Successors campaign is underway!

[macsen rufus]

I have started work on the Successors campaign for ATW2:EE, though it is till a looong way from being anything yet.....

So far the factions have been created, and territories assigned. The scenario starts in 301BC - just in time for Seleucus to have his own kingdom established, and well before the Gallic invasions.... of which more later.

As a quick taster, here are a couple of screenies:

Starting positions:

18778


Faction selection screen:

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The colours will change, and historical kings still need to be done, so pay no heed to old Dionysius here :clown:

Playable factions are:


Macedonia (Cassander)
Hellenic League
Seleucids
Mauryan Empire
Lysimachids
Gauls
Sparta
Illyria
Ptolemies
Nabatea
Antigonids
Armenia
Epirus
Scythia



Plenty of choice if you fancy some hot hoplite-on-hoplite grinding action, or something a little more exotic from the fringes of the known world.

Major reworking of the build_prod and unit_prod files needed (not least because I had culled all the Celtic units from the previous EE unit_prods), and some wicked ideas to be implemented for some provinces (and I don't mean 'wicked' in a nice way :evil: )

[YanBG]

All sounds very interesting! Good luck with the new campaigns.

[dimitrios the samian]

Great news Macsen ..... :2thumbsup:
Will be another great addition to our Ancient Sector ........
Nice backdrop too !! ...

[Leith]

Good news! This is perhaps the mod that interests me the most in ancient warfare. Hopefully there will be lots of hoplites/units, Militia hoplites, armoured hoplites, various selections of pike units. I'm curious to know if this is going to be a standalone release.

[macsen rufus]

Hi Leith,

It will be an extra scenario within Eastern Empires, and with a single start date.

To do it full justice would require a whole new mod, with three eras (because I can already hear someone out there typing out 'but there's no Parthian Empire in there....' that's because it didn't exist at my chosen start date... and editor's decision is final etc etc.) And that would be a two or three-year project.

And, yes, I think there may be one or two hoplites knocking around in there somewhere ~D

But it's very early days yet. Though I'm glad to say my wicked idea seems to work....

And to DtS, thanks re the backdrop - that's a sneak preview of the new front-end I've done (the BETA still has the one from the original Ancient, and it is a bit anachronistic for this).

[dimitrios the samian]

maestro , an extra scenario is fine for now :2thumbsup:

Later on ( in a few years ~D ) , you may re-consider as there will be a whole lotta redrawn & re-animated troops ....... including a few exotic elephant types & a deadly Succesor Chariot !!

OK Question , the map is really really heavy ( busy as western mentioned )

I'm hoping I it may be possible to open it in Photoshop & airbrush out as much as we need to make it easier on the eye ? .... ( I don't want you spending weeks making another as this one works )

... Have a think & let me know at a later date .

I'm fine with spending some time on it & I have an idea that I just need to leave the borders & positions were castles & ports are .

[macsen rufus]

I've been doing some work on the Armenians and Nabateans these past couple of days, plus sorting out some historical kings etc

And here's a new innovation that will add some colour to the Ptolemies and hopefully a couple of other factions:

18801

[dimitrios the samian]

Wow ! Nice result mac .
I hope it was quick and just a few sliders .
Potraits are very important for immersion in good old Hellenic i had the same stony face appear 3 or 4 times and sometimes up to 3 times in my army .
I wonder ..... How many different potraits can we use for each faction ?
I have not ever looked into the potrait structure in depth .
Keep up the great work mac ...

[macsen rufus]

The portrait isn't the innovation - check out the name ~;) I now have a way I can 'fix' an entire dynasty, almost certainly two, and possibly three or four.

But even so - 'how many portraits' is a good question - a quick look at vanilla MTW shows 201 Muslim kings, and 251 generals, so I think we have a way to go before hitting any limits - if there are any!

It's clear that every faction can have a unique set of portraits if desired - just need to create a folder for them - and of course find all the portraits. All heroes and 'famous kings' are drawn from the 'misc' folder, so the possibilities are immense - no less than 251 portraits to a category, and if each faction is given its own folder, you'll never come close to using that much.

