What do you Field and Why?

[Azrael]

Hey Guys,

Until theres a solid MP Forum up and running, looks like the Main Hall's the place for this.

In MP, which faction do pick, and why?

What Units do you use? Offence v.s. Defence?

Anyone out there got the Ultimate Army and Formation?

Let's hear what people are doing.

Azrael

[TenkiSoratoti]

Did you think before you put this post up lol.

Um well if i were to tell you, then you would probably copy me true?
Im on a kinda winning streak now so um .. i cant give any secrets away till i dont use them anymore.

[Vlad The Impaler]

well it was a signature to someone:
" a true warrior never reveals his true skills" or something; i cant remember exactly http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Dionysus9]

I am not as closed lipped about my tactics. I don't fear the un-initiated or un-sure, in fact I'd like to help you become better.

More challenge = more fun. So, I will tell you my basic tactics.

4 ranged units (arbs are cheaper than pavise and just as good once you use the extra $ to upgrade). They fight extremely well in hand to hand when your line becomes thin toward the end of the battle. Hold alt and left click to get them to draw their short swords and plug holes in your line. Try v2 arbs with 1 armor upgrade.

4 Spears to guard ranged units from cav attacks and also to hold the line against charges. Put the in hold form hold position for best effect. Make sure they are standing and facing the proper direction when the enemy impact comes. I always use v4 spears regardless of the cost.

4 Swords/Axes (shock troops) on the wings to flank the enemy line or at least to stop the enemy from flanking mine. Here you need to concentrate on valor, but dont spend too much. v2,v3 is normally sufficient.

4 Alan Cavalry = cheap and fast. Normall v2 will do the trick, but v1 if you are running low on money. Dont waste your time w/ v0 unless you only use them to chase down routers.

Go to www.totalwarassembly.com and look at the unit stats for each faction. Each faction has suitable units for my above set-up. Units with no bonus to attack/defend cav are normally non-spear shock units. Get the biggest sized unit that has decent morale (honor). Honor is important...pay for it.

So, there you have the basic format that has worked for me time and time again. The only real difference between factions is in shock troops. Look at the faction unit stats. In Byzantine you can use Byz Inf (nice and cheap, v3 kick ass), or Varangians (expensive, but v2 do well). In Egyptian you can use Abyssinian Guard. Some of the muslim factions are left with only Militiamen for shock troops--but they work ok. I prefer 100 man units if possible, but if not then get the 60's.

Good luck.

See you online.

[solypsist]

I just want to point out this is a good way to post a topic:
the title line asks the question/subject, and the secondary line lets everyone know the context.
Good job, Az.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif

[Nobunaga0611]

Everything obviously depends on what you're trying to do/what you feel in the mood for. If you want cavs, then Spain or Egypt. Unless you want all heavy cav (Spain will work for that) then another catholic faction. If you're looking for large units, then Byzantines or Italy. I personally think of the Germans as a 'Heavy' faction, so they're not good to use in the desert. I could go through all of them, but....

Having around 4 missle units is good, depending on which they are. 4 Longbows are good, but run out quickly in a battle. Sometimes bringing a mix is good. I don't want to sit here forever http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif so a good thing to remember is, don't let the core of your army, the center of the front line, break. If it does, most of the units around it will follow, then you're in trouble. Bring somewhat high valour spears, or whatever you wanna use for your center.

[Cheetah]

The 4x4 army suggested by Bacchus is a very good combo, but I would advise you to experiment with the proportions. So, build your armies around this combo, but one time buy 2 horse instead of 4 and let's say buy 6 spears, next time buy 2 swordsmen insted of 4 and buy 6 cavs, etc. Also, if you buy more cavs experiment with the differnt types, especially with chiv.knights and lancers http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif But, the most important thing IMHO, is to learn how to move your army as a whole, and how to use groups to their best advantage. Even the best combo is useless if you cannot move it properly.

Almost forgot it: people usually buy more ranged for defence and more cavs for attack but this 4x4 combo is good for both.

[Dionysus9]

Yes, Cheetah is right. Play around with the 4x4x4x4 army. I've settled on the above proportions after a couple of years of messing around. It works for both attack and defense--I sometimes find myself having to defend when I am the attacker, and visa versa, so I like to have balanced proportions.

I would also agree the most important thing is to learn how to move your army as a whole (use CTRL-A to select all). Learn to use ALT-LeftClick to move the entire army and retain its facing. Use Alt-RightClick (after Grouping the entire army with the G key) to change the armies facing as a group (instead of each unit turning to face the click, as if you hadn't used the G key). These couple of techniques are the beginning of advanced play. Learn them and use them if you dont already

[muffinman14]

I almost always use the Turks in MP. Good attackers and good defenders.

I dont need any tactical strategy, I have skill and thats all i need

[tootee]

It is also very fun and challenging to play with only 40-60 men units in 3v3 or 4v4.

[Katasaki Hirojima]

I haven't gone online yet, but in Custom I prefer useing less Cavalry and more infantry, I prefer to use 4 Italian Infantry, 3 serpentines, 3-5 Feudal knights or Mounted Seargents, 1-3 guns and 4 Chivalric M@A. ALso, if playing as Byzantine I go heavy on the Byzantine cav, like 6 of them, 4 spears, 4 Byz Inf and 2 Serpentines. Other factions, ecspecially those with very good Cavalry Archers change my setup. I LOve strong Cavalry archers like Mamluks, Byzantine and Boyar Cavalry.

Honour and upgrades are variable.

[Azrael]

Hey Guys,

Thanks for your usefull replies.

I'll try some of those suggestions out to find what balance works best for me.

And Tenkitorasoti. Did I "think" before I put this post up?

Well... yeah.

Glad that some people thought before they typed a reply.

Thanks guys.

