Cost to Retrain?

[burma_mtw]

Sorry if this is obvious or documented somewhere. I've looked but cannot find anything.

What does it cost to retrain a Unit?

For example:

1. A Unit is down to half strength. Does it only cost half what it would cost to train a full Unit.

2. A full Unit with no armor or metalsmith upgrades is retrained at a province with Gold/Gold upgrades. What does it cost?

3. Is the retraining cost for armor and metalsmith upgrades affected by the initial upgrade level? By that I mean does it cost more to upgrade from something like Bronze/Bronze to Gold/Gold then it does from Silver/Silver to Gold/Gold?

4. As time goes by, Bodyguards look different. You can retrain them to look like the new image. Does it cost anything and are they better Units?

Thanks........

[MiniKiller]

All I know is its cheaper then buying new ones but if u have say a valur 5 unit with 1 man, if u retrain they may loose 4 valur, yes when they look better (bodyguards) they are better/

[Basileus]

1. Yes
2. Same as if you would train a new unit
3. No
4. Costs to train them and they get better

short answers caus eim in a hurry http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Hosakawa Tito]

STW used to show the cost of retraining depleted units, but you have it right, replacing 50 spearmen costs half of the full price.

Upgrading a full unit's armor or weapons costs nothing, except what you paid to tech up for the buildings.

Except for looking different, the stats for a Royal Knight or Ghulam BodyGuard are the same. Hopefully by then you have upgraded the armor or weapons.

[Red Harvest]

Yeah, wish they would put the cost of retraining back in, as in STW... It was a nice little feature.

[Dijeeh]

I noticed this too, retraining is a good feature that doesen't let it's self be known


I never really retrain because i can build a whole new full sized unit in one year, or retrain and old one in the same time.

It's faster for me just to make new units.

I think you should be able to re-train 2 or maybe 3 units in one year depending on how depleted they are.

I feel im wasting a whole year training half a group..

Know what i mean?

[Tyrac]

The key is you retrain those older High valor units. Then it is worth it.
For example at the start of a game you had a few armies of mostly Vikings. They fought long and hard and you spent the time to recombine them over and over. Now, in the late period, you have 3 or so Viking units of 5, 6 or even 7 or so valor without command bonuses, i.e. they, solo, no star general have 5 or more valor. Those vikings can kill almost anything and are well worth moving to a good armor weapons province. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
I have not realy messed with it that much tho. Heh, best I have gotten is 4 valor stand alone. On a non leader unit that is.

[Lord of the Isles]

Quote[/b] (Hosakawa Tito @ Jan. 26 2003,03:30)]
Except for looking different, the stats for a Royal Knight or Ghulam BodyGuard are the same. Hopefully by then you have upgraded the armor or weapons.

No, there is a steady improvement in stats as you go from Early -> High -> Late for both Royal Knights and Ghulam Bodyguards. Not huge differences; mostly it is increased defence and armour. The biggest improvement is Early Royal Knights -> High Royal Knights. You get +1 Melee, +2 defence and +3 armour (though they cost 200 florins more). This is the same in v1.0 and v1.1.

So upgrading is well worth it IMHO. As I approach 1203 and the other period changeover (can never remember when High becomes Late) I'll often build a second Royal Court (if that is the right building?) in a province with a good armourer building if I don't already have one. Then I start to queue up existing RK/GB units for upgrading, usually high-command general's units first if I can spare them from the front line at the time.

As for upgrading other units: I rarely used to bother with this because of the tedious micromanagement but in my last couple of games I have started trying to do it when there's a lull in wars. But I may abandon this practice, both because it is boring and because I don't think the AI does it and sometimes I have hard-core leanings. http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Hosakawa Tito]

Lord of the Isles, maybe I didn't explain it clearly. The only difference in the stats of early thru late Royal Knights etal, are the upgrades you build in the province, weapons, armor, church etc... If you don't upgrade at all, then the appearance of the icon is the only difference.

[burma_mtw]

Thank you for the info.

Sounds like the best point is that one can upgrade an existing full unit's Armor/Metalsmith for free by retraining in an appropriate Province. Good news for the Turks.

[Red Harvest]

Best reasons to retrain:

1. High valor unit. Get it back up to full complement with upgraded armor/weapons. Sure the new recruits drag down the overall valor, but it will still be a very hard hitting unit and will not suffer from a handful of casualties. Plus the weapons/armor upgrades benefit the older troops in the unit. A unit like this is the one that is likely to cut through an enemy line like butter.
2. High quality commander in the unit. You want the command unit to be quite formidable so if needed it can deal the decisive blow in a closely run battle.
3. High accumen leader that might make a good governor/general, etc. but is in an older or depleted unit--upgrade his armor and weapons.
4. Saves upkeep cost to upgrade existing units over building new ones. Otherwise to hold costs the same you have to disband the "obsolete" unit. This really adds up over the decades and makes more economic sense than disbanding in most cases (unless the unit leader has "good runner" or very low loyalty or other vices that require the removal of the unit.)
5. If you don't have money to build more than one or two useful units, just upgrade what you have so that are quite useful again.
6. Going into a big battle with a large number of small or obsolete units is likely to result in a surprising piecemeal defeat.

[Asmodeus]

I would agree with all those reasons Red http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

[Lord of the Isles]

Quote[/b] (Hosakawa Tito @ Jan. 26 2003,15:08)]Lord of the Isles, maybe I didn't explain it clearly. The only difference in the stats of early thru late Royal Knights etal, are the upgrades you build in the province, weapons, armor, church etc... If you don't upgrade at all, then the appearance of the icon is the only difference.

Hmmm. Not sure I follow your point Hosakawa. It might be that you are playing without the v1.1 patch? Pre-patch you could not upgrade e.g. Early RK/GB to High RK/GB at all and so the only point of upgrading was armour/weapons/morale improvements in the province. But post-patch the actual units change as well.

If that doesn't explain it then I'm at a loss.

[Nelson]

Retraining makes even more sense when playing with huge units because new units take at least two years to raise. Retraining takes one year regardless of the losses replaced.

[einar]

I've for example, four units of feudal sergeants. After some battles, the ranks of the units are nearly depleted, but their valour and quality have increased. I combine the units until i have one or more fully units with 100 men each and one unit with the rest of the sergeants but less than 100% of its capacity . I retrain this unit. I want to preserve valour and experience acquired in battle.