I have nearly all the Ptolemies sorted - certainly as many as you are likely to get through in the course of a campaign. Still need good ones for VII, X, XI, XII and XIII. Of the 'starting' kings, I have good ones of Chandragupta Maurya, Seleukos, Lysander, Pyrrhus and Ptolemy. Kassandros and Antigonus are proving elusive so far, but I have Demetrius Poliorcetes and also some heroes. I should be able to get some later Mauryans, as well.

If all else fails, there's always coins ~D

[dimitrios the samian]

Excellent update Mac !!
Over the years I have inquired about Portraits & managed to make a few Princesses long ago , but I never quite understood the folder structure/code .
What you have discovered here is incredible & will add so much flavour to the game .
I have bits & pieces of suitable for portraits including many we can pillage from RTW & its mods !
The potential is inspiring .
kudo's to u again maestro :bow:

[macsen rufus]

On further playing investigation I have ascertained that the 'misc' folder for hero and famous king portraits must be in the portraits/[CULTURE] folder, ie campmap/portraits/catholic/misc, rather than /campmap/portraits/macedon/misc (it seems a misc sub-folder in the 'override' portrait folders doesn't get used at all).

Another discovery re the 'indestructible' buildings (aka province resources). They cannot be assigned to a culture - if they are, they lose their indestructibility. (I tried it out because I wanted some provinces to be 'unconvertable' in their religious leanings, pity it didn't work...)

There's something else I want to play with, which may open up some possibilities, but more later if it works ~D

I have portraits for the entire Maurya dynasty sorted now, and so far for Kassandros and Ptolemy IV Philopater I have had to resort to coins, but at least it makes them unique.

Been giving Epirus (Koinon Epeiroton) bit of a run, and the campaign reached a point where Ptolemy died; here's his successor:

18804

So it looks like the dynastic succession is working fine, and I expect them all to roll around in the correct order now :2thumbsup: Need to do some work to get Mauryans and Antigonids to follow suit, but they can never be guaranteed, unlike the Ptolemies.

I have to continue with the Epirotes long enough for their new, unique building (and associated office scroll) to show up so I can make sure it works...

And my rebel 'hero' general cropped up in Thrace as he was supposed to.

It has been fun watching the Gauls work - or rather, hack - their way through various factions. Amazingly, they do seem to be heading towards (the future) Galatia - perhaps there might be a way to persuade them to settle there. I'll have to think about that one :book2: The only fly in the ointment is that they re-emerged in Illyria with a mostly Illyrian army, so I'm going to have to look into that - I think it is fixable. A good re-emergence of sound Gallic troops would be awesome. With the FN_07 slot they totally raze any province they take, of course, which was the idea there.

And now, I must get to bed - a few night shifts this week, and not enough sleep in between... :zzz:

[dimitrios the samian]

Kudo's to you maestro macsen !
This discovery is huge ......
Bravo again .

[macsen rufus]

Things are progressing, with a bunch of new units added, and recruitment pools being tweaked between the various Successor factions. As the era is better attested than the earlier scenarios, a lot of famous kings have good portraits, and my system of adding soubriquets for the kings ('Soter', 'Nicator' etc) is working well. The Ptolemies will all come out in order, and the Seleucids and Antigonids have a fair chance of matching history quite well, with a lot of familiar characters making an appearance.

I've decided to shut down the boating pond - aka the Caspian Sea - to see if this helps the AI a bit. The Seleucids especially are way too fond of spamming ships into it, and draining their treasury for no good cause. I'll check how it plays out - it's nice to have the shortcut, but if taking the land route is the only way the AI can keep its cash, then so be it...

The Gauls are becoming, well, galling - the FN_07 slot can be fun, but I've had to close the border between Dacia and Scythia to keep them heading in the right direction, and they've taken to converting once they have conquered a Greek province. Not quite the plan... Then there's the awful habit of sitting on wads of cash and not training any troops, all the while throwing inadequate armies at their neighbours until their king becomes a gibbering idiot.

Finally, a quick look at the sort of army a well-developed Ptolemid empire can put together:

18820

The general is a faction hero but he doesn't come with 9 stars out of the box - that's the result of a couple of scrolls being dropped on his head plus a lot of campaigning.

[dimitrios the samian]

Great news Mac !!
I will not elaborate much now ( must eat lunch) & rest my head as Modding is swirling thru it 16 hrs a day .

