Something that makes me mad...

[keet]

One of the few things that really angers me is concerning the fighting ability of an armies leader, namely the king.

In my most recent battle against their kings army, I was pounding them into dust untill all that remained was the kings units of knights.

Then, all were killed except the king himself and the few that ran away earlier. I had him COMPLETELY surrounded by 240 Muwahid Foot Soldiers, 120 Mamalik Cavalry, 220 Ghazi Infantry, and a line of 480 Crossbowmen on a nearby hill.

Now let me reemphasize that he was quite literally surrounded by hundreds of men and he was one man.

He fought through ALL the soldiers and past the crossbowmen and escaped to the castle. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pissed.gif

I understand not all of my men could fight him at once but the sheer numbers should have overpowered him(over 1000 to one) and at least pulled him from his horse and pummeled him. Or at least you would have thought he'd be captured from exhaustion being I had so many fresh men.

Nope he fought past all of them and through and away the crossbowmen while they fired at him the whole time. Then my fresh cavalry on the hill were outrode by him, doesn't he get tired?

Also, my army all had 5-6 valour and were led by an 8 star general. The fact that he LIVED and ESCAPED against those odds makes me want to vomit.

I could see him putting up a fight, maybe even living, but not escaped when surrounded by that many high quality men after such a long fight all alone. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif

[A.Saturnus]

Yes, I`ve seen this myself a lot of times. I mean if it happened once I would say "strange things happen" but this is a common sight I thought the patch should have solved this, shouldn`t it?

[starkhorn]

Yeah I think everyone has seen this many times. I do remember seeing in the patch release notes that this was supposed to be fixed but I haven't noticed any difference.

However, I've been in the same position myself where my king was surrounded by hundreds of troops and he managed to fight his way out of there (despite being totally exhausted).

So we shouldn't complain too much......

[A.Saturnus]

This doesn`t help me cause I don`t commit my king in such as fight. And if I did I would expect to loose him As it is now it`s just unrealistic and silly, no matter who benefits from it.

[Kraxis]

The patch fixed the suicidal kings, but it didn't weaken them.

Only two (2) men can engage another man at any time, that means you only get two chances to hit him at any time. If those two men happen to be using spears you will never kill him. Your spear have an attack of about 2-3 if they are really good, while he has a defense of 13 or better as he is a Royal Knight with around 8-10 Valours, that means those spears will never kill him as he has plenty of hitpoints.

Next time hold him with the spears again and kill him with bows. Crossbows can do, but expect heavier losses that way.
If you can't do that you need to commit your heavy hitters, and you might lose them, but you will never stop him with spears.

[HopAlongBunny]

It seems if you don't kill them in place with the rest of their Royals, their escape is all but a sure thing. They will outrun any cavalry they were engaged with; light cavalry; missles...whatever. Rarely, very rarely, you might get a capture. Makes it harder to suicide unwanted heirs too http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Saki]

I can think of one example reported in hisotory/legend where a leader escaped wiv his life agianst impossible odds.I forget exact details (may be some one could elaborate)but Alexander was reported to have climbed a city wall wiv just a few body gauds and was set upon by the entire garrison.Any one else know of such events happening in history/legend

While it seems somwhat unrealistic its hardly a game stopper.In your situation it would of been best to hold wiv spears and charge wiv the Gahzi reapeatedly(good charge bonus) or some other goood charger unit.

[Kraxis]

I don't know about that story about Alexander, but he foolishly charged his Companions into the fray very early at Gaugamela (the first battle against the Persians) and got hit in the head with an axe. Only the timely arrival of a trusted friend saved him from a second and no doubt deadly blow. It has been speculated that the Persian generals counted on this young relatively unproven king to try and show his men his bravery by doing this. Well, wouldn't that have changed history had they managed to kill him

[Jaret]

Problems with the enemy king ??

Use Javlins Javelins = soon no more problem

They pirce Armour ... hurled from short range, they have quite good accurcy ... they have power 2 (dealing 2hitpoints of damage with each succesefull hit). My Javelins always kill enemy Generals/Kings.

[solypsist]

if it were that easy to kill enemy kings the game would be way to easy (or easier). all the above listed "unrealistic and silly" factors give enemy factions some level of survivability against aggressive human players.
and it's not a bad idea to exploit the hardiness of your own kings early in the game by using them as an active part of starting armies.
for more information, search the Table of Contents for these subjects, and for the hit points system attributed to Generals, Kings, and Heirs.

[Acronym]

but he foolishly charged his Companions into the fray very early at Gaugamela (the first battle against the Persians

You're thinking of the battle of Granicus, which the persians were deployed on one side of the river, as alexander stormed across. The battle ended as 10,000 greek mercenaires were surrounded and slaughtered by the macedonians. Guagamela on the other hand was a victory from the start(aside from Parmenio nearly being outflanked).

[andrewt]

I never had much of a problem even pre-patch with enemy kings and heirs. I've noticed now, post-patch, that they start to retreat once they have a few health left. While they still have a lot of health they continue fighting.

Your muwahid foot should have killed or captured him. I played Almohad and Egyptian already and only had kings and heirs escape when surrounded by a few units. In any case, Steppe and Saharan cavalry can and will overtake them. I've captured kings and heirs who escape my other troops with these cavalry.

[keet]

Some good info but regardless of making it fair, if the ai gets it's king in a poor position or had his army decimated then that is his tuff luck, regardless if it makes it easier to wipe him out(they can always reemerge).

They also should not pull through and outrun you if you have the same or better speed.

[LadyAnn]

Suddenly, Alexander the Great becomes a hot topic http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

I don't know of any battle where Alexander climbed city wall. I don't even recall he ever fought a seige battle. His army was always out numbered, his enemy confident to challenge him on the field.

Now, I am sensing some baiting here for flames http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

And greek mercenaries slaughter Macedonians for Persian generals? What kind of babbling is this?

Arkkk... Believe what you want...

Annie

[Leet Eriksson]

argh macedonians are greeks right?

btw about kings,they are very powerful(even for a coward like the egyptian sultan)the only solution of killing that bugger is to do like i am doin.Auto-calc whenever the battle your going to fight has a king this should kill him or get him captured(well most of the time that is).

[Kraxis]

Acronym, I believe you, I wrote that it was the first battle to make sure somebody would notice if I had made a mistake, as I did. I was not very sure, but I was very sure he did charge in at the first Persian battle.

And yes there were greek mercenaries in the local Persian armies. Alexander could not stop young soldiers from going out in the world and hiring their services out.

And yes, we need those powerful generals. We can focus of the general while the AI can't/won't. Even if it did we could use that as a very good bait to gain an unfair bait any human player would notice at once.