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Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 14:09
I guess I will say it one more time so everyone can keep up, even though it's been 90% of what I've talked about today.
Pay attention:
WE NEED TO LYNCH THE SCUM TEAM'S ROLEBLOCKER FIRST.
THAT IS NOT MONTMORENCY OR PELICAN. THAT MUCH I AM AWARE OF.
MONTY IS SCUM. HE'S NOT *THE* SCUM WE SHOULD BE LYNCHING.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 14:15
Two people have reported being blocked this game.
Either we're both scum, or there is a scum roleblocker in play.
That *can* be GH, but that doesn't match how things have gone down, in my opinion.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 14:19
It hasn't been too hard to figure out where I might be tracking, based on me being open about my suspects.
As such, with three scums, the only one I'm likely to catch with my tracking power is their roleblocker. Whoever that is, has been someone that hasn't been my top suspect each day.
Whoever has been doing the murder each night either has a ninja ability to dodge my tracking, or they've simply guessed correctly which scum needs to do the kill.
Given I haven't been anywhere close to the right person until the past couple rounds, it should have been easy for Monty to not kill two nights ago.
Since I tracked Monty that night, I'd be tracking a different person last night. Monty could then kill without me catching him.
All I can do with this frigging power is find their scum roleblocker, and I can only narrow it down to NOT Monty and NOT Pelican.
Not Al Sipsclar unless he missed a night, but given his low activity, that is possible.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 14:20
If I'm talking to a wall, let's get this game done and over with. It's never going to be anyone's favorite game and I'm ready to move on.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 14:43
Admittedly pretty silly of me to expect anyone to care about the strategic situation, only about any mafia at any cost.
That's too much of a stretch for a casual game. Fine. Lynch Monty, a townie dies, then we'll try to find scum blocker tomorrow.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 14:52
I'll take a stab at glory here.
Vote: dp101
The guy literally no one ever wanted to lynch ever. Give Al Sips the benefit of the tracking null.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 14:54
Monty- ninja or goon
dp101- scum roleblocker
atheotes or Al- last one
Reidquat- neutral protector guy
GH- Town jailkeep
Pizza- Town tracker
Pelican- Town vanilla
atheotes or Al- only townie left.
Riedquat
10-08-2016, 17:41
:inquisitive: You admit Monty is scum but do you want to catch a blocker out of the blue, because the hitman isn't Monty because when you tracked him, he did nothing? :inquisitive:
You have been barking at each other all the time but now you go different ways... ok, it is completely logical! What are your odds to get a scum? And what are the odds to get a blocker? You must be kidding!
Tally as of post 3008:
Lynch votes
2 votes: Askthepizzaguy (atheotes (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718059#post2053718059), Montmorency (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718060#post2053718060))
2 votes: Montmorency (Riedquat (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053717871#post2053717871), Dp101 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053717873#post2053717873))
1 votes: Dp101 (Askthepizzaguy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718089#post2053718089))
Voting history:
Askthepizzaguy
Montmorency
Montmorency
Al Sipsclar
Montmorency
Askthepizzaguy
Askthepizzaguy
Dp101
Honestly not sure if Pizza is town or scum based off of his vote on me. I feel mafia would know that trying to get me lynched is a futile endeavour, so they wouldn't vote for me unless they thought paranoia has set in among the village. On the other hand, a town would be fine trying to lynch someone who everyone thought was innocent because their priority is catching scum, not going along with groupthink.
Montmorency
10-08-2016, 18:58
It could also mean that you're partners and he's run out of room to throw shade.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 19:48
:inquisitive: You admit Monty is scum but do you want to catch a blocker out of the blue, because the hitman isn't Monty because when you tracked him, he did nothing? :inquisitive:
You have been barking at each other all the time but now you go different ways... ok, it is completely logical! What are your odds to get a scum? And what are the odds to get a blocker? You must be kidding!
Never tell me the odds.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 19:56
Honestly not sure if Pizza is town or scum based off of his vote on me. I feel mafia would know that trying to get me lynched is a futile endeavour, so they wouldn't vote for me unless they thought paranoia has set in among the village. On the other hand, a town would be fine trying to lynch someone who everyone thought was innocent because their priority is catching scum, not going along with groupthink.
It shouldn't be futile to lynch a villager under these circumstances.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 20:00
Right.... this would require Pelican to vote with me. Hahahahaha.
Oh this town is so boned.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 20:01
Even if I put my townies as atheotes, GH, Pelican, and Al, there's literally no way.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 20:04
Never kicking Reidquat out of the "neutral" category anyway.
But yeah, there's really no way that town functions as a unit here.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 20:05
Reidquat voting Monty, so that's the only one that's gettable right now.
Vote: Montmorency
Tally as of post 3017:
Lynch votes
3 votes: Montmorency (Riedquat (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053717871#post2053717871), Dp101 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053717873#post2053717873), Askthepizzaguy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718135#post2053718135))
2 votes: Askthepizzaguy (atheotes (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718059#post2053718059), Montmorency (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718060#post2053718060))
Voting history:
Askthepizzaguy
Montmorency
Montmorency
Al Sipsclar
Montmorency
Askthepizzaguy
Askthepizzaguy
Dp101
Montmorency
Voting ends in: tunnel snakes rule
Not voting - Al Sipsclar, GeneralHankerchief, Pelican
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 20:32
It occurs to me that I've been talking to mafia all day, and my entire town is more or less awol.
I think there's a maximum of 1 other townie even voting at this moment.
vote: atheotes
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 20:35
dp, if you're town, vote with me. Again.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 20:36
You're typically here for deadline switches.
If there's a cfd you can do one.
You're typically here for deadline switches.
If there's a cfd you can do one.
Not this time. Every time it has been a mistake, and I don't think the odds of it succeeding is any higher this time.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 20:50
Not this time. Every time it has been a mistake, and I don't think the odds of it succeeding is any higher this time.
I'll offer you a cupcake.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 20:51
What about Pelican? Would you lynch Pelican today?
What about Pelican? Would you lynch Pelican today?
Doubt it, I trust Quat and his scan of him didn't reveal him to be a threat.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 20:54
Doubt it, I trust Quat and his scan of him didn't reveal him to be a threat.
Makes sense.
Generalhankerchief or Al Sipsclar? Either or?
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 21:05
Vote: Generalhankerchief
Montmorency
10-08-2016, 21:06
Not this time. Every time it has been a mistake, and I don't think the odds of it succeeding is any higher this time.
But you're willing to vote me with him. :wink:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJQ35sJzRkE
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 21:06
11 minute delay on that question seems a bit long.
11 minute delay on that question seems a bit long.
I'm sorry for doing other things for any amount of time after your question. If you forced me to choose between those two, I would go Al.
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 21:15
I'm sorry for doing other things for any amount of time after your question. If you forced me to choose between those two, I would go Al.
Do you think he's the scum's roleblocker, and therefore, a higher value target than Monty?
Askthepizzaguy
10-08-2016, 21:36
Nope. Delays are too long for me to do this, it's taking up too much of my RL time.
I've given up time I would spend with my wife on our vacation for this game, I just reached my limit.
Let's lynch Montmorency, keep it as simple as possible, and return to this question tomorrow.
vote: Montmorency
Montmorency
10-08-2016, 21:47
I'm sorry. :sad:
Now please die.
Riedquat
10-08-2016, 23:14
Wonder where is everybody.... I expect this don't go wrong... :stare:
Montmorency
10-08-2016, 23:23
Why don't you try voting for mafia? :brood:
Al Sipsclar
10-09-2016, 00:09
If Riedquat wants to win with the scum, why he needs to lynch Monty? There are easier lynch targets.
Tally as of post 3037:
Lynch votes
3 votes: Montmorency (Riedquat (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053717871#post2053717871), Dp101 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053717873#post2053717873), Askthepizzaguy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718152#post2053718152))
2 votes: Askthepizzaguy (atheotes (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718059#post2053718059), Montmorency (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718060#post2053718060))
Voting history:
Askthepizzaguy
Montmorency
Montmorency
Al Sipsclar
Montmorency
Askthepizzaguy
Askthepizzaguy
Dp101
Montmorency
atheotes
GeneralHankerchief
Montmorency
Voting ends in: tunnel snakes rule
Not voting - Al Sipsclar, GeneralHankerchief, Pelican
...
I swear, if we lose this because 3 people don't vote, I will be rather ticked off.
GeneralHankerchief
10-09-2016, 01:29
I'm here, I'm here.
On GH's Chart of Trust (tm) I have Riedquat listed higher than both Pizza and Monty. So Riedquat says Monty's scum, even though I have Monty further up the Chart than Pizza? Alea iacta est.
Vote: Montmorency
Al Sipsclar
10-09-2016, 01:40
I'm tempted not to vote just to see Dp101 ticked off...
So, if Riedquat wants to win with scum, he also wants to keep Fry and robots alive. This means he only wants to lynch among Monty, Pizza, atheotes, Dp101. He could choose Pizza or atheotes, but he's chosen Monty.
Tally as of post 3042:
Lynch votes
4 votes: Montmorency (Riedquat (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053717871#post2053717871), Dp101 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053717873#post2053717873), Askthepizzaguy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718152#post2053718152), GeneralHankerchief (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718185#post2053718185))
2 votes: Askthepizzaguy (atheotes (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718059#post2053718059), Montmorency (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718060#post2053718060))
Voting history:
Askthepizzaguy
Montmorency
Montmorency
Al Sipsclar
Montmorency
Askthepizzaguy
Askthepizzaguy
Dp101
Montmorency
atheotes
GeneralHankerchief
Montmorency
Montmorency
35 minutes
not voting - pelican, al sips
remember you are required to vote
Looks like I will have to go just before deadline. Sorry, we probably lost anyway though.
Al Sipsclar
10-09-2016, 02:33
Vote: Montmorency
GeneralHankerchief
10-09-2016, 02:45
Vote: Montmorency
Reason being...?
GeneralHankerchief
10-09-2016, 02:53
If I could find a souvenir
Just to prove the world was here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=La4Dcd1aUcE
Al Sipsclar
10-09-2016, 02:55
Reason being...?
Only scum gives reasons when voting. :laugh4:
I tend to believe Riedquat. Seems to be overly elaborate ruse otherwise.
Al Sipsclar
10-09-2016, 02:57
Are you saying, I'm full of hot air, GH?
GeneralHankerchief
10-09-2016, 02:59
Are you saying, I'm full of hot air, GH?
Heh, not necessarily. Just your avatar.
I was looking for something to describe my state of mind heading into this deadline and the Nena lyric worked well.
http://theinfosphere.org/images/d/d6/Title_Caption_Film_04.png
Montmorency was lynched.
-------
"There is nothing at stake and no threat, beyond the shame of defeat." - Montmorency
https://i.imgur.com/syp9yNW.png
Mom
Player: Montmorency
Role: Mom (http://theinfosphere.org/Mom) [COVER: Bubblegum Tate]
Faction: MomCorp (MAFIA)
"Conquer Earth, you bastards!"
-------
It is now Night Seven.
Night actions due by: tunnel snakes rule
Alive: 7
Al Sipsclar
Askthepizzaguy
atheotes
Dp101
GeneralHankerchief
Pelican
Riedquat
---
Lynched: 7
d1 - spaceman98 - Leela
d2 - BSmith - Amy
d3 - Stork - Professor Farnsworth
d4 - novice - Scruffy
d5 - Cuthillius - Hattie
d6 - Murska - Dr. Wernstrom
d7 - Montmorency - Mom
---
Killed: 7
n1 - El Barto - Flexo
n2 - Visor - Hermes
n2 - seireikhaan - Larry
d3 - CrimsonFox - Zapp Brannigan
n3 - Newyn - Linda
n4 - choxorn - Morbo
n5 - Winston Hughes - Robot Devil
---
Modkilled: 1
johnhughthom - Hedonismbot
GeneralHankerchief
10-09-2016, 03:08
So, the mafia faction is Momcorp, Monty was Mom...