But , I love the army Roster & those Review Icon Panels are the best ive seen so far , Uniform in size at least ~:)

I'll be back later , to add/edit in my thoughts on key points ~;).

[macsen rufus]

After making the latest batch of changes, I'm giving the Seleucids a quick spin. In terms of territory and wealth, they are the superpower of the scenario, and an excellent testing house for some recent changes. They're also fun to play ~D

Let's start with the new units: I've added a Successors' Scythed Chariot:

18822


And also Pantadapoi spearmen to fill out the 'cheap and cheerful' levied spear-fodder end of the Successors' troop roster. Simple tech requirements (bronzesmith + spearmaker). In the early game, they will be the basis of your defensive line until more reliable troops come along. As the name suggests, they are recruitable everywhere, like slingers. It seems the other AI factions are training them, so they are not so unbalanced as they were last campaign (ie very missile-oriented, not very Greek of them at all...) one earlier but not mentioned so far, the Ptolemies get 'Machimoi' spearmen, too, and there are plans afoot to tweak some homelands, for more distinction between Successor factions.

Recruitment zones for Greek/Macedonian troops have been changed considerably for the Successors campaign. In RoP and Alex, there is a Greek 'homeland' zone and a small 'colonizable' zone which opens up the agora/palestra line required for Greek troops. In Successors, the 'homeland' remains the same, but the colonizable zone has expanded considerably - effectively every province/satrapy that has an 'Alexandria' in it is now 'colonizable', as well as the orignal zone. Don't forget though that setting up colonies is an expensive business, and it will take some time before you have enough facilities to train Greek/Macedonian troops there. Oh, by the way, the natives don't always like being colonized either ~D

Here's an early-game Seleucid army:

18823


'How come the Seleucids have ELEPHANTS in the EARLY game???', I hear you ask. This scenario begins shortly after Seleukos had been forced to cede his Indian satrapies to Chandragupta Maurya, in exchange for 500 war elephants. So there are some elephants in the faction's starting units. Not many, but you get an early play with them, anyway. The rest of the army shows the diverse ethnic mix in the Seleucid empire at this point, with a mix of Indian, Iranian and Macedonian troops in the line up.

Other changes: I've made miners dependent upon a siege engineer as well as a level 2 mine. The AI was too fond of producing them instead of a serious field army, so hopefully that silliness has been knocked on the head now.

Closing the boating pond seems to work fine, although it does mean the shortcut across the region has gone, and it's no longer necessary to protect against naval invasions in Hyrcania, Dahaea and Saka.

Flag and colour changes made for the Gauls, so they no longer look like Vikings on the strat map, and some pagan-conversion ability added to their troops to cut down on sudden conversions to civilised behaviour ~D

On the famous kings front, things seem to be working well, and here's a little 'rogues' gallery' of characters from the early years of my Seleucid campaign:

18824


Pyrrhus is a 'hegemon' because he was only a king within his own tribe - he never claimed kingship over all of Epirus and took the title hegemon instead (although 'a rose by any other name etc etc etc...')

[Leith]

Thank you Mac for getting me so excited about this mod! The sheer fancy names like "Pantadapoi" and "Machimoi" make me want to play this mod like now! I have a question: will the Seleucids have access to exclusive elite units like "silver shields" for example ? If you require help in creating certain Greek/Gallic bifs, just send me a PM with what you need and I'll see what I can do.

[dimitrios the samian]

I've decided to shut down the boating pond - aka the Caspian Sea - to see if this helps the AI a bit. The Seleucids especially are way too fond of spamming ships into it, and draining their treasury for no good cause. I'll check how it plays out - it's nice to have the shortcut, but if taking the land route is the only way the AI can keep its cash, then so be it...

........Yes , if need be "so be it" .... Is there any advantage in making (perhaps one segment) crossable by "connecting each side ? invisible land bridge ?

The Gauls are becoming, well, galling - the FN_07 slot can be fun, but I've had to close the border between Dacia and Scythia to keep them heading in the right direction, and they've taken to converting once they have conquered a Greek province. Not quite the plan...

