A mafi(y)a game

[autolycus]

GM's notes:
Double A: three days in a row not voting
autolycus: two days in a row not voting

Need I replace you? Almost certainly. Do I have replacements? No.

As you said before, I voted yesterday, it was Double A that didn't. You don't need to replace me :)

[Kagemusha]

I'm not part of any network. I have my own list of suspects, people I consider to be innocent, and people in the middle. The three people I mentioned are three of the folks on my "middle" list who I would like more of a read on.

In such case. If there is an investigator around, you should know who to investigate next.:yes:

[GeneralHankerchief]

Now i have no clue why should i have a wish for any of the players to be night killed, so i might as well hope that it will be me, as my usefulness is limited to my vote and most probably voting power will not become the main issue for the town in this game.

Oh no, don't you dare die on me. You need to stay alive, at least until we get to the endgame. :yes:

[Kagemusha]

Uhmm...I dont know.I feel bit non protected at this point.Maybe the wily mafia will indeed kill me.

[El Barto]

As you said before, I voted yesterday, it was Double A that didn't. You don't need to replace me :)
I keep amending my own posts! I shoudl refresh instead of having the same page open in three tabs.
Double A: where are you?

@dead people: is there any willing replacement?

[BSmith]

I suppose I could be a replacement.

[El Barto]

Good, you'll be in as of next phase (in 4 hours' time).

[Csargo]

So, what's everybody's ideal wishlist for what happens tonight? I'm particularly interested in knowing what Iskander, Csargo, and TexCat want to happen. :yes:

What's this? I hope I'm still alive when the day starts in a few hours? My suspicions have been pretty clearly stated. I'm a little miffed by how ATPG has taken over the thread tbh, but that's to be expected considering. I'm wondering what you're hoping to get from this question. Seems strange to me honestly.

Edit:wordz

[Double A]

I keep forgetting the org's a thing because I'm an idiot.

Tak I am shamefur dispray, and aporogize for this. Prease reprace me with BS or arrowh me to commit sudoku. :stwshame:

[El Barto]

Your rife is payment enough for your shame. Prease to commit sudoku at once to creanse famiry honour. :bow:

GM-san preased to introduce Suspiciousry Simirar Substitute BSmith as new prayer. :bow:

One minute's sirence to honour death of Doubre A.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Minute's over.

[El Barto]

Yes. We are now drinking saké to cerebrate death of impudent dog Doubre A and wercome to BSmith.

[Double A]

rip in peace me

[El Barto]

Prease to be sirent, worthress person-kun. I am about to begin the rabours of update.

[El Barto]

NIGHT THREE

TexCat was found dead He was a townie!
Double A was inexplicably gone. In his place, someone who had an inexplicable resemblance to the late BSmith had moved into Double A's furnishings.

1. Zack, mafioso, lynched on Day Two.
2. Csargo
3. landlubber
4. Double A → replaced by BSmith II.
5. Visorslash, townie, lynched on Day One.
6. BSmith, townie, killed by the mafia on Night One.
7. GeneralHankerchief
8. Iskander 3.1
9. seireikhaan
10. Kagemusha
11. johnhughthom
12. Askthepizzaguy
13. autolycus
14. TexCat, townie, killed by the mafia on Night Three.
15. Ishmael, townie, killed by the mafia on Night Two.
16. Winston Hughes, townie, lynched on Day Three.

It is now Day Four.
Time remaining for this phase:

[GeneralHankerchief]

Huh, cool, I was going to vote TexCat this phase.

[Csargo]

That's an odd choice considering the suspicion against TexCat. Another one off the list I guess...

[GeneralHankerchief]

I'm starting to think we might be facing a Zack-Double A(BSmith now)-johnhughthom scum team. I'm probably WIFOMing this way too heavily, but just bear with me for a second.

These kills, particularly the most recent one, haven't really jived with who you would have expected to die at night. My own personal reactions have ranged from "huh, okay" to "wait, really?" Now, admittedly, the two explanations that do a better job of passing Occam's Razor than the one I'm about to offer are that the mafia are a) using random.org, or b) doing this on purpose to mess with us. However, I'm personally leaning towards a third, and that's the triumvirate I listed above.

We know that Double A has been inactive in this game and just had to be replaced out. He wouldn't be contributing to any kill selections. I know from personal experience that El Barto is very strict in terms of the "no participation after death" rule - I doubt that Zack would be allowed to make any suggestions or send in kills after his lynch. This leaves the third scummo as john, who, in the most recent game, according to khaan, was perfectly fine with sailing along and pretty much unilaterally approving of khaan's kill selections. I believe that, ignoring the other two options for a moment, out of the remaining playerbase, john would be the most likely to send in these kills without the benefit of any sort of peer review.

So it's 50-50 for me right now. In the meantime, I'll cast my vote just to get him in the thread and starting to give me data points to work off of:

Vote: BSmith

[Csargo]

I like GH's theory, so Vote:johnhughthom we'll see what happens.

[BSmith]

I would actually like to play this game, so I would prefer not to be killed just as soon as I get back into it. ~:cool:

As for the actual game... I need to get read up before I can offer any competent contributions...

[seireikhaan]

I tell ya what, Bsmith, my boy, you left that post a couple hours ago and this thread aint that long. Vote: Bsmith

So get on down here, boy, I say, lemme see what you got.

[landlubber]

Vote: JHT. Deserves some pressure.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Vote: Generalhankerchief

[johnhughthom]

It's quite simple as to why I was happy to go along with 'khaan's kills, he didn't come up with any bad ones. As scum I'll generally go along with kills team mates want to do, if I think it's a bad one though I will say so.