...he had to be their roleblocker, right?
Right?
I think now what needs to be done is finding a list of people who said "Just Monty being Monty" in regards to his behaviour. We don't need to lynch the whole list, but it might be useful.
GeneralHankerchief
10-09-2016, 03:18
I think now what needs to be done is finding a list of people who said "Just Monty being Monty" in regards to his behaviour. We don't need to lynch the whole list, but it might be useful.
Well, as the head cheerleader in the "Monty being Monty" crowd.............. :laugh4:
Well, as the head cheerleader in the "Monty being Monty" crowd.............. :laugh4:
Hey, I didn't say the whole list. We will see though.
Al Sipsclar
10-09-2016, 03:22
Those, who are using novice's plugin, does it let you find all the votes from the beginning of the thread? I thought I'd ask before going into the trouble of installing it...
Those, who are using novice's plugin, does it let you find all the votes from the beginning of the thread? I thought I'd ask before going into the trouble of installing it...
If you noticed when he finished it, he got the vote counts for the first 3 days all at once, so I think you can make it work that way if you click the post tally button on the correct post.
Riedquat
10-09-2016, 03:31
I play for the scum.... blah blah blah.... you damned fools!
:laugh4::laugh4: This went better than I hoped for! I'm sorry Monty, but you had to go for me to win, simple as that. :bow:
Al Sipsclar - Robot
Askthepizzaguy - Alien
atheotes - ?
Dp101 - ?
GeneralHankerchief - Robot
Pelican - Human
Riedquat - Robot
It would be nice to survive the night but I guess you are really pissed off, perhaps we can resolve it as gentlemen in the morning?
atheotes
10-09-2016, 04:33
I did not see that coming!
Pizza is town? GH and Al sips is the scum team? But they could have lynched pizza with their votes. So one of GH/ Al is town.
atheotes
10-09-2016, 04:48
so it has to be Pizza and Al sips right? Al sips is definitely scum based on his ISO and voting pattern
I'm tempted not to vote just to see Dp101 ticked off...
So, if Riedquat wants to win with scum, he also wants to keep Fry and robots alive. This means he only wants to lynch among Monty, Pizza, atheotes, Dp101. He could choose Pizza or atheotes, but he's chosen Monty.
This looks like an open negotiation with Quat. But it implies Dp 101 is scum.(or robot)
Quat can protect Pelican. GH can jailkeep Dp. I will protect on of Quat/GH. Pizza can track Al sips again.
if Monty is not the RB, one of us will get RBed and we might get to know.
Walk me through how Al's post is implying I'm mafia? Is there some subtext I'm not seeing?
Al Sipsclar
10-09-2016, 06:42
so it has to be Pizza and Al sips right? Al sips is definitely scum based on his ISO and voting pattern
Sir, your derangement is impressive. I'm appointing you my official stalker. :laugh4:
Riedquat
10-09-2016, 07:39
I did not see that coming!
Pizza is town? GH and Al sips is the scum team? But they could have lynched pizza with their votes. So one of GH/ Al is town.
Lets try to not jump to conclusions yet...
This looks like an open negotiation with Quat. But it implies Dp 101 is scum.(or robot)
Walk me through how Al's post is implying I'm mafia? Is there some subtext I'm not seeing?
Every single post after I've claimed seems a negotiation to me, and of course it seems atheotes is suffering a bit of PIS, but yes there is a hidden subtext there.
So I agree, the answer is 47! ;)
Or everybody is paranoid and seeing things where is nothing!
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 12:43
I did not see that coming!
Pizza is town? GH and Al sips is the scum team? But they could have lynched pizza with their votes. So one of GH/ Al is town.
Riding or dying with GH as town.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 12:46
Let's see if Al can be inactive again tonight. Would be a pretty neat trick at this point if he's scum.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 12:53
So, the mafia faction is Momcorp, Monty was Mom...
...he had to be their roleblocker, right?
Right?
He can't have been, he wasn't the one who blocked you last night.
My money is on ninja or godfather. Mom is someone who could kill right in front of people's noses and not cause an alarm, imo.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 13:11
Riedquat
Take a look at atheotes tonight.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 13:23
GH
Based on the actions stated in the thread, you should be able to stop your own murder, or protect the victim.
If I get another tracking result, great, if I'm murdered, that's also great.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 13:30
If you're blocked again, that's a forced solve I think.
atheotes
10-09-2016, 15:16
Walk me through how Al's post is implying I'm mafia? Is there some subtext I'm not seeing?
"So, if Riedquat wants to win with scum, he also wants to keep Fry and robots alive. This means he only wants to lynch among Monty, Pizza, atheotes, Dp101. He could choose Pizza or atheotes, but he's chosen Monty."
out of the 4 who are not robots or Fry - Al is saying Quat could have chosen Pizza or myself. Why doesnt he want Quat to choose Monty or you? we now know Monty is scum.
atheotes
10-09-2016, 15:19
this is the best course of actions i can see.
Quat can protect Pelican and "scan" me.
GH can jailkeep Dp.
I will protect on of Quat/GH/myself
Pizza can track Al sips
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 15:23
Yeah no.
GH jailkeeper and atheotes full doctor is bullshit. You should be suspecting GH not me, and not only are you now suggesting GH is town, you're giving me tracking suggestions.
GH and I are not both townies with you or I would have gotten lynched yesterday, bud.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 15:28
If you believe:
1) Pelican is town, and got protected successfully last night, as you claimed was probable earlier today
2) You are town
3) Reidquat is neutral (as would be indicated by his lynch of Monty)
4) There's any possibility that GH is town and I am, you just declared the possibility of the scum team being exactly Al Sipsclar and dp101.
Which means I got lynched today, since you voted me. Strangely I'm still alive.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 15:35
I'm declaring an UncleDynamite here.
UncleDynamite lasted until endgame of a very long and somewhat large game with 5 scums. We lynched 3 of them, but then we hit a bunch of townies.
I accused half the townies in the game of being scum, one by one, and UD defended them as being townies, while also saying I was town.
Until it got to the point where he had literally defended the exact number of townies remaining in the game, being people other than himself.
He had essentially accused himself of being scum, since he white knighted more townies than should exist in the game if he's town.
You just did the equivalent.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 15:36
Easy mistake to make if you mistakenly believe from my perspective Al and dp101 can ever be scums together. The tally today precludes that possibility.
I have the Askthepizzaguy card that proves it.
It's not a mistake you can possibly make unless you forget you're a townie somehow.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 15:49
atheotes: shaken, but not stirring at the moment.
atheotes
10-09-2016, 15:53
:laugh4: good try.
If you have any problem with the suggested actions, lets discuss. Other things can be discussed during the day. :quiet:
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 15:56
I don't need to track tonight.
GH, you can include me in your list of people to block/protect. But make it unpredictable.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 16:03
Reidquat scans atheotes if unblocked and left alive. Blocking GH and killing pizza doesn't stop that from happening. Rediquat gets blocked, GH can stop a kill unless he gets killed and hits the wrong target, but then I'll be alive and have tracking data.
If I get blocked or killed, Reidquat gets a scan or GH gets off a jailkeep.
Not enough time to stop them all.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 16:51
Re-read of Monty is a pain in my ass. I really don't like reading his posts, nothing personal.
Tally as of post 2403:
Lynch votes
4 votes: Montmorency (Askthepizzaguy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053716708#post2053716708), Cuthillius (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053716760#post2053716760), Dp101 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053716802#post2053716802), Al Sipsclar (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053716821#post2053716821))
2 votes: Askthepizzaguy (Montmorency (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053716722#post2053716722), Murska (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053716877#post2053716877))
1 votes: atheotes (GeneralHankerchief (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053716882#post2053716882))
Scum GH always votes me here. He had Monty as basically lock town, so he has every excuse.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:15
I like Riedquat's paranoid theory. But I'm a sucker for in-universe clues. Even though Zack said that the knowledge of the universe would not help solving the game, he can be screwing with us nevertheless.
What I can't wrap my head around is why Dr. Ogden Wernstrom or Donbot, for that matter, would be "solid" cover roles for scum. For Larry (human) the cover was Elzar (alien). Pizza claimed Kif, who is another alien, so it'd be a point against Pizza.
I've always been Pizza's fanboi, I desperately want him to be town, but I won't regret losing to him, because I've been entertained.
So, Riedquat claimed neutral, and for this to be lylo, we need at least another 3rd party, who I assume is Pelican (Fry). I don't remember Pelican claiming neutral, but no one else counterclaimed.
If not me, not Riedquat, not Pelican, not DP, not GH, not Pizza, we have exactly Murska, atheotes and Monty left. The less-than-solid cover role makes me hesitant about Murska. Monty seems too reckless to be scum. I'm most convinced about atheotes. But I guess I have to do more paperwork to figure out who are the two scums among GH/Pizza/Murska/Monty.
Vote: atheotes
:stare::laugh4::stare::laugh4::dizzy2::inquisitive:
4 votes: Murska (GeneralHankerchief, Askthepizzaguy, Dp101, Riedquat)
2 votes: Al Sipsclar (atheotes, Montmorency)
2 votes: Askthepizzaguy (Pelican, Murska)
1 votes: Atheotes (Al sipsclar)
This can go so wrong....
The mutual votes between atheotes and Al Sipsclar here are baffling.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:18
Vote: Al Sipsclar
You should be blaming me for being the perfect patsy in General's evil plans. Well done, GH.
GH-Al team makes no sense here with Murska having only 1 more vote than the Al wagon.
The mutual votes between atheotes and Al Sipsclar here are baffling.
Yeah, EOD was really weird. The behaviour around it is almost too weird to be mafia, because it makes no sense. Found the seeming refusal for everyone to get on one target very odd.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:28
And who are the mafia?
You tell me. :yes:
^
Waiting for dp to make a mistake here, imo.
Has the scum team as GH-me-Al Sipsclar, but instead of pushing it and burying those suspects, atheotes is prompting dp to make a mistake.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:31
Yeah, EOD was really weird. The behaviour around it is almost too weird to be mafia, because it makes no sense. Found the seeming refusal for everyone to get on one target very odd.
Murska lynch was a bad lynch, so there are people avoiding being on that wagon.
Something you can do with your vote while you wait out a town on town disaster lynch is to vote for a scum that won't be lynched.
Al voting atheotes and vice-versa smacks of distancing.
You have to have the cojones to keep the vote there when GH moved to Al, but it's even worse to move off of Al at that point, because that connects you together.
Yeah, that's why I kept trying to get him to go first.
Post in reply to 3090 if it isn't clear.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:36
Yeah, EOD was really weird. The behaviour around it is almost too weird to be mafia, because it makes no sense. Found the seeming refusal for everyone to get on one target very odd.
Al did end up on Murska at your direct insistence. And GH's.
Al did end up on Murska at your direct insistence. And GH's.
Right, but it was much harder than it should have been to get people to consolidate.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:40
Right, but it was much harder than it should have been to get people to consolidate.
Agreed. A townie in that position should feel the panic of that situation setting in and consolidate. Especially if they were willing to lynch Murska in the first place.
The only real reason to vote off wagon there is if you're never voting murska, or if you're distancing from atheotes for show.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:41
There was no sense of urgency.
GeneralHankerchief
10-09-2016, 17:43
There was no sense of urgency.
Al hasn't had a sense of urgency this entire game. Not sure if that's a null tell or not.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:48
Al's not the scum roleblocker.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:49
That's too much of a risk, even if you're that close to winning, in case things go pear shaped, you never pile several scum votes on your scum roleblocker there.
Murska is right there.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:51
atheotes exactly the scum roleblocker or I've been deeply pocketed.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:54
My body is ready for that.
I'm jumping directly into the General's pocket, I understand there is a reusable cloth napkin of some kind in there, and winter is coming.
Riedquat
10-09-2016, 17:56
Err... I will scan who I need to scan, I'm not open to suggestions at this point in the game!
