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Efrem Da King
01-18-2003, 14:01
I have been thinking about what a good french unique unit in VI could be. Well I said to myself "what major war in the middleages did the french win" The hundred years war of course. Then "why did they win it" because they had the best artillery in europe at the time. "How could this be represinted in VI." Then it struck me http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/idea.gif , make french serpentines able to move, but that it takes a while for them to pack and unpack like trebuchets in aok.
So what does everyone think http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif .

Shahed
01-18-2003, 14:06
I for one have always stood for more variety and adaptibility. So I'd luv to see mobile artillery.

However, since the Viking Invasion is taking us back to pre-gunpowder times, I doubt such an addition would stick to the theme. They could of course have added it in for the normal campaign and MP of course. Doubt if this on the cards though.

Efrem Da King
01-18-2003, 14:10
France isn't going to be in the new map I ment as apart of the new units for the old factions. Now do you understand. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif

Shahed
01-18-2003, 14:18
Yes Thx i understand this:

The units for VI have already been decided on, announced, and clearly they have mentioned nothing about adding mobile artillery of any kind.

Perhaps in a "patch" ?http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

I appreciate the idea and as I said, I support it.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/flirt.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Efrem Da King
01-18-2003, 14:24
Just for the record I knew you understood and was just being an annoying arrogant bastard, cause I have to back to school in 12 days http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/eek.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/frown.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/frown.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pissed.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pissed.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/pissed.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif

Shahed
01-18-2003, 14:28
http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Think of the nice aspects of school, like GIRLS.

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

*Wishes Da King all the best, bows, and leaves this thread*

http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wave.gif

Efrem Da King
01-18-2003, 14:31
I go to a bloody all boys school http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mecry.gif . THe girls school is next door ( we're separated by a park) and we go there every lunchtime, but still http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif .

Alrowan
01-18-2003, 14:47
what school is that?

Efrem Da King
01-18-2003, 14:48
Sydney Boys. Why?

Foreign Devil
01-18-2003, 20:08
As I understand it, it would take some major work on the engine to get it to swallow mobile artillery peices. I, too, would love to see this, but I don't think it will be implemented, even though they are adding things the current campaigns.

Efrem Da King
01-19-2003, 06:12
It'll have to wait for renaissance total war then http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/cool.gif .

Emp. Conralius
01-20-2003, 20:20
new unit description


http://www.totalwar.com/community/medieval/viking2.htm

Geoffrey_FiztRogers
01-21-2003, 14:54
I just saw the pic for the new housecarl unit. They got the axe wrong. That saxons used a danish designed axe that was straight across the top then then a stright blade down (curved on the inside) comming to a point.

Kraxis
01-21-2003, 16:45
Geoffrey that is very much true. That is called a battleaxe.
To those who had a hard time understanding the description (not that it was bad), Gimli uses a very similar axe as his primary weapon.

The reason the axe didn't have the upwards curve, was because the upwards curve would limit the impact of the fastest point of the axe, the point. Also a curved head could get stuck because of the less able cuttingedge, and you don't want that in a battle. The downwardscurve is actually needed for cutting through the object as you swing the axe and thus the head will inevitably turn a little inwards. The axe would get stuck very fast if it didn't have a downwards curve.

Emp. Conralius
01-21-2003, 20:18
didn't the Anglo-Saxons and early Franks have throwing axes around this time?

What's with the Huscarls in AOE2 having swords? Is this inaccurate?

Loras
01-21-2003, 20:44
the name of the weapon the housecarls used was the "danish bearded axe" so named because the blade was shaped like a, well, beard. and yeah, the axe in the picture is definately wrong.

Loras
01-21-2003, 20:47
here's a picture of what i think the axe should look like:

http://www.medieval-weaponry.com/en-us/dept_464.html

(the second axe)

SeveredSoul
01-21-2003, 21:31
You are right Emp. Conralius [B]the Frankish troops at this time did carry throwing axes for a back-up weapon.

Leet Eriksson
01-21-2003, 22:10
c'mon people no need for argueing the weapon is wrong or not,its a game afterall.

Leet Eriksson
01-21-2003, 22:32
btw i want to see a late-era unique french unit,the Chevalier Grenadier,Chivalric knights but with gunsstill lethal in melee too

Geoffrey_FiztRogers
01-21-2003, 22:57
Lorais, Nice pics. The danish axe did look similar to the beared axe in the pic. However it was longer and two handed. I also think but can't swer to it that it came to more of a point at the bottom of the blade.

Kraxis
01-22-2003, 01:06
Yes that axe is very similar to what was used. Personally I don't care if the game represents the axe wrong, as long as it is an axe and wielded by two hands.

The axe in the picture is an earlier version of the bearded axe (the 'battleaxe' I mentioned is also twohanded but with a narrow head). The axes I have seen and read about are in fact very similar to the axe Gimli uses (perhaps that is where the inspiration for his weapon came?). It was streight on the top and the cuttingedge held a constant curve of about 30 degrees, but the axe did not have a beard. It was more like a slice, being a solid lump of steel, making it heavy and very capable. A deadly weapon in two hands.

