with Sprint) - why? once they level enough you can give them a med kit and a arc thrower - allowing them to fill both roles - and with sprint they don't have to be quite so close so they will (hopefully) draw less fire
alternatively they should be used by Recruits/Squadies since they are more "disposable"
How do I maximize my Psi soldiers
the power of a Psi trooper is directly related to their will - the higher their will the stronger their psi attack (and defense).
if you want to maximize the Psi troopers (to mind control an Ethereal for example) you will want to give them Psi Armour and a Mind shield (which doesn't just add to psi defense - it is actually the equivalent of the psi amp from the classic game) and use the Psi Inspire ability the turn before
truthfully however this isn't required outside of the final mission where having +will is incredible helpful
Most of the time you don't need more than the occasional Mind fray for a hard to hit biological and it is generally better to not focus on Psionics at all
Dang it, all of you going on about this game ... I suppose I may have to buy it. I'm guessing there's low to no chance of a Steam sale between now and Christmas?
Alexander the Pretty Good
11-22-2012, 03:35
Ask and you shall receive - the turducken weekend-ish sale includes XCOM for $34.
Ask and you shall receive - the turducken weekend-ish sale includes XCOM for $34.
Sold!
I've been waiting for a sale to justify buying this. :yes:
Yup, $34 for a new A-list game is more than fair. Done and done.
And now I'm off to visit relatives for three days. But when I come back ...
HopAlongBunny
11-24-2012, 18:00
... some thin men bastards will get a series of lucky crits on my experienced troops.:laugh4:
Misery loves company!
Papewaio
11-26-2012, 00:48
In CI you have to remember it is best to hunker down for a turn then move the last person into a new line of sight.
Classic is all about cover and situational modifications. For instance skeleton suit adds +10 defence so it is actually better then carapace for overall defence. Combine that with hard cover and you had +50 defence. Suppress enemy flankers to reduce their aim by -30 and wham the enemy are -80% to hit you.
However when it comes to enemies with area of effect weapons which always have a 90 or 100% chance to hit your best defence is back off and overwatch or kill 'em quick. So I reserve my rockets and grenades for thin man and mutons. Also don't fret about thin men poison cloud it is minimal damage (1 per turn for 3/4 turns) much better then a plasma shot to the face.
Early on medi kits are expensive and one shot. A grenade is a better option until you get at least a sprinter medic. Later when you have more advanced specialists and tougher aliens the damage value of grenades diminish. However their secondary effect of removing cover is great. A grenade is handy for wall breaches to see who is on the other side and to provide a quick exit.
The best cover in the game is the silver alien pods. Hard cover that I've yet to see been blown up. On the other hand cars used to kill half my troops. Do not have a person behind a vehicle fire on an alien then another person further back fire along the same track. If they miss and hit the vehicle your guy is hiding behind they now cannot move away and they face certain death when the vehicle blows up at the start of your next turn. Only way to save them is to kill all the aliens before your next turn... Not a great plan B. For that reason it is often good to grenade a forward vehicle to make it blow up and then run upto the wreck for cover.
Should have read more reviews. I'm not enjoying this game much at all.
Sigh.
Papewaio
12-03-2012, 23:01
What is going wrong? Difficulty or immersion?
Immensely long cutscenes, inability to select rooms in the anthill view of the base, etcetera. I could probably fix all of it if I could be bothered, but I'm kinda meh on the experience.
Papewaio
12-04-2012, 00:19
Apart from the tutorial (which is optional) you can skip most cutscenes on PC.
You can zoom in and out on the anthill. It was going to be possible to be attacked but they had balancing issues. I'm pretty sure you can click on some of the interactive elements. There are a few Easter eggs in the base including XCOM 1 on the arcade game.
HopAlongBunny
12-04-2012, 00:57
The amount of cut-scenes is pretty minor. The worst is the sniper one; sometimes seems to hang forever and just blows the flow of the game.
Overall its a pretty straight-forward experience. Kill'em all and advance through the missions; just what I'm looking for in a game sometimes :)
Sarmatian
12-04-2012, 11:22
You can turn the "action sequences" off, and the cutscenes in the beginning are for the tutorial (which you can also turn off).
The game really opens up after the first month
That's when the game becomes boring for me. After the first few months, the novelty wears off and you see a very repetive game, with same maps, just different graphical design. All missions are basically kill 'em all stuff. The research adnd inventory parts of the game are seriously dumbed down compared to the original.
HopAlongBunny
12-06-2012, 00:17
In some ways that's exactly what I like about this game. It's like running 100m; it's the same every time, the goal is to do it better each time out.
When I rip up the game with 0 casualties in Ironman (let alone Legendary) I'll set it aside :) My minor goal seems unattainable at this point so I'll continue 'til I figger it out.
Sarmatian
12-06-2012, 08:10
I don't know, I miss the feeling from the first UFO or from Apocalypse where you didn't really know what you're gonna get until you land, and how geoscape affected missions. If you take down a UFO, it was actually damaged in a mission. Sometimes just one alien survived the crash (sometimes none, sometimes all of them).
Here, it's the same thing every time, the only difference is whether you're gonna hide behind a tree or a mailbox. Same number of aliens, same groups, same tactics, same maps, dumbed down research, practically no inventory, just a few equipment gadgets... I got bored pretty quickly.
It's Civ 5 compared to Civ 4.
easytarget
12-07-2012, 05:18
Can't say I agree with all the negativity. Still enjoying it, and having fun with the DLC, which I just picked up for less than 5 bucks (god bless GMG, ha!).
Sarmatian
12-08-2012, 21:42
Can't say I agree with all the negativity. Still enjoying it, and having fun with the DLC, which I just picked up for less than 5 bucks (god bless GMG, ha!).
It isn't all negativity. The game is decent to good on its own. As a successor to a legendary franchise, mediocre to bad.
I never played the first xcom games, but i can safely say this one is difficult and fun. A little repetitive, but plenty of it is random. 8/10 imo
You should give them a try. I believe the original UFO: Enemy Unknown and Xcom: Terror from the Deep are abandonware now. Xcom: Apocalypse (the last) isn't, IIRC.
I still remember how fascinated I was with UFO and was unhappy that it was painfully slow on my Amiga 500. When I got Amiga 1200, that was the first game I got.
EDIT: I was mistaken, none of the original games is abandonware. I remembered seeing all three on Abandonia, but didn't see that you can't just download them, you have to buy them.
Papewaio
12-08-2012, 23:24
You can get them all on Steam cheaply and the orginal one works on my Windows seven PC unlike the latest fallout.
easytarget
12-12-2012, 02:21
It isn't all negativity. The game is decent to good on its own. As a successor to a legendary franchise, mediocre to bad.
It's not a successor. And take off the rose colored nostalgia glasses, I played the original when it came out, it had issues as well.
Sarmatian
12-12-2012, 09:45
It's not a successor. And take off the rose colored nostalgia glasses, I played the original when it came out, it had issues as well.
It had many issues but it also had -
1) Actually diverse maps, with diverse opponents. If you shoot down a UFO over Sahara, you're gonna get a mission in Sahara.
2) You could take up to 20 soldiers on a mission and losing a few meant acceptable casualties (like it should in a strategy game).
3) You could actually equip your soldiers from top to bottom, they actually could carry a grenade, rocket launcher and a stun thing at the same time, and the more weight you put on a soldier, less action points he has.
4) You had action points which allowed you to adapt to the situation. Do you need to take 3 shots or do you need to run really, really far.
5) You had a much more complex tech tree.
6) You had to balance the budget as you had to pay upkeep and salaries for everything.
7) You could produce stuff and sell it to other nations (corporations)
8) Weapons were diverse
I could go on and on, but the biggest problems I have is simplified control (move and shoot), small, bland and repetitive maps and lack of real options when equipping your soldiers.
easytarget
12-22-2012, 21:27
It had many issues but it also had -
1) Actually diverse maps, with diverse opponents. If you shoot down a UFO over Sahara, you're gonna get a mission in Sahara.
2) You could take up to 20 soldiers on a mission and losing a few meant acceptable casualties (like it should in a strategy game).
3) You could actually equip your soldiers from top to bottom, they actually could carry a grenade, rocket launcher and a stun thing at the same time, and the more weight you put on a soldier, less action points he has.
4) You had action points which allowed you to adapt to the situation. Do you need to take 3 shots or do you need to run really, really far.
5) You had a much more complex tech tree.
6) You had to balance the budget as you had to pay upkeep and salaries for everything.
7) You could produce stuff and sell it to other nations (corporations)
8) Weapons were diverse
I could go on and on, but the biggest problems I have is simplified control (move and shoot), small, bland and repetitive maps and lack of real options when equipping your soldiers.
