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Crandar
01-10-2018, 22:35
And it's Three Kingdoms:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4D42vMUSIM

Makes sense, thanks to the film industry, the Three Kingdoms is the most popular period of Chinese history. Personally, I'm not very excited, to be honest. The setting and the trailer imply a mix of history and fantasy with many mythical elements and a focus on heroic duels. A logical move from CA, because it allows her to combine the customers of both genres, but I am not thrilled.

EDIT: I am not sure who and why changed my title. It was more accurate than the revised version. The next historical title is the Saga game, the Thrones of Britannia. The major titles are now described as 'tentpoles' by CA employees themselves.

Gregoshi
01-11-2018, 02:40
I'm wondering about the mix of history and fantasy too. However, since it seems to be lining up on the historical side, I wonder if we are reading too much into some of the scenes based on the fantasy/magic Warhammer predecessors. Too early to tell. Though I can't imagine CA tossing magic in a historical title - the howls of outrage would be deafening.

Gregoshi
01-11-2018, 17:53
CA has put up a FAQS page on Three Kingdoms. Not much in the way of detail yet, as expected. You can read the FAQS here (https://www.totalwar.com/blog/total-war-three-kingdoms-faq).

Hooahguy
01-11-2018, 19:22
I am definitely intrigued. While the era isnt my favorite, I loved the film Red Cliff and the idea of heroes is pretty cool, considering that the Romance of the Three Kingdoms is almost mythical in China where you do have the type of heroes you see in the Warhammer games. Will definitely be keeping tabs on this.

Crandar
01-11-2018, 19:39
May I ask why the title was edited? The original was more accurate than the revised version. The next historical title is the Saga game, the Thrones of Britannia. The major titles are now described as 'tentpoles' by CA employees themselves.

drone
01-11-2018, 19:58
People have been asking for the Three Kingdoms for years, I suppose the potential of the Chinese market has finally brought CA around.

Gregoshi
01-12-2018, 02:56
May I ask why the title was edited? The original was more accurate than the revised version. The next historical title is the Saga game, the Thrones of Britannia. The major titles are now described as 'tentpoles' by CA employees themselves.

CA may use the term "tentpole", but they didn't in the official announcement. They called it a "Total War era". Now, I know you are less than thrilled with the choice, but a new Total War title has just been announced(!!) - is a thread title, now moved the a brand, spankin' new forum, really something worth diminishing the magnitude of the announcement? ~:pat:

Papewaio
01-12-2018, 04:12
About time they got to the 3 Kingdoms. So much that can be done in Asia that TW hasn't got to. And yes I would prefer it to have the options to play historical or warhammerish.

Crandar
01-12-2018, 10:03
CA may use the term "tentpole", but they didn't in the official announcement. They called it a "Total War era". Now, I know you are less than thrilled with the choice, but a new Total War title has just been announced(!!) - is a thread title, now moved the a brand, spankin' new forum, really something worth diminishing the magnitude of the announcement? ~:pat:
Yes, I understand, thanks for your explanation. In other news, unfortunately Jeff Van Dyck, who composed the music of Shogun will not be involved in the project.

hoom
01-12-2018, 14:16
Sweet :bow:
This was the one I thought was pretty much most likely & most desirable.

Interesting they may be using Warhammer style Hero unit tech.
While I am utterly uninterested in Warhammer a bunch of that tech can be used to produce some cool historical figures with relatively less fantasy abilities/buffs etc.
And we've previously had the S:TW Kenzai heros before...

Possible hint at a change back towards old-style campaign map?
http://cdn.edgecast.steamstatic.com/steam/apps/779340/ss_6edc23f8e0add502bb079486e9671ded6ff21f49.jpg
Probably not but one can live in hope :boxedin:

Happened on this vid which gives a nice overview of the historical background

https://youtu.be/8Q00oxe-_PQ

edyzmedieval
01-13-2018, 00:42
Warhammer's influence on the next historical TW games will clearly be seen, because it's a huge sales success for SEGA / CA and the formula will applied.