........ well we can't have that :laugh4:

Then there's the awful habit of sitting on wads of cash and not training any troops, all the while throwing inadequate armies at their neighbours until their king becomes a gibbering idiot.

Is this problem just with the Gauls ?
...............................................

Fantastic update again today Mac ... I love all those new units you mentioned & the Potrait Panels .. wow ! look really goood .
I look forward to beta testing this out also .
cheers

Edit :

18825

Had this Mac , I couldn't help myself ~D

Greeks called it a "Drepanophora Hamata" seeing you like using original lingo .

Be nice if someday we can recreate this "that is if we get our extra folders from CA" :rtwyes:

[macsen rufus]

Thanks both :bow:

@ Leith - yes, the Seleucids will have their Argyraspides, whilst the other factions keep the regular Hypaspists. Obviously all Successor factions have the Pezhetairoi as the top line phalangites. Seleucids and Antigonids will also have 'katakai' or 'klerouchos' phalangites from a limited recruitment zone that straddles the border between the two empires' starting positions - these will be the 'next best thing' to full Pezhetairoi, and depend on building kleroi - land-grants given in exchange for military service (which was hereditary). I haven't checked the full details of where kleroi need to be, but I was thinking probably in Cappadocia, Syria, Assyria and Babylonia.

I'll be making a couple of other changes to the lesser spears: enomotia ekdromon are currently recruitable everywhere (bronzesmith 2 + spearmaker), but I will make them dependent on the palestra as well to cut down their zone. Then for later on I also intend to add the heavy peltastai, thureoforoi and thorakitae - these will have quite steep build requirments just to stop them showing up too early.

I have all the BIFs I need, I think, and of course there's no room for any more now, anyway, but thanks for the offer.

@ DtS


nvisible land bridge ?

Not necessary, it plays well - the Antigonids have been giving me some serious trouble in Sarmatia recently, and the whole 'retreating into the steppe' thing works out nicely. With that out of the way, it also seems like the ship-spam in the Mediterranean is much reduced too (though I did also turn down some AI preferences, but that was so low already I hardly expected much difference...)


........ well we can't have that

Exactly - they still need bit of a kick up the rear, but they are improving ~D


Is this problem just with the Gauls ?

Yes, the exact opposite of what you want from them.... it's a tricky balance between them being a serious threat or an unstoppable juggernaut, and still leaving some pleaure in playing them yourself. I will get there, but plenty of play testing will help as I tweak things. Let's say that when they are finished it will be quite a unique faction :charge:



In this Seleucid campaign I've had a serious fight on my hands a couple of times now. The Armenians proved pretty tough even with their early-game stuff, and my Pantadapoi barely held the line. If it wasn't for their king dying suddenly with lots of arrows in him, they might have succeeded in taking Assyria off me. And as above, the Antigonids took a sudden dislike to my empire and landed a stack of nearly 5,000 in Sarmatia just as I'd taken it from the Scyths. I've taken it back now, but it was a bloody affair, and I can't make much headway in the fertile crescent because they have built up well, and I haven't got enough troops to mount a good attack and still protect my rear and flanks. I've been a bit tight on cash too - which surprised me since I have Babylonia and Assyria in the west, plus I've taken Gandhara and Hindush in the east. So strategic choices on where I spend my money.... all in all it's the best campaign experience I've had so far in the Successors era :2thumbsup:

Due to a minor slip in the startpos file, the Antigonids managed to skip a generation or two, and hence my Antiochus I Soter is currently at war with their Demetrius II Aetolicus (instead of Demetrius I Poliorcetes), but that glitch is fixed for next time. And right on cue, Bindusara Maurya is trying to defend his remaining lands from my imperial grasp. Old Lysimachus is in his seventies and still clinging to the throne, and I think Kassandros is still there. Alas, the Armenians and Illyrians have been wiped from the map.

When things are a little closer to complete, I'll start posting up some faction pages in the guides section :bow:


EDIT: oooh, 'drepanophora hamata' it shall be - that model is clearly based on the same source as my info pic, nice find :bow:

[dimitrios the samian]

Briiliant report allround Mac .

[macsen rufus]

Well, I've left the Gauls to themselves long enough, and thought it was time to take the driving seat myself.