I'm sure you could go on, but really, why? All you've established so far is you think these two games are somehow mutually exclusive, as if liking this new interpretation precludes liking the original or vice versa. You'll no doubt feel better about this, and most things actually, when you come to the realization most every thing exists along a spectrum.
easytarget
01-09-2013, 04:13
Heads up on Xcom: EU, the 3rd patch is out, big highlights, 2nd wave features are now implemented and teleporting aliens has supposedly been fixed (didn't have much trouble with that to begin with so I can't speak to that piece), here are the notes on the latest patch:
http://www.2kgames.com/blog/xcom-enemy-unknown-3rd-patch-is-live
Most of the 2nd wave options are of little interest to me, but I will admit I'm going to run through it again starting this weekend with Marathon turned on. :yes:
Marathon mode is no joke. I finally beat the game on classic/ironman about a month ago, so i figured if try try the and thing on Marathon.
Its hard. Just the fact that satellites are way me expensive really messes up your early strategy.
Yeah i noticed that. Sats are double the cost almost and research is 3x as long. Getting beam weapons will now cost you 100+ days: 20 for weapons fragment research, and 70 for beam weapons with the default scientist count. Scientists are now very attractive in the early game for mission rewards thanks to that. Though I am unsure if they beat out Engineers simply because engies are required. It definitely makes you not want to ignore them though.
I've also really enjoyed playing with Absolutely Critical, which means all flank attacks are a 100% crit. It makes the game incredibly punishing for stupid moves. There's no "well i can move him there because he's got good armor" thinking anymore.
I really like these extended options. When i get more time i'd love to run through a Classic Marathon game.
easytarget
01-16-2013, 00:23
Don't know if it is, but I've got to agree, Marathon definitely makes it harder.
Wish they'd list what 2nd wave options you have on in the campaign, if you have more than one going or leave it and come back, you're a bit stuck wondering what's on.
easytarget
01-19-2013, 04:28
Yes indeed, that does sound like it's going to be a tough slog, but then I guess that's the idea behind 2nd wave after all. ;)
LazyMcCrow
01-23-2013, 12:12
Hi! - Anyone got the Bubonic achievement? If YES and you feel like passing it on in multiplayer some time - PM me :D
Also - Has anyone done a run using names from the .org yet? I'm only familiar with players in the Gameroom on this site, but it just occurred to me that there are a ready supply of plasma fodder potential heroes for those of us who give a **** about that level of customisation :)
Anyway - stay vigilant!
easytarget
01-30-2013, 03:14
Ok, I need to confirm this, because I've not run into it yet on a mission, are you saying it's possible to run out of ammo? I didn't think that was possible, I mean I know it was on the original, but on the new one since you don't load out before the mission, I just figured other than the hassle of reloading, there was no way to run out.
LeftEyeNine
02-03-2013, 15:38
The demo was too tempting to resist. Just purchased the game.
easytarget
02-03-2013, 23:37
So, what do you think so far? Have you jumped in yet?
LeftEyeNine
02-04-2013, 07:28
I picked the Elite Soldier Pack DLC along with it. I was left "hungry" by the demo however I didn't have much time after purchasing it, so I saved the joy for today.
LeftEyeNine
02-07-2013, 09:28
So my first encounter with Mutons was extremely undesirable.
3 hulks with grenades...Oh boy, the squad was shredded in two turns. There was not much distance to the enemy however our boys kept missing in both turns such that two of the mutons turned away from the "firefight" -if you could say that- and left the most upfront fellow to deal with us.
Still, I got Sgt. "Septic" Harris who captured 1 floater, 1 outsider and 1 thin man in two consecutive missions. I suppose he earned his title indeed.
By the way, the thin man is one of the most unique enemies I've ever seen in this long gaming experience of mine. Not only their slender man-like physique is a sight to see, but also their movements are one of a kind as well.
So my first encounter with Mutons was extremely undesirable.
3 hulks with grenades...Oh boy, the squad was shredded in two turns. There was not much distance to the enemy however our boys kept missing in both turns such that two of the mutons turned away from the "firefight" -if you could say that- and left the most upfront fellow to deal with us.
Still, I got Sgt. "Septic" Harris who captured 1 floater, 1 outsider and 1 thin man in two consecutive missions. I suppose he earned his title indeed.
By the way, the thin man is one of the most unique enemies I've ever seen in this long gaming experience of mine. Not only their slender man-like physique is a sight to see, but also their movements are one of a kind as well.
The mid-game brings with it three big hurdles which you will be expected to compensate for incredibly quickly, one after the other. If you are unlucky, you will get them all at the same time. The key is to take things with a focused approach.
The first encounter with mutons will be your first red letter day in xcom. By the time you see mutons you have to be close to, or have already gotten either laser rifles or better armor. I usually always go lasers first followed by armor, but I've seen both approaches work. Facing mutons with conventional weapons you will lose a straight fight. Even if you win the head on fight you're almost promised casualties at higher difficulties. To negate the muton power never get in a shooting match with them toe to toe. You need superior firepower or protection, and you need to outthink them to survive.
The second hurdle is the Cyberdisks, who are as you'll find are incredibly deadly. However, the strength of the cyberdisk is easily matched by giving your heavies the HEAT round ability, which they get around level 4 (I think). HEAT rounds are a passive bonus that increase all damage to robotic enemies by double, which means instead of doing 5-8 damage against cyberdisks, you can expect to do 10-16 with conventional weaponry. HEAT rounds are a must for the late game. That isn't negotiable.
The last hurdle you can expect is the terror missions and the Chrysalids. The best defense against the bugs is to never get overextended. While you're racing against the clock in terror missions, you need to always keep your men covered with smart fields of fire. Against concentrated fire and overwatch Chrysalids might take one of your guys down, but they wont live long afterward.
Oh. And never stop building sats. Ever.
LeftEyeNine
02-08-2013, 12:56
I got one of my men HEAT rounds perk awarded however I've yet to encounter any Cyberdisks.
I, as in all games am, like to be solid on the defensive first so I had already reached Carapace Armor however I was unable to get my whole team a set due to insufficient funds. After my first terror attack where I came face to face with Chrysalids for the first time -a scenario I played over for 5 times-, only then my whole squad could afford carapace armors. I have already researched about Skeleton Suit however no resources could be allocated to get a set for now.
I was going to ask about research credits ? I remember it being mentioned once in my game, is it of any importance and, if so, in what way ?
HopAlongBunny
02-09-2013, 11:06
Interrogations and autopsies will get you research bonuses. The specific bonuses are listed on the tech-tree posted on pg2 of this thread.
Using the Arc-thrower (capture for interrogation) is a bit of a finesse move. It can be frustrating but when it works flawlessly you just feel soo cool :)
LeftEyeNine
02-24-2013, 18:30
OK now, whole team has got plasma variants of their essential gear. I got 2 of my snipers Archangel armors and the rest Titan Armors.
I've been delaying a campaign quest since I did not feel the team was hardened enough to proceed any further however I reckon now is the time.
Meanwhile, while I was thinking that I had done the best thing I could by acquiring a firestorm for each continent, a HUMONGOUS UFO appeared just to show off that alien technology is not supposed to be parallelled in this game.
I'm not onto the Advanced Construction tech in the foundry for which I need another Sectopod wreck -and hopefully I'll get to acquire one in the latest UFO downed in Canada.
Question: If a country withdrew its support from the project, it is gone forever ?
Also, WHEN WILL A TURKISH RECRUIT ARRIVE WHO WILL CAUSE A RUCKUS FOR NOT BEING ALLOWED A CIGARETTE BREAK IN THE MIDDLE OF A CIVILIAN RESCUE MISSION ? :smoking:
HopAlongBunny
02-24-2013, 18:45
Question: If a country withdrew its support from the project, it is gone forever ?
I have never seen a country return.
Question: If a country withdrew its support from the project, it is gone forever ?
Countries who withdraw support for the X-COM project have surrendered to the aliens. Yeah, they are gone forever.
LeftEyeNine
02-24-2013, 23:25
Pity.
Also, can you ever intervene with panic levels in countries before abductions/terror attacks occur (other than satellite-ing them ?)
a completely inoffensive name
02-25-2013, 10:46
Watched this live. Never played the game, but everyone was laughing so hard in chat.
Vid note: Profanity - LEN
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7X0Sd1hje30
EDIT: A little bit of context. He had just started playing XCOM that day and was playing on Impossible/Ironman. About 90% of his time was spent re-doing the first mission over and over again. He was going a bit crazy about the random number generator after a couple hours.
EDIT: A little bit of context. He had just started playing XCOM that day and was playing on Impossible/Ironman. About 90% of his time was spent re-doing the first mission over and over again. He was going a bit crazy about the random number generator after a couple hours.