My kill strategy as scum is based on lols. I would totes have killed Double A/BSmith last night.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I killed TexCat because she always correctly reads me as scum when I'm scum.

Best way to never get caught is to eliminate all the townies I'm actually fearful of. I don't know why it works, but it does.

[johnhughthom]

Explains my high survival rate in games.

[johnhughthom]

Vote: landlubber

Simple jump on a flimsy case.

[Askthepizzaguy]

unvote,

vote: Johnhughthom aka johnhugescum

[johnhughthom]

What happened to Iskander is 100% scum?

[Askthepizzaguy]

What happened to Iskander is 100% scum?

Shhh, shh shh shh.

You obviously don't believe that he is, or you'd be voting him. Thanks for the heads up, btw.

[Kagemusha]

Vote: Iskander

Mindless Borg at your service, your pizzanesss.:404:

[GeneralHankerchief]

Kage, what are your thoughts on the case I laid out against BSmith and john at the start of the round?

[BSmith]

Vote: GeneralHanDkerchief

D1 distancing?


Vote: Double A

WoG bait, part of the tiebreaker last round, lynch lurkers in vanilla games, etc etc etc.

It’s the beginning of D2, a little early to be talking about WOG bait (even though this is ultimately what happened)


I like the logic against vote:Double A, he's certainly more cautious now than we're used to. Deserves some pressure.

This comes right in the aftermath of Reid’s accusation of Zack killing BSmith. Ishamel is also guilty of this and turned out town, but it seems strange that they would not address the accusation at all.


Kind of wish you had delivered this accusation a bit later on in the round so we could get more unrelated discussion out of it, but hey, I'm always up for a mafioso being lynched. :2thumbsup:

Unvote: Double A
Vote: Zack

No avoiding it now. Might as well go all in and get in early on your partner.


We dont have much to go with at this point, but while Zack is the clear lynch to test the claim of Riedquat. I have to FOS: GH.

Old friend. If we assume Zack is indeed mafia and mafia tends to distance from each other at the start of the games usually.The one who seems most distant from Zack based on the first round and start of this one is you GH, with Zacks vote against you in the first round.:yes: Just wanted to point that out if i get killed early in this game too. So i have to embarrass myself with my ramblings while i still can.

Exactly what I am getting at here. Exactly. There is some further discussion about this but it doesn’t really shake my feelings on GH.


The funniest part is that I believe both of you. Because I'm a power role too! :laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:

Unvote: johnhughthom
Vote: TexCat

This is the kind of thing I’d do if I was feeling confident and was scum. I love telling the truth as mafia and getting away with it.

Bottom line my top suspect at the moment is GeneralHankerchief. Second choice would be landlubber.

I don’t like pizza’s WIFOMing about being mafia. I almost want to lynch him on principle, but I find it extremely hard to believe that Reid would bus his partner like that. I would also like some more reasoning as to his insistence that Iskander is scum and then dropping it today.

[GeneralHankerchief]

This reads like a classic case of someone going in and looking for confirmation bias.

Just to make sure I understand correctly, your counter-proposal includes a scum team of Zack, myself, and landlubber?

[BSmith]

I wouldn’t go so far as to call it a counter proposal. I am not confident in calling out a specific scum team, only what I am finding suspicious after a full read of the thread. Believe it or not I didn’t actually take your vote/case on me into consideration as I read the thread. My logic started with who I might be able to link Zack to and went from there, only realizing that I was technically performing an OMGUS response to you well after I got into it.

I suppose there could be some confirmation bias included, but only because of the initial link between you and Zack and the subsequent percolation of suspicion directed your way throughout the thread confirming my initial impressions gained through reading from the beginning.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Also, I'll have a more detailed response to this in six hours when I'm no longer riding a train whose parent agency is actively trying to kill its riders.

[Kagemusha]

Kage, what are your thoughts on the case I laid out against BSmith and john at the start of the round?

To be honest. I am wavering between going after you compared to BSmith and your proposed two/thirds of a trio. What is holding me back is Pizza and his unknown resources. I want to hear you out what you have to say and maybe Pizza will share some of his views also, so i am all ears.

[Csargo]

Unvote:jht, Vote:GH I eagerly await your detailed response.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I don’t like pizza’s WIFOMing about being mafia. I almost want to lynch him on principle, but I find it extremely hard to believe that Reid would bus his partner like that. I would also like some more reasoning as to his insistence that Iskander is scum and then dropping it today.

What WIFOM? I am the mafia. Lynch me, foolish townie.

[Askthepizzaguy]

To be honest. I am wavering between going after you compared to BSmith and your proposed two/thirds of a trio. What is holding me back is Pizza and his unknown resources. I want to hear you out what you have to say and maybe Pizza will share some of his views also, so i am all ears.

My unknown resources say that Iskander didn't do any night actions. It doesn't clear him, because boy oh boy, yesterday was a train wreck from him.

It's also something that would be easy to call. Iskander's partner should have done the murder last night, not him.

But, it's enough to make me look at johnhughthom and GH.

I prefer JHT but surprise me.

[Askthepizzaguy]

What happened to Iskander is 100% scum?

This is also a remarkably scummy reaction from John to me voting him. Just feels like grasping at straws.

The john I know is an olympic-sized swimming pool of apathy. But he's a huge scum instead of a huge thumb this game, so that fits the pattern.

[Askthepizzaguy]

It's quite simple as to why I was happy to go along with 'khaan's kills, he didn't come up with any bad ones. As scum I'll generally go along with kills team mates want to do, if I think it's a bad one though I will say so.