Last time Atheotes suggested the scanner to scan him the scanner ended dead... I'm smarter that that! :hide:
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 17:59
Err... I will scan who I need to scan, I'm not open to suggestions at this point in the game!
Last time Atheotes suggested the scanner to scan him the scanner ended dead... I'm smarter that that! :hide:
Just go in your list of unscanned and it will be good.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 18:01
Monty and atheotes suggesting the actions for Winston, GH, Reidquat, and myself for many rounds at this point, and none of those suggestions have been worth a pail of turds.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 18:02
I'm liking the anti-spreadsheet approach we've been doing. GH does what he wants, I track who I want, Reidquat just get literally any result and it will be useful.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 18:03
Pats game. GLGL
Yeah, honestly town telling mafia what they are doing ahead of time is a terrible idea. Is it common here?
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 18:15
Yeah, honestly town telling mafia what they are doing ahead of time is a terrible idea. Is it common here?
There was a long tradition of spreadsheeting o
n this site, but it annoyed a lot of players. Zack says he designed this game to avoid spreadsheeting anyway, if you read the first post of the game.
It's one of the reasons I've not felt that my tracking data was conclusive. Ninjas ruin spreadsheeting just by themselves, and with Riedquat able to do two actions at night, that also makes spreadsheeting ineffective.
Spreadsheeting works if you solve by suggesting X is busy that night, or not doing anything, therefore they cannot be Y.
There are many games where that was effective here, in the past. But the people doing the suggesting have been scummy as hell, and I never really figures atheotes for a spreadsheet style player.
That was my wheelhouse back in the day.
Askthepizzaguy
10-09-2016, 18:19
err second post.
Deadline in 20 mins, right?
http://basementrejects.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/futurama-season-1-title-card.jpg
Riedquat was killed.
-------
"I'm so excited I wish I could wet my pants." - Riedquat
https://i.imgur.com/UsmrMiJ.png
Bender Bending Rodriguez
Player: Riedquat
Role: Bender (https://theinfosphere.org/bender)
Faction: BENDER (NEUTRAL)
-------
It is now Day Eight.
Voting ends in: tunnel snakes rule
Alive: 6
Al Sipsclar
Askthepizzaguy
atheotes
Dp101
GeneralHankerchief
Pelican
---
Lynched: 7
d1 - spaceman98 - Leela
d2 - BSmith - Amy
d3 - Stork - Professor Farnsworth
d4 - novice - Scruffy
d5 - Cuthillius - Hattie
d6 - Murska - Dr. Wernstrom
d7 - Montmorency - Mom
---
Killed: 8
n1 - El Barto - Flexo
n2 - Visor - Hermes
n2 - seireikhaan - Larry
d3 - CrimsonFox - Zapp Brannigan
n3 - Newyn - Linda
n4 - choxorn - Morbo
n5 - Winston Hughes - Robot Devil
n7 - Riedquat - Bender
---
Modkilled: 1
johnhughthom - Hedonismbot
Slight error in your post, you say night actions due by when the day is meant to end.
no shortened phases or majority lynch/hammer
GeneralHankerchief
10-10-2016, 03:27
Jailed Dp101.
GeneralHankerchief
10-10-2016, 03:28
Addendum to the above: My action didn't go through, the roleblocker is still active.
GeneralHankerchief
10-10-2016, 03:36
Let's stop screwing around here.
Vote: atheotes
I dunno if Atheotes makes sense, his behaviour hasn't really felt like it had a cohesive plan behind it. Could be a mafia who decided that lone wolfing it would be a good idea, but you could also be a mafia jumping on the sheep that strayed from the herd. I will hold back for now, the lynching of a mafia has removed some of the stress from this game for me.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 05:00
I tracked atheotes to Generalhankerchief and Riedquat's locations.
Had I actually tracked anyone else, I would have seen absolutely nothing, and I said I was going to track Al sips, and then alluded to possibly being pocketed by GH. I wanted to confirm whether atheotes was the doctor or GH was the jailkeeper. One of them is always scum.
Even if atheotes suspected I'd be tracking him, I was already siding with GH. If I tracked his partner, I'd have falsely cleared atheotes' partner for being inactive. They have the ability to double up actions, just like Riedquat did.
Vote: atheotes
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 05:08
This means all my other tracking data doesn't prove anything, unfortunately.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 05:10
You can say none of them were the mafia roleblocker specifically, that's all. If they weren't murdering, that doesn't mean they aren't scum.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 05:15
If anyone is on the fence, recall that atheotes only soft-counterclaimed GH when GH claimed, he voted GH for a while, then he suggested he was a 1 shot doctor, then changed that story, then suggested GH was town after trying to get him lynched after saying GH had to be scum based on his claim, and UncleDynamited himself last night by suggesting any possibility of a dp101 and Al Sipsclar mafia team, something that's impossible unless the mafia blew a sure win.
This is not a man who is solving, and it really shouldn't even take tracking data to prove it. The proof is in the thread.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 05:17
Hard counter to GH's claim means no explanation for why atheotes is still alive after GH dies a couple of nights ago.
Thus they had to roleblock him and keep him alive. But if Riedquat lives, he finds another threat. Can't block GH and kill Pizza, and pizza's on the verge of accidentally clearing someone falsely anyway.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 05:20
With a soft counterclaim, if GH gets lynched, he can bluff a 1 shot something or other, and there's no urgency to his being NK if he's town.
A hard counterclaim is how town-atheotes challenges GH there. He went soft, and thus, is not a hard-shelled Zoidberg after all.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 05:21
If atheotes was town, he should have been protecting Riedquat as well. Anyone else wouldn't have cleared him.
Especially if he thought GH or I were actually scum. Losing a vanilla townie only reduces the number of mislynches in play, so there's no reason to protect any of them.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 05:34
He wouldn't be protecting Al, he thought Al was scum. Protecting dp101 doesn't make sense if he thinks Al is scum. Between dp101 and Riedquat, one of them has a protecting and investigating power. The choice should have been really simple.
I tracked atheotes to Generalhankerchief and Riedquat's locations.
Wait, so your tracking power tells you everywhere they have ever been? Or did they go two places in one night?
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 05:45
Wait, so your tracking power tells you everywhere they have ever been? Or did they go two places in one night?
2 places, one night. I don't get histories.
2 places, one night. I don't get histories.
Ok, is there something I'm missing or isn't that impossible? I thought you could only do one night action?
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 05:59
Ok, is there something I'm missing or isn't that impossible? I thought you could only do one night action?
I only get one night action. But if someone goes two places instead of just one place, I wouldn't only get half the data.
Which half would the game host give? If I tracked Riedquat this game to two places, I'd see him at both locations.
I'm the guy with one night action, atheotes has two.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 06:01
For the record, any game where anyone has two night actions is highly unusual for this board. I'm not even going to claim this has happened more than once or twice ever.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 06:03
Interesting. :pop2:
thanks for getting rid of Quat so that we can actually afford a mislynch. Thanks for outing yourself as scum Pizza. Pretty impressive that you and Monty were going at each other...it seemed genuine.
what is your plan after i flip town? wondering what kind of yarn you will spin. More importantly, who is your partner? Confident that they can win it for your team?
I know Pizza is not going to answer any of these questions. But it is for the rest of the town to figure if i get lynched.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 06:05
Let's stop screwing around here.
Vote: atheotes
Please make your case.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 06:09
I find it baffling that you'd make the same mistake twice.
Atheotes, if you were town, there are no more mislynches. You have to pretend that you're town when you tell lies.
Guy, I know there are 4 townies alive. But if you know that there are 4 townies alive besides just you, you're calling yourself scum again.
GG pal.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 06:10
Pelican - you need to vote today. if you dont you are going to lose it for the town.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 06:12
If it were 2 scums and 5 townies, yeah, we'd have a mislynch.
You could only think there are 5 townies left if you know there are 4 besides you.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 06:14
I find it baffling that you'd make the same mistake twice.
Atheotes, if you were town, there are no more mislynches. You have to pretend that you're town when you tell lies.
Guy, I know there are 4 townies alive. But if you know that there are 4 townies alive besides just you, you're calling yourself scum again.
GG pal.
wait what? oh..crap. we cant afford a mislynch. I dont know what i was thinking.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 06:15
@Pelican (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/member.php?u=100124) - you need to vote today. if you dont you are going to lose it for the town.
On the contrary. If he's AWOL today, we have exactly the number of votes we need to lynch a scum.
We could even lose a body today for mysterious god-related reasons and still win.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 06:16
Here is my unaltered role PM:
Young lady, I am an expert on humans. Now pick a mouth, open it, and say BR BR BR BR BRRRRRRRR.
https://i.imgur.com/GJnt6oO.png
Dr. John A. Zoidberg
Player: atheotes
Role: Zoidberg (https://theinfosphere.org/Zoidberg)
Faction: TOWN
Team Victory Conditions:
The Town achieves victory based on its ability to achieve the goals listed below.
- The Mafia are eliminated.
- All hostile Third Parties are eliminated.
- At least one member of the Town survives the game.
Abilities:
Hardy Carapace (1-shot bulletproof). Survive the first attempt to kill you at night. This is a passive ability that automatically triggers, you don't need to send me orders.
-----
If you have any questions, ask me privately.
:2thumbsup:
I was trying to get the scum to target me on the night with no kill. I dont know if the scum targeted Pelican or me on night with no kill.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 06:20
On the contrary. If he's AWOL today, we have exactly the number of votes we need to lynch a scum.
We could even lose a body today for mysterious god-related reasons and still win.
Pelican is AWOL. Dp has sheeped you all game. GH doesnt seem to be trying at all...it is likely that he is your partner. Al sips has made no effort in the game and he is not going to do so now.
Contrary to what you are claiminig, I have actually accused everyone here except Pelican of being scum. None of them are likely to vote with me. Game over. I lost the game when i did not go hard against you 2 days ago.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 06:24
I'm good, but go ahead and explain why a 1 time bulletproof counterclaims a jailkeeper, I guess.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 06:25
I go back to school, so I'll see you guys in 8 hours maybe.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 06:28
If any of the townies are willing to put the effort, take a careful look at my role pm. go and look back at my actions from the start of potential lylo. and if you have any questions for me i will be answer and we can discuss.
I am not going to address any of Pizza's posts. he is very good at posting mountains of WIFOM. By the time i answer one his posts he would have posted 20 more walls. If iam going to be voted for this reason i dont care.
If Pelican doesn't vote today, he will be modkilled.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 06:34
I'm good, but go ahead and explain why a 1 time bulletproof counterclaims a jailkeeper, I guess.
i never CCed. I did not believe GH's claim. so i called it out and voted for him.
I only claimed doctor at potential lylo to get myself targeted. After that i played along because i dont get confirmation if i was attacked or not.
Well, at least we know that there is a 50% chance of lynching a mafia today.
GeneralHankerchief
10-10-2016, 12:56
Please make your case.
My case? Okay.
It could be because you've had a questionable reaction to my claim and its follow-ups from the very beginning.
It could be because of hard numbers, many of the remaining players in this game are either about to be Wogged or cleared by one source or another.
It could be because Pizza - who is much further up GH's Ladder of Trust (tm) than you - tracked you to first my location (and I was visited at night by somebody) and then Riedquat's location (and he was killed).
It could be because your general overall behavior is off, and not townie, and has been this way for a while.
It could be all of these things put together, the whole being greater than the sum of the parts.
But mostly it's because one of the old Gameroom maxims apparently still holds true:
atheotes is always mafia.
Well, either mafia pair is Pizza and General, in which case we already lost because town can't unify (seems unlikely, but whatever, anything is possible) or Atheotes is mafia. Right now, Vote: Atheotes because on balance his behaviour surrounding the claims feels too odd to be town.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 18:25
My case? Okay.
It could be because you've had a questionable reaction to my claim and its follow-ups from the very beginning. - your claim is crap and you know it.