That's brutal and his reaction was not remotely exaggerated. I had to stop playing on Classic/Ironman due to frustration. I can't even imagine what it would be like to be on the receiving end of luck that bad in Impossible/Ironman. Part of the problem for me was that the more I got frustrated the more errors I would make, which just compounded the frustration and put me into a vicious spiral of suckitude.
HopAlongBunny
02-27-2013, 20:28
My hats off to anyone completing Classic/Ironman; all my attempts at Classic have ended in humiliation :p
Yes, I am still trying to "solve" this game :)
SwordsMaster
03-04-2013, 13:34
Likewise. Classic - best attempt so far, survived 5 missions before being left with no squad, and no money. Frustrating how thin men will hit me at long range every time, and yet my sniper will miss 3 tiles away...
Likewise. Classic - best attempt so far, survived 5 missions before being left with no squad, and no money. Frustrating how thin men will hit me at long range every time, and yet my sniper will miss 3 tiles away...
The dice gods can be quite unforgiving. The best way to approach the game on classic is to do what Gelatinous Cube suggested and go heavy explosives in your first few missions. Yeah, your scientist won't like it, but promoting your rookies is way more important in the first month than anything else (except for maybe getting engineers and building sats, but we covered that a few pages ago!)
Playing XCOM classic is a game of caution. Your best bet is to play cautiously and approach things with the dice in mind. A 50/50 shot is probably not going to be worth it, since you're essentially gambling with lives at that point in the game.
But sometimes? Well. Sometimes you just gotta roll the hard six.
easytarget
03-20-2013, 01:45
I'm holding out taking a run at classic ironman till they get the current patch they are working on, working. I've played classic, and I've played ironman, just not together. ;)
But it's time will come, I just want the teleporting business actually fixed, I've got time on my side, I'm still playing S2/ROTS/FOTS like they just released. haha
Papewaio
07-28-2013, 10:55
Just been playing this again before the next version comes out.
One of my female characters is Ms Ho.
Major Ho
Major 'Combo' Ho
Sweet.
easytarget
08-21-2013, 17:04
There's an Enemy Within. And in November the battle will be rejoined: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4KdSli869U
easytarget
08-24-2013, 03:40
Really? No one finds this even mildly interesting news?
Whatever.
Oh we do! Just not our wallets! :P
I have to avoid getting too hyped up and wait for a steam sale XD
Though I'm definitely way more interested in this, than The Bureau...
As do I. The mech class sounds like it would be fun to play as opposed to the SHIVs.
Plus flamethrowers. :bounce:
easytarget
08-25-2013, 16:53
I agree on all counts. The time, effort and resources wasted on the Bureau could have and should have been applied to XCOM EU, there is just so much untapped potential here.
With just more maps (god I hate seeing the same ones even after just one play through, that was just beyond stupid), some time spent doing a better job fleshing out interception (which right now is just a placeholder), a more robust strategic layer (right now it's build satellites and launch them, that's it), and base invasion they'd have taken quite a few steps towards taking advantage of the position they have in breaking open this IP again.
What they've done instead for about the last year appears to be the production of a fairly modest DLC. I mean I'll take what I can get, I might even pay 30 bucks for it (probably not, I'll still be up in my eyeballs in R2 in Nov).
I'm glad to see they are still developing for it. As everyone who has played and liked it has noticed, there's so much potential untapped. It's hard for me to not wonder why Firaxis isn't putting more behind this, because for my money, Civ 5 is played out, you either feel like you're on board with the byzantine number of decisions they've forced the game down along with the insane clutter of the map now, or you're not (you can no doubt guess which camp I'm in). But wasting more time putting out more DLC on that in my eyes is just stupid when there's so much low hanging fruit to be developed on XCOM.
Ah well, such is life, just thought I'd bring it to everyone's attention it's coming.
Alexander the Pretty Good
08-28-2013, 00:58
Interesting interview over on RPS:
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/08/27/the-mod-squad-xcom-enemy-within-interview/
I'm torn - it sounds like they want to add meaningful stuff, but it also doesn't sound like they care much about balance. I guess we'll know for sure when it's out.
Hooahguy
08-28-2013, 01:54
Finally got started on this game, its quite challenging I must say. The AI seems to be quite good.
Shame I accidentally uninstalled the game/lost my savegame file and now I cant play until I get back to campus on a strong internet connection.
Had no idea about this game until I saw Day[9] get *massacred* at it on Classic Ironman a few times before he just quit. I was playing Shadowrun Returns at the time and discovering a love for tactical shooters I didnt know I had so I thought "heck why not" and bought XCOM.
Beat the Classic Ironman a few weeks ago after 22 attempts (although at least 10 of those were me losing guys left and right at mission 1 and going the coward's route of retrying - yeah, I still suck). I gotta say I had a feeling I'd like the game based on what I saw in the LetsPlay, but I did not expect to fall completely in love with it. Holy hell does this game not joke around. I loved the constant tension and the progression of difficulty (new gear vs new enemies). In fact the only two letdowns were the endfight in the base assault and the endfight in the last level - the only really terribly balanced thing seems to be Squadsight (+Double Tap), which essentially turns your snipers into I-win-machines, esp against sole enemies with high hp. So no using Squadsight in the impossible playthrough ^^
I actually like the sort of simplied macromanagement aspect of the game. I got plenty of 1990's gamer frustration from the actual missions, and that's before the alien material gets a half-life. It struck a nice balance of not being too long and complex, while still maintaining the merciless fun/frustration-balance perfectly. Had a mission where 3 of my corporals were off-duty due to being nearly dead, so I sent a bunch of squaddies and corporals into the first mission featuring a Sectopod! Throw in a couple of Sectoid Commanders aggroed accidently and the mission was a blast! I ended up with 4 guys with 2 health left, but no casualties or critical wounds (taking the Will penalty). Next mission, all I face are Floaters and Thin Men - and 2 Thin Men flank my Colonel Sniper and wound her critically! Got lazy for a second, instant punishment. Good going, game! Dammit that Will penalty hurt when she later became my "defensive" Psi user.
It was quite fascinating how you slowly develop a care for certain soldiers that have saved your entire squad in pinced situations. I spat Coke all over my keyboard when the infamous sniper Tong Hi Lao was insta-gibbed in a council mission by a drop-in Thin Man. That guy was my best soldier! Too bad for me, suck it up and train a new Sniper. Funnily enough my new sniper squaddie by the name "Emily King" ended up saving me later by landing 3 35% shots in a row on Mutons in the train-mission, prompting me to rename her "Emilia Rex". She later became the first soldier in Archangel armor and earned the nickname "Angelica", which I found quite fitting, because of....
... am I playing "the Sims" in alien invasion space?
Game was good, looking forward to an expansion. If nothing else then for some more map variation.
easytarget
09-07-2013, 23:05
Yeah, that's a testament to a great game in my opinion, it creates great emergent stories about what happened that players are itching tell other players about. This game is full of those moments. The tension is well balanced especially in the tactical side, I wish they'd done just a bit more on the strategic (it comes down too much to just launching sats).
It's probably been my favorite game over the last year and I look forward to new content and hope Firaxis keeps giving it some love.
I don't understand why they haven't. By all accounts, the game sold well. I'm just waiting to throw some money at them for more content.
From the sounds of things the main creative forces behind Enemy Unknown have left development and went on to other things. The lead on Enemy Within isn't the same as the ones who made the base game. That may be the reason new content has been a long time in the making..
So yeah... a lot of people have noted how much harder "Classic" is than "Normal".
Let me just for the record state that "Impossible" feels like 3 times that gap atm. My Classic squad was made up of 2 assaults, 2 snipers, a heavy and a support, with the assaults spearheading to scout for mobs, letting the rest move in peace. Assaults are a great class to gear up due to their sick mobility with Run and Gun - and Im now considering not using any at all! Enemies seem to hit *every single shot* at medium range and they come in legions instead of packs. Assaults just die. Instantly. I dont think even Titan Armor with Chitin Plating would stop this, and I used Ghost Armor on Classic. My previously so graceful idea of not using Squadsight is also being seriously reconsidered, not because of "bossfights" but because of Thin Men. They are surprisingly terrifying when they pack 6 health instead of the usual 4. Add their annoying +hit modifier from Impossible and their stupidly powerful Light Plasmas in mission 3 and let the nightmare commence. The game does - not - joke - around. Also panic levels... yeah. Forget all about going for continent bonuses. Pick the 30% credits-per-month continent, you will never unlock it by satellites.
I wonder what Mutons will be like. I have yet to get anywhere close to seeing them :) Playing again has let me to get quite excited for the expansion, mostly due to the limited map pool. Its really starting to show itself. Takes a lot of the appeal out of the game when you "learn" most of the maps. I know its unavoidable, but for once I would seriously consider investing in a map pool DLC.