They are much better at spreading paganism now, but they really have a hard time against the pezhetairoi and hetairoi they meet. This is mostly down to their roster still being left-over Bronze Age units so I've had to drag them kicking and screaming into the 3rd century BC with some more contemporaneous units. Here's a taster showing the new Gallic Heavy Spearmen and Gallic Heavy Swordsmen (they will get more authentic names later...):

18855

Ah, yes - new faction colours and shield, too.

Their tech-tree is becoming quite unique, and they should be quite a challenging faction to play. There's still a lot of work to be done on them, but they are shaping up quite nicely :2thumbsup:

[Leith]

That's a great screen! The shields look brilliant. So do the unit icons and the new faction colors! The pike wall behind the units looks foreboding too. Well-done, Mac!

[dimitrios the samian]

I had a good read today & I like it all very much !

@ Leith - yes, the Seleucids will have their Argyraspides .....

>> I guess you will be adding a shield for them ? ~:)

Then for later on I also intend to add the heavy peltastai, thureoforoi and thorakitae - these will have quite steep build requirments just to stop them showing up too early......................

>> Awesome , this variety will make for very interesting & varied clashes .

In this Seleucid campaign I've had a serious fight on my hands a couple of times now. The Armenians proved pretty tough even with their early-game stuff, and my Pantadapoi barely held the line .........

>> Just how you like it mac & I bet Leith also ~;)

re: The Gauls - They are much better at spreading paganism now .... ...... >> Sounds perfect !
so I've had to drag them kicking and screaming into the 3rd century BC with some more contemporaneous units. ..........
>> Brilliant & that Bif fits just perfectly into the time period as well .

Their tech-tree is becoming quite unique, and they should be quite a challenging faction to play. There's still a lot of work to be done on them, but they are shaping up quite nicely .....

>> Unique :book2: , looks like were gonna need Tech Tree Diagrams eventually in the guides section .
& plus +1 on what Leith said re: the Sheilds , Unit Icons & Faction Colors , great work macsen :bow:

cheers DTS .

ps .. & more good news , I'll resume modding in a few days , fever has subsided & breathing lots easier .

[macsen rufus]

Thanks Leith and DtS :bow:


I had quite a mammoth battle out of the blue last night... The Antigonids managed to invade Epirus with a small but sufficient force, over-running my little garrison there. The Antigonids are nearly wiped out, but they still control the seas. I can't get a single boat out without losing it straight away, so cannot defend the coasts. Anyway, I had a three-star spy in the region so there was zero loyalty for the Antigonids. 'Great,' I thought, 'I'll get a loyalist rebellion, I won't counter attack yet...'

Well, I did get a loyalist rebellion... but there was also a re-emergence. The Koinon Hellenon popped up with four full stacks (about 3800 men in total), nicely balanced with Yficratian Hoplites, Toxotai Kretekoi, Hippeis Akontistes, Gastraphetes and Ekdromoi. Luckily, I could gather together about 4000 men and a 6-star general from surrounding provinces. My 'rebellion' added a measly two units.

The Antigonids abandoned the province, so I ended up having to 'attack' the Greeks. With a six-star lead in generalship, and a lot of teched-up Celtic Heavies, backed up with the new skirmishers (see below), a few tribal archers and some good Gaesatae, we managed to win, but it took a good long skirmish beforehand to ensure the phalanx was weakened enough for the rest of my guys to go toe-to-toe.

The new Celtic skirmishers are very light, javelin armed. No shield (so they can carry an extra javelin), and very fast. The missile roster is quite thin for the Gauls - just slingers, tribal archers (not the best bowmen out there...) and now these guys.

One other innovation - the fearsome Gaesatae spread fear amongst certain units.

The uniqueness of the Gallic tech-tree will not require much explanation once you experience it ~D

Haven't got anything done today, had a shift at work almost as unexpected as the Greek re-emergence, but I'm back to the campaign now, and might bring back another screenie or two tomorrow :2thumbsup:

& DtS - good to hear you've about cleared that lurgy

[macsen rufus]

As promised:

18857


Although this opens up the whole roster (for now... things may change...), there is also a 'regular' building dependency too. This one doesn't allow any valour upgrades, whereas the regular building line does. It is meant to represent the flow of migrating Celts into new areas. To get teched-up troops though, the province needs to be settled for a while, so the facilites can be built.