Lechev
01-13-2018, 10:01
People have been asking for the Three Kingdoms for years, I suppose the potential of the Chinese market has finally brought CA around.

Yes, i remember since TotalWar: Rome and TotalWar Medival. How long has it been?

drone
01-13-2018, 14:52
Yes, i remember since TotalWar: Rome and TotalWar Medival. How long has it been?

IIRC, I think the discussion dates back to the announcement of Med II. A lot of people thought it was too early to do a repeat, and wanted either pike and musket or Three Kingdoms.

edyzmedieval
01-13-2018, 15:30
CA went for other areas and time frames because after all, Europe has been central in almost every TW game, bar the Shogun series. It's something very interesting to see because it's a fresh start with Warhammer influences.

Tolkien
01-20-2018, 18:04
not my thing. medieval 3 or american civil war im in.

edyzmedieval
01-20-2018, 19:16
At some point, it will happen. Med 3 especially.

JacquestheApostate
01-21-2018, 04:31
I for one have been waiting for years for this announcement. Very happy, just hoping it's not fantasy, Warhammer type games are not for me.

quadalpha
01-22-2018, 09:07
Well, that's brought me out of the woodwork! Have you guys all been hanging out here all these years?



Possible hint at a change back towards old-style campaign map?
http://cdn.edgecast.steamstatic.com/steam/apps/779340/ss_6edc23f8e0add502bb079486e9671ded6ff21f49.jpg
Probably not but one can live in hope :boxedin:


I've always thought the 3D strategic layer was a mistake. I don't see CA ever going back to it, though.

xploring
01-23-2018, 10:35
I have been waiting for this for like 20 years. The spring release feels a bit rushed. I have read the Chinese book (most popular version) multiple times. Hopefully they will make a good game.

Crandar
01-23-2018, 17:50
It will be released in autumn, not spring. I think you are confused with the Thrones of Britannia, whose release date is indeed scheduled in spring.

That being said, I agree with your observation. One former CA employee said that 3K existed only on paper a couple of months ago.

Add to that that the normal circle between announcement and release is slightly more than one year (Rome II: July '12 - September '13, Warhammer I: March 2015 - May 2016), so I'm a bit skeptical too.

Lechev
01-24-2018, 02:35
I have been waiting for this for like 20 years. The spring release feels a bit rushed. I have read the Chinese book (most popular version) multiple times. Hopefully they will make a good game.

Wow, i can't believed its been 20yrs since Shogun. How times flies. i still miss those old days where we had popular Clans like the Greywolves, RTK, Kenchikukas etc..

edyzmedieval
01-24-2018, 21:02
It was released in 2000 - STW - so indeed, it's been quite some time. :yes:

Suraknar
01-30-2018, 03:43
Greetings all,

has been some time, hope all are well :)

I would just like to say that I am very very excited about this Title. It has been so many years I remember since Even the first Shogun TW that such an Era has been discussed and requested in these very forums. And finally it is being done :)

And it will be awesome.

I am currently playing Warhammer (Oh yes I love the Fantasy Universe of Warhammer having played the Tabletop collected the Games Workshop Miniatures etc) and I find it really Fun.

But I can already picture Three Kingdoms with that Engine! It will just be awesome!

Can't wait for it :)

Cheers!

edyzmedieval
02-04-2018, 00:03
Good to see old faces around here :bow:

On the topic of the thread, we can probably expect some more detailed info in March. The game is up for release at the end of this year, per Steam.

Suraknar
02-04-2018, 18:19
Good to see you too Edyz,

Thanks for the info! I shall be following it.

la revedere :)

Intranetusa
02-09-2018, 00:22
I am excited for the setting but am very worried about the very inaccurate trailer. You had exciting and new forms of warfare in this timeperiod in this part of the world, but the trailer decided to go with stereotypical "idiots running out of formation with nothing but one handed swords/short spears."