HopAlongBunny
10-09-2013, 23:51
A little more from RPS:
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/10/09/hands-on-xcom-enemy-within/
Enemy Within sounds like a beast :)
easytarget
10-11-2013, 19:20
I've pre-ordered. Wasn't going to, but found it at GMG for 20 bucks. I'll get value out of that with just one complete campaign, and I know, just know, I'll play it through more than once. :yes:
So after 15 or so tries Ive made it to see my first Muton. I don't know how I made it through Classic without ever really utilizing Hunker Down, but I rely heavily on it for Impossible. Got a good game going atm, I believe I might make it to the base assault, yay. Also Assaults are still gods, they just aren't immortal anymore. I engaged in learning!
And here I thought I'd pretty much "mastered the game" after a Classic win. Pfff! No Hunker Down. Frowning at Supression. Rushing to gear everyone in medkits, SCOPEs or Nanovests, leaving no grenades in the squad. Thinking that the 100%-crit bonus from Ghosting was "kinda cute I guess". I've learned so much more from this that I laugh at my own past inferior tactical self! Did I ever miss games that give me that feeling again (Thief 4, Im staring myself blind at you).
Pre-ordering was unavoidable.
Been spending a lot of time updating servers and fixing stuff, during which I've spent an irresponsible amount of time finding good XCOM series. If you're struggling with higher difficulties or just enjoy watching different ways to approach the game like me then I recommend these following series:
Beaglerush's Ironman Impossible (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9zJE9GodMQ) is a comedic post-play commentary on Beaglerush's IM/Imp playthrough in fast-forward. Well worth a watch for the entertainment value alone, but it's clear he knows his stuff.
Beaglerush's Live and Impossible (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ij6mAEL6_IM&feature=youtu.be) is a standard Letsplay with commentary from the same guy. He cranked the Second Wave-difficulty to "no oh god please don't" and commented on the experience.
Marbozir's IM/Imp Letsplay (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqlTVUOIEz0) is another Second Wave-Impossible Ironman with a slightly more aggressive approach than standard. Given my lust for Assaults I like his style, plus he taught me how to effectively use Heavies in Impossible.
Sean "Day[9]" Plott's XCOM Classic Ironman Day-off (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2NL9k1mIXo) is a Letsplay from the closest thing Starcraft-players have to an Obi-wan'ish mentor. His masterful RTS skills don't always convey to other genres, which, when mixed with his sense of humour, makes for some solid entertainment. I recommend checking it out at least up to the end of part 2 as to experience why Anna Sing is the funniest thing ever concieved by mortals.
easytarget
10-24-2013, 00:41
The latest game play footage has me convinced this is going to be good stuff gentleman.
HopAlongBunny
10-24-2013, 01:47
I went back to play the game; warm-up for the new content.
Gawd I suck! :dizzy2:
Must play more!!!
easytarget
10-25-2013, 18:01
Yeah, I believe you award them instead of having them handed out by the game itself like a run of the mill achievement. I'll be interested to see how exactly they've implemented it. It will be a nice touch.
I foresee some real heartache over losing troopers in this one, you get a member of your team all spliced up and enhanced only to loose him/her on a mission, that's going to leave a mark as you start over from scratch.
Been spending a lot of time updating servers and fixing stuff, during which I've spent an irresponsible amount of time finding good XCOM series. If you're struggling with higher difficulties or just enjoy watching different ways to approach the game like me then I recommend these following series:
Beaglerush's Ironman Impossible (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9zJE9GodMQ) is a comedic post-play commentary on Beaglerush's IM/Imp playthrough in fast-forward. Well worth a watch for the entertainment value alone, but it's clear he knows his stuff.
Beaglerush's Live and Impossible (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ij6mAEL6_IM&feature=youtu.be) is a standard Letsplay with commentary from the same guy. He cranked the Second Wave-difficulty to "no oh god please don't" and commented on the experience.
Late to the party, but anyone who is a fan and hasn't watched beagle's Ironman Impossible is doing themselves a real disservice. His tactics are really sound (for the most part) and when they are not, he's really good at explaining why things work and why they don't. The humor is top notch too, but that's subjective so you may not enjoy it as much as me.
Enemy Within looks like it's absolutely wonderful, but if the mech-troopers are as powerful as people are saying I may be bumping up to impossible to keep the challenge going. We'll see. Can't wait to get my hands on it either way.
easytarget
10-26-2013, 15:32
I suspect getting a Mec is going to be expensive and/or time consuming, and it is a commitment you can't go back on, and losing them means starting over. So I don't know that they are OP necessarily given how much will probably be entailed in getting one, I might forego that route and splice soldiers instead.
Besides, it's not like the aliens aren't fielding one of their own that's a counter to this. :yes:
Based on your recommendation, I'm going to make some time to look at the vid, I'm intrigued now.
easytarget
10-26-2013, 16:53
Ok, just finished watching the first two missions, this guy is tactically sound and absolutely hilarious. Love it.
So, does he do the entire campaign?
Alexander the Pretty Good
10-26-2013, 17:35
Apparently Base Defense is back in some form in Enemy Within:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=692779704079530&set=a.331680753522762.86598.112972802060226&type=1&theater
(Direct link to image from the 2k Facebook account: http://imgur.com/9Vmoqyx)
easytarget
10-26-2013, 18:27
Yeah, I that's going to come into play because there's a human group with a different agenda than xcom who turn up as an additional adversary.
Really gives the whole thing a bit of a Stargate SG-1 vibe. :rtwyes:
if the final mission is against a Col. Maybourne I may have to just throw in the towel right then and there.
easytarget
10-29-2013, 04:27
As a result of these comments I've decided that the naming convention for my first play through will be StarGate!
I anticipate Maybourne taking point early on and catching one in the forehead. haha
Papewaio
10-29-2013, 08:41
Well you have to get to Col first otherwise its just the son...
easytarget
10-29-2013, 12:55
True enough. haha In which case I'd probably be stuck working to keep him alive.
May have to reconsider that name, but there are plenty of others in the Stargate universe!
True enough. haha In which case I'd probably be stuck working to keep him alive.
May have to reconsider that name, but there are plenty of others in the Stargate universe!
Remember: Col. Jack O'neill. Two L's. There's another O'Neil with only one L. He doesn't have a sense of humor.
Now I feel left out from not having watched said show :(
There are those of us who are stuck having to rename Malcolm Reynolds every time he gets promoted to Major.
Alexander the Pretty Good
10-30-2013, 02:21
Now I feel left out from not having watched said show :(
There are those of us who are stuck having to rename Malcolm Reynolds every time he gets promoted to Major.
As long as his nickname is "Tightpants" does it really matter?
Papewaio
10-31-2013, 00:14
I usually name my cannon fodder after backroomers. In my current game Kadagar keeps surviving despite my best efforts. :no:
Is he always in the bar between missions or playing hello nurse?
Papewaio
10-31-2013, 00:31
Well he does like taking pot shots.
What nickname did you give him?
You can choose the nickname? I just lost that campaign, can't remember his nickname but it was real generic.
Once your troopers get assigned a nickname you can change it to whatever you want.
Apparently Base Defense is back in some form in Enemy Within:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=692779704079530&set=a.331680753522762.86598.112972802060226&type=1&theater
(Direct link to image from the 2k Facebook account: http://imgur.com/9Vmoqyx)
Confirmed. Hold onto your butts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUxqjq6HW3M
Devs have confirmed on an IGN stream: Lose the base defense mission and it's game over.
easytarget
11-05-2013, 01:51
As it should be, it is after all the only base you've got.
easytarget
11-11-2013, 16:14
Release day is almost upon us!
Alexander the Pretty Good
11-11-2013, 23:52
RPS Wot I Think - http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/11/11/xcom-enemy-within-review/
Pretty positive, it's going to be tempting to outright buy it. I'll probably try to hold out until the first patch is released though.
easytarget
11-12-2013, 01:10
I picked it up on GMG on a 20 buck pre-order, suspect I'll get at least two more complete play throughs in it, easily worth 20 bucks.
One will be to mess w/ MECs, the second to mess with gene splicing.
I'm assuming the core game play is pretty much the same, so it's always down to money early on about where you want to commit it so I always end up sacrificing something I wanted to fully explore but couldn't.
easytarget
11-13-2013, 00:20
Yep, same here, somehow there was a mix up, which is starting to get to be a pretty typical story with GMG, and the download that happened last night before game release didn't end up actually being the update (makes zero sense) and in order to kick start the process you had to go in and run verify integrity, at which point steam found like 5000 files that weren't up to snuff and proceeded to start downloading what is turning into a rather large file update.
This may be my last time doing business with GMG, I like their prices, but they aren't proving terribly professional at handling release launches and it's just old. Over the last year this is the third time with them, the last time I had to hassle with a refund process because what they were selling had no steam key, despite the fact the game had to be installed and run from steam (who but morons do that?).