My kill strategy as scum is based on lols. I would totes have killed Double A/BSmith last night.

This is the equivalent to john panicking.

He doesn't, but even a blip on the care meter is noteworthy.

See related picture.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/96/Grumpy_Bear.jpg

Pictured: John blue thumb explaining how he did it for the lols.

[seireikhaan]

Unvote; Vote: Johnhughthom


I say, do my eyes deceive me, or is the boy right that JHT flinched?

[GeneralHankerchief]

Okay, I'll divide my defense up into three parts, each concentrating on a separate behavior that BSmith accused me of.

On the possible connection of Zack to me with regards to the Day 1 voting
I'll keep this one shorter than the others because obviously I can't speak to Zack's behavior. However, let me repeat the previous defense I made when Kage brought this issue up a couple days ago: At one point on D1, I was the leading lynch candidate. Not tied for the lead, outright in the lead. At no point during the phase did Zack make any change to move his vote off me, when it would have been very easy to and he could have done so without any suspicion, it being D1 and the usual random votes coming in.

It's worth noting that BSmith in his reading of the thread glossed over my defense, even though he made reference to it by saying there is "further discussion about this" but not going into specifics. The fact that he's bringing up an issue that I already addressed without adding anything new to it means one of two things: Either BSmith is basing this portion of his case on me on a gut feeling, which there's no point in defending against, or that he's scum purposely trying to muddy the waters in order to try to push a lynch.

On the immediate reactions following Riedquat's reveal on Day 2
Here, BSmith accuses both myself and landlubber of scummy behavior, but uses extremely inconsistent arguments in doing so. Basically, after Riedquat all but revealed and pointed the finger at Zack on D2, he attempts to paint my immediate jumping on the fledgling Zack bandwagon as scummy. However, he also says that lubber's (and Ishmael's) non-reaction by ignoring the issue is also scummy. After a reveal like this, there are really only three ways you can react:

You can jump on the bandwagon
You can ignore the issue
You can actively argue against the case, usually by attacking the person who revealed

All three reactions can be construed as scummy if you're desperate to accuse someone of being mafia. For jumping on the bandwagon (what I did), you can do what BSmith said and say he's cutting his losses and making sure he buses his partner early. For ignoring the issue (what lubber did), you can do what BSmith said and say that he's attempting to deflect conversation away from his buddy or that he got caught off-guard. For actively arguing against the issue, you can say that he's trying to turn the lynch around and save his buddy.

This is what I meant earlier when I said that BSmith's argument reeked of confirmation bias. Any action can be construed as scummy if you're determined enough to find it.

On my supposedly "confident mafioso" behavior stemming from my Day 3 postings
Here BSmith attempts to categorize my jovial, amused actions in the early part of D3 as something that a confident mafioso would do, highlighting himself as an example. If we review the context of these actions, there is very little for me to be confident about if I were actually scum. To sum it up, either my sole partner or one of my partners (I'm operating under the assumption that we started the game with three mafiosi, but have no ironclad evidence to prove as much) was lynched on the previous day to the actions of a detective role of some sort who was still in the game. Furthermore, as BSmith himself mentions in his follow-up post against me, there had and has been a "percolation of suspicion directed [my] way throughout the thread". If I'm scum, and I've already lost one partner and have routinely come pretty close to the lynch myself on more than one occasion, I'm not confident. I'm wary.

To sum up, I don't really think BSmith's case against me really holds any water aside from maybe it being a gut feeling, which is completely subjective and something I'm unable to do anything about. I think it's far more likely that he's a mafioso who's looking to direct suspicion on an inviting target. That said, I'm glad that he's been participating in the thread. At some point in the phase I'll take a closer look at john and maybe switch my vote over to him, but for now it remains on BSmith.

[Askthepizzaguy]

So Khaan, it may interest you to know that if JHT flips innocent, you and Autolycus are both comfirmed to be the remaining mafia team.

Either you both are innocent, and JHT is guilty, or you're both guilty and he's innocent.

Isn't that fun?

Oh insane detectives, how much fun are they.

[seireikhaan]

So Khaan, it may interest you to know that if JHT flips innocent, you and Autolycus are both comfirmed to be the remaining mafia team.

Either you both are innocent, and JHT is guilty, or you're both guilty and he's innocent.

Isn't that fun?

Oh insane detectives, how much fun are they.
Let the games, I say, let the games begin. Let's see how it unfolds, why don't we?

[Askthepizzaguy]

You could also be scum with GH because why not.

If that's the case, I lol, and add to your already impressive pile of scum wins.

[landlubber]

I ignored Ried at first because I thought that his accusation was random, or at least based on something besides a scan. I didn't think that a cop would out the scum and put a target on his back so quickly. It didn't really occur to me that he could've been a proxy, which Pizza alluded to. So, yeah, I just didn't see anything worth addressing, not until I understood that he was serious.

[Csargo]

You could also be scum with GH because why not.

If that's the case, I lol, and add to your already impressive pile of scum wins.

I find this most likely. No one ever seems to want to lynch khaan though, he's untouchable...

[GeneralHankerchief]

If khaan and I are ever scum together, the very heavens will split open.

[Csargo]

Maybe they have and no one has noticed. We're all here twiddling our thumbs and staring at the ground. I'm fairly certain at least one of you is scum. Leaning more towards you at this point.