Over half the weapons used during this timeperiod were crossbows, pikes, halberds, long polearms, etc...but in the trailer you basically see nobody with crossbows/pikes/halberds except 2 heroes fighting on foot with really short polearms...

Hooahguy
02-10-2018, 03:06
I definitely think they are going for the romanticized version, which did have those sorts of heroes who could take out whole units and such. I think they definitely saw the success of the Warhammer TW games and want to try that formula just minus the magic.

Seyavash
02-10-2018, 17:10
I definitely think they are going for the romanticized version, which did have those sorts of heroes who could take out whole units and such. I think they definitely saw the success of the Warhammer TW games and want to try that formula just minus the magic.

If they use the romance as a source I wouldn't discount the possibility of magic being included in some form.

hoom
02-13-2018, 05:55
So I started watching 2008 Red Cliffs movie (got distracted & only watched the start so far), whats the consensus on its historicity?
Seems to have a pretty interesting selection of armor/weapons/unit types.

Intranetusa
02-13-2018, 18:41
So I started watching 2008 Red Cliffs movie (got distracted & only watched the start so far), whats the consensus on its historicity? Seems to have a pretty interesting selection of armor/weapons/unit types.

I'm no expert, but from what I've read/researched, the Red Cliff movie seems like garbage in terms of accuracy. It's not almost pure fantasy like 300, but it gets tons of stuff wrong and uses some semi-fictional elements.

1) The weapons and armor are incorrectly used or not portrayed correctly. The majority of weapons during the Han Dynasty were regular & heavy crossbows, pikes, halberds, long-halberds, and other types of polearms. Han Dynasty warfare heavily used pike and shot-esque combat with pikes/halberds and crossbows. Yet you don't see a single crossbow (they only show you the more niche repeating crossbows...which would've been more rare). They don't portray any of the common historical weapon formations - pikes, pike & crossbow, volley firing, etc.

The halberd (ji/daggeraxe-spear) is incorrectly portrayed as a slashing weapon, when in reality it was more of a armor piercing stabbing weapon that is swung like a warhammer and used to hook cavalry. This was a common weapon with a lot of variations, and they don't portray the other types (long halberd-pike hybrids, multi headed halberds, halberds with different secondary attachments such as cavalry hooks, etc)

The guandao/pudao (glaive looking polearm used by Guan Yu) wasn't wasn't invented until the Tang Dynasty a few centuries later...although this is not that big of a deal since it was basically a dao on a polearm so it may have existed.

And most of the soldiers are equipped with short 1-handed spears that for some odd reason they carry with two hands and they carry nothing in the other hand. That makes no sense - one handed spears are always carried with shields. Even shorter halberds are carried with shield. Shields are also one of the cheapest and most effective forms of protection. Everybody with a one handed weapon SHOULD be carrying a shield. Only two handed weapons (pikes, crossbows, long halberds, etc) would be used without shields.

2) The armor is off. One of the characters wears plated chainmail...which wasn't even invented until the medieval era in the Middle East/South Asia. That might be the inspiration for the plated chainmail Lu Bu wears in this 3K trailer.

The infantry are wearing leather caps combined with what should be metal lamellar (some infantry seems to be wearing non-overlapping coat of plates, which is inaccurate). Leather caps are light infantry/light cavalry helmets used during the Western Han period when they were mostly used lacquered rawhide lamellar from the Qin era. It makes little sense that they would be wearing light infantry Western-Han era helmets with heavier infantry Eastern-Han era body armor. The lamellar helmets are also more Western Han era in design, as they used more rigid helmets by the Eastern Han era iirc (although lamellar helmets could have still been in use, the movie leaves out the rigid helmet types). Not sure why nobody has shoulder guards except the generals, as these were pretty common for standard armored infantry dating back to the Qin Dynasty/Warring States era as seen by artifacts and terra cotta warriors.