I'm seriously considering moving the faction back out of the FN_07 slot - this was designed for the Vikings, of course, and worked quite well when I used it for the Sea Peoples in the Bronze Age mod, but here the conversion issue is just too prevalent. For one thing, the Gauls aren't sea-borne invaders, so they can't escape at the drop of a hat like the Vikings do. Secondly, they are going straight into 'catholic' land, and although they 'paganise' it quickly, it's not quick enough (whereas the Sea Peoples went straight for 'muslim' territory in that mod, and they don't convert in that direction). If they lose a single pagan province, their new conquests are generally not pagan enough to maintain the numbers, and their 'home' province is not safely tucked away overseas, so can be taken much more easily. All in all, it's a deal-breaker, unless my last couple of ideas work out better.

[dimitrios the samian]

kudo's macsen .... very good asdaption of this new discovery ! ... its shaping up like the Gauls will be fun to play :2thumbsup:
I gotta say those unit icons are looking quite uniform now & getting better .... I still see Spiro the horn blower :laugh4:
Anyway , I hope your ideas do work out for implementation , but if need be use a different slot .

mmmmm you mentioned , Sea Peoples .... Bronze Age .. cut it out Mac ! hehe :bounce:

[macsen rufus]

Spent most of the day sorting out the shields and weapons on another unit - the prodromoi (getting another use out of Duke John's Macedonian cavalry BIF :2thumbsup:)

Here they are in full charge, swords aloft ready to crush some tribal archers:

18859

I've also implemented the kleroi building now, so the katakoi and klerouchoi will now be geographically limited. In Lower Egypt the kleroi also give access to Gallic Mercenaries (foot and cavalry), which were quite important for the Ptolemids, who settled them in the Nile Delta.

[macsen rufus]

The Successors campaign is beginning to feel nearly complete now. Thureophoroi, thorakitai and argyraspides have all been added for relevant factions; Celtic mercenaries can be found in Lower Egypt as promised, and the faction/geographical distribution of katakoi and klerouchoi has been dealt with. The Gauls have been shifted to FN_06, which keeps them reliably pagan, but does seem to make them slightly less aggressive - the main downside is they don't get wads of cash by razing provinces to the ground, but the upside is they get a better start in provinces they settle. They still have odd teching-up behaviour, though, which I hope can be tweaked.

I'm currently running a campaign as Koinon Hellenon, and watching the map... the Gauls had some early successes in wiping out the Illyrians and Lysimachids, then got pushed back a bit by a Lysimachid re-emergence. I had some trouble from the Epirotes, but managed to put them down eventually, whilst the Spartans proved VERY tough to beat. Those homoioi are hard men....

Further east, the Mauryans and Seleucids are slugging it out nicley, with the border advancing and retreating. The Armenians are expanding well, and have just takem Media from the Seleucids, who now seem to be crumbling a bit. The Antigonids have managed to pick too many wars, though I have tried to remain allied to them due to their usual naval dominance. They are slowly losing their grip on Asia Minor, and the Nabateans have even managed to take Coele Syria from them, though the Antigonid hold on Cappadocia is thwarting the Armenians for now. The Ptolemies have some rebelliouness at home to deal with, and haven't expanded (they usually take out the Nabateans quite early...)

In the north, the Scyths are suffering, but are not out of contention yet....

It's definitely proving a different version of history from all the previous games I've played, so I think the balance is about there between factions now. My Free Greeks hold Macedonia down to Laconia, plus Crete and Lydia, which was snatched from a rebellion which had pushed out the Antigonids. We've pushed the Lysimachids back into Thrace, so I need to finish them off and then I think the Gallic flood needs to be plugged. Once I have a few more ship-building provinces I might be able to build up a fleet whilst the Antigonids are still friendly. I have a few out there for the all-important trade exports, but not enough for a naval war yet.

[macsen rufus]

Well, I've played on a few more turns, and think I have it in the bag for Koinon Hellenon. The Antigonids, Scyths and Armenians are history (oops - my fault ~D), as are the Nabateans (blame Ptolemy!) and Mauryans (ditto...)