[Kagemusha]

Ok. Let us lynch JHT then. Vote:JHT. But if he flips innocent you are next in my book GH.:yes:

[Csargo]

Just in case I can't post for the remainder of this phase, I'll lay out my thoughts so far. GH's question last night phase bothered me. I found it an extremely odd request. What could be gathered from that? It still doesn't make sense to me. Really I'd like some sort of explanation on that. His analysis of the kills was interesting at first, but really very little can be extracted from kills imo. It feels like he's trying to string us along. Yeah Double A was an absentee for basically the entire game until he was replaced. That's not typical behavior for scum, and he was present multiple times throughout the game. He just neglected to ever vote and was replaced by BSmith. I'd say there's only a tiny chance that Double A(BSmith) is actual scum. As far as JHT is concerned, he's just an easy target. Lurking seems to be how he plays the game. Lurking doesn't mean he's disinterested or not paying attention to the game. There's a lot less to work with, so in general people are more suspicious of lurkers.

khaan is overplaying his character imo. He's dragging it out for far longer than I figured he would. Seems like overcompensation to display normal behavior. Of course it could just be him being a townie and having a bit of fun, really hard to tell honestly. He also saved GH from the cluster tie of Day 2/3?, so there's that as well.

These are really just my gut feelings on the two of them. I'd say GH is a better lynch than khaan at this moment.

tl;dr GH is totally scum 100% A++, gut says he's stringing us along.

[Kagemusha]

Forgot to unvote and vote:JHT

[GeneralHankerchief]

My question from the other day was designed to catch people off guard. If you're townie, you have to do a little bit of thinking to put yourself in the mafia's head, but it's not that difficult once you put your mind to it. You most likely have a list of suspects; you most likely also have a list of people you're pretty sure are innocent. Ideally you, as town, want the mafia to kill either one of your suspects or one of the folks that don't fit in either category, as this makes life easier when you're narrowing things down. Meanwhile, if you're scum and you're trying to answer that question, you have to do a lot more mental gymnastics. You have to place yourself in the heads of the town, which you should be doing anyway, but you're now being asked to think like mafia thinking like town thinking like mafia. Do you say your partner? Do you say the person you have picked out as lynchbait? Do you say your target for the night? It's a lot easier for mafia to trip and fall all over themselves if they're not super careful.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Also, my fixation on Double A for a good part of the game can be explained. First of all, while I didn't consider him (and by extension BSmith) mafia until this phase, I also didn't want him alive if we got to the endgame simply because there'd be absolutely no data to go on. He wasn't worth a lynch because there were always more inviting targets (Zack, etc), and I wasn't sure if he'd get Wogged or not. I didn't want a Mafia X repeat to happen.

Also, in terms of Double A's complete inactiveness generally not reflecting typical mafia behavior, there is specific precedent for him doing so: Pirate Ship II, when he was in essence the mafia godfather in that game and went inactive mid-game because he was too busy playing video games by his own admission. As I'm going through the process of creating and balancing Pirate Ship III, I have to admit that this example was pretty darn fresh in my mind. Also, there's probably a subconscious part of me that hasn't quite forgiven him for doing that, but that's an issue for another day.

[johnhughthom]

Ummm...

I'm a power role?

:shrug:

[autolycus]

Well, if either johnhughthom or I is scum according to pizza, my course is clear. Of course, if johnhughthom comes up innocent, then I'll have to consider the other possiblity, that pizza is scum.

[Askthepizzaguy]

You guessed my secret identity. How did you know.

[Csargo]

My question from the other day was designed to catch people off guard. If you're townie, you have to do a little bit of thinking to put yourself in the mafia's head, but it's not that difficult once you put your mind to it. You most likely have a list of suspects; you most likely also have a list of people you're pretty sure are innocent. Ideally you, as town, want the mafia to kill either one of your suspects or one of the folks that don't fit in either category, as this makes life easier when you're narrowing things down. Meanwhile, if you're scum and you're trying to answer that question, you have to do a lot more mental gymnastics. You have to place yourself in the heads of the town, which you should be doing anyway, but you're now being asked to think like mafia thinking like town thinking like mafia. Do you say your partner? Do you say the person you have picked out as lynchbait? Do you say your target for the night? It's a lot easier for mafia to trip and fall all over themselves if they're not super careful.

So what did you gather from the three of us you were mainly interested in?

[GeneralHankerchief]

Not much. TexCat's answer seemed the most initially suspicious to me, but this suspicion got dimmed when her reaction was mirrored by the others' and then further dimmed when she got nightkilled (:tongue:). Not all probing tactics are created equal, I guess, but I'm not going to apologize for trying.

[Kagemusha]

Is it just me? I have bad feeling in my gut about this jht lynch. Im not feeling this as right move. unvote

[Askthepizzaguy]

Is it just me? I have bad feeling in my gut about this jht lynch. Im not feeling this as right move. unvote

Guilty results on Autolycus and Khaan and innocent result on JHT.

You should lynch inside this group to help determine whether the cop is sane or insane.

Most likely the cop is insane, or the cop is not a cop and is simply guilty himself.

Getting random cold feet and being indecisive is not a good look.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Okay.

Let's force the issue.

Unvote: BSmith
Vote: johnhughthom

[Kagemusha]

Guilty results on Autolycus and Khaan and innocent result on JHT.

You should lynch inside this group to help determine whether the cop is sane or insane.

Most likely the cop is insane, or the cop is not a cop and is simply guilty himself.

Getting random cold feet and being indecisive is not a good look.

Dont really care how i look, but let us test this intormation. vote: Autolycus

[Csargo]

Guilty results on Autolycus and Khaan and innocent result on JHT.

You should lynch inside this group to help determine whether the cop is sane or insane.

Most likely the cop is insane, or the cop is not a cop and is simply guilty himself.

Getting random cold feet and being indecisive is not a good look.

