Gaining Virtues

[Shahed]

Greetings All http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Post patch I'm finally into my third campaign. Pre-patch I remember gaining positive vices for the generals quite straight.

My generals usually get involved in the battle. Pre patch most would end up with virtues like, Fine Leader, Utterly Fearless etc...

Post patch I get the feeling that V&V's are random and tend to go into the negatively random i.e more easier a coward than fearless.

Can anyone share their thoughts, experiences, and sources on this. Or point me in the right direction for the answers, please.

Thank you.

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[The_Emperor]

My experience is that some of the V&Vs are random (happen when the Unit is made)

Others can be generated by actions, (Attacking against a superior army and winning, running away from battle, etc etc)

I have had some rather silly vices and virtues generated that cancel each other out. (for instance I had a "very charitable" yet "Greedy" General)

Strange how this works yes?

[Shahed]

Yeah I found that the V&V for the creation of the units are randon, hence you can get a crack brained William http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Once the general is active though, I can't seem to be getting any virtues through combat. I always use my general in combat. Example: Civil War in Egypt, so I seized the opportunity to capture the province from the Egyptians. The rebel force consisted mostly of low valor infantry, including spears. I had almost no infantry available to spare and hence sent in an all cavalry army consisting of 6 Armenian Heavy Cav, 6 Bedou Camels, 4 Turcoman Horse.

The battle was a simple cavalry charge head on. Most of the Cavalry were at valor 4-6 from previous battles. The Egyptian rebel army was literally swept from the field in one charge. The charge was led by the general and his cav were the first to hit the enemy. At the end the general's unit lost 5-8 men and took 134 (+-), gained 2 valor, but still no virtues added to the general's profile.

This is a repeating pattern and I'd really like to know how to influence virtues for the generals.

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[Thane Talain MacDonald]

Of course you can have a charitable and greedy guy, the money comes in one hand and goes out the other just as fast http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/joker.gif

[Goatus Maximus]

Interesting...I've had a totally different experience post-patch. I've frequently received the attacker/defender virtues, as well as all of the scant mercy ones when killing off the prisoners when in battle.

I will note that I have not received the leader/fearless virtues post-patch like I used to, if these are the virtues you are talking about.

Perhaps the leader/fearless virtues have become random, as you stated...but you still can generate some V&V through combat.

[Shahed]

Indeed. Attacker & defender (skilled, expert...) are command related virtues. The generals have been able to acquire those, as that is still directly related to the battles fought.

Scant mercy, butcher, blood lover are also gained through direct action considering POWs.

However the other virtues, seem to be impossible to achieve through combat. For example, to quote a few:

- Brave beyond belief + 3 Valor +3 Morale
- Charismatic Leader +3 Morale
- Famous Warrior +3 Valor +20 health
- Fine Leader +4 morale + 2 loyalty
- Great Leader +6 Morale +3 loyalty

Even the vice/virtue ---> scarred which I noticed very frequently if a General was caught out in between 300 spears http://www.totalwar.org/forum/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif or prolonged hazardous combat, is now absent ?

[pdoan8]

The attacker/defender V&V are much easier to get after the patch. The negative combat V&V such as cowardly/not so bold/good runner/... are also easier to get.

On the other hand, some V&V are much harder to get from combat experiences such as:


Quote[/b] (SeljukSinan @ April 28 2003,16:32)]
- Brave beyond belief + 3 Valor +3 Morale
- Charismatic Leader +3 Morale
- Famous Warrior +3 Valor +20 health
- Fine Leader +4 morale + 2 loyalty
- Great Leader +6 Morale +3 loyalty


There are a few that were very common before but I haven't seen since the patch: Unhinged loony, Scarred, Head in the cloud (I've seen only once).

[Hakonarson]

I had a leader who was fabulous except for being an out and out coward with -9 morale.

He had 7 or 8 starts, similar dread & accumen so I didn't want to kill him off.

So I put him in charge of several small battles, made sure he did some fighting, and he's down to the -2 morale modifier for having slightly suspect courage.

So I do think you get things - butperhaps a lot of it is context sensitive - for example to get fine attacker you probably need to win a couple or more attacks, while running down some low valour infantry with a massed charge of elite cavalry possibly doesn't rate much because it's what you'd expect to happen anyway.