Except, I turned off on the turn when Mauryans and Nabateans re-emerged - we'll see how that goes in due course. Meanwhile, I have got as far as Assyria and Media, and can add some more 'exotic' troops to the line, though the Athenian and Argive hoplites are doing most of the donkey-work. Ptolemy has once again discovered the secret southern sea route to Asia - which is how they eventually took out the Mauryans after a long struggle. Once I reload I'll see how that Mauryan re-emergence looks, but I think there were 4 or 5 stacks.

The Seleucids are about done, though they have managed to tech up enough to start fielding Kataphraktoi, and the Ptolemies now have their Celtic mercs and African elephants online. Unfortunately, the Ptolemies and Seleucids seem to be in a naval arms-race - the Seleucids especially seem to have neglected their land forces, so I'm pushing at an open door there. I'm still allied to Ptolemy, but when that breaks down, my trade network is toast. I need some more rich provinces before that happens, because without the trade I run a serious fiscal deficit (yeah, Babylon, I'm looking at you...)

[dimitrios the samian]

Great reading macsen ! ..... go get them Babylonians also ~:)
I have resumed my Ionian beta testing & with the Lydians gone ive got some huge clashes with the Babylonians along with Persia .
Its fantastic to hear that the Ptolemies are also using the sea route to exterminate the Indians !! :2thumbsup:
& the the Gauls are behaving better in their new slot , keep tweaking if need be .
This is shaping up nicely , well done so far .
cheers ....

Good to see you around again Leith , I hope all is well for you .

[macsen rufus]

I'd become used to the idea of the Spartans being ultra-conservative sticks in the mud, so I was quite pleased to discover Cleomenes III stirred things up a bit and that gave me an excuse for a new unit, which I've called the 'Cleomenean Phalangitai':

18905

More lightly armoured than the homoioi ('equals' - ie full Spartan citizens), but with a stronger charge, and considerably faster.

Next faction I'll be looking at is the Illyrians, as they get the Gauls in their face every time now ~D They have a great river defence map, but I've only played the gallic side of things so far...


(I imagine Leith will be busy for a couple of days with Eid al-Adha)

[macsen rufus]

... ok, so I mean the Illyrians, of course ~D

And, yep, this is a turtle faction. The early battle(s) against the Gauls are quite brutal, but it is possible to hold them off at the bridge, so long as you use the terrain and every tactical trick you can think of. It would be easy to get it wrong (like the AI does when you attack as the Gauls...)

Illyria is fairly secure by land, as all land routes involve river maps. There are three neighbouring provinces and factions when the game begins: Gauls in Dacia (quite a LOT of Gauls...), Lysimachus in Thrace, and Kassandros in Macedonia.

Once the Gauls are beaten back it may be tempting to take Dacia (for its iron, if nothing else....) but it is a VERY difficult province to subdue. The Illyrian strategy is to defend the homeland at all costs, whilst building up economy and tech. If either of the Hellenistic neighbours turn on you it will be painful.... even teched-up Illyrian spearmen are pretty much spear-fodder for pezhetairoi, so you have to be sure of your footing before trying to expand. I've managed to get as far as Ionia now, but it has taken 100+ turns, and the Antigonid naval supremacy is a huge problem, though I can now beat them back on land. They've done the usual and picked too many wars and are slowly imploding under the pressure.

In the end, my first expansion was to take out the Gallic re-emergence in Dacia (I'm afraid their first king had bit of an accident on one of my bridges ~D), but I could only do that after a long period of teching-up and raising the biggest army I could afford, and keep retraining units for the latest tech upgrades. The the next opportunity was to hit the Spartans by sea. Let's say the deadpage_coords.txt file was accessed many times in that battle.... After that I could raise a few mercenary hoplites from my subjugated Greek poleis, beef up the economy, and get the long, slow meat-grinder of a campaign on a firmer footing.

All in all, a difficult faction, but not impossible so long as you cover your ass every step of the way. No need to change anything, either. Factional and regional troop availability seems about right. Now making steady progress into Asia Minor, and I hope to be able to replace my fleet once the Antigonids are wiped out. I just hope they don't get holed up on an island beyond my reach, or it will be an expensive naval campaign trying to whittle down their ships first.