So, here I sit waiting through a download process that should have been done before launch....
HopAlongBunny
11-13-2013, 02:04
Downloaded! It's a big one.
It gives the option to play "Unknown" or "Within"; kinda nice as I still want to complete a campaign I was finishing up :)
easytarget
11-13-2013, 02:51
Yep, finally got the update loaded, starting a new.
easytarget
11-13-2013, 04:48
Yeah, but it is nice they put in some language choices, my snipers are all now speaking Russian and the heavies oddly enough are all speaking German. As for clothes, I changed the colors right off for ease of class identification. Otherwise you have to earn the rest by making Sgt, at which point you get your nick, your proper name and any specializations in appearance.
I changed the language right off though just because it's fun to hear different languages spoken on the missions. I foresee some new tough trade offs in the additions they made, I like it.
I hope there's one more DLC, they need to replace the intercept with something legitimate, not this placeholder BS they left in place. They need to make the strat level real, not just this one trick pony with firing Sats up in orbit. And lastly they need to update the ending and make it a challenging real ending.
I can't decide if the game is easier of it it is simply less :daisy: in the dice rolls.
I feel like heavy cover is way more reliable.. but it's now more much more destructible. Alien weapons fire will blow out hard cover pretty easily, but the protection inferred seems a lot more reliable when calculating hit rates, if that makes sense.
Sectoid numbers in the first few missions has been reduced from 3 aliens to 2 aliens per pack on Classic. This is a huge hit to early game difficulty. I haven't taken a single point of damage in the month of march. Will need to play more to see how it shapes up but overall the early game feels way easier. I don't like that. Will probably bump up to impossible if this keeps on.
New maps are freakin' awesome. Love them way more than the old ones, haven't come across a new map that I haven't liked yet, where in the original i was hard pressed to find one I did like.
MELD is an interesting concept. Turns most missions into an optional bomb disposal without the automatic fail if you don't get to the canisters. Moving at a mixed posture, I can typically secure at least 1 MELD per mission with 4 squadies. Haven't tried the new units yet but I'm about to make my first MEC. Should be fun.
Leveling up feels much slower. I bagged a triple kill with my squadie sniper in a UFO assault and he is still a squadie. I am almost certain he'd have hit corp by now in Enemy Unknown. Could just be a perception thing.
Also noticed Rookies getting auto promoted to Squadie after two active missions, even if they have 0 kills. I am fairly certain mission count never counted before toward rank up. Anyone else confirm?
edited for more thoughts
Doesn't come out here until tomorrow at midnight - I much jelly :/
That did make me spend the last couple of days getting smashed to absolute bits on Impossible again. You know - for warm-up!
Alexander the Pretty Good
11-14-2013, 00:06
Monk, I don't want to dig to find the source, but they adjusted the XP curve at least in the early game. It's not just you. :P
HopAlongBunny
11-16-2013, 22:37
Looks good; finished my old campaign.
The tutorial locks up at the same point everytime though.
Maybe I'll just skip straight to a game.
I take back what I said about it being too easy. I got pearl harbored on the 6th of april by a mixed thin men and floater opfor. Holy crap. The slower XP gains make the second month incredibly dangerous.
It's also a bad idea to rush the new toys in your first month. Play it smart and sat blitz like you normally would, go for MECs or Gene mods by the middle of month 2 at the earliest.
The EXALT dudes really add some much needed dimension to the strategic layer as well. Do you slowly weed them out, or do you risk trying to guess their base? On normal its a no brainer, on Classic it might be a difficult choice.
It depends on what your panic levels look like, honestly. Unless you're completely spiraling there's no reason to ever take the guess, but if you're about to lose a nation it might be worth the risk to get them out of the way once you've narrowed it down.
Also: Once EXALT shows up never, and I mean never, tread close to zero space dollars. If you don't have enough money for them to steal? Yeah. They will just raise panic instead.
Greyblades
11-17-2013, 22:29
Just been playing with my first mech trooper, Lt. Scottie "Clank" Gibson with the pneumatic fist suit and more medals than previous limbs, still having half his health taken out in one hit from by an errant zombie, hrm.
Also a bit dissapointed that while Scotland is a seperate nationality from Britain in this game, we still dont get seperate accents for their soldiers. I mean I have a guy named scottie for chris' sake and I cant role-play Mr Scott in a mech suit, what the heck man?
HopAlongBunny
11-18-2013, 08:46
Skipped the tutorial to by-pass where the game was freezing up on me. So far, so good :)
Need to see which candy is quicker now: weapons, armour or meld!
Need to see which candy is quicker now: weapons, armour or meld!
If you're playing on Classic or above, I still highly recommend the old strategy of weapons and satellites. Save Meld for when you've got resources to spare. Oh, and Memitic Skin is almost certainly the greatest single ability in the entire game.
LeftEyeNine
11-19-2013, 16:01
Since I had lost quite a lot of support following my negligence of satelliting as much country as I could, in my first go with XCOM:EW yesterday, I preferred to not spend a single shilling on soldier upgrades and focused on excavations, satellite uplinks and satellite launches instead.
I got torn up. The Matrix-esque guys had only recently shown up in game and my manpower was already plummeting. A survivor extraction mission ended up total disaster, losing all soldiers on site.
I just couldn't figure out how to balance out the sci-eng-credits expenditure concerning the squads and infrastructure. No satelliting means cancerous panic everywhere, no upgrades mean losing a lot of guys and eventually coming to an end. Should I sacrifice one over another (obviously the latter needs a little bit of improving but still) or the gameplay accepts a management I couldn't figure out yet?
:bow:
Since I had lost quite a lot of support following my negligence of satelliting as much country as I could, in my first go with XCOM:EW yesterday, I preferred to not spend a single shilling on soldier upgrades and focused on excavations, satellite uplinks and satellite launches instead.
I got torn up. The Matrix-esque guys had only recently shown up in game and my manpower was already plummeting. A survivor extraction mission ended up total disaster, losing all soldiers on site.
I just couldn't figure out how to balance out the sci-eng-credits expenditure concerning the squads and infrastructure. No satelliting means cancerous panic everywhere, no upgrades mean losing a lot of guys and eventually coming to an end. Should I sacrifice one over another (obviously the latter needs a little bit of improving but still) or the gameplay accepts a management I couldn't figure out yet?
:bow:
Perhaps there are other strategies, but the satellites/weapons priority works fine for me on Classic Ironman, even in EW. You make up for your shortfall in equipment/abilities on the battlefield with better tactics. Do not be afraid of explosives, they are your friend, especially in the early game. Any loss of weapon fragments is a minor inconvenience if it saves the life of your soldiers. Don't forget that explosives can destroy cover as well. I cannot count the number of times I have used explosives to knock down walls (without damaging anything) just to open up a shot so that another soldier can save one at risk of death. It's not a cake-walk by any means. Even in my successful runs I've taken some big losses, losing some of my best soldiers in months 2-3. However, the game is relatively kind in this regard and if you find yourself running short on a role you'll often see a high ranking soldier of that role pop up as a reward on an abduction mission. If you've gotten panic under control with satellites, you'll have more freedom to select missions like that with rewards you want, instead of having to choose purely based on panic levels.
If the "Matrix-esque guys" you're referring to are the Seekers, there are specific tactics that defend effectively against them. The Seekers uncloak just prior to strangulation, and at that point overwatch gets triggered on them from everyone but the target of the attack. Thus, when you uncover Seekers, everyone at risk of a strangulation attack should try and get within LOS of each other and all be put on overwatch. If you do that, it's very likely that the Seeker will be instantly killed by the overwatch fire when it uncloaks, before it can do any damage. I've also had success by rocketing the area where they went invisible immediately afterwards, though that's something of a gamble.
easytarget
11-20-2013, 01:16
Oh, and Memitic Skin is almost certainly the greatest single ability in the entire game.
In my opinion this completely wrecks the balance of the game for missions. I've got a friend who by month 2 or maybe it was 3 had an entire squad with this. The AI doesn't even begin to know how to handle it. And by the time you get snipers who get full cover EVERYWHERE, as I have in my current campaign, I can basically take my two snipers and plant them anywhere I want to and shoot the place up. It's a shooting gallery.
I can't honestly believe this does not have a cool down. It's ridiculous.
easytarget
11-20-2013, 01:27
Oh, and one mimetic medic with the extra 3 steps or a bot coupled with an 5 snipers would be just flat out stupid. With low profile (half cover is full) and double tap.
There isn't an enemy in the game the AI can field that could even comprehend what was happening to them much less handle it.