Riedquat seemed extremely confident about Zack, and Zack flipped scum. Couldn't you just ask whoever what result they got on Zack?

[Kagemusha]

Okay.

Let's force the issue.

Unvote: BSmith
Vote: johnhughthom

What are you scared off? unvote and vote: GH

[GeneralHankerchief]

...being lynched?

[Csargo]

Okay.

Let's force the issue.

Unvote: BSmith
Vote: johnhughthom

Odd choice.

[GeneralHankerchief]

How so?

[Askthepizzaguy]

I asked the guy who tracked Zack to the murder, and he said he was the guy that I replaced, and he said Iskander didn't commit the murder last night, so I can verify that I saw that happen personally because I'm the guy who saw it happen firsthand because I am the Tracker.

GH be the insane cop or scum or (really unlikely) sane cop with aforementioned guilty guilty innocent results.

[Kagemusha]

How so?

Should we not prioritise the guilty readings from pizza's source rather then jht whovthe source is suggesting innocent?

[Csargo]

How so?

So you got an innocent result on Zack then?

[GeneralHankerchief]

Well, since Pizza put it out in the open despite my direct PM request to him not ten minutes ago to not do this (I'm hoping he just didn't see it in time), let's put it all out in the open, shall we?

I am a Cop.

I am not *the* cop, as I had nothing to do with Zack's result. My night results are as follows:

N1: khaan. Guilty.
N2: autolycus. Guilty.
N3: johnhughthom. Innocent.

So why am I pushing for john so hard? Because I believe it's highly likely that I'm an insane cop, therefore reversing all of my night results.

After my N1 "guilty" on khaan, I was all set to blow him up on the thread in D2. But not right away. I wanted there to be some untainted discussion out there first, and then I would reveal after D2 was a little more than halfway over. Riedquat beat me to the punch and fingered Zack. I decided to sit on my information and see how the round played out.

Once Zack flipped guilty, I took the leap and contacted Riedquat with what I knew. Not to be a part of any network, you all know my feelings about that, but simply as a backup, to ensure that my "guilty" result lived on in case I died. I did the same when ATPG replaced Riedquat, as the role was not statistically more likely to become mafia just because ATPG replaced in. When my scan on autolycus came up "guilty" the second night, that's when I started to get suspicious. Nobody's that lucky. Plus, there was also the option of me being a "paranoid" cop, which apparently gives out guilty results no matter what. There was too much uncertainty. I passed off my second result to ATPG along with my suspicions. In the meantime, I continued to sit on my results.

N3, I scanned john and got hit with an "innocent" result. This ruled out the option of me being a paranoid cop. I knew now that there were two possibilities: Either john was scum and khaan/auto were innocent, or john was innocent and khaan/auto were scum. I wanted to have a john lynch today happen naturally in order to keep me unrevealed for another day, but now that's come and gone. I have chosen the route that I believe is more likely.

I was trying to gamble and stay alive for another night even after one of my suspects went down. That is no longer an option. Assuming john is the lynch, I will accept my impending death this night phase, knowing that I have done as a detective is supposed to do in this game.

[Kagemusha]

Maybe i am just wrong eith my gut feeling. Let us see. unvote and vote: jht

[Csargo]

I asked the guy who tracked Zack to the murder, and he said he was the guy that I replaced, and he said Iskander didn't commit the murder last night, so I can verify that I saw that happen personally because I'm the guy who saw it happen firsthand because I am the Tracker.

GH be the insane cop or scum or (really unlikely) sane cop with aforementioned guilty guilty innocent results.

What was your other result?

[Csargo]

unvote:, vote:jht

[El Barto]

DAY FOUR

johnhughthom was lynched. He was a mafioso!

johnhughthom: landlubber; Askthepizzaguy; seireikhaan; autolycus; GeneralHankerchief; Kagemusha; Csargo (7)
landlubber: johnhughthom (1)
GeneralHankerchief: BSmith II (1)

not voting: Iskander 3.1 (1)

1. Zack, mafioso, lynched on Day Two.
2. Csargo
3. landlubber
4. BSmith II.
5. Visorslash, townie, lynched on Day One.
6. BSmith, townie, killed by the mafia on Night One.
7. GeneralHankerchief
8. Iskander 3.1
9. seireikhaan
10. Kagemusha
11. johnhughthom, mafioso, lynched on Day Four.
12. Askthepizzaguy
13. autolycus
14. TexCat, townie, killed by the mafia on Night Three.
15. Ishmael, townie, killed by the mafia on Night Two.
16. Winston Hughes, townie, lynched on Day Three.

It is now Night Four.
Time remaining for this phase:

[GeneralHankerchief]

And now, it gets interesting.

[Iskander 3.1]

Sorry guys. Had to pull a couple of late nights at work and didn't have time to participate.

[Csargo]

Well I was completely wrong about GH, feels good :shame:

[GeneralHankerchief]

Well I was completely wrong about GH, feels good :shame:

We still have more scum to find. Let's move forward, not look back. :yes:

[Askthepizzaguy]

What was your other result?

I did not track during the night I got my role PM, because it took a while for me to get it after I replaced in, and I didn't log in in the meanwhile.

We have plenty of data. I'll be looking into the folks who aren't scanned guilty by GH.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Well, since Pizza put it out in the open despite my direct PM request to him not ten minutes ago to not do this (I'm hoping he just didn't see it in time)

It's completely the latter (didn't see it), but if I had seen it in time, I still would have done the former.

As I told ya privately, the third route (C) is you as mafia, so revealing you helps seal the fate of you in such a universe.