It could be because of hard numbers, many of the remaining players in this game are either about to be Wogged or cleared by one source or another. - Please elaborate
It could be because Pizza - who is much further up GH's Ladder of Trust (tm) than you - tracked you to first my location (and I was visited at night by somebody) and then Riedquat's location (and he was killed). - Pizza claimed this after your vote. SO it cannot be part of your reason for voting me.
It could be because your general overall behavior is off, and not townie, and has been this way for a while. - weak
It could be all of these things put together, the whole being greater than the sum of the parts. - so nothing really.
But mostly it's because one of the old Gameroom maxims apparently still holds true:
atheotes is always mafia. terrible!
Anyways, thanks for confirming yourself as pizza's scum partner. There is no hope for the town. If i am the most vocal townie town is doomed.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 18:30
Well, either mafia pair is Pizza and General, in which case we already lost because town can't unify (seems unlikely, but whatever, anything is possible) or Atheotes is mafia. Right now, Vote: Atheotes because on balance his behaviour surrounding the claims feels too odd to be town.
what is it that you are finding odd? I claimed a role to get myself targeted by the scum so that we did not lose the game.
Remember, all scum have cover roles.
Assume i am scum and try to explain happened on the night of no kill.
GeneralHankerchief
10-10-2016, 18:40
Assume i am scum and try to explain happened on the night of no kill.
Easy. Riedquat wasn't lying and successfully protected Pelican.
The switching and such strike me as weird. Your cases have also been a little odd. However, I just realised that Pizza still hasn't posted his role pm. Since this is the last day, Pizza, could you please post your PM to confirm the validity of your results?
atheotes
10-10-2016, 18:50
Easy. Riedquat wasn't lying and successfully protected Pelican.
from the point of view that i am scum. I am asking Dp101 and the other townies to look at my posts in conjunction with the actual situation and what happened.
I threw the spanner in the works for the scum team. otherwise game would have ended there.
atheotes
10-10-2016, 18:51
The switching and such strike me as weird. Your cases have also been a little odd. However, I just realised that Pizza still hasn't posted his role pm. Since this is the last day, Pizza, could you please post your PM to confirm the validity of your results?
By switching you mean the votes? my cases are bound to be not solid. I am town and i dont have any other information other than what is in the thread.
Good point abt pizza's role pm though. lets see.
GeneralHankerchief
10-10-2016, 18:56
It could be because of hard numbers, many of the remaining players in this game are either about to be Wogged or cleared by one source or another.
You asked me to elaborate on this, so I'll indulge you.
6 people still alive.
Al Sipsclar
Askthepizzaguy
atheotes
Dp101
GeneralHankerchief
Pelican
Pelican is cleared by virtue of Riedquat protecting him and then Riedquat being nightkilled - i.e. Riedquat was in opposition to the mafia.
ATPG is not 100% lock clear but a town-aligned tracker makes sense with what's been confirmed about the setup and his theories make sense at this stage in the game.
Dp101... isn't mafia. End of discussion.
And then there's me.
This leaves us with two scum remaining: atheotes, and Al Sipsclar.
It's not out of the realm of possibility that Pizza is a mafioso. But I'd put money on atheotes and Al Sipsclar being some variation of Walt and Igner (Mom's two unaccounted-for sons), and the game concluding upon their deaths.
GeneralHankerchief
10-10-2016, 19:14
from the point of view that i am scum. I am asking Dp101 and the other townies to look at my posts in conjunction with the actual situation and what happened.
I threw the spanner in the works for the scum team. otherwise game would have ended there.
I'm not sure what the two have to do with each other. If you're scum, you're lying about your role and have no protection ability whatsoever. This leaves us with Riedquat protecting Fry/Pelican.
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 21:09
My role PM again. I claimed it probably 3 or 4 phases ago at this point.
The first time I posted it, I had adblocker on, so the image didn't post when I went to copy n paste it. IMGUR is filtered out by adblock plus for firefox.
If you recall, I breadcrumbed that I was a tracker on night 1, and also knew where Winston Hughes went, and he flipped townie. I've been tracking people.
Use a brush, you dunderhead! And mix these mixed nuts. I see two almonds touching!
https://i.imgur.com/eft18SV.png
Fourth Lieutenant Kif Kroker
Player: Askthepizzaguy
Role: Kif Kroker (https://theinfosphere.org/kif)
Faction: TOWN
Team Victory Conditions:
The Town achieves victory based on its ability to achieve the goals listed below.
- The Mafia are eliminated.
- All hostile Third Parties are eliminated.
- At least one member of the Town survives the game.
Abilities:
Large Eyes See All (Tracker). At night, use your larger-than-human eyeballs to target another player and see who, if anyone, they visited.
-----
If you have any questions, ask me privately.
:2thumbsup:
Askthepizzaguy
10-10-2016, 21:24
I'm turning in early. I woke up earlier than usual this morning and I'm falling asleep at the keyboard.
I'll check for other questions before school tomorrow and can be here for several hours when I get home tomorrow.
@Pelican (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/member.php?u=100124)
ping ping.
Pizza, when you get back, sorry to keep requesting more clarification than should be necessary, but how is this an uncledynamite situation with Athotes? What is it about him specifically narrowing down his list of allowed mafia to me and Al that makes him obvscum?
Hi pals, really sorry for all of the silence on my end, but this is the first spare moment I've had in days that I can reasonably devote to this game. And even this has to be brief. Based on what I can glean from a very cursory skim of the thread, I'll go ahead and vote for vote: Al Sipsclar; Don't want to go Pizza after Monty's flip and out of the remaining candidates, I feel he has been most suspicious throughout the game. I'm glad to see that there's still tomorrow for me to be around and change my vote if need be, but that participation may be limited to just a half hour or so around the EoD, unfortunately. Really sorry, I know players like me who sign up for a game and can't commit the necessary time later on are a major pain in the shiny metal ass (RIP my good friend Bender :cry:), but I really am trying my best with the situation I find myself in.
Askthepizzaguy
10-11-2016, 03:22
Pizza, when you get back, sorry to keep requesting more clarification than should be necessary, but how is this an uncledynamite situation with Athotes? What is it about him specifically narrowing down his list of allowed mafia to me and Al that makes him obvscum?
It was half that and half another thing. Let me grab the post.
Tally as of post 3164:
Lynch votes
3 votes: atheotes (GeneralHankerchief (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718372#post2053718372), Askthepizzaguy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718380#post2053718380), Dp101 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718451#post2053718451))
1 votes: Al Sipsclar (Pelican (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718530#post2053718530))
Voting history:
atheotes
atheotes
Atheotes
Al Sipsclar
Askthepizzaguy
10-11-2016, 04:30
I'll walk you through my thoughts as they occurred.
I did not see that coming!
Pizza is town? GH and Al sips is the scum team? But they could have lynched pizza with their votes. So one of GH/ Al is town.
1. "I did not see that coming! Pizza is town?"
This reaction, even if there weren't already serious problems with atheotes for most of the game (stuff I highlighted in orange and red in an earlier analysis post) smacked of a mafioso being caught with their pants down after the expected mislynch target didn't go through and a scum died instead.
Why would I simply be town after all that suspicion just because Monty flipped wolf? Especially if you're atheotes and you figure if you voted incorrectly, that would have been game. Which he says immediately afterward:
2. "GH and Al sips is the scum team? But they could have lynched pizza with their votes."
Right. And he also has GH as one of his top suspects for the past several rounds at this point. Monty's flip should not have suddenly thrown all the suspicion on me and also Generalhankerchief into doubt. In fact, he specifically avoids saying whether or not he even still suspects GH or Al, which allows him to reverse course on either one, depending on which one looks like they'd be willing to mislynch tomorrow. Leaving options on the table.
So up to here, it's gross because I know he's wrong about half of the scum team minimum, and he also hard defended Montmorency as town in the previous phase on a day that was a potential lynch or lose. But this isn't the point.
continuing to the next post.
so it has to be Pizza and Al sips right? Al sips is definitely scum based on his ISO and voting pattern
This looks like an open negotiation with Quat. But it implies Dp 101 is scum.(or robot)
Quat can protect Pelican. GH can jailkeep Dp. I will protect on of Quat/GH. Pizza can track Al sips again.
if Monty is not the RB, one of us will get RBed and we might get to know.
Immediately after the hard reset of his suspects list and keeping me in it, and after suspecting Generalhankerchief for a while, now Generalhankerchief is town just because of Monty's flip. GH and Monty had a fairly buddy buddy relationship all game. The sudden drop of suspicion on GH, how it vanishes here, implies that he now does have GH as specifically a town slot.
So he's thinking that GH and himself are town, and he has Pelican as town. There's one left. He also specifically mentions that he would only protect inside Riedquat and Generalhankerchief. (Red flag: He is giving himself an out when Riedquat dies, he can claim to have been protecting GH instead. He can't do that unless he marks GH down as town after suspecting him for ages)
Then he says "Pizza can track Al Sips again".
That suggestion reveals that he thinks I can be town. If I am town and atheotes is town, there was a town-on-town vote at lynch or lose. So why didn't I get lynched?
Remember, he says this in the same breath as he suggests that GH is simply just a townie now. So in the same post, he first establishes that GH is probably the town jailkeeper, and that it would be a good idea to jailkeep DP, which doesn't make a lot of sense because dp is a claimed vanilla townie and supposedly a potential mislynch target since we have no data on him at all. Why not jailkeep Askthepizzaguy if you believe I am scum? or Al Sipsclar? So that Riedquat can do his thing unmolested.
So the thought process is exactly this:
(a) generalhankerchief is town after that mislynch, and my suspicions on him are gone. (b) pizza and al sipsclar are scum candidates (c) Riedquat is still not a suspect (d) Pelican is town and should be protected (e) Pizza can track Al Sipsclar.
^They literally happen one after the other, boom boom boom.
What tracking data is he expecting to get from me? What scum team is he thinking of if he suggests that GH can be town and pizza can be town in the same breath?
What town team is he thinking of?
He's got a moment where he suggests GH and Askthepizzaguy and Pelican are all townies. In one post, in one connected thought.
That leaves Al Sipsclar and dp101. A team which is impossible.
Examine it and see what happens when you highlight those names in blue and neutral:
Lynch votes
4 votes: Montmorency (Riedquat, Dp101, Askthepizzaguy, GeneralHankerchief, Al Sipsclar)
2 votes: Askthepizzaguy (atheotes, Montmorency)
1 not voting: Pelican
There are three scumbags left, based on the lylo warning.
If you are giving Pizza tracking suggestions, you think there's a chance he's town after saying that GH is town. And he's marked Pelican down as town as well. That's three.
Where's the last townie?
If you put it anywhere besides dp101 or Al Sipsclar, you're landing it on atheotes. But a dp101 and Al Sipsclar team is impossible, because of this:
Lynch votes
3 votes: Montmorency (Riedquat, Dp101, Askthepizzaguy, GeneralHankerchief, Al Sipsclar)
4 votes: Askthepizzaguy (atheotes, Montmorency, dp101, Al Sipsclar)
1 not voting: Pelican
Dp and Al Sipsclar were both here at deadline to switch, and there was a town-on-town vote, according to what atheotes is suggesting. ^This would have been the final vote count if dp and Al were both scum.
However, you can have Askthepizzaguy as a potential townie and GH as a potential townie at the same time, with Pelican, with 2 slots left to color in, like this:
Lynch votes
3 votes: Montmorency (Riedquat, Dp101, Askthepizzaguy, GeneralHankerchief, Al Sipsclar)
4 votes: Askthepizzaguy (atheotes, Montmorency)
1 not voting: Pelican
All you have to do is color atheotes' name in red, and one of Al Sipsclar or dp101 in as town. Then the count works. And then you have 4 townies other than atheotes, which is what makes that math work.
That is how pizza can possibly be a townie and avoid being mislynched yesterday. A position that would be very difficult for atheotes to justify otherwise.