While no one is forcing you to play like this, it's a game play balancing failure of epic proportions that this is possible.
easytarget
11-20-2013, 01:29
Huh.. I must have read that one wrong cuz it didn't look that good and I ignored it. Doesn't it not work if the enemy could see you're starting point?
Just start using it some and you'll see just how comically easy it is to abuse. With full cover snipers I can run almost anywhere on a map and remain invisible. Till of course I've planted not one but two 15 pt plasma shots in your head.
Huh.. I must have read that one wrong cuz it didn't look that good and I ignored it. Doesn't it not work if the enemy could see you're starting point?
Yeah, but there are plenty of ways around that. For example, you can just have you snipers kill the thing that can see you. Another option derives from the fact that Memitic Skin works on ANY movement, not just the first move of a round. So, if an enemy could see you, you can use you first move to reveal with the movement taking you to a spot the enemy cannot see. You then use Dash to move back to a full cover spot, thus making you invisible again before the enemy gets a turn. Put Memitic Skin on assaults with Lightning Reflexes, and even overwatch issues are solved here.
easytarget
11-20-2013, 01:41
Try it, you'll see. It needs to be nerfed with a cool down or something, right now it's comical.
Use it and see how befuddled the AI becomes. Turns take longer while the AI tries to sort out where I've gone....haha
LeftEyeNine
11-20-2013, 08:29
What does mimetic skin provide practically? I remember not being awed having read the description.
What does mimetic skin provide practically? I remember not being awed having read the description.
Scouting. You can spot enemies without them seeing you, and plan accordingly. Combined with Squadsight snipers and rockets, you can kill entire packs of enemies before they even see one of your soldiers. In addition, it makes it much, much easier to obtain Meld. There's significantly less risk with splitting off a soldier to run across the map and snag some Meld when that soldier can stay invisible (and thus out of harms way) the entire way. It's also superb for getting personnel close enough to the enemy for flanking attacks and stunning. Finally, Exalt covert ops missions are a piece of cake if your operative have Mimetic skin. He can run around the place activating all the various comms towers without much concern for his own safety, despite his lack of equipment.
Something that even Mimetic skin users may not have realized: Mimetic skin works in any cover that acts like high cover, not just any cover that is high cover. As such, a sniper with Low Profile and Mimetic skin will actually go invisible hiding in any cover on the entire map. This opens up some interesting options for aggressive Snapshot snipers.
LeftEyeNine
11-20-2013, 14:50
Scouting. You can spot enemies without them seeing you, and plan accordingly. Combined with Squadsight snipers and rockets, you can kill entire packs of enemies before they even see one of your soldiers. In addition, it makes it much, much easier to obtain Meld. There's significantly less risk with splitting off a soldier to run across the map and snag some Meld when that soldier can stay invisible (and thus out of harms way) the entire way. It's also superb for getting personnel close enough to the enemy for flanking attacks and stunning. Finally, Exalt covert ops missions are a piece of cake if your operative have Mimetic skin. He can run around the place activating all the various comms towers without much concern for his own safety, despite his lack of equipment.
Something that even Mimetic skin users may not have realized: Mimetic skin works in any cover that acts like high cover, not just any cover that is high cover. As such, a sniper with Low Profile and Mimetic skin will actually go invisible hiding in any cover on the entire map. This opens up some interesting options for aggressive Snapshot snipers.
WHOA.
I say nerf inbounds.
easytarget
11-20-2013, 17:12
Something that even Mimetic skin users may not have realized: Mimetic skin works in any cover that acts like high cover, not just any cover that is high cover. As such, a sniper with Low Profile and Mimetic skin will actually go invisible hiding in any cover on the entire map. This opens up some interesting options for aggressive Snapshot snipers.
This is THE reason I find it comical.
To be fair, having 4-5 Squadsight-specced Snipers was comically imbalanced in the vanilla game as well, even before Ghost Armor-Supports/Assaults. Them being invisible is just icing on the cake - pretty silly icing considering they invented a new enemy type to very specifically counter the concept of lone Squadsight Snipers. But I feel you really should limit your squads to max 2 of a type anyway, mostly due to Snipers.
Beaglerush said that he's not going to use any of the MELD-enhancements and solely rely on MECHs, because all the enhancements are bloody stupid in that they're overpowered while being unnecessary, and though I have yet to acquire anything remotely useful yet (due to me being consistently dead, hello Impossible, its been a while), I have a nagging little feeling that he might be right... which is kind of saddening. I remember, when I first saw footage of the leg enhancements that let your soldiers act like Thin Men and jump higher than Kris Kross (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=010KyIQjkTk) mixed with Die Antwoord (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Uee_mcxvrw&feature=player_detailpage#t=144) would have ever dreamt of, that this is... redundant while being stupid. I mean we have grappling hooks and Archangel Armor for that, and those things were the exact mix of sci-fi-awesome and gameplay-functional for me. What is this?
Enemy Within is a nice addition due to the polish of a lot of little things, map variety and different starting positions on each map and so forth, and I really like the Meld-container concept, giving you more than one objective on abduction and UFO missions, but the whole MELD-idea is bugging me and perma-stealth - a feature so imbalanced that if Ghost Armor provided no defense and no mobility increase it would still be worth it for the 4 charges alone - makes me more anxious.
Arh, Im being wholly unreasonable. Let the game prove to me that it's silly! To the front! Hopefully further than mission 5 this time!
That is a valid point. What Im worried is that the choice is less "Gunslinger" versus "Damn Good Ground" (the hardest choice in the game for me) and more "Squadsight" versus... whatever that other thing is called that no one has ever used, ever. But with some patches to polish the balance, the concept could be good. It's just that... the vanilla game never really got that. So I'm sceptical. But I guess it is all moddable in time.
So yeah, the teleport bug is back with a fury that I've yet to experience before. I was playing an unusually solid first mission, clearing a train yard step by step. Got the first MELD canister, got the first group with no hits taken and no grenades used. Then started moving towards the other side of the train yard after clearing every inch of "my" side.
Decided to Overwatch my squad while my straggler caught up with a dash. As she dashed through completely familiar territory, she somehow invokes 3 Sectoids out of litterally thin air (as in - I could see the area they spawned from). And that was my last move, so they got 3 free flankshots from the rear. My confidence is shaken - how am I to advance if the enemy can be anywhere? Anytime? Wait... that cloaking augment... do the Sectoids have access to it?!
Greyblades
11-22-2013, 01:03
"Squadsight" versus... whatever that other thing is called that no one has ever used, ever
...Snapshot has it's merits...
...Snapshot has it's merits...
It might in the expansion. I am in awe of how elegantly they nerfed Squadsight in EW (didnt notice at first). Pretty good idea to limit the damage potential of Squadsight Snipers while also making Headshot more of a choice. I like it.
I tried Snapshot once, back when it was -20 aim, and I didn't get it. I still don't get it, to be honest. I'm excited that some people do - maybe I'll learn something valuable - but to me the ability makes no sense. Why would I bring a Sniper, the lowest health-class, to move and shoot with less accuracy than a Rookie (In EW it is now aim=Rookie) when I have 3 classes that can do that job for me? Especially when the Sniper is the only class which can reliably deal damage at long range (not counting Heavy-secondaries). I'm bending my head to find a use for it that isn't more effectively covered by bringing someone else. An Assault with a standard Rifle (or its upgrades) still seems better to me for that job. What does the Snapshot Sniper offer that I'm missing?
easytarget
11-22-2013, 04:42
Some of my latest fun I've had was with, mimic beacons, the upgrade to the MECs punch and the gene splice that prevents MC.
The beacon draws any of the flesh based enemies out into the open, they ignore everything and run towards. Imagine the fun.
The MEC punch upgrade takes what was an interesting melee and increases the damage by 50%, I'm often getting 18-23 damage from it, so naturally I walk up and hit stuff a lot.
And last, tired of getting MC'd, well now you've got the additional resistance spliced right into your soldier, on top of the Psi armor and the helmet. Combined you can make someone invulnerable to PSI attacks.
I just finished a normal campaign just for the purposes of seeing what new was going on, time to fire up ironman classic and try and survive the early months where I often run into the big challenges keeping it all together. Should be interesting with all these new options, and really that's all it is, just more choices about how you want to tackle a problem.
Anyway, I've liked the new additions quite a bit, I'd LOVE to see them release a DLC that did 3 things:
1. made the strat layer slightly more involved then just firing sats up
2. add a wing commander style intercept, jumping into the seat of the intercept would just be too cool for words
3. the ending, i mean seriously, i don't know, put some sectapods at the door, put the head PSI alien somewhere harder to shoot at, i mean god, the choices on how to improve the ending are nearly endless and many of them would be no more difficult than putting different aliens there and placement
LeftEyeNine
11-22-2013, 08:44
I started all over and chose North America as my base so as to be able max. out airborne power as soon as possible.