Now we simply deal with universe A (sane cop) and B (insane cop) instead of universe A B and C, and John's flip helps matters, we're pretty much in universe B or C now, and you're owned in universe C.

So, universe B it is.

[Beskar]

I was tempted to come in thread to say "vote: Johnhughthom" before these latest reveals as a joke, glad I didn't now with this result. Might have not liked me... :laugh4:

[johnhughthom]

Aww, I'll always like you Beskie.

Crawls back into grave...

[Csargo]

I did not track during the night I got my role PM, because it took a while for me to get it after I replaced in, and I didn't log in in the meanwhile.

We have plenty of data. I'll be looking into the folks who aren't scanned guilty by GH.

Ah okay, I was just wondering.

[El Barto]

I'm doing the update… incidentally, I'll have to make this Day phase slightly longer than usual.

Aww, I'll always like you Beskie.

Crawls back into grave...
Posting while dead? Editing your posts? Speaking to someone who's not playing? What the-?

[El Barto]

NIGHT FOUR

Kagemusha was found dead.

1. Zack, mafioso, lynched on Day Two.
2. Csargo
3. landlubber
4. BSmith II
5. Visorslash, townie, lynched on Day One.
6. BSmith, townie, killed by the mafia on Night One.
7. GeneralHankerchief
8. Iskander 3.1
9. seireikhaan
10. Kagemusha, townie, killed by the mafia on Night Four.
11. johnhughthom, mafioso, lynched on Day Four.
12. Askthepizzaguy
13. autolycus
14. TexCat, townie, killed by the mafia on Night Three.
15. Ishmael, townie, killed by the mafia on Night Two.
16. Winston Hughes, townie, lynched on Day Three.

It is now Day Five.
Time remaining for this phase:

[GeneralHankerchief]

Congrats mafia, you've fallen into the trap. Expecting my corpse instead?

Kage-sama. Your sacrifice will not be forgotten. :bow:

[seireikhaan]

Vote: Iskander 3.1

Now, my boy, I say my boy, I saw that last night, that was a right rude thing to do! Whatcha think you're tryin' to do, killin' off innocent people like that, you gotta use finesse, boy, FINESSE! I swear these kids these days....
Normally, I'd make a comment about how he was a nice lad but was missin' a few screws, but this one? Yeeeeeeesh

[GeneralHankerchief]

For the out-of-the-loop:

khaan is a voyeur - anybody he follows at night, he gets to see who visited them. The original plan was for him to latch himself onto me, I'd turn up dead (as I really should be, by rights), but he'd bag another mafioso in the bargain. A worthy tradeoff.

Kage is... I'm not sure of his exact role title, but whoever he follows at night, any actions done to that person are done to him instead. He approached me this night phase and said he was going to protect me, just in case.

So the mafia who ended up attacking me attacked Kage instead. Meanwhile, khaan, who visited me, visited Kage instead. So khaan saw Kage's murder as it happened.

I'm not sure I deserved to live in this game over Kage, but we're past that now.

Vote: Iskander 3.1

[GeneralHankerchief]

Oh, and I scanned ATPG, who came up "guilty".

[Csargo]

Vote:Iskander 3.1

[autolycus]

Seems clear enough. Vote:Iskander 3.1

[landlubber]

vote:Iskander

[Kagemusha]

:bow:

[Askthepizzaguy]

Landlubber targeted no one last night.

I'm pretty sure that's enough for a forced solve, so the final mafioso (or fourth mafioso after Iskander, who was obviously guilty, as I said) can concede now without shame.

It's mechanically locked, I think.

[Askthepizzaguy]

PS I was going to target sexymusha but I thought he was either the doctor (since he kinda sorta approached me the first night I replaced in, and I told him I was vanilla to make him go away)

Or a scumbag.

But he said what he was and I believed that was plausible for the setup so I switched wisely to lubber.

[GeneralHankerchief]

There's the slight possibility that Kage's ability interfered with my earlier results on khaan or (more likely, considering tonight's events) autolycus. But I think he would have mentioned that to me in the night phase considering it was all out in the open.

[Askthepizzaguy]

So as not to spam your inbox,

And once you've crossed that line, GH, you are simply committing more than one murder. Perhaps there are degrees, but your hands are stained and there's no washing it off.

Welcome to the dark side. Now we can be miserable together!

[seireikhaan]

It's definitely not networking.

edit: damn, forgot to foghorn.

[Askthepizzaguy]

It's definitely not networking.

edit: damn, forgot to foghorn.

If it's any consolation, you and your close friend will be damned together.

I'll keep you company. We're all in this together now.....

Never to be separated. Again. :stare:

[Askthepizzaguy]

http://thumbs.modthesims2.com/img/6/4/0/6/6/8/MTS_joninmobile-652533-0510_theshining_2.gif


Come play with us, Khaanny....

[Csargo]

Landlubber targeted no one last night.

I'm pretty sure that's enough for a forced solve, so the final mafioso (or fourth mafioso after Iskander, who was obviously guilty, as I said) can concede now without shame.

It's mechanically locked, I think.

Who is that? Only me or BSmith is left afaik?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Who is that? Only me or BSmith is left afaik?

Well actually, GH still has to flip, if Iskander is not the last scum. Then, Auto and Khaan and myself are all confirmed innocents.

Landlubber still technically could be mafia, just like Iskander still was after he was inactive the night prior.

But with Khaan's voyeurism and my tracking and GH's insane detective-ry, there's no way for any remaining mafia to kill undetected.

As such, with that many confirmed townies and actual detectives remaining, once GH flips the game is a lock.