All factions are also incorrectly portrayed as wearing the same armor and weapons...which would be inaccurate. The factions didn't have the same industrial and manufacturing base, so they had to make do with different armor designs and materials. Eastern Wu was a naval/marine/infantry power in the subtropical jungle and mountains of South China, so it makes no sense they're using the same weapons and armors as Tsao-Wei, which was more cavalry + pike/halberd oriented power around the central Chinese plains.

3) The formations are a joke. The infantry semi-circle only has a single line of troops which would be easily broken with a cavalry charge. The spinning turtle-tank formation created from small shields is total fiction. Again, you don't see any common historical formations portrayed as at all (pike formations, pike and crossbow formations, repeating crossbow volley fire formations, etc)

hoom
02-15-2018, 02:50
Thanks for detailed answer :bow:
It was particularly the guy with the plate/chainmail armor in the bit I saw that seemed questionable :inquisitive:
Its clearly better than 300 in that they actually wear their armor though.

edyzmedieval
02-15-2018, 23:07
Let's remember that Shogun 2 had the same type of trailer and people thought it had duels.

Crandar
02-16-2018, 14:32
As a reminder, CA has announced that their game is based on the Romance and not the Records.
The answer to their concerns was also very evasive ("We assure you that Cao Cao will not sit in a huge throne throwing flames"-straw-man fallacy). It's true that we don't know much yet, but there are strong indications, more concrete than a cinematic trailer, that it's not going to be as historical as the previous titles.

Intranetusa
02-17-2018, 00:26
Let's remember that Shogun 2 had the same type of trailer and people thought it had duels.

Well, Shogun 2 had matched combat...which might as well been duels. The trailer's depiction of units, weapons, and armor were pretty close to what the actual game had.

If the soldiers, weapons, and armor depicted in the 3K trailer is similarly representative of what is found in the actual 3K game, then the game would be as inaccurate as portraying the army of the late Roman Republic during the days of Caesar as a hoplite phalanx army from 500 BC.

edyzmedieval
03-03-2018, 23:03
Matched combat as in what exactly? The units moved like in the trailer?

caravel
03-06-2018, 16:06
Makes sense, thanks to the film industry, the Three Kingdoms is the most popular period of Chinese history.
There has been a "whatever Hollywood is doing" aspect to the franchise well, since it became a franchise...


Personally, I'm not very excited, to be honest.
I haven't been excited about TW games (or games in general) for a long time, but each to their own.


fantasy with many mythical elements and a focus on heroic duels
Ah... special hero characters on wires who can leap from rooftop to rooftop during sieges...? :creep:

Crandar
03-06-2018, 20:12
That's what it looks, but maybe the trailer is a bit misleading. However, CA confirmed that it will be based on the epic of the Romance and not the Records, for whatever that may mean for the historicity of the franchise. In my opinion, it will be less accurate than the previous titles, exploiting the obscurity of that period among the customers, while heroes will probably be unkillable and similar to those of Warhammer, but without (hopefully) any magical abilities.

hoom
03-07-2018, 02:39
Matched combat as in what exactly?As in the long sequences of motion capture which broke unit balance by disrupting formations/leaving 'victorious' soldiers surrounded by enemy -> insta-dead.

Intranetusa
03-07-2018, 21:56
Matched combat as in what exactly? The units moved like in the trailer?

As in the long sequences of motion capture which broke unit balance by disrupting formations/leaving 'victorious' soldiers surrounded by enemy -> insta-dead.

Yes. Depictions of the combat as 1v1 duels instead of formation fighting.

wermez
05-20-2018, 21:55
I think that next game will be about Alexander the Big.

JStahlhelm1090
03-03-2019, 03:00
I think it's a fresh idea for CA to create a total war game on a time period that many people probably not know about. From my experience from Shogun 2 total war (actually my first total war game), I learned a lot of the history behind it which sparked my interest for medieval Japan.
I would be expecting a lot of flaws in the game once it gets released but that's where mods come in. In case people are saying the game isn't as good upon released, I would just buy it when it's on sale.

edyzmedieval
03-15-2019, 02:15
Speaking of TW games, they are now on sale on the Steam Store!

http://www.steampowered.com