This time, however, I built a genetics lab at first chance and loaded my 2 heavy and 1 assault soldier with bone marrow upgrade. %66 shorter recovery time and 2 HP max.ed to level without armor in combat sound extremely useful for tankers. I also got the heavy whose first shot does not count as an action hypersensitive pupils that increase their aims in case they miss with the former try -I thought that would complement each other. Another Heavy member has Halotargeting skill so I assume that will add up nicely.
It was too late in the night and I couldn't risk another 10-15 minutes of combat sequence traded off for some sleep.
Hopefully, genetics upgrades are not in vain, yes ?
easytarget
11-22-2013, 14:07
If those two heavies you are focused on are going on most of your missions it's hard to see how any of the gene splicing you do on them will go to waste. I've not regretted any of the ones I've done, but I'll admit I've only done a few, the health regen one, the PSI protection one near the end, of course I've messed with mimic skin, nd I've used the jump one plus the better aim one on snipers. I consider them all good investments that increase the surviveability of my regulars.
To all those deprived of greatness: Beagle is back! Get the MELD! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlUM4VwLQzI) His stream channel (or his girlfriend's) has quite a few hours of commentated gameplay, which is highly appreciated. Also "ANANDA GUPTA! JAKE SOLOMON!" is now an official "why is this happening to me"-battlecry for XCOM-gaming.
You know you've got something special when your biggest problem with a game is that it's so good you forget things around you - even when you haven't gone farther than the first EXALT-mission yet due to quadquad+1 Thinmen. This game, guys, this game... so good. Let's hope the modding gets off to a good start, or even better: Steam Workshop!
Greyblades
11-24-2013, 01:23
What does the Snapshot Sniper offer that I'm missing?
Well, I was hoping that someone else would answer and reenforce my convictions that my preference for "snapshot" is not a mistake.
Anyway, I find the ability to reposition and fire the same turn has saved many a trooper from being mind controled by a commander or etherial that refuses to come out of hiding. It also helps get the "In The Zone" free shots I get from higher ranked snipers as the aliens never seem to put themselves in a flankable position for my stationary snipers. I add a scope to each of my snipers to undo somewhat the penalty to hit.
That is a pretty important point. I always picked Double Tap so that I don't rely on having to shoot enemies in flanks with my Snipers - I'm trying to capitalize on how often I can hit them anyway, with SCOPE and innate high rank +aim for the class. But with the nerf to Squadsight so that Snipers can no longer crit on a Squadsight shot (outside of Headshot) this approach might not be as effective anymore. Now I have never tried Snapshot+In The Zone, which might be a viable option in the expansion. I hope so! I dislike choices that are so heavily weighted in one direction as the vanilla corporal Sniper felt to be.
As for MC, if my Squadsight Sniper is in range of an Ethereal's mind control, something has gone terribly, terribly wrong. Ideally they're somewhere at least 1 move away from firing/Psi range. Now that means that Snipers are pretty bad at retreating and shooting/overwatching, which is one more reason I kind of like Gunslinger. Gunslinger makes the stock pistol = assault rifle with infinite ammo and a Sniper's aim. Sure, once Ethereals are on the board your plasma pistol shots feel almost laughable (almost... they're actually not that bad) but by then you should be able to control the situation without having to bail your Snipers constantly. But heck, if I ever get an overweight of Snipers I will give it a go. I didn't believe in Suppression for the longest time and now I can't live without it. Who knows? Especially given the new enemy type that really mocks your isolated Snipers.
Greyblades
11-24-2013, 02:32
As for MC, if my Squadsight Sniper is in range of an Ethereal's mind control, something has gone terribly, terribly wrong.
Not exactly what I meant. When the etherials start taking over my assaults whether the sniper can weigh in some damage makes the difference between a dead etherial and my supports getting a shotgun in the face.
That the etherials have a habit of putting a wall or two between them and my other troops make the freedom to move my sniper around handy.
easytarget
11-24-2013, 03:24
At the point I typically encounter these guys I have a blaster launcher and just shove one of those in the door from out of sight, which puts everything in the room in a bad state, blows the walls off, at which point the snipers finish it off.
So there is never a turn that allows them to MC anyone...
easytarget
11-24-2013, 21:50
Just stopping by to announce I hate thin men.
LeftEyeNine
11-25-2013, 13:20
Just stopping by to announce I hate thin men.
I love the way they groove. Them being poisonous sons of daisies is what I hate.
easytarget
11-25-2013, 14:20
Agreed, their animations are some of the best in the game. The problem I have with them, especially in I/C, is that they are insanely accurate. So my guys end up making a bunch of wild shots with their crappy starter weapons and miss a lot of course while these guys kill off my troops one shot'ing them.
I just had a guy killed behind full cover and this thin man was not near by, and he wasn't even remotely flanking, in fact he was at an angle to the inside of the full cover which just so happened to be a large truck.
Really hard to rank guys up with this stuff happening early.
It's one of many things that strangely makes the game difficulty curve completely out of whack. The first 3 months are harder than any other part of the campaign, and sections of the ending are so easy they really prove no challenge at all, to say nothing of the actual ending.
LeftEyeNine
11-25-2013, 17:22
Agreed, their animations are some of the best in the game. The problem I have with them, especially in I/C, is that they are insanely accurate. So my guys end up making a bunch of wild shots with their crappy starter weapons and miss a lot of course while these guys kill off my troops one shot'ing them.
I just had a guy killed behind full cover and this thin man was not near by, and he wasn't even remotely flanking, in fact he was at an angle to the inside of the full cover which just so happened to be a large truck.
Really hard to rank guys up with this stuff happening early.
It's one of many things that strangely makes the game difficulty curve completely out of whack. The first 3 months are harder than any other part of the campaign, and sections of the ending are so easy they really prove no challenge at all, to say nothing of the actual ending.
I agree with their frustrating level of accuracy. Actually, what I have experienced so far is that aliens in general have their accuracy increased. If you are somewhat exposed, there is no way they are missing, not even your typical home-use basic aliens. And when they do not, they splash criticals like confettis all over an award-winner.
I agree with their frustrating level of accuracy. Actually, what I have experienced so far is that aliens in general have their accuracy increased. If you are somewhat exposed, there is no way they are missing, not even your typical home-use basic aliens. And when they do not, they splash criticals like confettis all over an award-winner.
That's why Hunker Down is your friend. There are many, many situations in which Hunker Down is vastly superior to Overwatch.
That's why Hunker Down is your friend. There are many, many situations in which Hunker Down is vastly superior to Overwatch.
When half cover makes you frown: It's time to Hunker Down.
I just had a guy killed behind full cover and this thin man was not near by, and he wasn't even remotely flanking, in fact he was at an angle to the inside of the full cover which just so happened to be a large truck.
Thin Men are the Xenos version of your snipers. They have great accuracy no matter the situation and have good crit chance. I find that when i approach them with this mind set they are much less annoying to deal with.
Thin Men have 75 aim on Classic+. So even in Hardcover you will get hit once per 3 shots, for 4-6 damage (6-9 critical). Taking a potshot fight with Thinmen early on is one of the best ways to get wiped with no real chance to win. You either have to outflank them, heavily outgun them or explode them along with their cover. Incidently MECs do all three of those quite admirably. Having one on the 17 Thinmen council mission makes it a lot smoother.
On Impossible, Sectoids also have 75 aim along with an innate 20 critical. So taking a fight hardcover to hardcover gives you 25% to hit with 10% crit, vs their 35% chance to hit and 20% crit which can be buffed to 45% crit with Mindmerge. Also Merge heals 1 health. Potshot duels are completely unwinnable from day 1. You must cower like the Cowman said - Hunker Down while repositioning in hard cover is vital as this move grants you 80 defense. For some reason the aliens will take 0% shots at you at times instead of just Overwatching, but be mindful that if the aliens are close enough they will get range-bonuses to hit and can hit soldiers even in Hunker Down. Lost 2 Hunkered rookies on my 2nd mission to what I believe was a 10% and a 20% shot at close range from the last two Sectoids on the map. Blerh.
And finally a little whine-story: After finally stabilizing and getting 2 months into the game I was left with everyone in medcare except my Sniper for an abduction mission, so I took one of my 3 Squaddie Heavies along with 3 rookies to do a little training. First round triggers 2 rooftop-Sectoid and 6 Floaters, killing 2 rookies before they ever got a chance to shoot an alien. Through some insane luck I managed to stabilize and clear all of the map bar 1 group, but my only survivor by then was my corporal Sniper, who had earned a promotion for his modest 10 kills that mission. The reward was panic reduction and a sergeant Sniper, which I heavily lacked, so I decided to take on the last group with just my Sniper. I manage to activate them from a rooftop that has heavy cover, giving me a real fighting chance against those two 6-hp aliens. I first thought they were Thinmen and kind of freaked. Turns out they were Seekers...