As such, it's actually somehow in the scums' best interests to leave GH alive.

[GeneralHankerchief]

:coffeenews:

So...

...how's everyone's weekend?

[Zack]

:coffeenews:

So...

...how's everyone's weekend?

I've never felt less alive.

[landlubber]

:coffeenews:

So...

...how's everyone's weekend?

Just phenomenal. It's Labor Day weekend in the US, which means that professors have license to assign 4x as much work as they normally would over a weekend.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Hmm, I have an idea to make things interesting.

If the game does NOT end with this lynch, then I pledge not to use my investigative powers for all future phases. I suggest that all other pro-town roles do the same.

Seven people, one(?) scum. Turn it into a true vanilla game with nothing but our wits as weapons. Should we get that far. What say you?

[seireikhaan]

Hmm, I have an idea to make things interesting.

If the game does NOT end with this lynch, then I pledge not to use my investigative powers for all future phases. I suggest that all other pro-town roles do the same.

Seven people, one(?) scum. Turn it into a true vanilla game with nothing but our wits as weapons. Should we get that far. What say you?
Well, our wits and prior knowledge of scans. But hey, sure, why not. I'm game.

[El Barto]

ENDGAME

Iskander 3.1 was lynched. He was a mafioso, the last one! (that the townies knew about -they wanted to lynch this El Barto who knew all along who the criminals were and hadn't told the town, but he was nowhere to be found. They did find a note saying ‘tistorhs nunim öys’ on his litter, though.)
Now they rejoiced, partying like it is 1999.


Iskander 3.1: seireikhaan; GeneralHankerchief; Csargo; autolycus; landlubber (5)

Not voting: Askthepizzaguy (1×); Iskander 3.1 (2×); BSmith II (1×)


1. Zack, mafioso, lynched on Day Two.
2. Csargo
3. landlubber
4. BSmith II
5. Visorslash, townie, lynched on Day One.
6. BSmith, townie, killed by the mafia on Night One.
7. GeneralHankerchief
8. Iskander 3.1, mafioso, lynched on Day Five.
9. seireikhaan
10. Kagemusha, townie, killed by the mafia on Night Four.
11. johnhughthom, mafioso, lynched on Day Four.
12. Askthepizzaguy
13. autolycus
14. TexCat, townie, killed by the mafia on Night Three.
15. Ishmael, townie, killed by the mafia on Night Two.
16. Winston Hughes, townie, lynched on Day Three.

The game has ended.

Congratulations, town!

[Zack]

I feel like we never had a chance. All those scans and powers with no abilities of our own and no counter.

[landlubber]

Yeah, I was surprised that the town had so many power roles. The odds were against you guys. Fun game nonetheless.

[Zack]

And next time I am scum, I am going to absolutely destroy Riedquat on N1. :stare:

[Visor]

I was clearly the MVP of this game

[Visor]

GG all

fun game to watch

scum got a bit shafted in the balance department

[Zack]

And next time I am scum, I am going to absolutely destroy Riedquat on N1. :stare:

I will destroy you! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4Qm8iErbHQ&feature=youtu.be&t=17s)

[GeneralHankerchief]

GG everyone!

In terms of balancing, I think this game was kind of the perfect storm against the mafia. There were a lot of power roles, but each of them had a flaw - I was insane, ATPG could only track, khaan could only see who visited, Kage was a weird sort of imperfect doc/bus driver, etc. I'm guessing that Barto designed my role to screw up really early on in a catastrophic mistake. It almost worked too - I was less than 12 hours away from publicly naming khaan, which would have most likely ended up with the destruction of two separate power roles. Instead, Riedquat beat me to the punch, I got another night result which made me suspect I was insane, and as a result I essentially became a full-fledged Detective, which is never balanced.

So probably one part balancing, but two parts bad luck.

I'll also have more thoughts about networking in an hour or three.

[Zack]

Well, it was worse because private communication is involved, inevitably leading to a network, and since none of us had any powers the town network was never going to be inflitrated, and with no roleblocker (or anything) we had no counter-move to anything the network did. With a roleblocker to prevent power roles from operating and a scan of our own to blend in and infiltrate and create an alibi, we would have stood a much better chance.

And with how often I'm scanned N1, I should have known better than to perform the kill.

[El Barto]

I so wanted to tell you not to RNG the kill and think it through, but I couldn't… the game was balanced for a handful more people and I had to downsize it… unevenly, as it turned out. I had to take out the Serial Killer, which might have just been left in… also, regrettably, in the last few games I've hosted, the town have managed to make horrendous mistakes, and I thought they'd follow the pattern… one lives and learns. The town sometimes do network. In the past I've prohibited nighttime communication, and I got flak for it… next time I won't. :(

[Askthepizzaguy]

To the scum team:

You absolutely got shafted by an imbalanced town power role set, and all of you were found by detective.

Except Iskander, who acted so much like a scumbag that I named him before he got caught by detective.

Gotta work on that, Iskander man! :bounce:

If you guys don't want to count this game against your scum record, I wouldn't hold it against you. Detectives blow, can we just all agree?

You know, I literally networked with zero people who didn't contact me first. And then I almost told both of them off, too....

I lied to Kagemusha and said I was vanilla, and then I didn't really trust GH and probably would have lynched him at some point.

[Askthepizzaguy]

If I hadn't replaced in, the game still would have been pretty rough for the scums, just with the powers remaining.

[Zack]

Night talk is great, I hate it when games prohibit it. I have zero problem with the talking at night in this game. If it wasn't allowed, any important parts just happen in private instead, making it even worse for those not in the know.