Emp. Conralius
01-22-2003, 03:56
I don't know about you guys, but I want to see some Anglo-Saxon axe-throwers (maybe a better nam) The Franks weren't the only ones to use 'em. I'm thinking a very slow rate of fire yet can cause terrible damage.

Efrem Da King
01-22-2003, 09:00
Quote[/b] (faisal @ Jan. 21 2003,15:32)]btw i want to see a late-era unique french unit,the Chevalier Grenadier,Chivalric knights but with gunsstill lethal in melee too
Good idea http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif . Thought the devs have said that they haven't told us all the new units http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif . So there's still hope.

A.Saturnus
01-22-2003, 15:29
Knights with guns were called Cuirassiers (they offen had two guns, have a picture of one, looks great but sorry, too much work to upload it). But they didn`t appear before 1500, so I guess we won`t see them in VI. The throwing axe of the Franks were called Francisca and this is where my ancestors had their name from.

Kraxis
01-22-2003, 17:03
Yes the Francisca... but that is too early a weapon to be in the game. If the Franks were part of VI then the Francisca could be part of the game.
Can you imagine a powerful infantry with somewhat more powerful ranged weapons than javelins? DAMN They would be scary.

maroule
01-22-2003, 17:28
and it was with a francisca that Clovis broke the skull of that soldier in the 'Soisson Vase' incident...

Efrem Da King
01-23-2003, 01:27
Quote[/b] (A.Saturnus @ Jan. 22 2003,08:29)]Knights with guns were called Cuirassiers (they offen had two guns, have a picture of one, looks great but sorry, too much work to upload it). But they didn`t appear before 1500, so I guess we won`t see them in VI. The throwing axe of the Franks were called Francisca and this is where my ancestors had their name from.
I know that you know that but do marketing people know that?
I think not. May be just pistoliers.
I.E gerandames which have pistols to shoot.
Be pretty much like javs except cooler and damaging to moral.

Leet Eriksson
01-23-2003, 01:39
ze Chevalier Grenadiers existed before the Curiassiers,i remember reading an article on them but i don't remember where http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/dizzy.gif it was looong time ago though http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif i also had a drawing of them,it depcits heavy knights with arqeubuses on armoured horses,so i'd think they would either be chivalric knights or gendarmes with guns.would be cool for a french UU.

Efrem Da King
01-23-2003, 04:32
Quote[/b] (faisal @ Jan. 22 2003,18:39)]ze Chevalier Grenadiers existed before the Curiassiers,i remember reading an article on them but i don't remember where http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/dizzy.gif it was looong time ago though http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/tongue.gif i also had a drawing of them,it depcits heavy knights with arqeubuses on armoured horses,so i'd think they would either be chivalric knights or gendarmes with guns.would be cool for a french UU.
Too true.

Mr Frost
01-23-2003, 05:55
Gendarms with guns : sounds like a cool mod when I figure out how to do it .
I modded both gun types to be more accurate {not hugely , but it makes them atleast useful} and I would use the pistol like Mamluk one with the Handgonne stat for mounted fire {keeping the existing Gendarme stats also} and the Arqubuss {with Arq stat} for dismounted .
They would be rather effective like that I feel

I am inclined to believe the French should get Lancers or similar {I mod them thus but Late period for France and Spain} . I gave Feudals Normandy as a +1 Valour province so France can raise Feudals as good as Chivalrics {lower armour rating but higher honour} as well as Chivalrics as good as Lancers {I havn't figured if I should make one province "famous" for Lancers yet , nor which if I do} .

Perhaps there could be a uniquely French heavy cavalry , but with them having the ability to make +1 Valour Chivalrics {and with my modding , Feudals} then perhaps giving them a discount on their Chivalric Knights {a simple mod} would be in order .
Another idea might be to make their Royal Knights arrive with 1 higher Valour {including Kings and Princes} wherever they are raised {not sure how that might be modded} ... France was supposed to have the finest knights in Europe after all .

Captain Fishpants
01-23-2003, 17:48
The French don't benefit from any exclusive new units in the Vikings expansion, but they do get to use the new Organ Gun which should be a huge satisfaction to many French commanders. This particular artillery piece is optimised for anti-personnel use.

Like everyone else, they'll need to build a Master Gunsmith and a Master Foundry to produce it.

As to introducing pistoliers and the assorted caracole-tactic cavalry of the later medieval/early Renaissance into the game - this wasn't ever likely to happen in an expansion kit called "Viking" Invasion http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif Sorry, but the French did really rather well with the mix of units available to them in the original game and with the advantages given by some of their provinces.

MikeB ~ CA

Brown Wolf
01-23-2003, 19:01
Hey I want to see an add on that allows us to use the Billmen (the guys with the REALLY big axes) from the pre norman times.