Second thought about USA as a "torture state"

[HopAlongBunny]

Lower court ruling that might see American contractors held liable for possible torture, and an unsuccessful attempt to cover-up the act.
Might the USA be drawing back from its fabulous premiere as a torture state?:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/06/30/us-abughraib-caci-idUSKBN0F51BK20140630

[Fisherking]

Lower court ruling that might see American contractors held liable for possible torture, and an unsuccessful attempt to cover-up the act.
Might the USA be drawing back from its fabulous premiere as a torture state?:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/06/30/us-abughraib-caci-idUSKBN0F51BK20140630

No!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolfowitz_Doctrine

http://www.archives.gov/declassification/iscap/pdf/2008-003-docs1-12.pdf

[Don Corleone]

Not speaking to the ethical/political discussion intended for this thread, but the actual mechanics of it...

I've accidentally backed myself into experimentation with water-boarding (on myself). To make a long story short, I was drinking water in bed, with a much lower pillow than I had used before.

Interesting... no matter how much I tried to go slow and prepare myself, despite the fact that I myself was administering the water to myself.... Could not suppress the reflexive terror of the instinctive feel of drowning.

Honestly, this changed my whole view on water-boarding. Prior to this, I always suspected that the detainees and others subjected to it were making mountains out of molehills. I stand thoroughly corrected, it does indeed incite tremendous, possibly unbearable psychological pressure.

[Kadagar_AV]

Not speaking to the ethical/political discussion intended for this thread, but the actual mechanics of it...

I've accidentally backed myself into experimentation with water-boarding (on myself). To make a long story short, I was drinking water in bed, with a much lower pillow than I had used before.

Interesting... no matter how much I tried to go slow and prepare myself, despite the fact that I myself was administering the water to myself.... Could not suppress the reflexive terror of the instinctive feel of drowning.

Honestly, this changed my whole view on water-boarding. Prior to this, I always suspected that the detainees and others subjected to it were making mountains out of molehills. I stand thoroughly corrected, it does indeed incite tremendous, possibly unbearable psychological pressure.

Yeah, people judging it as anything less than torture must watch Fox News several hours a day...

[Don Corleone]

I didn't use the word torture, as that's a pretty value laden term with many definitions that are in the eye of the beholden. I'll stay with extreme psychological pressure.

[a completely inoffensive name]

I didn't use the word torture, as that's a pretty value laden term with many definitions that are in the eye of the beholden. I'll stay with extreme psychological pressure.

How is that anything but the definition of torture?
noun
noun torture


the action or practice of inflicting severe pain on someone as a punishment or to force them to do or say something, or for the pleasure of the person inflicting the pain.



great physical or mental suffering or anxiety.
torment (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) agony (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) suffering (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) pain (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) anguish (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#)misery (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) distress (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) heartbreak (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) affliction (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) scourge (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#)trauma (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) wretchedness (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) hell (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) purgatory (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#)

a cause of suffering or anxiety.
infliction of pain (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) abuse (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) ill-treatment (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#)maltreatment (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) persecution (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#) sadism (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/chrome-extension://mgijmajocgfcbeboacabfgobmjgjcoja/browser_action.html#)

[Papewaio]

Torture state is a bit harsh, ya? More like torture administration. Today, charge the contractors, tomorrow charge Rumsefeld!

Well, no, probably not. Would be nice, though. :shrug:

Nation State not people. When the highest officers of the state have commerical contractors committing torture on their behalf it is a state issue. It's not even just a hypothetical or a doctrine, it was acted upon by the state for the benefit of the state.

[HopAlongBunny]

Not surprising I suppose, but apparently the prosecutors told lies and failed to disclose information in the conviction of Canadian Omar Khadr.
That the Canadian gov't never really rose to the defense of Khadr is our shame; that the USA falsely convicted him is a comment on so-called US justice

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/secret-us-memo-suggests-no-legal-basis-to-charge-omar-khadr-with-war-crimes/article19438694/