[seireikhaan]

Yeah, I have to feel for the mafia. This game was really rough for them. I will second one thing that GH said- we almost had two of the town power roles lynched the first two days because of him investigating me. Problem is, there really shouldn't be 3 people with investigative-esque power in such a small game in the first place. The most powerful tool in mafia is information. In an ideal world, I'm with pizza- no detectives at all. Scanners can work as a substitute, but even then, they're quite powerful.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Okay. Networking.

Since there are SOME PEOPLE out there who insist on putting out the SLANDER that my previously sterling reputation regarding the stain and besmirchment of being a support of town networks is in tatters after this game, I feel like it's time to set the record straight. :snobby:

I tried really hard not to network in this game. I revealed to khaan on D1 saying that I was a detective (didn't realize I was insane yet, didn't have any results, had the most votes at that point) and could he please not lynch me as a courtesy for making me look like a complete idiot at the end of the previous game. I didn't expect it to go beyond that. When I revealed to Riedquat and later Pizza after Zack flipped mafia, I didn't intend to coordinate actions with them or take orders, etc. I made a judgment call that they weren't scum and thus used them as a conduit to ensure that my results would live on if I died (I was really paranoid that khaan was going to kill me since I was never 100% sure if I was insane or not).

The final night, when Kage contacted me with his role and what he was going to do, I simply online-nodded. In short, I personally never coordinated night actions with anybody, nor did I ever ask for, receive, or give out orders.

Any night communication I did was not a network. It was an entente.

If I wanted to legitimately network, I could have easily done so. I could have pushed hard for a lynching that would have revealed whether or not I was an insane detective much earlier than I did. I could have easily worked with khaan and/or Pizza (as well as Kage) in order to brute force this game and keep the power roles alive. Instead, I for the most part kept the information to myself (while exercising a reasonable degree of caution by ensuring at least one backup), never dictated orders, and made a conscious effort to keep the discussion in the game thread flowing naturally. Yes, my case on john and BSmith on D3 was partially aided by the fact that I believed that john was scum due to my night results. But the death of TexCat, one of my top suspects at the time, would have got me thinking along that path anyway.

Now, there are people who played this game that are far more involved in the current mafia scene than I am. If they and the rest of you guys think that the above constitutes networking, fine, I'll take my sullied reputation and live to play another day. But just know that it could have been a lot worse.

:soapbox:

[El Barto]

Eeeeeeeeeh… what? why should there be anything wrong with networking? If there were any mistakes here they were mine because I didn't balance the game properly, but no one's having a go at you.

[GeneralHankerchief]

I'm being half-serious. I'm more trying to convince myself than anyone else; ATPG had been playfully ribbing me all game that my well-known reputation of being totally against networks was in tatters because of what I was doing.

[El Barto]

Well, next time I'll specifically ban everyone else but you from private communications, then.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I'm being half-serious. I'm more trying to convince myself than anyone else; ATPG had been playfully ribbing me all game that my well-known reputation of being totally against networks was in tatters because of what I was doing.

It is, and I'm not sure how playful I'm being. :wink:

Tatters. Utter and complete tatters. You went all the way. You're only not in the ATPG stratosphere of evil in terms of networking because the game didn't have a hundred peoples in it.

:tongue2:

You besmirched yourself for all time. ALL TIME. You have the network herps and there's zero cure.

[GeneralHankerchief]

You know, this is an excellent way for me to reacquaint myself with the .Org's infraction system.

https://i.imgur.com/gG6Dgfw.png

[Askthepizzaguy]

What would all the fallen legendary heroes of .org mafia think if they knew the great and powerful Generalhankerchief had reduced himself to networking, with Askthepizzaguy, in your own words, "of all people"!?


I'm coming dangerously close to networking and I'm doing it with you out of all people. The world is a funny place.

Oh @ Sigurd (http://Google.com)!~ @ Sasaki Kojiro (http://Google.com)!~ @ Seamus Fermanagh (http://Google.com)!~

Guess who ended up in bed with the networking antichrist - The mighty and incorruptible founder of mafia himself.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5mtclwloEQ


No one can resist the overpowering allure that is whispering sweet nothings into my very evil ears. No one.

[Kagemusha]

Lol you guys! :laugh4: Anyway congrats for the town. My role was a Selfless person. I could replace an individual during a night phase and if the person would have been attacked i would die. So my role was basically a "disposable doctor". Because i was not too keen on replacing random people. Our dear host changed my role so i had a compulsion, which forced me to replace a player each night. Those two nights i had the compulsion. I was replacing GH, which played out quite nice in the end. Thanks for the game everyone.:bow:

[johnhughthom]

Good game all, and thanks for hosting El Takarto.

Hopefully this little Org mafia revival keeps going, I always enjoy games here more than other forums for some reason.

[Iskander 3.1]

Good game everybody. We had the odds stacked against us but it was still fun. I'm clearly out of practice! This also reminded me of why I wasn't able to keep up all those years ago...can't do too much posting at work, evenings can be busy, and with the holiday weekend I never had a chance to attempt to defend myself on the last day (not that it would have done me any good). Anyways thanks El Barto and I will try to keep playing from time to time!

[Askthepizzaguy]

Good game all, and thanks for hosting El Takarto.

Hopefully this little Org mafia revival keeps going, I always enjoy games here more than other forums for some reason.

It's the TheGuild skin. The best skin of all time.

[Kagemusha]

It's the TheGuild skin. The best skin of all time.

Guild skin? Bah i say! Not that i am in any way biased towards STW and TW2S skins as i made them...~D

[Zack]

Morbid skin best skin.

[El Barto]

Guild Skin ftw.