Granted, he said he still had me as scum, but then in the same breath he suggested GH and Pelican were town, he gave me tracking orders.
You don't suddenly just forget which of us you have as town. You literally cannot have both GH and Askthepizzaguy as town if you're atheotes, while also having Pelican as town. Because then the game would be over.
The only way that works is if you think there are 4 townies in the game besides yourself.
Look, I'm the kind of guy that turns his opinion on a dime. I get having GH as scummy in one post and then town in the next. They could even be 1 minute apart. It can happen.
I have even seen someone have a player as scummy at the start of their post, and townie by the end of it, after talking themself through it. That's also possible, albeit rarely.
But you don't have Askthepizzaguy as scum and town in the same post, in the same connected thought. There's no tracking data that's worth a damn for me to give if I am scum. I can invent anything I want.
However, there is a purpose to asking me to track Al Sipsclar: If you are running out of ways to block and kill the powers that threaten you.
If you have to block GH, and kill one of Reidquat or Askthepizzaguy, but you leave the other alive, give him a suggestion that always causes him to miss what happened. Ask him to track Al Sipsclar, then roleblock and kill. That way, both crimes go undetected.
It wasn't a momentary lapse in concentration either:
this is the best course of actions i can see.
Quat can protect Pelican and "scan" me.
GH can jailkeep Dp.
I will protect on of Quat/GH/myself
Pizza can track Al sips
If he's planning on killing Riedquat, the scan is worthless. He could then claim "why would I ask Riedquat to scan me if I'm scum?" which, although that shouldn't fool people, I've seen it happen.
But point blank, he's got neither Riedquat or Pelican as scum suspects here.
Then he tells GH to jailkeep dp101. Which doesn't make a lot of sense, especially if he thinks that there's any possibility his "1 shot" bulletproof power actually was the reason for the no death the night prior, instead of suggesting it was possibly Riedquat's doing. If he knows he's town, and he has no active powers left, and that he might have been targeted for death, he should be asking to be jailkept, himself. But nevermind, that's a minor quibble.
He now suggests that he will have a protect on himself as a possibility, as well as possibly GH or possibly Riedquat. Which means that he could kill either one. He could decide to block Riedquat and kill Generalhankerchief IF GH is jailkeeping dp101. That gives him options.
He's giving me tracking instructions.
He's giving me tracking instructions for the second time, with enough time in between for me to post several times.
He is asking for Riedquat to scan himself, which gives him absolutely no information.
He's telling GH to block someone besides himself.
He's telling me to track someone besides himself.
The block or track should both be clearing for atheotes if he was town, if they were successful. Instead, he goes with the one information role which is getting murdered that night, and also, would tell him absolutely nothing he didn't already know about himself if he were town.
The two roles which survived the night were asked not to look at him. The one role he did ask to look at him, he should have been asking to look at dp101, who was the other person that Riedquat claimed to have not scanned yet, and thus, would be the only useful piece of data for atheotes IF Riedquat had survived.
But he's telegraphing the fact that he's about to kill Riedquat here.
And my tracking data wouldn't have seen anything if I followed that instruction.
And it wouldn't have told us anything if we listened to atheotes' previous suggestions for night actions, either. He keeps giving us suggestions that conveniently don't solve the game, and telegraphing our actions to the scum team (if he were townie) which is ill advised. Scum can counter such courses of action if they can predict them exactly.
Such as making sure I'm looking the wrong way.
But the point:
Again, he suggests the possibility that I am town with Generalhankerchief and Pelican.
That's twice in one night, while giving bullshit order suggestions that solve nothing.
If you know there are 4 townies alive in the game, you could mark all three of us as townies and still have room for 1. But that's only if you're not trying to solve the game.
If you were trying to solve the game, you'd also have yourself as a townie, and see that a dp101 and Al Sipsclar team is literally impossible due to the vote count.
And thus, you would have a different or more concrete pair of suspects, or a different and more concrete townie trio.
Why this is analogous to UncleDynamite:
In that game, UD defended the people I was accusing, without accusing me, and even marking me down as a town read.
The problem was, he was also defending his mafia partner, for obvious reasons. And he had one suspect.
But there were two scums alive, and the only way all of those other people could be town, is if the one slot remaining was scum. His slot.
From atheotes' perspective, there is a way that GH and I and Pelican can be town. And that's if you don't have atheotes as town.
How atheotes can forget that he's town as town? He can't. It's never happened.
But, I've seen a scumbag white knight too many townies and accuse themself of being scum by process of elimination before, by marking off too many townies at once.
It doesn't happen often, but it does happen if you're more focused on making sure your kill goes through that night, and giving instructions that solve nothing to the town, while telegraphing which role out of the three is going to be murdered.
Or it happens if you're simply trying to protect your scum partner from a townie's accusations, but feel you'd lose a direct confrontation with said townie, so you mark them down as scum. You also want to discredit that townie by defending the other townies he's attacking, so they side with you. Suddenly, you lose count of how many townies you're supposed to have, and accidentally put one too many.
If atheotes is solving the game and has any theory in his head, then at any time, he cannot come up with an Al Sips and dp101 scum team.
But those suggested actions, repeated, suggest that exact team. Without saying it outright. Because it's wrong and he does in fact need one of your votes today.
It's not a team he's ever going to push, because he doesn't believe it is a real team either. He discounted it above. And it's obviously incorrect.
But it's the only team that remains if you believe atheotes' suggested night actions are legitimate and come from a town mindset:
this is the best course of actions i can see.
Quat can protect Pelican and "scan" me.
GH can jailkeep Dp.
I will protect on of Quat/GH/myself
Pizza can track Al sips
Reidquat not scum. Pelican town. GH town. Himself town. Pizza town. Leaves Al and dp, a team that shouldn't ever exist in any villager's brain, after they point out such a team is impossible.
This was the post he made just a few posts prior:
I did not see that coming!
Pizza is town? GH and Al sips is the scum team? But they could have lynched pizza with their votes. So one of GH/ Al is town.
He's already proven he knows that team (GH and Al Sips) is impossible, but the same logic holds true for dp101 and Al Sipsclar. In fact, any 2 of the Montmorency voters.
But he accidentally suggests such a team moments later, proving he's not solving, but manipulating the outcome of the night phase as his primary motivation.
He couldn't make such a suggestion unless he has 4 townies in play other than himself.
The only way that happens is when you forget to include yourself in your list of townies.
Holy crap, thanks for the extensive writeup. I understand things a lot better now, and I feel I understand mafia thinking a lot better now, and might actually become a decent townie one day. I realise that most of the above probably doesn't matter because if I trust you on that then I also trust your scan, which proves his guilt anyway.
Askthepizzaguy
10-11-2016, 04:42
Or it happens if you're simply trying to protect your scum partner from a townie's accusations, but feel you'd lose a direct confrontation with said townie, so you mark them down as scum.
NETA
What UD did in that game. Should read "town", was typing too fast.
Askthepizzaguy
10-11-2016, 04:59
Look at the timestamps between these two posts:
this is the best course of actions i can see.
Quat can protect Pelican and "scan" me.
GH can jailkeep Dp.
I will protect on of Quat/GH/myself
Pizza can track Al sips
Yeah no.
GH jailkeeper and atheotes full doctor is bullshit. You should be suspecting GH not me, and not only are you now suggesting GH is town, you're giving me tracking suggestions.
GH and I are not both townies with you or I would have gotten lynched yesterday, bud.
His mistake immediately occurs to me because I am solving the game. This is not something that I had to even ponder for more than a moment.
All of those thoughts I just described in the above post (which takes a long time to type) occurred the instant I saw atheotes' post. A couple happened later on, but the main thrust of it, the live townie miscount, all happened just then, and the reasons behind it, and the cited example of where I've seen a scum doing it before.
GH is correct, I can't fake certain thought processes. I've been off the mark for most of the game, but I've given thought processes that made sense and explained them.
I do this because people need to know WHY I was incorrect if I was incorrect. And also so that if I am incorrect, someone can tell me why before the lynch actually happens. Then I can reverse.
Examples: suspicion on GH immediately reversed when I saw that claim. Jailkeeper is someone the mafia would have to roleblock or kill every single night for the rest of the game if he's town. And if he's scum, that will be found out when he's still alive at LYLO, usually.
Suspicion on Winston Hughes: Nonexistent the entire game. Never saw his original soft claim, suspected him precisely because I thought he claimed at night, which you shouldn't do if you're an investigative role or role with any active ability, unless you're also giving out information you're afraid will be lost.
As soon as it was pointed out he had claimed before that, the suspicion vanished again.
I could walk you through my suspicions and town leans on every single person I've talked about this entire game. Especially any reversals.
Ask me anything about any individual person.
Note also that he declared that it wasn't LYLO today, because Riedquat got shot.
Again, that can only be the case if you think there are 4 townies alive who aren't yourself.
2 scums and 4 other townies is not lylo, because if you include yourself, that's a final 7.
Final 6 means if there are 2 scums and 4 other townies, you are one of the scums.
Because final 6 does not occur very much on this board due to a lack of vigilantes, it's understandable that atheotes could forget the dynamics of LYLO and suggest in a taunting fashion that since Riedquat died, town can "afford to mislynch" atheotes, so therefore bluffing that town will get pizza tomorrow if atheotes is lynched incorrectly today.
But he made the same mistake again, forgetting to include himself as townie.
You don't need tracking data to catch atheotes here. The thread is often times far more conclusive than claims, especially in a non-spreadsheet solve game with host-provided fake role PMs given to the scums.
You must examine the in-thread stuff. But I know GH is lock clear now, and that atheotes is not scumming with GH. I also know at least one of Al Sips and dp101 are townies. Pelican could be scum if he had a role that falsely scanned as Fry, but if anyone had a godfather power it was probably Montmorency based on flipping Mom, so I'm not in favor of that theory.
You know, on balance, even if I am wrong and you are mafia and Atheotes is innocent, I would be absolutely furious with myself if I lost via lynching a claimed tracker with the info needed for us to win (or at least continue the current game state). My vote will stay where it is.
Askthepizzaguy
10-11-2016, 05:42
At one point, Montmorency was the top poster in this game, with twice as many posts as me. Note how his activity level declined as his motivation was no longer to townclear himself, since many people including myself had done so. Once a lot of people had him as town, he was focused on getting mislynches, and his focus became quite narrow, so that he could avoid looking more wrong than townies. His activity level dipped. Cuthillius passed him and dp101 passed him.
It's one of the reasons why a drop in activity levels are a tell for the really active posters- they can get town points for themselves, but once that happens, town is likely voting for one another, and that means the scums have to do less in order to win. And then, you avoid accusing too many people, and skate by on your being town-read. dp, your levels kept climbing. So did Cuth's, until he died. Monty only died last phase and he's far behind the leaders.
Just something to note for future reference. It's harder to sustain an early townie-looking game, and then also explain why you're never murdered and your suspects keep flipping town. If your suspect is someone that you can accuse for several rounds in a row, even better. There's no data in the thread showing how you're wrong.
Al Sipsclar
10-11-2016, 07:21
So, no two sane scums could be outside of Pizza's wagon yesterday. Two scums outside Pizza's wagon could be possible only if Pizza himself were to be scum (and Monty and Pizza created two competing wagons for themselves just for kicks), or if the second scum was AWOL.
Vote: atheotes
not voting - atheotes
Voting ends in: tunnel snakes rule
Tally as of post 3173:
Lynch votes
4 votes: atheotes (GeneralHankerchief (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718372#post2053718372), Askthepizzaguy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718380#post2053718380), Dp101 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718451#post2053718451), Al Sipsclar (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718559#post2053718559))
1 votes: Al Sipsclar (Pelican (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718530#post2053718530))
Voting history:
atheotes
atheotes
Atheotes
Al Sipsclar
atheotes
Al Sipsclar
10-11-2016, 07:37
Out of GH, Dp, PP, and myself, I seem to be the most likely last scum. However, that contradicts my role PM (I had to re-read it, just to be sure I didn't overlook it, :laugh4:), so this is really interesting. Probably also means I'm going to survive until final four, being the scum's last chance to unify town against itself. This is why lurkers should be lynched early.