ANANDA GUPTA! JAKE SOLOMON! WHY? Had to bail the mission! I have never bailed a mission before! My Sniper got out in time, but... goodbye reward-Sniper and goodbye Canada :(
easytarget
11-25-2013, 20:57
Frankly I don't care what the explanations are, the fact is the difficulty modeled here is front in loaded.
That means from a play experience the vast majority of the people playing this game will do the following:
1. Play and win on easy or normal, enjoyed the game, want to play through again with stiffer resistance
2. Fire up C or C/I only to find this was not a sloped difficulty increase, it was a step function that faced them from the 1st mission
3. one or two squad wipes later - game shelved
However, if they had survived the first three months they would have discovered lo and behold the game actually gets significantly easier and by the end is stupidly easy.
Tell me that's smart game play design.
easytarget
11-25-2013, 20:59
I abort missions all the time... early on losing one of your few vets is much worse than losing a mission.
One of the many reasons C/I gives me headaches. No such option.
easytarget
11-25-2013, 21:00
That's why Hunker Down is your friend. There are many, many situations in which Hunker Down is vastly superior to Overwatch.
I shouldn't have to hunker down from a thin man when I'm behind full cover or face death as a result, yet that's routinely what I'm facing.
easytarget
11-25-2013, 21:05
Thin Men have 75 aim on Classic+. So even in Hardcover you will get hit once per 3 shots, for 4-6 damage (6-9 critical). Taking a potshot fight with Thinmen early on is one of the best ways to get wiped with no real chance to win. (
I don't know what to make of this one, the only way to shoot at something is in LOS, so there's really no choice but to close on them, and no choice but to take "pot shots" at them because what's the other option? Not shooting at them?
I have the misfortune of no heavies and no snipers, that's just the luck of the draw, I however have assaults and rookies, so you can do the math on what my options are in a four man squad with two rookies and two assaults.
If I go into hunker down there will be no shots, not only do they fire more accurately, their movement range is greater than mine and they can move either to close faster than I can cope with or flank faster.
easytarget
11-25-2013, 21:57
Btw, I feel much better now after the above rants about thin men. Carry on. :wall:
I don't know what to make of this one, the only way to shoot at something is in LOS, so there's really no choice but to close on them, and no choice but to take "pot shots" at them because what's the other option? Not shooting at them?
I have the misfortune of no heavies and no snipers, that's just the luck of the draw, I however have assaults and rookies, so you can do the math on what my options are in a four man squad with two rookies and two assaults.
If I go into hunker down there will be no shots, not only do they fire more accurately, their movement range is greater than mine and they can move either to close faster than I can cope with or flank faster.
How many Thin Men are you faced with so early in the game? It makes no sense to not have any classes when Thin Men show up, you've had at least 2 Abduction missions by then, and 95% of the time there's been a 4xSectoid 1xOutsider-UFO mission as well - and this is all assuming a very early council mission outside the standard two scripted ones.
And not shooting is actually not that bad of a choice, if it means Hunkering instead. They shoot their 0-5% shot, now they're not on Overwatch. You can now move to another hardcover and Hunker. Circle the enemy like that and force him to either retreat (which they rarely do, but that could set up a 4xOverwatch trap), move to unfavourable cover, or get flanked. "Unfavourable" can simply mean "cover which a soldier with a grenade is within range of". If he does that, its 3 damage + he's now exposed and your measly 25% shots turn 65% for Rookies. Unless you rush way too aggressively, you should always outnumber Thin Men while you still bring Rookies to missions. Also Assaults with Lightning Reflexes are the absolute hotness on council missions.
On Classic you have to rely on tactics. Just shooting at the enemy is just gonna get you killed. This is mostly relevant once Thin Men become abundant, since on Classic a grenade is a guaranteed insta-kill on Sectoids. So on the first missions you are faced with 8, 10-12 and 4Sectoids+Outsider, meaning that with 4 nades you might not have to shoot anyone at all. Grenading Mind Mergers from a Hunker-advancement is often more viable. Why move without shooting? To advance in Hunker and threaten grenades. Threaten flanks. Leave the enemy optionless except to take an unfavourable firefight, which is to fight coverless against your hardcover. If he still kills someone, well... that's XCOM for you. But almost always you will come out ahead, and losing a guy here and there is acceptable and expectable at higher difficulties - that's part of the challenge.
You should rely on Hunker Down when facing Light Plasma Rifles on Classic, because the game seizes to mess around at that difficulty. If hardcover was unbeatable, the game would be moot. As for the bizarre difficulty curve, it's much reliant on overpowered abilities becoming abundant later on. In vanilla it was Squadsight, Blaster Launchers and Ghost Armor, in EW it's things Mimetic Skin and... Blaster Launchers. I agree, this should be handled by better balancing of the lategame, but if you self-impose a max of 2 of a class per mission, outlaw things like Mimetic Skin and refuse to ever build a Blaster Launcher the game stays somewhat hyper in spikes. It'll work until mods come out that overhaul Berserkers, Muton Elites and Sectopods again. For now, let's be happy that they nerfed Squadsight and HEAT Ammo, and increased research times of weapons and armor. It helps a lot and is all very intelligent rebalancing.
Watch some later EPs of Beaglerush (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ij6mAEL6_IM&feature=youtu.be) or Marbozir (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqlTVUOIEz0) to see how Hunker Down can be utilized.
I don't know what to make of this one, the only way to shoot at something is in LOS, so there's really no choice but to close on them, and no choice but to take "pot shots" at them because what's the other option? Not shooting at them?
I have the misfortune of no heavies and no snipers, that's just the luck of the draw, I however have assaults and rookies, so you can do the math on what my options are in a four man squad with two rookies and two assaults.
If I go into hunker down there will be no shots, not only do they fire more accurately, their movement range is greater than mine and they can move either to close faster than I can cope with or flank faster.
Thin men in full cover are easy to deal with. Normal grenades will pop their cover and leave them with 1 health, thus avoiding the resource destruction you get by grenading sectoids. I routinely hunker down to survive the thin man volleys, then grenade them with one soldier and slaughter the uncovered survivors with the rest. Explosives are your friend! Cover destruction is a very important thing and you should utilize it regularly. Overwatch is, quite honestly, not of much use on harder difficulties due to the aim penalties. It's generally only decent when you've got high level soldiers with great aim and/or classes with feats that remove the reaction shot aim penalties. For low level people who will take those penalties, better to spend your time hunkering down so that you make it to the next turn intact.
easytarget
11-26-2013, 01:20
No, my guy was in full cover and still busy getting killed by a thin man who had no business making the shot he did.
As for grenades, I've got 4 guys, so that's four grenades. There are quite a few more greys and thin men on a mission plus two of the new invis-squid thing than four grenades will cover.
So, you used up your grenades, pat yourself on the back for taking 3 health off a psi'd grey who had 4, or a thin man who had the same, neither of which are dead, and they proceed to kill you behind full cover.
easytarget
11-27-2013, 04:06
Well, back to the drawing board. This run through on C/I netted me too many assaults and no heavies or snipers and I just couldn't manage it with just assault/rookie teams. Ran into a mission early called portent that is too tight of a map to properly flank on (a complaint I have about many of the maps, particularly the urban ones), with high buildings the thin men have on trouble jumping up no top of for yet another buff, and this pretty much put an end to this campaign with half the squad killed I dusted off and abandoned the mission.
Getting back to base I decided with no one ranking up and w/o the right classes this was probably headed quickly towards disaster.
But hope springs eternal, started a new one and the first couple of missions have gone well, but best of all, I've got a sniper and a heavy. So, we'll see how this one goes!
easytarget
11-28-2013, 14:43
I agree, there is a lot you can come back from, but I couldn't get to 6 man and squads (w/ armor, lasers) with what I had, and the re-start is going quite nicely, got to love first mission no one gets hurt and I get one of each class, now that's what I call a proper start.
The OTS in my opinion should have a re-train feature in case you get stuck with the wrong classes, make it take as long as you think keeps the game balanced, but make it so a commander has the option to fix what he or she may consider an untenable situation w/o requiring them to restart like I did, that's a design failure. Or make it a 2nd wave option. This isn't a requirement for everyone I'm making here, I'm suggesting yet another depth of option that ought be something the dev team would understand since that's really what this add-on was, a new set of options.
I have decided to follow a more traditional EU development, only grab meld where it works, still keep some focus on sats, but also make sure I keep my guys alive by skipping missions like portent if/when I know I'm simply not ready (I'll just take the increase on panic and lose some countries for the sake of ranking guys up).
A great game though in my opinion, I hate it and love it in equal measure, there can be no greater tribute I could make to a re-make of the original (which inspired the same feelings).
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