Azrael

[OleRight]

I'll throw in a counter-point. In addition, I think its fun to discuss different ideas and what works for some people and not for others. I don't feel it gives anyone else an edge over me, the better general will usually always win regardless of the force under his command (all other things being equal). So...

I've had issues with the effectivness of most missle troops so I prefer to do away entirely with missle troops and get extra spears and shock troops. What I've found is that I need to be a bit more agressive and manuver more, but when the moment of decision comes and all the troops are engaged I have 2-4 additional melee units to toss in. An extra 2-400 men or so in reserve is worth more to me than the slow damage over time and minor morale penalties missle troops provide.

The major down side of this is that your tactical options become more limited. Sometimes you have to sit and take missle fire and not be able to do anything about it. That is quite frustrating, but having a few light cav units to brush the enemy missle troops off helps.

Personally, I've had lots of luck with the units availible to the Turk Faction. Muslim units tend to be a bit faster than others and (important) recover from a rout quicker (at least it seems so to me). Most are spear based and it has the Janissary Heavy Infantry a very expensive but very capable unit. You have to be careful though, many of the units availible are lighter than their Christian counterparts and as such have lower base moral and attack stats. Besides, they are different and since most people don't mess around with them they don't know what to expect from them (...know your enemy...). So a Turk army is a rapier rather than a battle axe and should be used as such.

(I just read what I wrote... man I'm good&#33http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

So if anyone wants to test their "mix" against mine just look for me on the MP server.
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smokin.gif

[Dionysus9]

OleRight I'll look you up. My Byzantines have a score to settle with your Turks anwyay.

[ElmarkOFear]

Az, here is my patented Elmo All Missile Army which you played against last night:

5 arbs - val 0,
4/5 handgunners - val 4, armor 1
2/3 arquesbusiers - val 4, armor 2
3/4 murabitin (almohad) - val 2
1 camel archer general (almohad) - as much valor as can afford after buying other troops.

As you notice I vary the amount of handgunners, arq's and murabitin, depending on who I am playing. I also sometimes add in 1 or 2 naptha throwers at val 3 in place of the arq's if I feel there will be a rusher nearby. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif Good luck, but I warn you .. this army is extremely hard to become proficient at and you will suffer a lot of losses when first using it. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif Have fun.

[Azrael]

Hey Guys,

Elmo Those Handgunners are absolute nutters They way they handle hand to hand combat with spear troops they must be made of lead.

Tenkitorasoti. I apologise for my snappy reply above. It was a bit late when I typed it, so I'll blame tiredness.

You were right in thinking that I was new to multi-player and wanted some tips on Unit Balance etc..., but of course I know better than to think people are going to list me "their perfect army" that "wins for them every time".

The stuff that you guys have posted has been helpful, especially pointing out the info available at the Total War Assembly.

Thanks alot.

Azrael

[Puzz3D]

Azrael,

The basic problem facing you online is stopping a rush. The 4x4 army is nice because its flexibility allows you to adapt to varying battlefield situations. Since cavalry is currently the rushing weapon of choice, that's what you have to be able to stop. While I won't say it's easy to do, I think you can do it if your 8 infantry are good anti-cav units, and you don't allow any rear attacks on your units by the enemy cav. You have to be defensively minded even if you are techincally the attacker, since there is no way your infantry army can effectively attack the faster cav army unless they are backed into a corner. Unfortunately, taking 8 anti-cav infantry means no swords unless you substitute some swords for your ranged or cav units.

[bosdur]

Quote[/b] (Azrael @ Nov. 16 2002,06:01)]Hey Guys,

Until theres a solid MP Forum up and running, looks like the Main Hall's the place for this.

In MP, which faction do pick, and why?

What Units do you use? Offence v.s. Defence?

Anyone out there got the Ultimate Army and Formation?

Let's hear what people are doing.

Azrael
My favorite faction after patch currently is the spanish with the following combo:

4 spears ^ ( if possible order foot valor 3 or chiv sarge at valor 4 better upgrade if further possibe)
2 shock | (fmaa at valor 3 if possible)
4 passive arbs /
6 cavs C (Lancers,chiv knight,feudal at valor 0 upgrade weapon and defence is enough if possilbe)

Arranged like this:

/ / / /
^^ || ^^

CC CC CC

Why the shock in the middle ? well, I'm a lazy player http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif, i think it's tedious and took a lot of concentration to swing my shock army to the flanks, so what I prefer to do is seek the weakest front (usually spears) unit in my enemy line and target the 2 of my shock troops there hoping to rout it. If it routs then my middle cav men will charge forward and start to wreak havoc in blitzkrieg kind of way. The remaining cavs will be the substitute for my shock infantry, I feel that if cav is faster and it brings more morale penalty why not use them instead of shock troops. Especially with cav capable of beating spears now (think about the 16 cav rush tactic).

Above is of course the ideal situation, which only happens 10 % of the time for me http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/redface.gif. But the theory is good isn't it http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif ? Most important is imo being dynamics/flexible and have good instinct, also learn the rules (stats/bonuses). For example i played with someone yesterday who confidently rushed me in the woods with spears while I have mostly swords army http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/rolleyes.gif. Trees disable rank bonuses for spear/pikemen, this is a basic bonus rule that I feel not many new players know about it, the rest of the rules can be obtained by searching over this site or read it from the strategy guide. Another example of flexibility is elmo's all missile army, which crazy guy would think of that http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/shock.gif ??? It is rarely defeated and works quite well(if the opponent doesnt have lots of cavalry and allies know how to protect elmo's flank-ass).

I'd also recommend to watch the play of good players, I recommend XxAMPxX a.k.a ampmortog. He's a player with many tactics and very dynamic too, my favorite of his tactics is the single line-sword rush that I used yesterday in the trees battle.