GeneralHankerchief
10-11-2016, 16:34
A thought: What if Fry is mafia? Would that make sense given what we know about Riedquat's role and the balance of the game?
We know he's a neutral role because that was confirmed to us upon Riedquat's death. But most of his actions are town-favored: protections, scanning, etc. This would counteract itself nicely if Riedquat's primary objective is a mafioso in disguise.
OTOH, this would mean Riedquat has two contradictory goals: Keep robots (town) alive, and keep Fry (mafia) alive. Which is impossible to do given the parameters of the game. So I guess not then.
Yeah, I was wondering that too. Like you, I think it's probably just paranoia, but we must consider it. Still feels a bit like a potential bastard role to me though if it works that way.
GeneralHankerchief
10-11-2016, 16:47
Yeah, I was wondering that too. Like you, I think it's probably just paranoia, but we must consider it. Still feels a bit like a potential bastard role to me though if it works that way.
Given Riedquat's stated victory conditions I don't see how it makes sense. It is physically impossible to satisfy both of his conditions (save robots/save Fry) if the two of them are on opposite sides.
I had Pelican as lock town, moved him out of it for a couple minutes when I was thinking the previous post through, and put him back in the lock town category upon completion of the thought.
GeneralHankerchief
10-11-2016, 16:48
Unless a secret provision of Riedquat's role was that of a cult leader or something. But IIRC there aren't cults in this game as per the OP.
Not thinking about that. Pelican's safe, if I'm wrong then oh well.
GeneralHankerchief
10-11-2016, 16:55
I keep running the scenarios through my head, and every time it comes back atheotes/Al Sipsclar as the final two. I just can't see any other combination.
I'm me. Pelican is lock clear. That leaves us with four.
Dp101 has been super townie all game and is not displaying any sort of behavior I associate with mafia whatsoever, particularly not in their second game ever.
Pizza is always a possibility, but we've verged on a LYLO on more than one occasion that was avoidable. His behavior makes no sense if you're trying to win now, and while Pizza is absolutely the type who tries to score style points on occasion, he's not the type to do so one mislynch away from victory.
It has to be atheotes and Al Sipsclar by process of elimination.
atheotes
10-11-2016, 17:37
You asked me to elaborate on this, so I'll indulge you.
6 people still alive.
Al Sipsclar
Askthepizzaguy
atheotes
Dp101
GeneralHankerchief
Pelican
Pelican is cleared by virtue of Riedquat protecting him and then Riedquat being nightkilled - i.e. Riedquat was in opposition to the mafia. - Pelican was neutral and had his own goals, including keeping Fry alice. He was opposed to non-robots. So it doesnt clear Pelican.
ATPG is not 100% lock clear but a town-aligned tracker makes sense with what's been confirmed about the setup and his theories make sense at this stage in the game. - a tracker who is left alive till lylo? anyways you agree that he is not clear.
Dp101... isn't mafia. End of discussion. ok. not cleared by any source.
And then there's me. - not cleared by any source
This leaves us with two scum remaining: atheotes, and Al Sipsclar.
It's not out of the realm of possibility that Pizza is a mafioso. But I'd put money on atheotes and Al Sipsclar being some variation of Walt and Igner (Mom's two unaccounted-for sons), and the game concluding upon their deaths.
my responses in red.
you said "It could be because of hard numbers, many of the remaining players in this game are either about to be Wogged or cleared by one source or another."
But your stated reasons dont match what you had said.
atheotes
10-11-2016, 17:40
I'm not sure what the two have to do with each other. If you're scum, you're lying about your role and have no protection ability whatsoever. This leaves us with Riedquat protecting Fry/Pelican.
i am a 1-shot BP. i only claimed protection ability so that i might be targeted for the kill.
You are scum with Pizza. There is no way you would play like this as town.
unfortunately the rest of the people alive dont seem to have enough experience playing with you and pizza to see that.
atheotes
10-11-2016, 17:42
Pizza, when you get back, sorry to keep requesting more clarification than should be necessary, but how is this an uncledynamite situation with Athotes? What is it about him specifically narrowing down his list of allowed mafia to me and Al that makes him obvscum?
What? i narrowed my list of scum to you and Al? where?
atheotes
10-11-2016, 17:48
Hi pals, really sorry for all of the silence on my end, but this is the first spare moment I've had in days that I can reasonably devote to this game. And even this has to be brief. Based on what I can glean from a very cursory skim of the thread, I'll go ahead and vote for vote: Al Sipsclar; Don't want to go Pizza after Monty's flip and out of the remaining candidates, I feel he has been most suspicious throughout the game. I'm glad to see that there's still tomorrow for me to be around and change my vote if need be, but that participation may be limited to just a half hour or so around the EoD, unfortunately. Really sorry, I know players like me who sign up for a game and can't commit the necessary time later on are a major pain in the shiny metal ass (RIP my good friend Bender :cry:), but I really am trying my best with the situation I find myself in.
Al sips has been skirting along and sheeping votes. he has looked very scummy. I was convinced he was scum because of the way he voted Monty and his overall behavior till then.
I thought Pizza was town based on the Monty flip. But he comes around claiming fake results. and on hindsight he started setting me up for the mislynch even before today.
GH is his scum partner.
If you dont have time to read, i guess its a lost cause anyway.
What? i narrowed my list of scum to you and Al? where?
According to one of pizza's posts you did that at some point, I think he quoted it in his big writeup.
atheotes
10-11-2016, 18:13
Holy crap, thanks for the extensive writeup. I understand things a lot better now, and I feel I understand mafia thinking a lot better now, and might actually become a decent townie one day. I realise that most of the above probably doesn't matter because if I trust you on that then I also trust your scan, which proves his guilt anyway.
You know, on balance, even if I am wrong and you are mafia and Atheotes is innocent, I would be absolutely furious with myself if I lost via lynching a claimed tracker with the info needed for us to win (or at least continue the current game state). My vote will stay where it is.
:laugh4: You are just too drunk on pizza sauce. if possible look at it objectively:
1. town JK
2. Jown tracker
3. a VT who has been most people's top town read for the entirety of the game.
add to that, on a lower level,
4. Fry - the protagonist of the game theme
All these people are alive for Lylo. even if the scum team was fully made of newbie players, this situation would never happen.
Also, walls of WIFOMs with cherry picked posts is not analysis. Mostly agenda.
this is my mafia 101 lesson for you. ~;p
atheotes
10-11-2016, 18:16
Look at the timestamps between these two posts:
His mistake immediately occurs to me because I am solving the game. This is not something that I had to even ponder for more than a moment.
All of those thoughts I just described in the above post (which takes a long time to type) occurred the instant I saw atheotes' post. A couple happened later on, but the main thrust of it, the live townie miscount, all happened just then, and the reasons behind it, and the cited example of where I've seen a scum doing it before.
GH is correct, I can't fake certain thought processes. I've been off the mark for most of the game, but I've given thought processes that made sense and explained them.
I do this because people need to know WHY I was incorrect if I was incorrect. And also so that if I am incorrect, someone can tell me why before the lynch actually happens. Then I can reverse.
Examples: suspicion on GH immediately reversed when I saw that claim. Jailkeeper is someone the mafia would have to roleblock or kill every single night for the rest of the game if he's town. And if he's scum, that will be found out when he's still alive at LYLO, usually.
Suspicion on Winston Hughes: Nonexistent the entire game. Never saw his original soft claim, suspected him precisely because I thought he claimed at night, which you shouldn't do if you're an investigative role or role with any active ability, unless you're also giving out information you're afraid will be lost.
As soon as it was pointed out he had claimed before that, the suspicion vanished again.
I could walk you through my suspicions and town leans on every single person I've talked about this entire game. Especially any reversals.
Ask me anything about any individual person.
Note also that he declared that it wasn't LYLO today, because Riedquat got shot.
Again, that can only be the case if you think there are 4 townies alive who aren't yourself.
2 scums and 4 other townies is not lylo, because if you include yourself, that's a final 7.
Final 6 means if there are 2 scums and 4 other townies, you are one of the scums.
Because final 6 does not occur very much on this board due to a lack of vigilantes, it's understandable that atheotes could forget the dynamics of LYLO and suggest in a taunting fashion that since Riedquat died, town can "afford to mislynch" atheotes, so therefore bluffing that town will get pizza tomorrow if atheotes is lynched incorrectly today.
But he made the same mistake again, forgetting to include himself as townie.
You don't need tracking data to catch atheotes here. The thread is often times far more conclusive than claims, especially in a non-spreadsheet solve game with host-provided fake role PMs given to the scums.
You must examine the in-thread stuff. But I know GH is lock clear now, and that atheotes is not scumming with GH. I also know at least one of Al Sips and dp101 are townies. Pelican could be scum if he had a role that falsely scanned as Fry, but if anyone had a godfather power it was probably Montmorency based on flipping Mom, so I'm not in favor of that theory.
What a load of BS! Scum know the situation exactly. They do not make mistakes like what i did. I guess Pizza is unable to control himself at this point.
atheotes
10-11-2016, 18:18
So, no two sane scums could be outside of Pizza's wagon yesterday. Two scums outside Pizza's wagon could be possible only if Pizza himself were to be scum (and Monty and Pizza created two competing wagons for themselves just for kicks), or if the second scum was AWOL.
Vote: atheotes
Out of GH, Dp, PP, and myself, I seem to be the most likely last scum. However, that contradicts my role PM (I had to re-read it, just to be sure I didn't overlook it, :laugh4:), so this is really interesting. Probably also means I'm going to survive until final four, being the scum's last chance to unify town against itself. This is why lurkers should be lynched early.
you are scum according to everyone but me. who do you think is my scum partner?
Look, fine, if Pizza is mafia I hereby grant you permission to laugh at me endlessly after the game.
atheotes
10-11-2016, 18:22
According to one of pizza's posts you did that at some point, I think he quoted it in his big writeup.
I dont read his big write ups. So you just believe whatever he is saying? dont verify for yourself? you wont do it after tomorrow.
the only thing i can remember is when i thought Al sips was scum and he was negotiating with Quat. He left you out of the possible lynches to be pushed by Quat. I suspected you being scum.
your general sheeping has felt wolfy at times but i have generally dismissed it as your inexperience with Pizza. dont know if i ever commented on it.
atheotes
10-11-2016, 18:27
Look, fine, if Pizza is mafia I hereby grant you permission to laugh at me endlessly after the game.
nah. the only people who have put in enough effort in this game to actually win are Pizza, Monty and you are probably third. So its fair game if they win.
I was just dumb to think Zack would not give cover role abilities also to scum. if it is not an ability but a guess from Pizza, he deserves to win just for that.
last qn to you, what do you think about GH and pizza's position on GH being lock clear?
I dont read his big write ups. So you just believe whatever he is saying? dont verify for yourself? you wont do it after tomorrow.
the only thing i can remember is when i thought Al sips was scum and he was negotiating with Quat. He left you out of the possible lynches to be pushed by Quat. I suspected you being scum.
your general sheeping has felt wolfy at times but i have generally dismissed it as your inexperience with Pizza. dont know if i ever commented on it.
So what, I'm not allowed to trust direct quotes of players because they were quoted by someone you don't like?
atheotes
10-11-2016, 18:33
So what, I'm not allowed to trust direct quotes of players because they were quoted by someone you don't like?
i am saying you got to read the whole context. often the clueless and paranoid ones are townies, like yours truly.
Askthepizzaguy
10-11-2016, 22:38
Just checking in before bed. Note about this:
What? i narrowed my list of scum to you and Al? where?
Al sips has been skirting along and sheeping votes. he has looked very scummy. I was convinced he was scum because of the way he voted Monty and his overall behavior till then.
I thought Pizza was town based on the Monty flip. But he comes around claiming fake results. and on hindsight he started setting me up for the mislynch even before today.
GH is his scum partner.
If you dont have time to read, i guess its a lost cause anyway.
Look back to last night. He specifically has GH as town there and keeps me as scum. There are several posts where he puts GH as town.
He's not being truthful about having me as town, except for the fact that for a moment, he declares the possibility of both me and GH innocent with Pelican in a pair of posts. Which would be the exact listing of just dp101 and Al Sipsclar. Unless he was accusing Reidquat, if you look, you won't see any indication that Riedquat's alignment was in question from atheotes.
And something as simple as "I thought Pizza was town based on the Monty flip" shouldn't be misremembered so quickly. It's clear that he doesn't think I'm town last night, and then gives me a tracking suggestion.
My guess for the final one is Al Sipsclar, but it would be prudent to give each player remaining another look through their ISO, and most especially, what the flipped scums had to say about them throughout the game. I'll be at school tomorrow, but in about 13 hours, I'll be able to give my best look. If you give me a hand with it, put the dead not-mafia people on ignore mode and you can read the thread and get a much better perspective on things.
atheotes
10-12-2016, 01:07
It would be so funny if pizza is town and there is a scum bus driver...:laugh4:
pizza
Who would mafia even be then? GH + Al?
Tally as of post 3196:
Lynch votes
4 votes: atheotes (GeneralHankerchief (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718372#post2053718372), Askthepizzaguy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718380#post2053718380), Dp101 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718451#post2053718451), Al Sipsclar (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718559#post2053718559))
1 votes: Al Sipsclar (Pelican (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718530#post2053718530))
Voting history:
atheotes
atheotes
Atheotes
Al Sipsclar
atheotes
atheotes not voting
just under 30 minutes to end of round
He voted, just forgot to use the correct formatting.
atheotes
10-12-2016, 02:50
Who would mafia even be then? GH + Al?
Probably..but its outlandish. I just think it would be funny. [emoji2]
Oops...vote: pizza
So, everyone ready to lose? I really need a good way of relieving lynch stress at lylo.
GeneralHankerchief
10-12-2016, 02:58
https://media.giphy.com/media/RHiD0K65NxxLO/giphy.gif
GeneralHankerchief
10-12-2016, 02:59
So, everyone ready to lose? I really need a good way of relieving lynch stress at lylo.
I'm a fan of Philadelphia sports teams, so I've learned the hard way that if you're feeling good about something... just shut up, otherwise you'll jinx it.
atheotes
10-12-2016, 03:24
https://media.giphy.com/media/RHiD0K65NxxLO/giphy.gif
:rolleyes:
I'm a fan of Philadelphia sports teams, so I've learned the hard way that if you're feeling good about something... just shut up, otherwise you'll jinx it.
Did it happen once already this game? ~:)
GeneralHankerchief
10-12-2016, 03:25
Did it happen once already this game? ~:)
Yeah, when Murska got lynched.
atheotes
10-12-2016, 03:26
So, everyone ready to lose? I really need a good way of relieving lynch stress at lylo.
If i had offended in you in any way i apologize. :bow:
Looking forward to play with you again.
atheotes
10-12-2016, 03:27
Yeah, when Murska got lynched.
yeah....right. :rolleyes:
How long are you going to keep up the charade? :beam:
Deadline was half an hour ago, probably shouldn't post anything that is alignment indicative.
Don't post.
Sorry, I was studying and lost track of time. :sweatdrop:
Tally as of post 3209:
Lynch votes
4 votes: atheotes (GeneralHankerchief (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718372#post2053718372), Askthepizzaguy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718380#post2053718380), Dp101 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718451#post2053718451), Al Sipsclar (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718559#post2053718559))
1 votes: Al Sipsclar (Pelican (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718530#post2053718530))
1 votes: Askthepizzaguy (atheotes (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?152111&p=2053718688#post2053718688))
Voting history:
atheotes
atheotes
Atheotes
Al Sipsclar
atheotes
Askthepizzaguy
Young lady, I am an expert on humans. Now pick a mouth, open it, and say BR BR BR BR BRRRRRRRR.
https://i.imgur.com/GJnt6oO.png
Dr. John A. Zoidberg
Player: atheotes
Role: HYPNOTOAD [COVER: Zoidberg]
Faction: ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD
:laugh4:
Role: Walt [COVER: Zoidberg]
Faction: MomCorp (MAFIA)
:laugh4: :laugh4:
Role: Zoidberg (https://theinfosphere.org/Zoidberg)
Faction: TOWN
Alive: 5
Al Sipsclar - Calculon
Askthepizzaguy - Kif Kroker
Dp101 - Richard Nixon's head
GeneralHankerchief - Donbot
Pelican - Philip J. Fry
---
Lynched: 8
d1 - spaceman98 - Leela
d2 - BSmith - Amy
d3 - Stork - Professor Farnsworth
d4 - novice - Scruffy
d5 - Cuthillius - Hattie
d6 - Murska - Dr. Wernstrom
d7 - Montmorency - Mom
d8 - atheotes - HYPNOTOAD
---
Killed: 8
n1 - El Barto - Flexo
n2 - Visor - Hermes
n2 - seireikhaan - Larry
d3 - CrimsonFox - Zapp Brannigan
n3 - Newyn - Linda
n4 - choxorn - Morbo
n5 - Winston Hughes - Robot Devil
n7 - Riedquat - Bender
---
Modkilled: 1
johnhughthom - Hedonismbot
MomCorp Victory!
Alive: 5
Al Sipsclar - Calculon
Askthepizzaguy - Igner
Dp101 - Richard Nixon's head
GeneralHankerchief - Donbot
Pelican - Walt
---
Lynched: 8
d1 - spaceman98 - Leela
d2 - BSmith - Amy
d3 - Stork - Professor Farnsworth
d4 - novice - Scruffy
d5 - Cuthillius - Hattie
d6 - Murska - Dr. Wernstrom
d7 - Montmorency - Mom
d8 - atheotes - Zoidberg
---
Killed: 8
n1 - El Barto - Flexo
n2 - Visor - Hermes
n2 - seireikhaan - Larry
d3 - CrimsonFox - Zapp Brannigan
n3 - Newyn - Linda
n4 - choxorn - Morbo
n5 - Winston Hughes - Robot Devil
n7 - Riedquat - Bender
---
Modkilled: 1
johnhughthom - Hedonismbot
Game is now over. Thanks everyone for playing and congrats to the winners.
More details and stuff coming later this week, I'm going to be busy tonight and probably tomorrow. :sweatdrop:
(GH was the only non-vanilla left, and the mafia would have just blocked him and could have killed anyone.)
GeneralHankerchief
10-12-2016, 03:56
Jesus Christ.
EVERYONE, dead or alive, can now post, since it's over.
:2thumbsup:
Pelican Askthepizzaguy Montmorency seireikhaan
Congrats!
Riedquat
I haven't looked at the specifics yet, but I think you also did quite well.
GeneralHankerchief
10-12-2016, 03:58
This is what I get for not ISOing. A little voice in the back of my head said that Pizza and Monty passed up a lot of opportunities to truly force the issue with each other, but there were always bigger targets. Argh.
Well played, you nutjobs. :laugh4:
Well, this is all my fault. My perfect win streak is now shattered, and it could easily have been avoided if I just listened to Winston. Feel free to blame me for the loss, my brain must have equated walls of text with actual decent cases, and I forgot the Cuthillius mess way too quickly. I maintain that while Quat scanning mafia as not a threat in one specific case does make some kind of sense as to avoid him being a seer, it still feels a bit like a bastard role.
GeneralHankerchief
10-12-2016, 04:00
Riedquat
I haven't looked at the specifics yet, but I think you also did quite well.
Okay, there's lots of things that are gonna bug me (most of them self-inflicted, don't get me wrong :wall:) but let's start with this one. With Fry being mafia, aren't Riedquat's two goals of protecting both robots (townies) and Fry (mafia) self-contradictory?
Riedquat
10-12-2016, 04:02
Gosh!!! Amazing game! Thanks for hosting Zack!
Now, you, stupid Igner! Why did you need to kill me?? I know I kinda got your mother lynched, but wasn't my intention! That night I scanned you, never scanned Monty ;) I lied here and there of course but I needed both town and scum to achieve my goals!
Team Victory Conditions:
Bender's victory is graded (at the host's discretion) on his ability to achieve the goals below, listed in no particular order.
- Survival. You, Bender, survive the game.
- Evil Twin. Outlive Flexo. (Bonus points for being directly involved in Flexo's death.)
- Robot Prosperity. As many robots as possible survive the game (except Flexo, he can die).
- Kill all humans. As few humans as possible survive the game (except Fry, he can live).
- Except one. Fry survives the game. Bender: [crying] All those times... I said "kill all humans"... I'd always whisper "except one". Fry was that one.
Abilities:
Kleptomania. Each Night, you may steal an item from another player, which will reveal their relation to your victory conditions, if any. This ability cannot be used on the same player twice.
Further the cause. After using "Kleptomania" on a player, you have a chance at gaining one use of this ability. Use it on the same player, and depending on how they relate to your victory conditions, you will either protect or kill them. You can use this ability and Kleptomania on the same night.
This metal is more than just shiny. Nightkill immunity on Night 1. This is a passive ability and it triggers automatically.
GeneralHankerchief
10-12-2016, 04:02
I'm waiting to read the mafia quicktopic where Pizza and Monty inevitably quote my one post saying "you two are both town and you need to stop going after each other" and just laugh as loudly and obnoxiously as they can.
Okay, there's lots of things that are gonna bug me (most of them self-inflicted, don't get me wrong :wall:) but let's start with this one. With Fry being mafia, aren't Riedquat's two goals of protecting both robots (townies) and Fry (mafia) self-contradictory?
riedquat never posted his real role pm
I'm so excited I wish I could wet my pants.
https://i.imgur.com/UsmrMiJ.png
Bender Bending Rodriguez
Player: Riedquat
Role: Bender (https://theinfosphere.org/bender)
Faction: BENDER (NEUTRAL)
Team Victory Conditions:
Bender's victory is graded (at the host's discretion) on his ability to achieve the goals below, listed in no particular order.
- Survival. You, Bender, survive the game.
- Evil Twin. Outlive Flexo. (Bonus points for being directly involved in Flexo's death.)
- Robot Prosperity. As many robots as possible survive the game (except Flexo, he can die).
- Kill all humans. As few humans as possible survive the game (except Fry, he can live).
- Except one. Fry survives the game. Bender: [crying] All those times... I said "kill all humans"... I'd always whisper "except one". Fry was that one.
Abilities:
Kleptomania. Each Night, you may steal an item from another player, which will reveal their relation to your victory conditions, if any. This ability cannot be used on the same player twice.
Further the cause. After using "Kleptomania" on a player, you have a chance at gaining one use of this ability. Use it on the same player, and depending on how they relate to your victory conditions, you will either protect or kill them. You can use this ability and Kleptomania on the same night.
This metal is more than just shiny. Nightkill immunity on Night 1. This is a passive ability and it triggers automatically.
-----
If you have any questions, ask me privately.
:2thumbsup:
Well, at least I called the potential bender kill all humans thing right.
Riedquat
10-12-2016, 04:09
Well, this is all my fault. My perfect win streak is now shattered, and it could easily have been avoided if I just listened to Winston. Feel free to blame me for the loss, my brain must have equated walls of text with actual decent cases, and I forgot the Cuthillius mess way too quickly. I maintain that while Quat scanning mafia as not a threat in one specific case does make some kind of sense as to avoid him being a seer, it still feels a bit like a bastard role.
Hey, it was a difficult game for everybody, my scans were useless for town, the threats to me were the humans, the only one who was really suspicious was Atheotes! And honestly, I never suspected Monty of being scum I just lied my ass off there because he was admittedly human and I needed him dead, was prepare to reveal the true role after the lynch, my last order was to scan you, and all these post from Al Sip and atheotes pointing at you, well I was being subtle trying to point at you like a nice night target...
Fry!!?? Why??
Askthepizzaguy
10-12-2016, 04:10
Brain slug told me to say GG
*hugs* to my worthy competitors. I hope that you were able to have fun regardless.
As is tradition for me, you will of course note that I admitted to being mafia with Montmorency, and then said I would light my cigar with your bodies.
Sorry. I got to do that, it's just who I ams.
On a more serious note, I truly appreciate the folks in this game who really tried, and the scoreboard doesn't indicate how close it was. Things could have gone way downhill for us if only a little bit changed, like me being lynched before Monty. After the atheotes kill attempt failed, we thought we had blundered it away. Atheotes played his slot well, since he managed to draw a kill.
The worst part was, I even thought he might be a one shot bulletproof "or something" and suggested killing elsewhere that night. No idea what happened there.
I want our new players to come back. Novice and dp101 were both a breath of fresh air on this site.
CrimsonFox brought a lot of heart, I would ask that he tone things down as this site is more casual as you can see.
Riedquat, I feel sorry about the very cold hearted decision to kill you. But it was for the greater good of being bad. I wanted to win outright with you at final 7 but I guess you had a win condition that forced your hand otherwise? Dunno what happened there.
Scum Quicktopic:
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/yL4spGrep5i
Our strategy and running commentary throughout the game. Please enjoy.
~:pimp:
GeneralHankerchief
10-12-2016, 04:12
Scum Quicktopic:
https://www.quicktopic.com/52/H/yL4spGrep5i
Our strategy and running commentary throughout the game. Please enjoy.
~:pimp:
Do I read this before bed, or wait until tomorrow?
...
...aaaaaaaaaaaand there's that masochism instinct kicking in.
Askthepizzaguy
10-12-2016, 04:14
Gosh!!! Amazing game! Thanks for hosting Zack!
Now, you, stupid Igner! Why did you need to kill me?? I know I kinda got your mother lynched, but wasn't my intention! That night I scanned you, never scanned Monty ;) I lied here and there of course but I needed both town and scum to achieve my goals.
Oh, well in that case...
I was dropping hints like they were elephants in the thread for you to unvote and then vote with me. So now I don't even feel bad.
Lol
Go re-read that day. I couldn't have been more obvious, actually.
Hugs anyway. I wanted this game to be over and for you to achieve your win conditions, but I spoke directly to you all day and told you he was scum and to get off of him, openly, in public.
If you can't hear me after I do that, I'm afraid MomCorp finds you to be faulty and recalls you to be scrapped, y'know?
I hope we killed enough humans for you to do well regardless.
Askthepizzaguy
10-12-2016, 04:15
Do I read this before bed, or wait until tomorrow?
...
...aaaaaaaaaaaand there's that masochism instinct kicking in.
I said several kind things about many players in there. It's a good read, albeit lengthy.
I think this town will get a lot out of this qt and recommend it. It shouldn't be cringe-worthy even in the position of having failed to defeat our team.
Well, time to read the thread and see if my theory of mafia keeping me alive because they knew they could easily pocket me was true.
El Barto
10-12-2016, 04:16
riedquat never posted his real role pm
He did, meatbag!
Askthepizzaguy
10-12-2016, 04:17
I want to know what was up with Stork's role.
Also, gg stork and good try.
Askthepizzaguy
10-12-2016, 04:19
Well, time to read the thread and see if my theory of mafia keeping me alive because they knew they could easily pocket me was true.
No, I actually thought I had lost you at several points.
The person I specifically kept alive was GH because people were suspecting him so much.
And I knew that was a massive risk because of (a) his role and (b) he's a very dangerous player and (c) I have never successfully pocketed him and wouldn't immediately think that's my best option, ever.
But, it worked out, because it was such an outlandish thing to try.
Also I told my teammates to bus me literally all game, for the same reason. Too outlandish for me to try. But I had to try once, you see.
He did, meatbag!
he edited omitted some stuff
I thought it was kinda funny that no one noticed that, in the Role PM atheotes posted, the font changed halfway through the ability description then changed back.
Made me feel a bit silly for how much effort I put into making them all super consistent (down to stuff like making sure all links used https instead of http). :laugh4:
El Barto
10-12-2016, 04:22
So, mafia, why did you kill me on Night One? Did my attempt at being Bender succeed that well? The idea was that, as I could keep talking after death, I'd draw fire rather than lose a power role (not that I didn't suspect Bender could easily be set to ‘kill all humans’ mode or, Zack being Zack, have been repossessed by MomCorp or joined Evil Santa or, or, well, Bender's evil, basically).
Askthepizzaguy
10-12-2016, 04:22
Was there a dead chat?
Askthepizzaguy
10-12-2016, 04:23
So, mafia, why did you kill me on Night One? Did my attempt at being Bender succeed that well? The idea was that, as I could keep talking after death, I'd draw fire rather than lose a power role (not that I didn't suspect Bender could easily be set to ‘kill all humans’ mode or, Zack being Zack, have been repossessed by MomCorp or joined Evil Santa or, or, well, Bender's evil, basically).
I don't remember at this point. It might be in the QT.
You did well with your talk after death power. I had to ignore you at a certain point because you were successfully damaging my credibility.
Riedquat
10-12-2016, 04:23
Oh, well in that case...
I was dropping hints like they were elephants in the thread for you to unvote and then vote with me. So now I don't even feel bad.
Lol
Go re-read that day. I couldn't have been more obvious, actually.
Hugs anyway. I wanted this game to be over and for you to achieve your win conditions, but I spoke directly to you all day and told you he was scum and to get off of him, openly, in public.
If you can't hear me after I do that, I'm afraid MomCorp finds you to be faulty and recalls you to be scrapped, y'know?
I hope we killed enough humans for you to do well regardless.
:laugh4: I saw all your elephants around all the thread, but I lacked certainty you were 100% scum! That in particular, phew... I really was afraid to blow my fabricated townie mascarade, how to go back after revealing a fabricated result... interesting thing my scan didn't went through your cover...
I want to know what was up with Stork's role.
Also, gg stork and good try.
Damn it, Mom! No one kills my crew except for me! You're going down.
https://i.imgur.com/35Y7Er0.png
Professor Hubert J. Farnsworth
Player: Stork
Role: Professor Farnsworth (https://theinfosphere.org/Farnsworth)
Faction: FARNSWORTH (THIRD-PARTY)
Team Victory Conditions:
Farnsworth's victory is graded (at the host's discretion) on his ability to achieve the goals below, listed in no particular order.
- Survival. You, Farnsworth, survive the game.
- Arch-nemesis. Outlive Dr. Wernstrom. (Bonus points for being directly involved in Wernstrom's death.)
- Kill the competition. Mom's Friendly Delivery Company is a threat to Planet Express business. Outlive Mom. (Bonus points for outliving all of MomCorp.)
- Consolidating Power. The only valuable employees of Planet Express - Hermes the bureaucrat, Leela the spaceship captain, Amy the rich girl - survive.
- Collect stock. Every other member of Planet Express (https://theinfosphere.org/Planet_Express_crew#List_of_current_members) dies so you can recover their stock. Scruffy in particular has an especially large amount of stock in the company.
Abilities:
Role Peek. At night, choose up to two other players to target. If you target: a) 1 player, you learn their true character name and alignment, b) 2 players, you learn their character names (but do not see through cover roles).
Owner and CEO. At night, if you can correctly identify a member of Planet Express (https://theinfosphere.org/Planet_Express_crew#List_of_current_members), recruit that player into a private QuickTopic. You must include your actual reasoning, guesses will be ignored - this is not a peek. You CAN use Role Peek simultaneously with this ability. This is NOT a conversion, their alignment will not change. They will not learn anything about your alignment.
Limited Bulletproof. If you are attacked Night 1, you will not die. You are susceptible to being killed any other night.
Anonymous tip. At any time, send an anonymous message to MomCorp. PM me the message you want to send, and I'll send it on its way asap.
-----
If you have any questions, ask me privately.
:2thumbsup:
I could have designed it better, I had to rework the role at the last second (in the original, larger design the Prof was the fifth member of MomCorp). Stork also had insanely bad luck with the early lynches/kills. Visor (Hermes) had an ability that helped him find memebrs of Planet Express, and Stork found him n1, so he theoretically was primed to do well.
In retrospect the role had a lot of issues and probably shouldn't have been included. Sorry Stork.
I dunno, I guess the main reason I'm feeling despondent is that I felt I finally had learned something valuable from Pizza in terms of how to catch mafia, and in the end it turns out that everything was just lies and I, as always, substituted other people's opinions for my own. I don't think I can become an effective player until I can advocate for my own ideas effectively, and I can't manage that right now.
I enjoyed the game quite a bit. I know skating through the endgame is kind of a cheap way for a wolf to contribute to the team, but it's what the strategic situation and my RL schedule allowed. With no one seriously targeting me, and Pizza doing fine with the heavy lifting, any huge increase in participation on my end would have probably risked more than the potential benefits. But I had a lot of fun playing regardless and learned a lot. Thanks to all involved. I wish I could join the next game here but I probably won't be able to play these for a while unfortunately.
El Barto
10-12-2016, 04:32
I don't remember at this point. It might be in the QT.
Found it! You really did want to frame CrimsonFox after all.
You did well with your talk after death power. I had to ignore you at a certain point because you were successfully damaging my credibility.
You refused to do analysis on some palyers inexplicably and announced your every absence. I felt as if I were the only sane man robot in the room.
El Barto
10-12-2016, 04:35
Heh, for some reason Monty said he thought the game wouldn't end before late October (post #225).
CrimsonFox
10-12-2016, 04:55
Do I have to kill ALL the wolves for you?
Role was certainly not my style and not fun at all for me to play after n1 unfortunately.
Whatever, gg Pelican especially I guess.
Murska what in the world were you doing?
CrimsonFox
10-12-2016, 04:58
death by inactivity
https://thebrotherhoodofevilgeeks.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/5339_futurama_hd_wallpapers_fry1.jpg
Al Sipsclar
10-12-2016, 05:01
I think it's self-explanatory.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfoR8SbFhy8
Askthepizzaguy
10-12-2016, 05:04
I dunno, I guess the main reason I'm feeling despondent is that I felt I finally had learned something valuable from Pizza in terms of how to catch mafia, and in the end it turns out that everything was just lies and I, as always, substituted other people's opinions for my own. I don't think I can become an effective player until I can advocate for my own ideas effectively, and I can't manage that right now.
I would say in general, the advice is sound. It's just that, because I've been a townie for 8 years at this point, I know how to take good town advice and twist it to suit my own purposes.
General's been around for years longer than I have, and nothing I said in the game didn't pass his sniff test as to its town-merits.
So, if it fools a veteran, you honestly shouldn't even begin to feel bad.
My scum game is a really, really difficult nut to crack because individual players are extremely smart, but the moment you make them into a democracy and they need to decide things by committee, and they don't have all the information they need, they always become extremely vulnerable.
Play more games with us. You are underselling your fundamentals.
And the number of people who have said "never again" to being fooled by me specifically, only to have it happen again, is substantial. Do not feel like you in particular were especially vulnerable, because unless the town has an alignment cop and scans me directly, their track record is pretty bad.
Visor is an excellent player and he town-read me. GH is as well. Winston Hughes even got pocketed by me. These are people who know me and have played with me for years and have seen what I can do as scum.
I think you really cannot beat yourself up over figuring me out.
I think the missed opportunity was perhaps not pushing Pelican, town in general didn't touch him and neither did the scums. The reasons why should have been looked into more. This was before Riedquat falsely cleared him.
I would have been extremely vulnerable as a claimed tracker with a dead scum roleblocker. Our entire team collapses after such a lynch.
Ok, just finished reading the mafia thread. Just one question, what is wogging?
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